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The Sharmat
Sep 5, 2011

by Lowtax
Hereditary monarchy is crap and anyone that would choose Svanrige over Cerys hates Freedom.

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Tirranek
Feb 13, 2014

I think it's pretty funny now that I've finished the game how much Gaunter sticks out. After playing other games where eccentric = deep I thought he was just a normal NPC, and that his subtle vanishing off camera was jank. The fact his face wasn't reused is also pretty telling.

Megazver
Jan 13, 2006
This was a really good game.

Deakul
Apr 2, 2012

PAM PA RAM

PAM PAM PARAAAAM!

The combat is really good too, I don't get the criticism against it.
It's satisfying and requires a degree of skill to be really good at on higher difficulties.

The Sharmat
Sep 5, 2011

by Lowtax
As far as I can tell Dark Souls somehow ruined all other action RPG combat for a lot of people.

Terrible Horse
Apr 27, 2004
:I

Deakul posted:

The combat is really good too, I don't get the criticism against it.
It's satisfying and requires a degree of skill to be really good at on higher difficulties.

I found it great except for fighting sirens on cliff faces and similar situations (and outside of combat, anything remotely "platformy" was pretty finicky).

Deakul
Apr 2, 2012

PAM PA RAM

PAM PAM PARAAAAM!

Terrible Horse posted:

I found it great except for fighting sirens on cliff faces and similar situations (and outside of combat, anything remotely "platformy" was pretty finicky).

Ah, I haven't encountered sirens yet.

The platforming can be a little finicky though, yeah.

NatasDog
Feb 9, 2009

Terrible Horse posted:

I found it great except for fighting sirens on cliff faces and similar situations (and outside of combat, anything remotely "platformy" was pretty finicky).

God that section was frustrating. An overly frustrating section of an otherwise amazing game though, so I just sucked it up and moved on.

chunkles
Aug 14, 2005

i am completely immersed in darkness
as i turn my body away from the sun
Finished Hearts of Stone. A+++ pretty fun overall, although I thought it was sorta disappointing that O'Dimm appears to be the actual devil, I thought it would be more interesting if he was a more morally neutral spirit, instead of turning Ofieri's heart to stone, it turns out that granting Ofieri's wishes can't assuage his grief over Vlod's death. He also does seem to be pretty ambivalent up until Geralt wagers his soul, refusing to tell Geralt his true name because it would destroy him or whatever.

They also missed a golden opportunity to have Vlod possess random people at the wedding and gently caress around with them.

chunkles fucked around with this message at 22:39 on Nov 18, 2015

The Sharmat
Sep 5, 2011

by Lowtax
He's not the actual devil. He's just a really bad, really old, really powerful thing that likes to make deals. People are taking the testimony of the insane suicidal professor and the folklore allusions too literally I think.

Mystic Stylez
Dec 19, 2009

Is Melt Armor worth it (5 points?!) or should I skip to Firestream?

Also Aard seems like the weakest sign on paper, is it or the alternative mode any good?

Pellisworth
Jun 20, 2005

Mystic Stylez posted:

Is Melt Armor worth it (5 points?!) or should I skip to Firestream?

Also Aard seems like the weakest sign on paper, is it or the alternative mode any good?

Both Melt Armor and Firestream are just sort of alright. Firestream is better against lone targets or in tight spaces since it requires a channel, if you're mostly using Igni to blast groups of ghouls and such it may not be that useful. I don't notice a huge difference with Melt Armor, ymmv. Not everything has armor.

Aard is good for knocking fliers (like harpies especially) and humanoids on their rear end. Alt-Aard lets you do it in a radius around instead of a cone. Cool, but imo not that amazing.

Personally I'd say the best Signs tree picks are-

Delusion (Axii) for the dialogue options and I think it's underused in combat. Certainly a lot of enemies in the expansion are vulnerable to it.
Both low-tier Yrden abilities, the lightning turret is great and longer duration and the ability to have multiple traps out at once is also very nice.
Quen abilties if you like the alt-Quen bubble shield mode. Not my playstyle but powerful if that's your thing.

Everything else is pretty underwhelming imo.

Edit: basically Signs are mostly for utility than straight up damage, although the Burn effect from Igni can do a lot and the Yrden lightning turret is alright sustained damage.

Woozy
Jan 3, 2006

Mystic Stylez posted:

Is Melt Armor worth it (5 points?!) or should I skip to Firestream?

Also Aard seems like the weakest sign on paper, is it or the alternative mode any good?

Aard is ridiculous. Enemies who are knocked down by Aard can be executed without a fight. You'll have to find a way to pump up Sign Intensity to get reliable knock downs, however. Fortunately blue mutagens are the most plentiful early game so you can pretty easily craft one or two Greater Blues. Some enemies are less resistant to Aard than others, notably Harpies (that also drop blue mutagens), Nekkers, and almost anything that can fly. The alternate mode is cool but works best with a dedicated Griffin/signs build since it requires higher sign intensity to knockdown the same level of enemy as the regular Aard.

Pellisworth
Jun 20, 2005

Woozy posted:

Aard is ridiculous. Enemies who are knocked down by Aard can be executed without a fight. You'll have to find a way to pump up Sign Intensity to get reliable knock downs, however. Fortunately blue mutagens are the most plentiful early game so you can pretty easily craft one or two Greater Blues. Some enemies are less resistant to Aard than others, notably Harpies (that also drop blue mutagens), Nekkers, and almost anything that can fly. The alternate mode is cool but works best with a dedicated Griffin/signs build since it requires higher sign intensity to knockdown the same level of enemy as the regular Aard.

Yeah let me clarify, Aard is really good against the things it can knock down. Is it worth occupying an ability slot or two to give a it a longer range or fire in a radius rather than cone? I think not, but it's certainly a good sign.

Edit:

Signs in general

Aard - force wave in about 90 degree (?) cone in front of Geralt, staggers and has a chance to knock down enemies. Humanoids and fliers are particularly vulnerable to being knocked down and then you can one-hit coup-de-grace kill them (you are invulnerable for the duration of the kill animation).
Alt-Aard - does the same thing but in a 360 degree radius around you instead of a cone

Igni - blast of fire in about 90 degree (?) cone in front of Geralt, does a base amount of damage and has a chance to set enemies on fire. Burning enemies take damage as % of their max HP over time and may panic and dance around trying to put out the flames for a few seconds.
Alt-Igni - does the same but as a channeled flamethrower effect. Longer range, narrower cone and multiple ticks of damage make it more likely to set isolated targets on fire but you have to maintain the channel.

Yrden - creates a slow-zone trap that reduces enemy movement and attack speed.
Alt-Yrden - creates a lightning turret that repeatedly shocks a nearby enemy for decent damage, staggering them. Note you can have both regular slow-zone Yrdens and the alt-Yrden turrets active at once with the first tier talent.

Quen - generates a protective shield as a buffer, usually absorbs about one hit from anything serious.
Alt-Quen - channeled, incoming damage consumes stamina instead, can be talented to heal you on incoming damage. More reactive playstyle.

Axii - after a short channel, stuns an enemy.
Alt-Axii - after a short channel, charms an enemy for a few seconds to fight for you.


They're all good it just comes down to budgeting for ability slots. You only ever get 12 max. Axii seems underused by most players, I think.

Pellisworth fucked around with this message at 00:37 on Nov 19, 2015

Megazver
Jan 13, 2006
I think the alt-mode on Aard is great, but you don't need any of the other abilities for it.

The Sharmat
Sep 5, 2011

by Lowtax
There's like two mods that make the ability slot thing not matter and I'm tempted to use them because I hate that mechanic, but I worry it would be really overpowered.

Megazver
Jan 13, 2006
I've installed the mod that makes the yellow traits active without slotting them in and I thought that was a good balanced approach, overall.

Woozy
Jan 3, 2006
The radius has specific uses, notably against Wraiths who tend to be one of the more annoying enemies to fight. There are also a couple of scripted encounters that leave you surrounded in close quarters by enemies, and a few enemy types in the wild that have a swarming style of AI (wolves and dogs of any kind, including the monstrous wolves used by the Wild Hunt). The biggest advantage by far is being able to conveniently use Bombs whenever you want because no one is waiting to backstab you before or after you throw them, and the stun/knockdown effect ensures that the bomb will hit its target. The spell comes out fast and there's just a big quality of life element to being able to shake enemies off of you whenever you want.

As far as I know the improved range talent also makes the radius of the alternate mode bigger so I think its worth taking as long as you deliberately aren't going for a Whirlwind or Alchemy build to trivialize all combat for all time. Actually, it would probably work pretty well with a Whirl build too.

Edit: Has anyone put together a Beastiary guide with all the specific tactics and counters for enemies in the game? I started working on one for myself when the game came out but once people realized how ridiculous Alchemy builds got it seemed like a waste of time.

Woozy fucked around with this message at 00:47 on Nov 19, 2015

The Sharmat
Sep 5, 2011

by Lowtax
It'd probably still be worthwhile since the expansions are trending towards more difficult combat. I couldn't be lazy with it in Hearts of Stone like I was for the latter half of the base game.

Supreme Allah
Oct 6, 2004

everybody relax, i'm here
Nap Ghost

The Sharmat posted:

As far as I can tell Dark Souls somehow ruined all other action RPG combat for a lot of people.

Dragon's Dogma did it for me. Christ the combat in that game.

Pellisworth
Jun 20, 2005
Not to make too strong of a statement about Fallout 4 quite yet, but Witcher 3 has pretty much ruined me on Bethesda games too. I mean, F4 still does exploration and dungeon-diving better than W3, but it's a mile wide and an inch deep in terms of writing, plot, and characterization. Fallout 4 is very typical Bethesda, if you liked Fallout 3 and Skyrim you'll definitely enjoy F4 but there's nothing new or different about the gameplay other than settlement-building.

To stretch the metaphor a little, Wild Hunt somehow pulls off being a mile wide while also being a mile deep, it's truly amazing how high the quality of writing and animation are compared to F4.

It's sort of hard for me to consider Fallout 4 as an RPG, even, it's so weak in that department. A post-apocalyptic exploration/shooter with RPG elements? Ok yeah.

Supreme Allah
Oct 6, 2004

everybody relax, i'm here
Nap Ghost
I can't get into Fallout 4 at all right now, I end up going back to W3 and just wandering around. Maybe do a little shopping. This weekend if I have time I need to hammer down and get into F4 like it's my job.

WrightOfWay
Jul 24, 2010


Delusion 3 will always stagger an enemy, regardless of sign intensity. With enough stamina regen you can Axii, fast attack, Axii and keep any single enemy permanently stun locked while dealing damage. It's good.

Terrible Horse
Apr 27, 2004
:I
Are achievements broken? I think I've done all the contracts but haven't got Geralt: professional yet. I think there was another that I've definitely done (contract on Morkov or something) that I haven't got.

Wandering the land and killing bandit camps is lonely; I guess I should get Hearts of Stone. I'm gonna miss this game when its completely over.

Hector Delgado
Sep 23, 2007

Time for shore leave!!
Alt-Igni is great for shield-bearing enemies. I also enjoyed watching them burn to death. Good stuff.

Toadsmash
Jun 10, 2009

Dave Tate's downsy face approves.
Act 3 stuff having finally gotten around to finishing the game

I really don't feel like the Crones were a loose end that needed to be tied up. That sequence was anticlimactic, a bit out of character for Geralt/Ciri, and totally unnecessary. "Semi deific beings who everybody is rightly terrified of but aren't entirely a clear villain or ally" is a nice niche and not every big scary entity in the world needs to exist as a monster for the player to kill. Sounds like a problem Blizzard has had! In my mind, it makes the world feel bigger and more believeable when there are powerful beings with their own agenda that don't seemingly exist just for the player to kill them. I found the rationale for needing to fight them in the first place very weak from a plot standpoint, too, relative to the supposed danger they present by Geralt's own words.

mcbexx
Jul 4, 2004

British dentistry is
not on trial here!



Toadsmash posted:

"Semi deific beings who everybody is rightly terrified of but aren't entirely a clear villain or ally"

In what world are you living where eating children is kind of a grey area?

Nektu
Jul 4, 2007

FUKKEN FUUUUUUCK
Cybernetic Crumb

mcbexx posted:

In what world are you living where eating children is kind of a grey area?
The crones provide order and security to the humans in their area of influence. Granted, the rules you are required to follow and the prices you pay for their help are somewhere between harsh and horrific, but if you follow them, you can life a somewhat normal life.

The contrast to that would be the nature spirit they trapped in the tree (that I released like a moron :v:). That one just kills whoever, whenever because its nature and why the gently caress not.

The baron is another such character that really is not sympathetic at all. But he also provides a certain amount of order in what otherwise would be a completely anarchistic warzone.

Nektu fucked around with this message at 08:03 on Nov 19, 2015

THE AWESOME GHOST
Oct 21, 2005

Megazver posted:

I've installed the mod that makes the yellow traits active without slotting them in and I thought that was a good balanced approach, overall.

I mean didn't the game itself let you activate some abilities without them being equipped? I think they fixed that eventually but I think for example some of the stuff that raises toxicity limits was an actual passive

420 Gank Mid
Dec 26, 2008

WARNING: This poster is a huge bitch!

Nektu posted:

The crones provide order and security to the humans in their area of influence. Granted, the rules you are required to follow and the prices you pay for their help are somewhere between harsh and horrific, but if you follow them, you can life a somewhat normal life.

The contrast to that would be the nature spirit they trapped in the tree (that I released like a moron :v:). That one just kills whoever, whenever because its nature and why the gently caress not.

The baron is another such character that really is not sympathetic at all. But he also provides a certain amount of order in what otherwise would be a completely anarchistic warzone.


The crones hurt Ciri. The crones want her blood. The only greater threat to Ciri's survival than the crones is the Wild Hunt and Eredin himself. No way Geralt and Ciri walk off stage without talking care of business

Toadsmash
Jun 10, 2009

Dave Tate's downsy face approves.

420 Gank Mid posted:

The crones hurt Ciri. The crones want her blood. The only greater threat to Ciri's survival than the crones is the Wild Hunt and Eredin himself. No way Geralt and Ciri walk off stage without talking care of business

That's a fairly sensible line of reasoning, but it's not at all how the game presents it. If you wrap up Velen with the baron still alive, remember how Strenger wants to go back to the swamp with an army at his back to deal with them and he has to bribe Geralt to come with him at that point? Geralt wants nothing to do with it, and if you do accept, the matter of Ciri's safety isn't even mentioned. Neither is it mentioned at Bald Mountain -- they went there for Imlerith, whom they're told that even the Crones bow and scrape to, and it's treated as a matter of course that the Crones evidently have to go, too. Because they're in the way, I guess? They don't even talk about it. It's just assumed. That's what irked me about the whole sequence. For all the buildup that the witches got as these ancient, incredibly dangerous beings who everybody is scared out of their wits of, the matter of their deaths is treated as virtually an afterthought. I got the impression that they're nearly as much of a threat in their own right as the Wild Hunt itself, but Ciri is perfectly capable of doing away with them in a plain old fisticuffs duel with no outside help at all.

The Sharmat
Sep 5, 2011

by Lowtax
The Crone plot isn't wrapped up. The Weavess escape with an item of great personal importance to Ciri. Remember what they do with those? Also all the things people say in favor of the crones you could also say about a rancher in regards to his cows.

If they were as much of a threat as the Wild Hunt, why were they afraid of it? They only dared to go against them if doing so got them Ciri's blood (which would presumably propel them to new heights of power). That said yeah the fight could stand to be harder and it's weird that Geralt suddenly considers sending Ciri after the Crones instead of Imlerith as the safe option when if anything it would be the reverse.

The Sharmat fucked around with this message at 13:16 on Nov 19, 2015

The Sharmat
Sep 5, 2011

by Lowtax

Nektu posted:

The contrast to that would be the nature spirit they trapped in the tree (that I released like a moron :v:). That one just kills whoever, whenever because its nature and why the gently caress not.
You missed something big about the Tree Spirit. Hint: It's not at all different from the Crones in at least one key regard. Specifically It's not a druid or nature spirit at all. It's the Crones' mother. They rebelled against it, killed it, and it survived by locking itself in its tree. Its murders are not untargeted like it claims. Rather, it specifically targets anyone that worships the Ladies of the Wood because it hates them and wants to weaken them.

Nektu posted:

The baron is another such character that really is not sympathetic at all. But he also provides a certain amount of order in what otherwise would be a completely anarchistic warzone.

You missed some stuff here too, since he doesn't actually provide all that much order and is only in power because he's sending his men to steal from the locals to feed the Nilfgaardian army.

The Sharmat fucked around with this message at 13:24 on Nov 19, 2015

Mystic Stylez
Dec 19, 2009

Where can I find Nekker Hearts? I've got three by blowing up nests but I still need one more for White Raffards.

Also I'm not sure if I should really destroy those nests, because maybe I will need more of these later and then I can farm the Nekkers that spawn there?!

Renoistic
Jul 27, 2007

Everyone has a
guardian angel.
I'm at Velen and the enemy levels are completely out of whack in this game. I'm plaing on hardest, had no problems during the first area (except the Griffin which took a couple tries), got to the event with the guys burning the house of an elf and they kill me in a single hit while I had to single one guy out and hit him ~30 times before he died, and I'm not using starting equipment. Is there a decent mod which fixes this? I don't mind if some big monster one-hit kills Geralt but I shouldn't have to whack my sword at some deserter with shoddy equipment for a solid minute before downing him. It's not like the sword was broken or anything.

Crappy Jack
Nov 21, 2005

We got some serious shit to discuss.

Renoistic posted:

I'm at Velen and the enemy levels are completely out of whack in this game. I'm plaing on hardest, had no problems during the first area (except the Griffin which took a couple tries), got to the event with the guys burning the house of an elf and they kill me in a single hit while I had to single one guy out and hit him ~30 times before he died, and I'm not using starting equipment. Is there a decent mod which fixes this? I don't mind if some big monster one-hit kills Geralt but I shouldn't have to whack my sword at some deserter with shoddy equipment for a solid minute before downing him. It's not like the sword was broken or anything.

The mod that fixes this problem is called getting to about level 10, at which point the game becomes a cakewalk again, even on the hardest difficulty. In the early game, when you're playing on the hardest difficulty setting, the game will be pretty difficult.

Renoistic
Jul 27, 2007

Everyone has a
guardian angel.

Crappy Jack posted:

The mod that fixes this problem is called getting to about level 10, at which point the game becomes a cakewalk again, even on the hardest difficulty. In the early game, when you're playing on the hardest difficulty setting, the game will be pretty difficult.

That's just it. I don't want the game to be a cakewalk, I just want the enemy levels to make sense while still giving me a challenge. Geralt dying in a single hit is just as boring as him killing three enemies in a single stroke while tanking tons of damage. The Ranger difficulty in Metro 2033 was perfect - you died really quickly but so did your enemies.

I don't mind hard-to-kill monsters but spongy human enemies are the worst and completely take me off the game.

EDIT: The way the game is designed you pretty much HAVE to enable the immersion-breaking enemy lifebars so you can see their levels, since there is no way to tell which humans are made of flesh or are literally made of steel. I just turned it back on and those enemies are 7 levels above me. If the devs want to actively discourage the players from straying from the main quest and exploring the area, why even bother making an open world game? I enjoyed W2 immensely but 3 had been a major disappointment so far.

Renoistic fucked around with this message at 21:20 on Nov 19, 2015

Woozy
Jan 3, 2006
That area is really bad because its not meant for your level but the very first sidequest after White Orchard wraps up there (right next a different event-style quest that you get tricked into without realizing its way too high a level).

If you're determined to get through it you can cast Aard on the door to the house and let the captive free. She'll pick up a bow and kill the bandits for you. Otherwise just leave and stick to the main quest until at least level 7. Not trying to defend the game because that was a dumb pitfall I feel into as well.

Renoistic
Jul 27, 2007

Everyone has a
guardian angel.

Woozy posted:

That area is really bad because its not meant for your level but the very first sidequest after White Orchard wraps up there (right next a different event-style quest that you get tricked into without realizing its way too high a level).

If you're determined to get through it you can cast Aard on the door to the house and let the captive free. She'll pick up a bow and kill the bandits for you. Otherwise just leave and stick to the main quest until at least level 7. Not trying to defend the game because that was a dumb pitfall I feel into as well.

Thanks! I'll try that!

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chunkles
Aug 14, 2005

i am completely immersed in darkness
as i turn my body away from the sun

The Sharmat posted:

He's not the actual devil. He's just a really bad, really old, really powerful thing that likes to make deals. People are taking the testimony of the insane suicidal professor and the folklore allusions too literally I think.

C'mon though a crossroads? Only way it coulda been more of a classic devil blues tale is if Olgierd pulled out a guitar and performed a masterful rendition of Me and the Devil Blues with the musical talent he sold his soul for

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