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adding starvation cobs was the food overhaul 
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Nov 30, 2015 06:35
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Tactics such as "gently caress you, melee". Lasty really, REALLY hates melee characters, apparently.
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Nov 30, 2015 06:36
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this is all horrible put it back!!
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Nov 30, 2015 06:36
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Someone Awful! posted:Already done in trunk! Have fun! :iamafag: It's gonna be the summoner meta, because gently caress not having minions to block rMut (until malmutate becomes smite targeted, so you must use the Firestorm Tactic to avoid mutations in an interesting fashion).
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Nov 30, 2015 06:36
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Internet Kraken posted:I like how the commit says warding was the least interesting amulet. Rather than gourmand, which gives the exciting effect of EAT MORE FOOD. The Mattybee posted:Tactics such as "gently caress you, melee".
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Nov 30, 2015 06:37
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Honestly I kinda liked warding for situations like curse skulls/elf:3/literally anything that summoned, but maybe I'm the only one who thought it was half-decent 
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Nov 30, 2015 06:37
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In my head, all I can see is SWAT team clearing a room with a flashbang assisted entry, and Lasty appearing out of nowhere, knee-capping the cop and shouting "TACTICS NOT TOYS!" and running off like a lunatic. I don't get how having less options is more tactical, at all.
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Nov 30, 2015 06:39
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Internet Kraken posted:I like how the commit says warding was the least interesting amulet. Rather than gourmand, which gives the exciting effect of EAT MORE FOOD. Gourmand is great now that autoeat is in by default. Never worry about hunger costs again! Everything else about these changes is awful though. But hey, good way to force people to read id everything, and never play without investing in throwing or casting because just being a melee character means you sure don't know tactics. Crawl 0.18: just learn tactics, noobs
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Nov 30, 2015 06:39
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Haifisch posted:Don't worry, they'll make it so swapping it out sets you to Fainting status. No, based on most of his previous changes he loving HATES melee. Things Lasty loving loves: monsters who do ridiculous melee damage, monsters inflicting hunger damage, corrosion. Idk what tactics a melee guy is supposed to use again malmutators without rMut.
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Nov 30, 2015 06:39
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Someone Awful! posted:Honestly I kinda liked warding for situations like curse skulls/elf:3/literally anything that summoned, but maybe I'm the only one who thought it was half-decent It's kind of niche, but it's very good against god wrath summons, specially Trog's since all they do is melee. It's also very good if you worship Xom and he decides to summon a small army of summons to fight you.
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Nov 30, 2015 06:39
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FR: just add an abyss banish chance / glow chance to all rings and amulets and... gently caress it to all equipment, and also all staircases
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Nov 30, 2015 06:39
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apple posted:It's gonna be the summoner meta, because gently caress not having minions to block rMut (until malmutate becomes smite targeted, so you must use the Firestorm Tactic to avoid mutations in an interesting fashion). More like the "never do extended" meta. People think extended isn't very fun? Well lets make it even WORSE! :iamafag: Someone Awful! posted:Honestly I kinda liked warding for situations like curse skulls/elf:3/literally anything that summoned, but maybe I'm the only one who thought it was half-decent I used warding on a lot of extended characters just for the rN+ pip. The protection from summons was a nice bonus though. Now I'm just never going to touch it.
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Nov 30, 2015 06:40
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Someone Awful! posted:Honestly I kinda liked warding for situations like curse skulls/elf:3/literally anything that summoned, but maybe I'm the only one who thought it was half-decent The Mattybee posted:Idk what tactics a melee guy is supposed to use again malmutators without rMut. That's pretty much it.
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Nov 30, 2015 06:41
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The Mattybee posted:No, based on most of his previous changes he loving HATES melee. Well, based on chat in IRC you should just learn to always train throwing, or just walk up the nearest stairs and wait. And if you don't want to invest in throwing (or rods I guess), well, get hosed.
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Nov 30, 2015 06:42
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Whenever I try to go against Shining Eyes without rMut I end up hopelessly mutated. Did those get toned down too? Or do you hope you just get enough cMut?
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Nov 30, 2015 06:42
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Internet Kraken posted:The rot on removal of regeneration is just pathetic. Hey, want to actually keep the player from just equipping it to heal fast and taking it off? Have it not do anything until the player reaches full health once. There, problem solved without giving it an obnoxious downside that will make people just throw it away as soon as they find it. Yeah, a better solution can be reached to stop 'tactical swapping' by just going the gourmand amulet route if you absolutely must do retarded poo poo like this.
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Nov 30, 2015 06:42
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Mr. Despair posted:Well, based on chat in IRC you should just learn to always train throwing, or just walk up the nearest stairs and wait. Stairdancing/pressing 5: INTERESTING PLAY
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Nov 30, 2015 06:43
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Mr. Despair posted:Well, based on chat in IRC you should just learn to always train throwing, or just walk up the nearest stairs and wait. in fairness why wouldn't you invest in throwing or evo, how much else do you have to put xp into as a straight melee?
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Nov 30, 2015 06:43
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The Mattybee posted:Stairdancing/pressing 5: INTERESTING PLAY Tactical Espionage Action.
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Nov 30, 2015 06:44
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The Mattybee posted:Stairdancing/pressing 5: INTERESTING PLAY
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Nov 30, 2015 06:44
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odiv posted:Whenever I try to go against Shining Eyes without rMut I end up hopelessly mutated. Did those get toned down too? Or do you hope you just get enough cMut? lol Someone Awful! posted:in fairness why wouldn't you invest in throwing or evo, how much else do you have to put xp into as a straight melee? That is clearly more xp that can be going into armour and dodging (throwing is really good, I agree it's already pretty dumb not to invest in it, but making it even dumber to not be able to go ranged is also pretty dumb compared to say, making rmut less effective).
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Nov 30, 2015 06:50
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Internet Kraken posted:Hey, want to actually keep the player from just equipping it to heal fast and taking it off? Have it not do anything until the player reaches full health once. This would be just fine.
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Nov 30, 2015 06:51
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Someone Awful! posted:in fairness why wouldn't you invest in throwing or evo, how much else do you have to put xp into as a straight melee? Well in a low rune game you probably won't get enough exp to get throwing up to a point where it can reliably kill mutators. If you go extended you pretty much always want SOME kind of ranged attack, but a melee character with ranged backup is never going to be able to kill mutators as quickly as a purely ranged chatacter. You may be okay if you only run into one at a time, but groups of them will gently caress you up. The idea that you can just magically use tactics to avoid being mutated 100% of the time is a dumb myth though. Pan spawns so many mutators that sometimes you can enter a level and be surrounded by them. Cacodemons at every angle, what do you do? If you can't break LOS to all 3 in one move you may get mutated. In Hell its straight up RNG. Get red glow from a hell effect, have fun turning into a sideshow. Either you have tons of cancellation potions or you get hosed.
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Nov 30, 2015 06:51
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Internet Kraken posted:Well in a low rune game you probably won't get enough exp to get throwing up to a point where it can reliably kill mutators. If you go extended you pretty much always want SOME kind of ranged attack, but a melee character with ranged backup is never going to be able to kill mutators as quickly as a purely ranged chatacter. You may be okay if you only run into one at a time, but groups of them will gently caress you up. Oh well yeah, I agree with that 100%. I just recently had to do Abyss without any rMut and even as a character who could kill things from range I still caught some nasty malmuts and it was actually pretty unfun. Moreso because curing them made me lose all my good mutations I'd gotten. 
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Nov 30, 2015 06:53
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Internet Kraken posted:have tons of cancellation potions or you get hosed. it's called Tactics.
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Nov 30, 2015 06:54
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Someone Awful! posted:He's also the guy who added a bunch of the new negative randart properties (*Confuse! *Corrode! *Drain! So fun!), so, yeah. Not exactly surprising. Can you explain what the problem is with those?
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Nov 30, 2015 06:54
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PleasingFungus posted:Can you explain what your problem is with those? There is literally no situation where I'm going to wear an otherwise good artefact that has any of those traits on them. e: Okay, maybe *Confuse if I have innate clarity
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Nov 30, 2015 06:55
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*Drain is tolerable if it's something you'd literally never take off. Otherwise, yeah. The "offset good properties with bad"(or vice versa) didn't really work, because the bad properties are so bad you're never going to use them.
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Nov 30, 2015 06:56
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why is swapping to regen to speed up healing a bad thing? for newer players they probably wont do it and for experienced players its literally 0.5s of swapping equipment and is really just for more efficient play anyway
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Nov 30, 2015 06:57
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*Drain isn't so bad unless its a piece of gear you wouldn't want to keep on for longer periods of time. *Confusion is dumb since wearing it is a gamble unless you have clarity, in which case it doesn't matter at all. *Corrosion is ridiculously bad and I'd never wear an artifact with it unless it was insanely good and I also had a source of rCorr I could keep on constantly.
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Nov 30, 2015 06:58
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Isn't drain just when you remove the piece?
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Nov 30, 2015 06:59
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Someone Awful! posted:There is literally no situation where I'm going to wear an otherwise good artefact that has any of those traits on them.
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Nov 30, 2015 06:59
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I don't have a problem with the ones that have negative effects when you take them off, drain is the worst one but if it covers up a really big weakness of mine i'm usually willing to bite the bullet on it. All of those only trigger on removal, right? I hadn't played for like the year in-between tournaments.
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Nov 30, 2015 06:59
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World Famous Whore posted:I agree with ya' on the Confuse or Corrode but *Drain is normally not a concern unless it is on something like an amulet which I will be changing often. Not that that is going to be an issue anymore... In that case, it's (*Drain) still dumb because it's not a meaningful impact in any way
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Nov 30, 2015 07:00
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uPen posted:Isn't drain just when you remove the piece? NOPE! It happens RANDOMLY while you wear it! All of the *whatever occur both when you take them off and randomly while used.
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Nov 30, 2015 07:00
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FireSight posted:NOPE! It happens RANDOMLY while you wear it! All of the *whatever occur both when you take them off and randomly while used. I think it's "when taking damage" from looking at the commits actually, which makes it more cool & good
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Nov 30, 2015 07:01
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*Drain is just when removed, but the rest only happen as you take hits.
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Nov 30, 2015 07:01
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FireSight posted:NOPE! It happens RANDOMLY while you wear it! All of the *whatever occur both when you take them off and randomly while used.  They should change the tooltip, but I haven't noticed that behavior. Someone Awful! posted:In that case, it's (*Drain) still dumb because it's not a meaningful impact in any way I like it a lot more than confuse/teleport or that AWFUL one that gave you random mutations. It forces you to not swap gear that you may otherwise want to so you have to make a decision about living with one really good piece or swapping in worse pieces that may be better for a particular situation.
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Nov 30, 2015 07:02
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Someone Awful! posted:There is literally no situation where I'm going to wear an otherwise good artefact that has any of those traits on them. *Drain is just Contam with a silly mask on, *Confuse seems perfectly useable if you have clarity, though I'm not sure about *confuse without clarity or *Corrode in general, since I haven't been playing lately. Please keep in mind, however, that these properties are only appearing when the game would have otherwise previously generated stuff like *tele, *rage, contam, etc.
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Nov 30, 2015 07:02
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uPen posted:
What tooltip? Do you mean the * in *Drain? (*Drain was originally added as an on-hit effect and only changed later, which is probably what people are thinking of.)
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Nov 30, 2015 07:05
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