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Tao Jones posted:Yesterday, December 7, 2694—a date which will live in infamy—the United States of America was suddenly and deliberately attacked by naval and air forces of the Empire of Japan. I think you mean 16 Frimaire CL
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Nov 30, 2015 02:32
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V. Illych L. posted:imo the "CE" nomenclature is weird and sort of dumb Really, the annoying one is BCE because that's just going out of its way to remind you of things. Before Common works just fine.
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Nov 30, 2015 04:27
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V. Illych L. posted:imo the "CE" nomenclature is weird and sort of dumb CE is sensible and good because it achieves the dual goals of not requiring us to change a bunch of dates and not putting a big "gently caress yeah christianity" stamp on the dating system
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Nov 30, 2015 04:37
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Jeb Bush 2012 posted:CE is sensible and good because it achieves the dual goals of not requiring us to change a bunch of dates and not putting a big "gently caress yeah christianity" stamp on the dating system Not really. Everybody knows what it means and when the "common era" started and why. A rose by another name and all that. It seems more like a sop to rabid secularists than anything else.
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Nov 30, 2015 04:44
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Deteriorata posted:Not really. Everybody knows what it means and when the "common era" started and why. A rose by another name and all that. You're right, China should start dating things in the year of our Lord 2015.
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Nov 30, 2015 04:56
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Deteriorata posted:Not really. Everybody knows what it means and when the "common era" started and why. A rose by another name and all that. It's weird how it doesn't matter and yet the mere sight of other people not calling them jesus years prompts whining about "rabid secularists"
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Nov 30, 2015 05:05
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Jeb Bush 2012 posted:It's weird how it doesn't matter and yet the mere sight of other people not calling them jesus years prompts whining about "rabid secularists" You're right. It doesn't matter. So why are some people so dead set against the traditional A.D.? Changing the letters doesn't actually change any dates, so what's the real point? Why does it matter to the people who want to use different letters? If the tradition was CE and some people wanted to change to AD I would ask the exact same questions. I don't object to changes, but I do object to disingenuous arguments.
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Nov 30, 2015 05:13
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change dating to AUC also lol at the "Look at how much I don't care about this! It's you who cares too much!"
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Nov 30, 2015 05:15
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Tao Jones posted:Yesterday, December 7, in the first year of the consuls Franklin Roosevelt Delano and Henry Wallace Agard—a date which will live in infamy—the United States of America was suddenly and deliberately attacked by naval and air forces of the Empire of Japan.
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Nov 30, 2015 05:20
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Where would a purely agnostic, universal dating system begin, actually? Like, if you claim that BC/AD is bad because it's too Christian, OK, but where do you stick the starting date? What would actually make sense, be accepted by everyone in the world, and still be remembered thousands of years into the future?
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Nov 30, 2015 05:20
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abandon dates entirely, refer to events relative to when they occur to other events
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Nov 30, 2015 05:21
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Tomn posted:Where would a purely agnostic, universal dating system begin, actually? Like, if you claim that BC/AD is bad because it's too Christian, OK, but where do you stick the starting date? What would actually make sense, be accepted by everyone in the world, and still be remembered thousands of years into the future? http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Galactic_Standard_Calendar Ready-made, future-proofed. The date of Yavin is of course 1977.
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Nov 30, 2015 05:37
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Tomn posted:Where would a purely agnostic, universal dating system begin, actually? Space Tinder, of course.
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Nov 30, 2015 05:40
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Deteriorata posted:You're right. It doesn't matter. So why are some people so dead set against the traditional A.D.? I didn't say it doesn't matter. (it's not massively important but given the choice I would always use CE) And idk why you're claiming not to know why some people would rather give their date system a name that is not explicitly christian, seems like it should be pretty easy to figure out Tomn posted:Where would a purely agnostic, universal dating system begin, actually? Like, if you claim that BC/AD is bad because it's too Christian, OK, but where do you stick the starting date? What would actually make sense, be accepted by everyone in the world, and still be remembered thousands of years into the future? Well one thing you could do is keep the arbitrary zero year you have already because, well, it's arbitrary and it's easier not to change all the dates. But then you replace BC/AD with some other, secular, names. Compromise!
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Nov 30, 2015 05:40
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Jeb Bush 2012 posted:CE is sensible and good because it achieves the dual goals of not requiring us to change a bunch of dates and not putting a big "gently caress yeah christianity" stamp on the dating system You'd think historians would be the people least likely to be scandalized by historical artifacts baked into our language and terminology.
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Nov 30, 2015 05:43
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Tomn posted:Where would a purely agnostic, universal dating system begin, actually? Like, if you claim that BC/AD is bad because it's too Christian, OK, but where do you stick the starting date? What would actually make sense, be accepted by everyone in the world, and still be remembered thousands of years into the future? 00:00:00 Coordinated Universal Time (UTC), Thursday, 1 January 1970 e: since I'm not in the computer jokes forum and the reference is not obvious, this is the beginning of time for computers running Unix-like operating systems fantastic in plastic fucked around with this message at 05:46 on Nov 30, 2015 |
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Nov 30, 2015 05:43
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Tomn posted:Where would a purely agnostic, universal dating system begin, actually? Like, if you claim that BC/AD is bad because it's too Christian, OK, but where do you stick the starting date? What would actually make sense, be accepted by everyone in the world, and still be remembered thousands of years into the future? Make January 1st, year zero be in the year the first true writing was made, as such everything historical can be dated in AH, after history began. Problem is, we don't know when that was.
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Nov 30, 2015 05:46
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Jeb Bush 2012 posted:I didn't say it doesn't matter. (it's not massively important but given the choice I would always use CE) But again, the point is having a standard that everyone uses. It doesn't matter what it is, as long as everyone uses it. The AD/BC nomenclature has been in use for over a millennium. CE/BCE is not an improvement, it's just different. Yeah, I get that some people object to the overt Christian reference. Big deal. The days of the week also refer to various pagan gods from ages ago. Wednesday is just Wednesday because that's what we call it. Nobody objects to it being named for Odin, or that somehow they're worshiping Thor every time they write Thursday. Jesus was actually born sometime around 4 BC, so it doesn't even match that anyway. The CE/BCE stuff just comes off as a bunch of whining over nothing.
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Nov 30, 2015 05:51
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Well, this would be 14 Safar, 1457. No need to worry about offending secularists. Allah Akbar!
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Nov 30, 2015 05:53
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Deteriorata posted:Not really. Everybody knows what it means and when the "common era" started and why. A rose by another name and all that. It's actually a sop to religious people who aren't Christians for whom repeatedly referring to Jesus as the Lord is sort of a problem. While it's not something I think about much I think you can imagine why say a periodical which might have practicing Muslims or Jews on staff wouldn't want to use a style guide that conflicts with their faith.
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Nov 30, 2015 06:00
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Deteriorata posted:But again, the point is having a standard that everyone uses. It doesn't matter what it is, as long as everyone uses it. The AD/BC nomenclature has been in use for over a millennium. CE/BCE is not an improvement, it's just different. Deteriorata posted:Yeah, I get that some people object to the overt Christian reference. Big deal. The days of the week also refer to various pagan gods from ages ago. Wednesday is just Wednesday because that's what we call it. Nobody objects to it being named for Odin, or that somehow they're worshiping Thor every time they write Thursday. Deteriorata posted:Jesus was actually born sometime around 4 BC, so it doesn't even match that anyway. The CE/BCE stuff just comes off as a bunch of whining over nothing. Again, this is a pretty weird point to make given that this started, as it almost always does, with people complaining about the fact that other people use CE/BCE
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Nov 30, 2015 06:04
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Deteriorata posted:The CE/BCE stuff just comes off as a bunch of whining over nothing. 
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Nov 30, 2015 06:05
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Deteriorata posted:The CE/BCE stuff just comes off as a bunch of whining over nothing. I disagree. I think it's easy to see what the objection is if you write out in longhand what AD is implying, like "Posted on this, the 29th day in the 11th month of the 2015th year of the reign of our Lord Jesus Christ". Religion doesn't matter much to me, personally, so AD/CE/whatever, it's just a convention, but it's not hard to see how some people would take it seriously. (I'm also willing to entertain the notion that the names of the days of the week also have baggage, sure. I've known Christians who call the days "first day" "second day" "third day" when dealing with co-religionists.)
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Nov 30, 2015 06:07
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Your entertainment is always my first priority. Thank you for adding your own whiny post about nothing.
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Nov 30, 2015 06:08
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Tao Jones posted:00:00:00 Coordinated Universal Time (UTC), Thursday, 1 January 1970 Nah, UTC is based off of TAI, which is in turn computed using GPS. Ergo, the new base date should be (00:00) 6 January 1980.
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Nov 30, 2015 06:19
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Yes, it's like a lava lamp.
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Deteriorata posted:You're right. It doesn't matter. So why are some people so dead set against the traditional A.D.? Tomn posted:Where would a purely agnostic, universal dating system begin, actually? Like, if you claim that BC/AD is bad because it's too Christian, OK, but where do you stick the starting date? What would actually make sense, be accepted by everyone in the world, and still be remembered thousands of years into the future? Well, like I said, HE is superior because basically all human history happens after 1HE/10000BC so you don't have to have to count down to 0 and then up again, which is retarded. Can anyone provide a reason for another system being superior? Obviously "mya" and "X hundred thousand years ago" is superior for anthropology/archeology/geology time, but for human history I can't see why you'd really need to go back before the neolithic revolution, or at least, I can't see how you would need to do that and also know the exact year. I don't like TAI because probably at some point a better, more accurate atomic clock or other timekeeping method will be designed. Not any time soon, of course, but if you're building a calendar you should be looking several thousand years into the future. Plus geoid-corrected TAI is 1 January 1977 00:00:00, but like, the year is still listed in HE so atomic timekeeping is equally easily applied to any year system that keeps the 365+1/4 days and has the same number of days per month, etc, which HE does. Agean90 posted:well you see the current system is the best one because gently caress you im not memorizing a new set of dates But you don't have to! 2015AD in HE is just 12015. Easy! Keldoclock fucked around with this message at 06:48 on Nov 30, 2015 |
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Nov 30, 2015 06:35
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well you see the current system is the best one because gently caress you im not memorizing a new set of dates
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Nov 30, 2015 06:42
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Year 15 of the Willennium
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Nov 30, 2015 06:44
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Obviously today is 4/26/239.  Or maybe it's 2/19/14 
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Nov 30, 2015 07:05
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The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Ask / Tell > Ask me about Roman/Greek/other ancient history: Let's discuss calendar nomenclature
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Nov 30, 2015 07:10
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Date chat is great, but I'm looking for an idea for a cartography project. Where's a fun/good GIS dataset for anything Roman/Ancient? Edit: I mean I say this then immediately find the Digital Atlas of Roman and Medieval Civilization so I feel dumb. What do you guys think would make a cool map? I'll post whatever I end up doing. TheLawinator fucked around with this message at 07:18 on Nov 30, 2015 |
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Nov 30, 2015 07:14
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could you people also tell what's your favourite train
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Nov 30, 2015 07:19
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Doesn't referring to AD as CE just reinforce the idea that Christianity is synonymous with modernity and the current world. What current era is being referred to, the era of Christianity. During the French Revolution the imperial system of measurement was abandoned for promoting monarchy, and was replaced with the metric system. If they decided to use the model of BCE and CE instead they'd just change foot to numel and call it a day. It just cements Christian conventions to claim its dating system as the "current" or normal one. Same reason one doesn't refer to people who are hetrosexual as "normal". Especially given that there are fairly large sections of the human population that don't use BCE/CE, or BC/AD for everyday use.
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Nov 30, 2015 07:28
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Terrible Opinions posted:there are fairly large sections of the human population that don't use BCE/CE, or BC/AD for everyday use. Who the gently caress are these people? Off the top of my head I can only think of: Chinese national traditional holidays, weddings etc (Chinese Rural Calendar) Orthodox Christian religious holidays (Julian Calendar) But daily use is still the Gregorian calendar.
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Nov 30, 2015 07:38
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Easiest ones to point to definitely are the Iranian calendar which is the official calendar of Iran and Afghanistan, the Ethiopian calendar, and the Bengali calendars. The Chinese and National Indian calendars are more arguable given how much prominence the Gregorian calendar has alongside each, though such dual use is the result of extended contact with countries that use the Gregorian calendar.
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Nov 30, 2015 08:15
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TheLawinator posted:Date chat is great, but I'm looking for an idea for a cartography project. Where's a fun/good GIS dataset for anything Roman/Ancient? Stanfords Orbis project is great: http://orbis.stanford.edu/ although im not sure you can get the data. Else the Pleiades project should work: http://pleiades.stoa.org/
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Nov 30, 2015 09:08
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BC is stupid because it implies there was a time when Christ was not, a heretical Arian viewpoint that was rightfully suppressed after the Council of Nicaea.
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Nov 30, 2015 09:36
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Angry Salami posted:BC is stupid because it implies there was a time when Christ was not, a heretical Arian viewpoint that was rightfully suppressed after the Council of Nicaea.  May I quote that if I ever get into a stupid debate about BC/BCE?
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Nov 30, 2015 10:07
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Tomn posted:Where would a purely agnostic, universal dating system begin, actually? Like, if you claim that BC/AD is bad because it's too Christian, OK, but where do you stick the starting date? What would actually make sense, be accepted by everyone in the world, and still be remembered thousands of years into the future? Well, the first thought would be to start with the earliest dated writing, but the obvious issue there is it's entirely possible we will find earlier writing. So my second thought is the Bur-Sagale eclipse, which as far as I know is the earliest precisely datable event, occurring on June 15, 763 BC. It's either that one or the Eclipse of Thales on May 28, 585 BC. Terrible Opinions posted:Easiest ones to point to definitely are the Iranian calendar which is the official calendar of Iran and Afghanistan, the Ethiopian calendar, and the Bengali calendars. The Chinese and National Indian calendars are more arguable given how much prominence the Gregorian calendar has alongside each, though such dual use is the result of extended contact with countries that use the Gregorian calendar. The Chinese calendar is only used for the dates of holidays and astrology bullshit. It literally never ever comes up otherwise.
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Nov 30, 2015 11:59
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Tomn posted:Where would a purely agnostic, universal dating system begin, actually? Like, if you claim that BC/AD is bad because it's too Christian, OK, but where do you stick the starting date? What would actually make sense, be accepted by everyone in the world, and still be remembered thousands of years into the future? Vostok 1. First human into space seems like a pretty big deal, and likely more so when we're all living on Mars colonies and stuff.
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Nov 30, 2015 12:06
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