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Doublestep posted:yeah ok thats fine, but you're still being a massive rear end in a top hat to everyone in your party. In normal mode? I find that hard to believe. I was solo healing a group when we did hard mode.
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Nov 12, 2015 20:40
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Since when do goons give a poo poo about appeasing pubbies?
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Nov 12, 2015 20:40
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pubbies
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Nov 12, 2015 20:40
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epic pubby tears ftw
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Nov 12, 2015 20:41
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Mordiceius posted:AST is the only class I have at 60. So yeah, I'm going to queue as AST. Not going to level and gear a DPS just so I can not slightly inconvenience pubbies. Treating other people and their problems as though they neither exist nor matter seems like a pretty unhealthy way to play this game
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Nov 12, 2015 20:41
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Doublestep posted:yeah ok thats fine, but you're still being a massive rear end in a top hat to everyone in your party. ummm this is something awful, loving pubbies lol!!
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Nov 12, 2015 20:41
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armoredgorilla posted:Since when do goons give a poo poo about appeasing pubbies? Life pro tip: "not being a massive rear end in a top hat to everyone who doesn't know your secret handshake" is not the same thing as "appeasing pubbies". Treat the people you're blind queueing into with the same respect you hope they'd give you, and you'll have a way better time on average. Mordiceius posted:In normal mode? I find that hard to believe. I was solo healing a group when we did hard mode. Wisent, Brachiosaur, and basically anything on the IV-heavy islands can get hairy fast. It's possible to solo heal just the boss if you know what you're doing, but Wisent in particular has a nasty habit of making it more than just the boss, even with coordinated players. Niton fucked around with this message at 20:45 on Nov 12, 2015 |
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Nov 12, 2015 20:43
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Again, I wouldn't do that in a premade group. But when I solo queue in Ishgard, I'm going to go do my own thing. If you want a full group dedicated to a single mission, make a party before queuing. EDIT: Ooh. Thanks for the new avatar.
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Nov 12, 2015 20:45
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Lmao whomever changed Mordiceius' avatar: well played, though this thread is gonna get a ton more confusing now.
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Nov 12, 2015 20:47
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You know there's a 2 hour lockout, right? If the essential players decide to gently caress off and do their own thing, the other players can't just drop and try again - they're stuck with your decision to be selfish, whether they choose to continue or not.
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Nov 12, 2015 20:48
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Mordiceius posted:Again, I wouldn't do that in a premade group. But when I solo queue in Ishgard, I'm going to go do my own thing. no one cares that you're going to do your own thing we're just saying if you're going to do your own thing at least have the politeness to do it on a dps class so you aren't loving 7 other people out of a thing for 90 minutes
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Nov 12, 2015 20:49
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armoredgorilla posted:Diadem makes a lot of petty people really insecure about their elite video gamer status, it's the best content FFXIV has produced.
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Nov 12, 2015 20:51
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Doublestep posted:no one cares that you're going to do your own thing Okay, let me just go level up another class since my highest DPS class is at level 30 just so that I can ensure I'm not wasting the time of pubbies that I don't care about.
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Nov 12, 2015 20:53
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I do wish there were a better system for getting to go gathering in Diadem. But there's not, and until such time (as ever) that there is, people randomly queueing should tailor their expectations appropriately. There's not just the risk of a healer loving off to go gathering, either. There's a risk of someone going as (insert role here that gets faster queue times) and then switching inside to (insert other role here that they actually want to play). On the one hand this could result in extra tanks and healers - at least when I ran, the DPS queues were oddly the shortest - but on the other hand it could result in the "tanks" and "healers" suddenly turning into a pile of dragoons. Or as in the case we're discussing here, healers turning into fishers. None of us can prevent that from being a possibility when we randomly queue. All we can really affect is our own attitudes and personal responses when it does happen. For example: you go in as monk, the astrologian promptly fucks off to fish, you can either a. try a harder fight with one healer and maybe die a lot (which might not accomplish anything), b. sit around being a dick to the now-fisher (which will not accomplish anything), or c. switch to scholar and get in a different flavor of DPS while letting Selene help heal (which will probably help accomplish something).
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Nov 12, 2015 20:54
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Boten Anna posted:Lmao whomever changed Mordiceius' avatar: well played, though this thread is gonna get a ton more confusing now. Do yourself a favor and reread the last few pages, Belzac and Mordiceius' new avatars are the thing that turned this really bad thread into a really good one
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Nov 12, 2015 20:54
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Who ever killed my wonderful fracture avatar has done this thread a disservice.
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Nov 12, 2015 20:56
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Vil posted:I do wish there were a better system for getting to go gathering in Diadem. But there's not, and until such time (as ever) that there is, people randomly queueing should tailor their expectations appropriately. for every retard who only has astrologian leveled there are also people who only have dps leveled. i guarantee you if there was a way to prevent gathering in random queues morde would be sitting in this thread complaining about how those loving pubbies are ruining his video game experience and SE is really bad at game design
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Nov 12, 2015 20:56
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Glorious.
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Nov 12, 2015 20:57
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Doublestep posted:for every retard who only has astrologian leveled there are also people who only have dps leveled. I do think there's a major logic hole in all of these suggestions to only switch jobs if you queue in as DPS. It assumes that people who queue as DPS are literally incapable of switching to tank or healer. Or even that they're capable of it but so unwilling as to go to extremes and dig in their heels to avoid doing so. That's... honestly pretty unrealistic. Sure, like you said, there'll be some people who only have DPS leveled, just like Mordiceius here only has a healer leveled. But there are an awful lot of people with multiple roles leveled who can just shrug and switch. Odds are extremely slim that everyone in the group has limited enough job diversity that the group as a whole cannot adapt. Even if two of the DPS are "I ONLY DEEPS LOOK AT MY LEVEL 0 CONJURER", the other three are probably more like "yeah, I'd rather DPS if possible, but given the choice I'd prefer to heal rather than do nothing or wipe a lot".
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Nov 12, 2015 20:58
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Belzac posted:Who ever killed my wonderful fracture avatar has done this thread a disservice. This tbh
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Nov 12, 2015 21:02
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Man the OF is going hog wild with the bad opinions today.
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Nov 12, 2015 21:02
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give me my cartoon penis avatar back
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Nov 12, 2015 21:02
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Leal posted:Man the OF is going hog wild with the bad opinions today. Oh is Mordicieus posting there too?
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Nov 12, 2015 21:07
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armoredgorilla posted:Diadem makes a lot of petty people really insecure about their elite video gamer status, it's the best content FFXIV has produced.
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Nov 12, 2015 21:08
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Vil posted:I do think there's a major logic hole in all of these suggestions to only switch jobs if you queue in as DPS. It assumes that people who queue as DPS are literally incapable of switching to tank or healer. Or even that they're capable of it but so unwilling as to go to extremes and dig in their heels to avoid doing so. That's... honestly pretty unrealistic. I kinda get it - if a DPS switches to a gathering job, it's not that big a deal, and no one (necessarily) has to replace them. If a healer or tank does, you do have to replace them, and there's a small (probably sub-5%) chance that your group won't be able to handle it. From a utilitarian point of view, doing it as a DPS is the way least likely to cause you problems Also, Mordiceius, a piece of actual advice: If you really don't enjoy DPS, you should just level Scholar. Scholar is a nice alternative to Astrologian as a healing class, and not only are SCH/SMN the best classes for Diadem, but you can just queue up as SMN to sidestep the "essential role changed" problem entirely!
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Nov 12, 2015 21:11
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If you keep quoting things that are untrue it doesn't make them more true.
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Nov 12, 2015 21:12
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This isn't remotely the case and it's frankly really funny that a bunch of people who spend a large portion of time making fun of people who haven't paid $10 for an internet forum are now doing the exact same thing as said people, but with somehow an even larger lack of self awareness.
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Nov 12, 2015 21:12
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megalodong posted:This isn't remotely the case and it's frankly really funny that a bunch of people who spend a large portion of time making fun of people who haven't paid $10 for an internet forum are now doing the exact same thing as said people, but with somehow an even larger lack of self awareness. Like this is the same poo poo as being physically AFK in Alexander, or early pulling a hunt when there's no other hunt to go to - it provides marginal utility to you, at the cost (or utility, apparently) of being a dick to people who haven't done anything wrong. And there are people defending it as the good / funny thing to do 
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Nov 12, 2015 21:14
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Niton posted:I kinda get it - if a DPS switches to a gathering job, it's not that big a deal, and no one (necessarily) has to replace them. If a healer or tank does, you do have to replace them, and there's a small (probably sub-5%) chance that your group won't be able to handle it. From a utilitarian point of view, doing it as a DPS is the way least likely to cause you problems I'd estimate that the odds of it being An Actual Problem are even lower than 5%. But maybe I'm just naively positive about how diverse people are in the roles they level. (As a data guy, this promptly makes me curious of the Venn diagram distribution of players between the three roles, among players with more than one job at 60.) But yes, that's a good point. DPS disappearing does not necessitate a change, healer disappearing probably necessitates a change, and tank disappearing (since it's 1/2/5 rather than 2/2/4, I think?) definitely necessitates a change.
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Nov 12, 2015 21:17
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Honestly I knew that Diadem, largely ignored by the playerbase in meta discussion leading up to the patch, would be kind of a big deal and cause explosive amounts of drama.  Seriously y'all, I know that death of the game creator is a thing but a lot of people are looking at it in a "glass half empty" kind of way that is perverting what is actually really cool and good about it. It's a catchup mechanic that isn't completely goddamned worthless for people who have been farming A4S since that was a thing, even beyond the rather abstract reward of sitting on a pile of sky pirate coins for materia to pop into your future 3.2 raid gear. Such people have a chance of getting something marginally better than their gear, and that's cool. For everyone else, esp the "midcore" it's a fun catchup mechanic that offers i210 gear to help get the ol' item level up in hopes that someday before 3.2 you can clear A3S. Seriously, please for your own sakes, just stop handwringing about that there is theoretically maybe a possibility of getting an entire gearset slightly better than your i210 raid drops because that's not the point of Diadem and it never was. It's not even clear at this point what kind of time commitment and realistic possibility getting such gear even is in the first place. Have fun grinding the poo poo out of diadem and stockpiling tokens and enjoy what BiS i210 you actually get instead of agonizing over what BiS i210 might exist.
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Nov 12, 2015 21:19
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Samba De Amigo posted:It's a dumb sentiment and I'm aware, but when the raids are designed around 8 people pulling their weight you want to try and make your team as successful as possible you start to get dumb ideas and thoughts like this. And just because you wipe at 1% or don't have that gear doesn't make it your fault or even necessarily your team's, but it doesn't stop you from wondering what if. Then stop wondering about it on your own. Because you shouldn't - Diadem gear won't make that big a difference. My incredibly casual-as-hell raidgroup that had attendance issues all throughout the middle of 3.0 is just now getting to the back half of Savage Alex. We've only really started getting 210 gear of any sort regularly. We still clown on A1S in two pulls at most these days, and were doing so in nearly all 200-or-lower gear, and we're getting pretty close to having A2S be that clean to kill too. And I know from what I've seen that A3S and A4S, like drat near all the fights in this game, will come down more to execution than to damage. For my part, I'm going to be getting my farthings, I'll do a bit of daily hunting and maybe some other stuff if it comes up and time permits, I'll probably do a bit of Diadem every now and then, and I'll be confident that I'll upgrade my 200 set to 210 at a good pace and be an effective, contributing member of the team. I cannot possibly conceive of the situation in which having .5% better sub-stats on one piece of gear would have Turned The Tide; the only 1% wipes I've seen in Yoshida's XIV have been down to execution, and subsequent pulls have always beaten the boss easily with time to spare. And I cannot, cannot conceive the early bosses of Alex Two being so tightly tuned that such optimization makes that much of a difference. Unless you are explicitly a world-first raider - unless such a contribution matters to the very existence of your group - do not worry about Diadem optimal gear. No, don't. Don't. This is a mental block, not one the game is putting up. The substats in this game don't matter that much*. You will be fine if you're in 210 gear by 3.2. You will be fine. *(Now, Diadem gear being comically better for DPS-contributing healers because healers want DPS-level accuracy and have the tools to do significant DPS but the item and dungeon design teams refuse to give them this accuracy and don't seem to design the fights around healers doing good DPS when they theoretically can and should... well, that's less about Diadem gear specifically and more about there being a disconnect on XIV's design team itself, and one that's been festering for two years. Diadem's loot design just happened, by accident I think, to stumble right into the middle of that problem. I can level with any healer, especially a Scholar, feeling like they have to rock full Diadem accuracy gear, because that elephant in the rooom's been getting particularly restless since 2.4, and I wish the design team would just finally address it one way or the other.) Also as someone who actually raids with Technogeek, this thread is about to get very strange for me
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Nov 12, 2015 21:21
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gently caress i'm agreeing with you on something
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Nov 12, 2015 21:23
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SpaceDrake posted:*(Now, Diadem gear being comically better for DPS-contributing healers because healers want DPS-level accuracy and have the tools to do significant DPS but the item and dungeon design teams refuse to give them this accuracy and don't seem to design the fights around healers doing good DPS when they theoretically can and should... well, that's less about Diadem gear specifically and more about there being a disconnect on XIV's design team itself, and one that's been festering for two years. Diadem's loot design just happened, by accident I think, to stumble right into the middle of that problem. I can level with any healer, especially a Scholar, feeling like they have to rock full Diadem accuracy gear, because that elephant in the rooom's been getting particularly restless since 2.4, and I wish the design team would just finally address it one way or the other.) Unfortunately, the Diadem Accuracy dream is dead. I've looked at probably 30 Diadem healing pieces, and no accuracy to be seen  ..but now I don't have to farm it  Talking to you guys has made me come around on Diadem gear - I think it's cool that it exists, and it's nice to have something to chase. I hope I get a few nice pieces before 3.2, but I also know how much of an outlier the good drops are. Also, the Pegasus owns.
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Nov 12, 2015 21:24
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That prompts another question: does Diadem healer gear include accuracy as a possible substat in the first place, or is it just piety crit det spellspeed? e: Well, that ^ answers that.
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Nov 12, 2015 21:25
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speaking of healer accuracy, im really glad there are no accuracy requirements for diadem proper if i was missing malefics i would be really sad on some of the IV/Vs that i can dps for extended periods
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Nov 12, 2015 21:26
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when you get a chance can you add the three new job icons as smileys on ffgoons, I can't do it myself since it requires uploads to the server
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Nov 12, 2015 21:27
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Hey people, you're just feeling the wrong things. Just chill out and don't feel those things. The game is a lot more fun if you don't feel.
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Nov 12, 2015 21:27
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Doublestep posted:speaking of healer accuracy, im really glad there are no accuracy requirements for diadem proper Yeah, i'm super glad about that. I hope they switch Accuracy to a sliding scale one day (hits do less damage / more damage depending on Accuracy), but i'll definitely take this over missing 3 Broils in a row during Hand of Pain.
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Nov 12, 2015 21:28
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Belzac posted:Hey people, you're just feeling the wrong things. Just chill out and don't feel those things. The game is a lot more fun if you don't feel. This but unironically.
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Nov 12, 2015 21:28
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SpaceDrake posted:Unless you are explicitly a world-first raider - unless such a contribution matters to the very existence of your group - do not worry about Diadem optimal gear. No, don't. Don't. This is a mental block, not one the game is putting up. The substats in this game don't matter that much*. You will be fine if you're in 210 gear by 3.2. I agree, and I'm aware the concept I expressed is pretty drat silly and I'm not worrying about it too heavily myself but I do see where people are coming from on this. I'm not arguing that the gear itself would fix the 1/10000000000 1% or less wipe; if that even happens just pull again and finish it off! That was us in Echo Chamber before echo hit T13. But I do feel like having that extra gear would facilitate your team better and relieve pressure from them; even if it's only like .00001% pressure from their shoulders. It's silly to take it to that much of an extreme, but I want to serve to help my teammates as much as I can. That being said I'm with you 100% on not worrying about it. The only way I WOULD worry is if those bard pants had actually been real and gear that silly with max substats across the board existed. Belzac posted:Hey people, you're just feeling the wrong things. Just chill out and don't feel those things. The game is a lot more fun if you don't feel. Now that I'm a skeleton without a heart everything is pretty cool Samba De Amigo fucked around with this message at 21:33 on Nov 12, 2015 |
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Nov 12, 2015 21:30
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