CanPol Megathread: Big Changus

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resistentialism: Aug 13, 2007

PT6A posted:

On the basis that we should just let suggestible mentally ill people run amok until they blow something up or cut a man's head off and nibble on it a bit? I agree that prison is not the right option, but we can't be having these folks, who are ill, running around without treatment. Illness or not. If someone had a dangerous "physical" disease like Ebola, we'd compel them to be quarantined and treated; that doesn't mean our society has a hatred of the Ebola-infected, just that it needs treatment.

Setting up elaborate and expensive entrapment schemes to see if someone is willing to commit violent acts in the name of foreign terrorist groups is not the right way to run a mental health program. Not that the RCMP was trying to run a mental health program, but that is the context of your bizarre defense of what the were doing.

If nothing else, you only get to test a really limited number of someones at once.

How about spending that money on education and providing treatment in a way that minimizes the stigma that keeps people from seeking help?

# ? Nov 23, 2015 20:12

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# ? May 15, 2024 07:09

Melian Dialogue: Jan 9, 2015; NOT A RACIST

Melian Dialogue fucked around with this message at 05:28 on Feb 2, 2016

# ? Nov 23, 2015 20:12

Juul-Whip: Mar 10, 2008

PT6A posted:

On the basis that we should just let suggestible mentally ill people run amok until they blow something up or cut a man's head off and nibble on it a bit? I agree that prison is not the right option, but we can't be having these folks, who are ill, running around without treatment. Illness or not. If someone had a dangerous "physical" disease like Ebola, we'd compel them to be quarantined and treated; that doesn't mean our society has a hatred of the Ebola-infected, just that it needs treatment.

Mental illness isn't deadly or contagious. Not everyone who is "suggestible" is an imminent threat to others the way an Ebola carrier is. Your comments really stigmatize people with addictions and mental illness, who are largely not dangerous and in fact are overwhelmingly the victims of violent crime, not the perpetrators. If we rounded up everyone who is "suggestible" and "mentally ill" we'd need a whole lot of mental health care facilities. Society came to a consensus some time ago that we should err on the side of people's fundamental human rights, rather than stuffing every misbehaving person into an institution.

If you want to call for more and better mental health care that's fine, but the situation with Nuttall and Korody is indefensible and wrong, and you're a first-class moron if you think they would have been scooped up by "Daesh recruiters" if the cops hadn't got to them first. Looking at that and saying "well at least they're off the street because mental health" a bit stinky.

Juul-Whip fucked around with this message at 20:25 on Nov 23, 2015

# ? Nov 23, 2015 20:17

Beelzebufo: Mar 5, 2015; Frog puns are toadally awesome

senae posted:

Rather than talking about how PT6A wants to kill some terrorists for the 13'th time, can someone explain how this could possibly be legal?

It's another one of those informal rules, Harper is a poor sport things.

# ? Nov 23, 2015 20:21

sbaldrick: Jul 19, 2006; Driven by Hate

senae posted:

Rather than talking about how PT6A wants to kill some terrorists for the 13'th time, can someone explain how this could possibly be legal?

It's legal but most of the people might be asked for to resignation, which is pretty easy in patronage appointments.

# ? Nov 23, 2015 20:25

flakeloaf: Feb 26, 2003; Still better than android clock

THC posted:

Society came to a consensus some time ago that we should err on the side of people's fundamental human rights, rather than stuffing every misbehaving person into an institution.

And then we overcorrected by dumping them all into the Sally Ann.

# ? Nov 23, 2015 20:26

Juul-Whip: Mar 10, 2008

Well yeah I mean it turns out a lot of that was just about cutting the welfare state so we could have lower taxes, but I still find it pretty chilling.

Tons of people are impressionable, and tons of people are pretty nasty and prone to lash out at others. But let's be honest, in our ideal society of universal mental health care and forced institutionalization, it would mostly be the poorest ones, (and of course aboriginals,) who would be sent to totally humane, well-funded and fully-equipped mental health facilities, staffed by only the most compassionate saintly nurses and orderlies, and filled with fluffy bunnies and sugar canes.

Juul-Whip fucked around with this message at 20:43 on Nov 23, 2015

# ? Nov 23, 2015 20:38

Postess with the Mostest: Apr 4, 2007; Arabian nights
'neath Arabian moons
A fool off his guard
could fall and fall hard
out there on the dunes

PhilippAchtel posted:

The conservative framing of the Paris bombing as well as calls for Trudeau to "reconsider" or "moderate" his position on refugees influenced the bizarre policy shift to "no singles dudes allowed". Absolutely, and I'm not irrational to make that connection given the timing of recent events.

The bombing itself may be a factor but we weren't talking about that so I left it out. The above statement is nonsense. I'd even like for it to be true because I'd be able to make fun of Trudeau for caving to the weakest of pressures but it's not. It's completely irrational, without any proof , disconnected from reality and borderline paranoid delusional. It makes you seem extremely biased against the conservatives and thus unable to critically evaluate the decisions of the current government. It is a crazy person argument, like saying that unicorns are also controlling Justin Trudeau and I can't prove they aren't.

Thankfully, it seems like you're in the small minority and most people seem to realize the buck stops with JT so he's the one accountable.

PhilippAchtel posted:

Anyway, arguing this point by proxy with you makes no sense. My comment was directly aimed at Ikanski, who knows and is now trying to weasel out of the statements and discussion I'm referring to.

Yeah, you're just proving my argument more: The people who think conservatives still have any power are the same nuts who think that Brad Wall and conservative facebook posts are partially responsible Justin's decision to refuse single male refugees. These people are the leftie mirror image of the "all muslims are terrorists" conservatives.

# ? Nov 23, 2015 20:46

flakeloaf: Feb 26, 2003; Still better than android clock

Mental illness causes poverty much more reliably than poverty causes mental illness.

But if you're alleging that the wealthy will be able to escape meaningful mental health care the same way they also escape meaningful drug rehab and criminal justice you're pretty much spot-on. Doesn't mean we shouldn't do it. Neither does the history of barbarism that sprung from the ignorance, superstition and downright social backwardness that permeated the asylums of old.

# ? Nov 23, 2015 20:46

Juul-Whip: Mar 10, 2008

Establish your mental health care system, fill it with minorities and homeless people, give it 20 years of budget cuts and "efficiencies", and watch as neglect and abuse become commonplace. We may have moved past the days of lobotomies and Nurse Ratched but our institutions can still be pretty careless, and the public still hates poor people and "Indians".

Juul-Whip fucked around with this message at 21:04 on Nov 23, 2015

# ? Nov 23, 2015 21:00

Dreylad: Jun 19, 2001

sbaldrick posted:

It's legal but most of the people might be asked for to resignation, which is pretty easy in patronage appointments.

Let's look at the article that it's linking to since it provides more context:

quote:

Former Conservative Prime Minister Stephen Harper�s cabinet quietly stacked government agencies and Crown corporations with dozens of �future appointments,� and early appointment renewals in the dying days of its regime, many of which were only scheduled to go into effect long after the Conservatives were defeated, iPolitics has learned.

While some had been due to come up for renewal in November and December, others were renewed up to a year in advance of when they had been scheduled to expire and made effective the date the appointees� current term was due to end.

For example, Mark O�Neill�s term as director of the Canadian Museum of History wasn�t scheduled to expire until June 2016. Last June, Harper�s cabinet renewed his $212,700 to $250,200 a year job for five years, effective June 2016.

John Badowski�s appointment as chairman of the Transportation Appeal Tribunal was renewed July 28. The renewal takes effect Jan. 1, 2019, and runs until July 29, 2020. The position currently pays between $174,700 and $205,500.

A review by iPolitics of order in council appointments by the Harper government found 49 appointments were made in recent months but scheduled to only take effect after the Oct. 19 election. Of the 49 appointments, 15 went into effect between election day and November 22. Six take effect today.

Another 28 are slated to go into effect between November 26 and January 2019.

Of the 49 future appointments and early renewals, 29 were adopted in a single day � June 18, 2015. The earliest dates to November 2014 when National Farm Products Council member Michael Pickard�s mandate was renewed for three years, effective April 2016.

The move by Harper�s government constrains Liberal Prime Minister Justin Trudeau�s ability to put his government�s stamp on some key agencies like the National Energy Board, which regulates things like the construction of pipelines and the import of crude oil and natural gas.

For example, National Energy Board member Lyne Mercier was due to be renewed in December. Instead, Harper�s government renewed the appointment for seven years last June, effective in December. In July, Keith Chaulk was appointed to the National Energy Board for seven years, effective Nov. 23. Both are scheduled to remain on the board until 2022.

Jacques Gauthier, a temporary member of the National Energy Board, was renewed in April, well before his mandated to expire in December. He is now to sit until 2018. Another temporary member, Michael Richmond, was renewed for three years last April, effective Nov. 1, the day his term was set to expire.

The moves mean that barring the future appointments or early renewals being rescinded, the Trudeau government will not be able to replace any temporary members of the National Energy Board until at least May 2018 and any permanent members of the NEB until January 2020 � which is after the next election.

Many of the future appointments could be hard to undo without risking litigation. Of the 49 early renewals and future appointments, 24 are conditional on �good behaviour,� meaning appointees can only be stripped of their positions for bad conduct.
Another 20 appointments, however, were made �during pleasure� meaning the government can terminate the appointment for little or no reason.

One reappointment, of honourary consul Ricardo Guimaraes, which takes effect in December, can be cancelled by either side on 60 days notice. Four appointments do not spell out the terms of the appointment.

While some governor in council appointments are full time jobs with six figure salaries, others may be part time jobs paid per diems of a few hundred dollars each time they attend a meeting.

Governments appointments in the dying days of an administration has at times been controversial.

In the 1984 election campaign, former Conservative Leader Brian Mulroney politically eviscerated former Liberal Prime Minister John Turner for making dozens of appointments that went into effect just before he called the election. The controversy over the appointments contributed to Mulroney winning the election in a landslide.

Liberal Senator Percy Downe, who handled appointments for three years for former Prime Minister Jean Chr�tien before then becoming his chief of staff, says making appointments that run into the next government�s mandate is �unbelievable� and unprecedented.
�The longstanding tradition has been that a current government can�t bind a future government�.You don�t make appointments that are two years ahead of time on the eve of an election.�

Downe said reappointments would normally only be done two or three months ahead of time and was surprised to learn that some reappointments done by Harper�s cabinet only take effect more than a year later.

�That�s way in advance. That�s unbelievable.�

Downe is particularly concerned by the Harper government�s move to block the Trudeau government from making any appointments to the National Energy Board for several years.

�I have never heard of the like of that ever � that�s amazing, that�s a big story. Particularly with the National Energy Board they were trying to tie the hands of the future government which is not fair game at all.�

Downe said he believes the government can cancel the appointments, if it desires, even the ones that were made subject to good behaviour.

�The bad conduct may simply be the way it was done. It�s unprecedented to do appointments years ahead of time.�

Cory Hann, spokesman for interim Conservative Leader Rona Ambrose, said it will be up to the Liberal government to decide what to do.

�It will be up to the current government to determine if it wishes to overturn any appointments or re-appointments made by the previous government.�

Officials from the prime minister�s office have not yet responded to questions from iPolitics.

The list is at the bottom of the article. And it looks like this has happened in the past -- 30 years ago. Some of these appointments can be overturned, others can't without risking litigation (or proof of bad behaviour).

It includes the head of Via Rail, Canada Post, Human Rights Tribunal, the heads of both Canadian History Museum and Natural History Museum, the National Energy Board as the article mentions, and the Immigration Refugee Board. At a glance most of the appointees to Crown Corporations can be dismissed at will.

Dreylad fucked around with this message at 21:04 on Nov 23, 2015

# ? Nov 23, 2015 21:00

Risky Bisquick: Jan 18, 2008; PLEASE LET ME WRITE YOUR VICTIM IMPACT STATEMENT SO I CAN FURTHER DEMONSTRATE THE CALAMITY THAT IS OUR JUSTICE SYSTEM.; Buglord

vyelkin posted:

The biggest issue is that we have two perfect examples from the last fifteen years of large-scale military interventions making their region somehow even worse, more violent, less stable, and less secure than it was before. Afghanistan is still fighting what's essentially a civil war now, 14 years later, and Iraq for a long time was essentially a failed state under military occupation, and still lacks any kind of strong central governance or security apparatus 12 years later. The biggest problem with Western military intervention is not the intervention itself (the Taliban are bad, Saddam Hussein was bad, and ISIS are also bad; the world will not be a worse place for any of those people being removed from power) but the lack of any kind of political drive to actually follow through once the military campaign is over and rebuild the destroyed country into a functioning state. We know full well that the West's military could wipe out ISIS a hundred times over. Any one Western country could probably wipe out ISIS's central military and government institutions in short order if we really decided to go in 100% like the US did in Afghanistan and Iraq. This of course is ignoring, for the sake of argument, the fact that what ISIS wants more than anything else is for the West to invade them, and we shouldn't give them what they want.

The problem is what happens next. We lack any political will to sink billions of dollars into rebuilding a country once we've gone in, done our oorah-military-thing, and destroyed all its institutions. Do you know the reason why ISIS has any level of popular support at all? It's because they're providing functioning political and social institutions where there were none before. The people may not like everything ISIS is doing, but the fact that they're putting police on the streets, operating hospitals, and employing people in their military and civil service means a lot of people are willing to overlook the horrible things they do because it's better than living in the middle of a warzone. If we go in, destroy those institutions again and then leave without rebuilding them, all that's going to happen is we're going to create a power vacuum again and someone equally bad or worse is going to fill it and five or ten years from now we're going to be facing down calls for a fourth Iraq War because ISIS 2.0 took over.

I, personally, and I think most people who are against direct military intervention in the form of bombs, are not against it because of potential civilian casualties, even though those are obviously something we should avoid at all costs. ISIS are horrible and should be eliminated, period. But they have to be destroyed in a way that doesn't create a power vacuum in the region, and that is going to take a long time and be much less clean and immediately gratifying than dropping bombs on things, especially because bombing things is a perfect way to destroy institutions in the first place. The most effective thing we can do to defeat ISIS in the long term is to rebuild regions that are retaken from ISIS territory, and to strengthen the regional actors that we can remotely stand so that they can occupy that territory and hold it. For Canada, that means humanitarian aid to refugees, logistical support to rebuild infrastructure, and military support for ground forces like the Kurds that can actually take and hold territory--and to Trudeau's credit, these are the kinds of commitments he's actually proposing Canada make. Bombing from the air is no way to actually defeat ISIS without an equivalent commitment to a) ground forces to take and hold territory from them; and b) logistical and humanitarian support to rebuild that territory. Otherwise we'll just occasionally blow up a hospital or school and then get bewildered when ten years from now the people of this region are supporting a new horrible pseudo-state because they reopened hospitals and schools and actually bothered to govern the territory.

Iraq without the US hand holding is now a puppet of Iran. Without the Iranian militias hand holding they would have lost so much more. You [not directed at you] can't simply state I want to bomb [group] without a concrete plan as to what follows next, it's crazy and been proven in the region to be a failed strategy.

PT6A posted:

If we ended the insane maze of funding and proxy wars, do you think Syria would then simply pull itself out of the insane situation it's currently in and stabilize? No, we need to do that and combine it with military intervention with only two sides: Daesh and everyone else.

So you want to bomb ISIS, ok great you kill them all somehow through black magic and there are no members left anywhere on the globe. Bad photos/videos of murders are no longer placed on social media for a while.

What is the endgame with ISIS now gone? What about the FSA, various kurds, various 'moderate' islamists, turkey, Assad, Russian, and KSA interests? Do you think the war ends with ISIS?

Those Islamists that wish to wage jihad now join the next latest and greatest Islamist group. What now? You've destroyed their main group ISIS, but the message still exists and the recruits are still willing to die insha'Allah.

This is assuming you can ~~end~~ decisively end a guerilla war against the same group (al Qaeda in Iraq) that survived a previous decade of US military occupation.

Risky Bisquick fucked around with this message at 21:57 on Nov 23, 2015

# ? Nov 23, 2015 21:06

brucio: Nov 22, 2004

[http://news.nationalpost.com/news/canada/gay-men-will-be-included-among-syrian-refugees-in-addition-to-women-children-families

quote:

The federal government will include gay men among the Syrian refugees it brings into Canada as part of a plan that puts the focus on accepting women, children and families.

The Citizen has learned that while the Liberal government, because of potential security concerns, will not accept lone males � at least during the first wave of migrants � this approach will come with an important caveat. The government is sensitive to the fact that gay men escaping violence in the region could be persecuted, so they will be permitted to come to Canada.

So what's the "gay" screening going to look like?

# ? Nov 23, 2015 21:27

Juul-Whip: Mar 10, 2008

Bring back the fruit machine.

# ? Nov 23, 2015 21:29

Dreylad: Jun 19, 2001

The RCMP sighed as it dusted off its Fruit Machine.

edit: aw god dammit THC

# ? Nov 23, 2015 21:30

Juul-Whip: Mar 10, 2008

Don't worry guys - the systematic persecution of single adult males has never, ever resulted in bad things happening.

# ? Nov 23, 2015 21:43

Reince Penis: Nov 15, 2007; by R. Guyovich

THC posted:

Don't worry guys - the systematic persecution of single adult males has never, ever resulted in bad things happening.

I'm sure they'll all stay behind and work hard to rebuild their societies (without any women) peacefully and not be bitter at all.

# ? Nov 23, 2015 21:44

Kafka Esq.: Jan 1, 2005; "If you ever even think about calling me anything but 'The Crab' I will go so fucking crab on your ass you won't even see what crab'd your crab" -The Crab(TM)

Freeland got a little pasted by Maher's "reasonable bigot" shtick.

edit: Context.

edit2: watching it again, it really shows how little Freeland understands Maher's debate tactics. He made her point before she even finishes her first sentence.

That whole exchange should have gone like this:

Maher: Their values are at odds with our values. That may not be wrong. If you are in this religion, you probably have values that are odds with OUR values. Those values are not OUR values. *quotes David Cameron on the so-called Islamic values like forced marriage and honor killing*
Freeland: I disagree with that. Let's stand up for real diversity.
Maher: So keeping women as second class citizens is standing up for real diversity?
Freeland: Nice try, Bill, but what you've done is said that the values of these refugees are somehow equivalent to the worst in the Islamic world, and real diversity is recognizing that what you said isn't true. We're not going to say that Muslims are worse than Christians or Jews -
Maher: The IDEAS are worse. That's what it comes down to.
Freeland: You're willing to tell thousands of the most secular Muslims in the Middle East that they're actually running TOWARDS the infidel West because they're secretly hiding their wish to be able to do female circumcision in a place where it is illegal? Don't be ridiculous, those people have already joined up with ISIS. They're not the ones coming to the US and Canada.
Dude from Manhattan: Let's extrapolate these Turkish opinion polls to all Muslims and -
Freeland: No, just loving no. You don't get to take a Pew poll in Turkey and apply it to 1.5 billion Muslims so your rhetoric works out in the wash. Your argument is that refugees are dangerous, because they will export the worst ideas, and I've pointed out why that falls flat. Do you have anything else that isn't a cheap trick?

Kafka Esq. fucked around with this message at 22:24 on Nov 23, 2015

# ? Nov 23, 2015 21:48

MohawkSatan: Dec 20, 2008; by Cyrano4747

Melian Dialogue posted:

Dogpiling on PT6A is bad enough, but creating a dogpile based off of a really bad interpretation of what he said is even dumber. I get that PT6A is the best we got other than Ikanstki for a "Conservative" poster but go post on your racist uncle's Facebook page if you really need to get your rocks off calling out a right-winger.

I think I'm probably one of the more right-wing people in here, purely because of my views on gun stuff, but the mental illness stuff he was saying is right loving out there. Someone who's completely hosed between mental illness and drugs can be convinced over the course of several months to make a bomb? Lock'em up? That's goddamned insane. There's a lot of hosed up things people can and will do, but picking on the people who legitimately need help, and even implying you're gonna improve poo poo by loving with them even more? Yeah, no, that's straight up bullshit, and deserving of a dogpile.

Also, gently caress Maher, and Freeland has gone up a notch in my book.

# ? Nov 23, 2015 23:05

Melian Dialogue: Jan 9, 2015; NOT A RACIST

Melian Dialogue fucked around with this message at 05:29 on Feb 2, 2016

# ? Nov 23, 2015 23:55

namaste friends: Sep 18, 2004; by Smythe

loving lolling at Freeland getting shrill. Yet again Canadian liberal has worthless opinions.

The only person with a coherent defence against mahrer's nonsense about Islam is Reza Aslan.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/p...r-a6738161.html

Stop listening to or watching bill mahrer and save some brain cells

# ? Nov 24, 2015 00:13

Eej: Jun 17, 2007; HEAVYARMS

The crazy part is everyone dogpiling on PT6A for a strawman when he also said that the international community should rally around Assad to fight ISIS and then we'll deal with the consequences after.

# ? Nov 24, 2015 00:19

vyelkin: Jan 2, 2011

Eej posted:

The crazy part is everyone dogpiling on PT6A for a strawman when he also said that the international community should rally around Assad to fight ISIS and then we'll deal with the consequences after.

PT6A is the prose version of that meme with the picture of Smilin' Saddam and bold impact font saying "Miss me yet?"

# ? Nov 24, 2015 00:26

A Typical Goon: Feb 25, 2011

Here's a helpful hint for discussing the Syrian civil war with anyone: if someone unironically states that supporting the Assad regime is a good or sensible way to end the conflict it's ok to assume that person doesn't know poo poo about the Syrian civil war

Case in point: PT6A's posts in this thread

# ? Nov 24, 2015 01:03

flakeloaf: Feb 26, 2003; Still better than android clock

"Brad Wall has softened his stance on the Syrian refugee issue after discussing it with representatives from the federal government, who he says have eased some of his concerns..."

That's one way to put it. Another way would be to say that he's slowed down his ridiculous fearmongering after a conversation with someone who knows what the gently caress they're talking about revealed to him that he does not, and that maybe he shouldn't go running his stupid mouth on behalf of over a million people.

# ? Nov 24, 2015 01:24

Panas: Nov 1, 2009

A Typical Goon posted:

Here's a helpful hint for discussing the Syrian civil war with anyone: if someone unironically states that supporting the Assad regime is a good or sensible way to end the conflict it's ok to assume that person doesn't know poo poo about the Syrian civil war

Case in point: PT6A's posts in this thread

Civil wars generally end in lovely compromises. Negotiating peace never ends with the "bad guys" getting beheaded or imprisoned while all the moderates take control and democracy grows like a beautiful flower. If there is ever going to be peace in Syria, it needs to be done with the cooperation of the Assad regime.

# ? Nov 24, 2015 01:37

A Typical Goon: Feb 25, 2011

Panas posted:

Civil wars generally end in lovely compromises. Negotiating peace never ends with the "bad guys" getting beheaded or imprisoned while all the moderates take control and democracy grows like a beautiful flower. If there is ever going to be peace in Syria, it needs to be done with the cooperation of the Assad regime.

Why would the FSA/Nusra ever agree to peace under those terms? Assad started the war by turning his guns on peaceful protestors and accelerated it by imprisoning/torturing/murdering tens of thousands. Why would Sunni Syrian Arabs ever agree to go back to being subjugated by a minority Alawite regime?

A Typical Goon fucked around with this message at 02:00 on Nov 24, 2015

# ? Nov 24, 2015 01:57

unlimited shrimp: Aug 30, 2008

Kafka Esq. posted:

Freeland got a little pasted by Maher's "reasonable bigot" shtick.

edit: Context.

edit2: watching it again, it really shows how little Freeland understands Maher's debate tactics. He made her point before she even finishes her first sentence.

That whole exchange should have gone like this:

Maher: Their values are at odds with our values. That may not be wrong. If you are in this religion, you probably have values that are odds with OUR values. Those values are not OUR values. *quotes David Cameron on the so-called Islamic values like forced marriage and honor killing*
Freeland: I disagree with that. Let's stand up for real diversity.
Maher: So keeping women as second class citizens is standing up for real diversity?
Freeland: Nice try, Bill, but what you've done is said that the values of these refugees are somehow equivalent to the worst in the Islamic world, and real diversity is recognizing that what you said isn't true. We're not going to say that Muslims are worse than Christians or Jews -
Maher: The IDEAS are worse. That's what it comes down to.
Freeland: You're willing to tell thousands of the most secular Muslims in the Middle East that they're actually running TOWARDS the infidel West because they're secretly hiding their wish to be able to do female circumcision in a place where it is illegal? Don't be ridiculous, those people have already joined up with ISIS. They're not the ones coming to the US and Canada.
Dude from Manhattan: Let's extrapolate these Turkish opinion polls to all Muslims and -
Freeland: No, just loving no. You don't get to take a Pew poll in Turkey and apply it to 1.5 billion Muslims so your rhetoric works out in the wash. Your argument is that refugees are dangerous, because they will export the worst ideas, and I've pointed out why that falls flat. Do you have anything else that isn't a cheap trick?

Didn't read the preamble closely enough and briefly thought this fantasy was reality

# ? Nov 24, 2015 02:00

Postess with the Mostest: Apr 4, 2007; Arabian nights
'neath Arabian moons
A fool off his guard
could fall and fall hard
out there on the dunes

Kafka Esq. posted:

Freeland got a little pasted by Maher's "reasonable bigot" shtick.

That whole exchange should have gone like this:

Maher: Their values are at odds with our values. That may not be wrong. If you are in this religion, you probably have values that are odds with OUR values. Those values are not OUR values. *quotes David Cameron on the so-called Islamic values like forced marriage and honor killing*
Freeland: I strongly disagree. After the paris attack, it's more important than ever not to discriminate against the muslim faith. Canada recognizes that the problem isn't muslims, the problem is actually straight, single men and we've based our official policy around that idea.

Bam, discussion finished, agreement all around, let's go get a beer.

# ? Nov 24, 2015 02:37

Count Roland: Oct 6, 2013

A Typical Goon posted:

Here's a helpful hint for discussing the Syrian civil war with anyone: if someone unironically states that supporting the Assad regime is a good or sensible way to end the conflict it's ok to assume that person doesn't know poo poo about the Syrian civil war

Its certainly not good and it might not be sensible, but it might be a way to actually end the thing. Insisting Assad leave power has created a catastrophe that can hardly get any worse. It can always get worse.

# ? Nov 24, 2015 02:51

Arivia: Mar 17, 2011

Ikantski posted:

That whole exchange should have gone like this:

Maher: Their values are at odds with our values. That may not be wrong. If you are in this religion, you probably have values that are odds with OUR values. Those values are not OUR values. *quotes David Cameron on the so-called Islamic values like forced marriage and honor killing*
Freeland: I strongly disagree. After the paris attack, it's more important than ever not to discriminate against the muslim faith. Canada recognizes that the problem isn't muslims, the problem is actually straight, single men and we've based our official policy around that idea.

Bam, discussion finished, agreement all around, let's go get a beer.

As someone with a women's studies degree, this is completely true.

# ? Nov 24, 2015 02:57

Marijuana Nihilist: Aug 27, 2015; by Smythe

Arivia posted:

As someone with a women's studies degree

wow and i felt bad about my life choices

zing!

# ? Nov 24, 2015 03:05

vyelkin: Jan 2, 2011

A Typical Goon posted:

Why would the FSA/Nusra ever agree to peace under those terms? Assad started the war by turning his guns on peaceful protestors and accelerated it by imprisoning/torturing/murdering tens of thousands. Why would Sunni Syrian Arabs ever agree to go back to being subjugated by a minority Alawite regime?

Because we the West decided that ISIS is the worst thing ever since Hitler and therefore everyone around the entire world agrees that ISIS is the worst thing ever since Hitler and therefore if we decide we're going to make deals with their enemies to defeat ISIS then they will go "yep seems legit" and support us 100%.

# ? Nov 24, 2015 03:14

Beelzebufo: Mar 5, 2015; Frog puns are toadally awesome

It does seem like everybody has forgotten the phrase "industrial scale killing" that was used to describe the Assad regime in early 2014. ISIS causes media stir with shocking violence, but the kind of detached systematic killing Assad was/is doing seems way worse. Not that ISIS hasn't been doing that too, but it's not what makes the news about them.

# ? Nov 24, 2015 04:26

Funkdreamer: Jul 15, 2005; It'll be a blast

Canadian airstrike alleged to have killed 10 civilians in Iraq

"Canada's military is facing fresh allegations its bombs may have killed civilians in Iraq, CBC News has learned, following reports in local media that 10 civilian workers were allegedly killed after an airstrike by Canadian warplanes last week."

Hearts and minds

# ? Nov 24, 2015 04:40

St. Dogbert: Mar 17, 2011

Sad news from Alberta - PC MLA Manmeet Bhullar was killed in a car accident today.

# ? Nov 24, 2015 05:34

David Corbett: Feb 6, 2008; Courage, my friends; 'tis not too late to build a better world.

Apparently he was a great guy. I've heard that it happened because he had stopped to help someone who had gotten stuck, but he ended up getting hit by a semi truck. Awful.

# ? Nov 24, 2015 05:47

Excelzior: Jun 24, 2013

Sedge and Bee posted:

It does seem like everybody has forgotten the phrase "industrial scale killing" that was used to describe the Assad regime in early 2014. ISIS causes media stir with shocking violence, but the kind of detached systematic killing Assad was/is doing seems way worse. Not that ISIS hasn't been doing that too, but it's not what makes the news about them.

yeah but ISIS is pretending to do it in the name of Allah, which makes it 1,452 times worse in PT6A's view

a little brutal repression is a-ok as long as it is done in the name of secular authoritarianism

# ? Nov 24, 2015 06:10

Albino Squirrel: Apr 25, 2003; Miosis more like meiosis

St. Dogbert posted:

Sad news from Alberta - PC MLA Manmeet Bhullar was killed in a car accident today.

He was a good guy from all accounts. He had the stones to start investigating the epidemic of deaths of children in care, while Human Services minister. He also seemed to give a crap about providing funding for the homeless, which is far more than I can say for a lot of his caucus colleagues.

Also Highway 2 is a loving nightmare near Red Deer anytime there's precipitation, let alone a blizzard.

# ? Nov 24, 2015 06:26

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# ? May 15, 2024 07:09

The Duggler: Feb 20, 2011; I do not hear you, I do not see you, I will not let you get into the Duggler's head with your bring-downs.

Never help anybody

# ? Nov 24, 2015 06:31

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > CanPol Megathread: Big Changus

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