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Barry Shitpeas posted:In Coldsnap maybe, Ice Age only had snow-covered lands And hardly anything cared about snow-covered lands but there were a bunch of hate cards for them. Like the best you got was Balduvian Conjuror or Gangrenous Zombies, but there were a bunch of creatures with Snow landwalk of various types or cards that only worked if your opponent had snow lands or whatever. It's weird to look back at old designs and see how much we take for granted about design now that wasn't understood at all back then. Things like appropriate power level for creatures and spells, how to do power/toughness counters properly, and having mechanics that aren't just dumb flavorful downsides.
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Nov 23, 2015 18:12
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 Hello, affinity. Also, ha, Spectral Chaos did artifact lands first.
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Nov 23, 2015 18:13
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The only thing Ice Age actually did with Snow was cards that cared whether you controlled snow lands or how many of them you had. Snow mana wasn't a thing. Snow creatures weren't a thing. (lol that Goblin Snowman isn't a Snow Creature) "Snow" wasn't even a supertype originally. Hell, "Legend" wasn't even a supertype back then. I don't think there even were supertypes then.
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Nov 23, 2015 18:16
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Punishes snow lands:IIIIIIIIII Rewards snow lands: IIIIIIIIIIIIIII Both at once??????: I Changes snow lands: II I may have counted wrong but you get the idea. And sometimes the reward is as marginal as "you get more mana for cumulative upkeep." The four best rewarding-snow cards are 3 different "prevent all damage" effects that recur for sacrificing a snow land, and Pestilence that costs 1 less. Imagine if 40% of Theros's enchantments matter cards were punishing the opponent for having enchantments and the pick of the litter were Fog, Fog, and Fog.
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Nov 23, 2015 18:22
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Entropic posted:The only thing Ice Age actually did with Snow was cards that cared whether you controlled snow lands or how many of them you had. Snow mana wasn't a thing. Snow creatures weren't a thing. (lol that Goblin Snowman isn't a Snow Creature) "Snow" wasn't even a supertype originally. Hell, "Legend" wasn't even a supertype back then. I don't think there even were supertypes then. Right, snow mana wasn't a thing yet, but card keyed off of snow lands being slightly different from basics, which is what OFS was saying.
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Nov 23, 2015 18:23
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Orange Fluffy Sheep posted:
that's not what theros was like? cuz i mean thats how i remember theros 
Zoness fucked around with this message at 18:40 on Nov 23, 2015 |
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Nov 23, 2015 18:24
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Basically a ton of early magic design was individually designed cards with no concept of set synergy and the cards themselves were mostly top-down flavour designs with more often than not a downside ability thrown in because flavour. There's a whole bunch of early cards, and even sets (looking at you Homelands) that seem like they were made by people with a basic understanding of the mechanics of magic who were going "if you made X as a magic card, what would its abilities be?" without any regard for it actually being a fun card to play or not. It's like this "Let's make politicians / tv shows / whatever into Magic Cards!" threads that pop up now and then but it was "let's make fantasy tropes into magic cards!"
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Nov 23, 2015 18:28
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The problem with Spectral Chaos is everything is so drat complicated. I'm a rules advisor and I'm sure Limited with that set would confuse me badly.
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Nov 23, 2015 18:30
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Ramos posted:
How would you even put that these days? T: Add one mana of any colour to your mana pool and put a depletion counter on ~. If ~ has a depletion counter on it, instead sacrifice it and add UUUU to your mana pool?
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Nov 23, 2015 18:36
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Sleep of Bronze posted:How would you even put that these days? Going by Gemstone Caverns, yeah, you got it more or less right.
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Nov 23, 2015 18:41
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Swords to Plowshares was originally costed at WW. Perhaps they should've kept it that way.
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Nov 23, 2015 18:46
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Chamale posted:The problem with Spectral Chaos is everything is so drat complicated. I'm a rules advisor and I'm sure Limited with that set would confuse me badly. Welcome to every single magic set before Mirage or so. Also Limited wasn't even a thing back then. This was originally designed before Ice Age even came out IIRC, booster draft hadn't been invented and Sealed was barely even a thing and they certainly weren't designing with it in mind. Again, stuff we take for granted in design now.
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Nov 23, 2015 18:47
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This has Swords to Plowshares and Southern Paladin and other card concepts printed in Alpha.
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Nov 23, 2015 18:50
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Orange Fluffy Sheep posted:Swords to Plowshares was originally costed at WW. Probably a typo, Swords was in the original playtest at W
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Nov 23, 2015 19:03
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Barry Shitpeas posted:Probably a typo, Swords was in the original playtest at W I know they started designing expansions before Alpha actually went to print. And the original playtest cards had weird cost templating, like Serra Angel was "5WW" which meant "5 mana, two of which has to be white".
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Nov 23, 2015 19:08
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Frozen_flame posted:The only Magic slashfic I found was one of Urabrask and Melira. The funny thing is you're being literal here. GeneX posted:Urabrask is a dude. The person you're quoting is somehow innocent enough to not know the meaning of slash fiction. frozen_flame is definitely not innocent.
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Nov 23, 2015 19:11
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Entropic posted:I know they started designing expansions before Alpha actually went to print.  there is no way that is the more recent templating
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Nov 23, 2015 19:15
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Orange Fluffy Sheep posted:Swords to Plowshares was originally costed at WW. The game would be worse for StP costing WW
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Nov 23, 2015 19:16
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Barry Shitpeas posted:
instead of saying "i plow your mom" i'm going to start saying "your mom takes up farming" and winking suggestively
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Nov 23, 2015 19:28
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black potus posted:instead of saying "i plow your mom" i'm going to start saying "your mom takes up farming" and winking suggestively I'm going to say "You can return your mom to your deck after your game" whilst waggling my eyebrows.
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Nov 23, 2015 19:30
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don't worry, you get your mom's power in life
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Nov 23, 2015 19:31
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Barry Shitpeas posted:
Alpha was just way better than current magic, judging by this card
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Nov 23, 2015 19:42
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if I know that my opponent's RL mother has died I'm going to be extra smug as I remind them that they cannot raise their mom from the dead
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Nov 23, 2015 19:42
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Ramos posted:
This card is like power 9 busted. Entropic posted:Basically a ton of early magic design was individually designed cards with no concept of set synergy and the cards themselves were mostly top-down flavour designs with more often than not a downside ability thrown in because flavour. There's a whole bunch of early cards, and even sets (looking at you Homelands) that seem like they were made by people with a basic understanding of the mechanics of magic who were going "if you made X as a magic card, what would its abilities be?" without any regard for it actually being a fun card to play or not. So basically like Legendary Cube. (It's really, really bad. It's the Timmiest of Timmy Cubes in an actively boring way).
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Nov 23, 2015 19:47
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Angry Grimace posted:This card is like power 9 busted. There's also a mox that taps for colourless mana. Basically another copy of Mox Emerald for most Vintage decks.
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Nov 23, 2015 19:49
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So, who is templating and proxying these up for cubes?
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Nov 23, 2015 19:50
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odiv posted:So, who is templating and proxying these up for cubes? Someone of them seem impossible to template without making the text box look like Demonic Consultation. Not sure how you'd even template a card that makes basic lands produce enemy colors AND nonbasics produce produce colorless. It's a blatantly unprintable card to begin with (it's Blood Moon and a Blood Moon variant for basics at the same loving time).
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Nov 23, 2015 19:54
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Barry Shitpeas posted:
Can we get a StP but with "target creature takes up farming?"
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Nov 23, 2015 19:54
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Fiend Computer posted:Can we get a StP but with "target creature takes up farming?" I will be perfectly fine with "takes up farming" becoming rules text for exile, controller gains life. Just put the rest in reminder text and it'll be fine.
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Nov 23, 2015 19:57
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Angry Grimace posted:Someone of them seem impossible to template without making the text box look like Demonic Consultation. Not sure how you'd even template a card that makes basic lands produce enemy colors AND nonbasics produce produce colorless. It's a blatantly unprintable card to begin with (it's Blood Moon and a Blood Moon variant for basics at the same loving time). Whenever a player taps a nonbasic land for mana, it produces colorless mana instead of any other type.. If tapped for mana, Plains produce {R/B}, Islands produce {R/G}, Swamps produce {W/G}, Mountains produce {W/U}, and Forests produce {U/B} instead of any other types. vvv That's a better templating. Niton fucked around with this message at 20:05 on Nov 23, 2015 |
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Nov 23, 2015 19:58
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It'd have to go by Reality Twist's oracle text.quote:If tapped for mana, Plains produce {R}, Swamps produce {G}, Mountains produce {W}, and Forests produce {B} instead of any other type.
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Nov 23, 2015 20:02
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Orange Fluffy Sheep posted:
Even better with Twincast
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Nov 23, 2015 20:18
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I need new sleeves. I've been using kmc perfect fit and hyper matte. Should I try any other brands?
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Nov 23, 2015 21:40
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Molybdenum posted:I need new sleeves. I've been using kmc perfect fit and hyper matte. Should I try any other brands? stay the course, kmc can do no wrong.
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Nov 23, 2015 21:42
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Zoness posted:stay the course, kmc can do no wrong. This is wrong. Dragonshield Matte sleeves are by far the best sleeves you can buy quality wise. Though if you are going to the KMC Route, the correct sleeves are the Hareruya ones.
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Nov 23, 2015 21:45
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Zoness posted:stay the course, kmc can do no wrong. First time I double sleeved Merfolk I had 2 sleeves break the first time I had to shuffle them on my first Wednesday of using them. And then a third the next Wednesday.
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Nov 23, 2015 21:46
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Molybdenum posted:I need new sleeves. I've been using kmc perfect fit and hyper matte. Should I try any other brands? Zoness posted:stay the course, kmc can do no wrong. This is correct. Hypermattes are great.
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Nov 23, 2015 21:47
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mcmagic posted:This is wrong. Dragonshield Matte sleeves are by far the best sleeves you can buy quality wise. Though if you are going to the KMC Route, the correct sleeves are the Hareruya ones. Shockingly, McMagic was right
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Nov 23, 2015 21:49
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Count Bleck posted:First time I double sleeved Merfolk I had 2 sleeves break the first time I had to shuffle them on my first Wednesday of using them. you gotta use a gentle touch  I've used both kmc's and dragon shields and I feel like kmc's are overall lighter which is great for riffle shuffling which I love to do because I'm some kind of idiot who doesn't care about card value or whatever. Dragon Shields just feel too heavy/thick or something I dunno man. oh yeah I'm not talking about kmc hyper mattes I forgot they existed. I bought like 400 hareryua style sleeves when they were on sale a while back 
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Nov 23, 2015 21:49
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Skyl3lazer posted:Shockingly, McMagic was right Of course i'm right. The Hypermattes are very nice as well but they split at the top too often...
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Nov 23, 2015 21:51
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