Register a SA Forums Account here!
JOINING THE SA FORUMS WILL REMOVE THIS BIG AD, THE ANNOYING UNDERLINED ADS, AND STUPID INTERSTITIAL ADS!!!

You can: log in, read the tech support FAQ, or request your lost password. This dumb message (and those ads) will appear on every screen until you register! Get rid of this crap by registering your own SA Forums Account and joining roughly 150,000 Goons, for the one-time price of $9.95! We charge money because it costs us money per month for bills, and since we don't believe in showing ads to our users, we try to make the money back through forum registrations.
 
  • Post
  • Reply
Blackbelt Bobman
Jul 17, 2004

I don't need friends! I've been
manipulatin' you since the start!
All so I can something,
something X-Blade!


EXP to HP in Dissidia duodecim makes no sense. It never actually heals me. gently caress you game for having this completely useless ability!!!

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Head Hit Keyboard
Oct 9, 2012

It must be fate that has brought us together after all these years.
It actually does but it does for pretty little so it's really only useful in long hauls like 000's mega dungeons. For most fights you're better off with EXP to Brave or EXP to Assist.

Gologle
Apr 15, 2013

The Gologle Posting Experience.

<3
If I remember correctly (note: I may not) EXP to BLANK is also affected by the multiplier of your accessories. Either that or the damage dealt which gives you higher EXP (along with many other factors, some of which are, you guessed it, accessories used) which gives you more HP back. I definitely remember that there was a Yuna build, (well, really an omnibuild, Dissidia and Duodecim's best builds were the ones that were universally great regardless of character choice) that utilized EXP to Brave to give her automatic 9999 Brave value after a successfully landed HP attack.

Sunning
Sep 14, 2011
Nintendo Guru
Hajime Tabata did a presentation on FFXV development for the Family Game Forum in China: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JWkHDJ7Z_1k

Here's a translation: http://femto-jiokichi.tumblr.com/post/134141626703/fgf-2015-translation-of-the-presentation-done-by

To summarize, Tabata talks about the challenges facing Final Fantasy and how his teams plans on addressing them. He realizes it's dangerous to assume customers are already familiar with the Final Fantasy series. The risk they face is FF's fanbase dwindling down to only hardcore players. They need to appeal to new players as well as series fans.

Tabata admitted the PS3/360 era of development was unsuccessful due to the jump to HD production and a focus on cutting edge visuals. The FFXV team is focusing on providing a quality user experience (UX) in that everything from art to gameplay is satisfying to the player. They don't want to focus on graphics to the determent of the UX. Much of the artwork and game mechanics are tailored towards players not familiar with Final Fantasy.

There's also some information about FFXV and a Q&A session. With how badly they've handled the brand over the last decade, I've been skeptical of Square-Enix's ability to revitalize the series as a premiere AAA RPG. So it's good to see them attack problems head-on rather than stick their head in the sand.

The TLDR is - Hajime Tabata: Make Final Fantasy Great Again!

BENGHAZI 2
Oct 13, 2007

by Cyrano4747
I bought 13 yesterday. I enjoy it. Does the exploration ever open up at all or is it just hallways with fights and cutscenes

Artix
Apr 26, 2010

He's finally back,
to kick some tail!
And this time,
he's goin' to jail!
It does, about 20-25 hours in. At which point it pretty much loses any semblance of pacing that it might have had, and you'll probably want the hallway back. :shrug:

Head Hit Keyboard
Oct 9, 2012

It must be fate that has brought us together after all these years.

Literally The Worst posted:

I bought 13 yesterday. I enjoy it. Does the exploration ever open up at all or is it just hallways with fights and cutscenes

Chapter 11.

Artix posted:

It does, about 20-25 hours in. At which point it pretty much loses any semblance of pacing that it might have had, and you'll probably want the hallway back. :shrug:

Well you can jump back into the main story and the hallways that come with it whenever you want so :shrug:

zedprime
Jun 9, 2007

yospos
I love FF13, so I feel I need to bring the expectations back to where they need to be. Chapter 11 isn't open. You get two choices, beeline the main story and end up underleveled without fast travel opened up, or following the side quests in a guided grand tour of the open field and its adjacent mountain hallway opening up fast travel points along the way.

FF13 is good but please don't play a game you don't like.

Help Im Alive
Nov 8, 2009

zedprime posted:

FF13 is good but please don't play a game you don't like.

The weird thing is when people act like XIII is the worst game they've ever played and then decide they need to play XIII-2 for some reason

Josuke Higashikata
Mar 7, 2013


Baal posted:

A new copy does, but i'm p sure it might just be first print copies. It's weird because I think someone reported a while ago they got a copy of the game well after it was released and it still had it.

I got a new copy around August and it had it.

Though in all fairness, it was £10 which is essentially "clear our stockroom" price so I would assume it was still first print.

Haven't played it or the demo for more than 10 minutes because MGSV came out and then my PS4 absconded.
One day I'll get to it even though I thought the PSP version was rear end and XV looks bad.

Saoshyant
Oct 26, 2010

:hmmorks: :orks:


Help Im Alive posted:

The weird thing is when people act like XIII is the worst game they've ever played and then decide they need to play XIII-2 for some reason

"But surely they got it right after a second try?"

Tae
Oct 24, 2010

Hello? Can you hear me? ...Perhaps if I shout? AAAAAAAAAH!
What part of FF15 looks bad? Or do you just hate the 3D era of FF?

bloodychill
May 8, 2004

And if the world
should end tonight,
I had a crazy, classic life
Exciting Lemon

Sunning posted:

Hajime Tabata did a presentation on FFXV development for the Family Game Forum in China: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JWkHDJ7Z_1k

Here's a translation: http://femto-jiokichi.tumblr.com/post/134141626703/fgf-2015-translation-of-the-presentation-done-by

To summarize, Tabata talks about the challenges facing Final Fantasy and how his teams plans on addressing them. He realizes it's dangerous to assume customers are already familiar with the Final Fantasy series. The risk they face is FF's fanbase dwindling down to only hardcore players. They need to appeal to new players as well as series fans.

Tabata admitted the PS3/360 era of development was unsuccessful due to the jump to HD production and a focus on cutting edge visuals. The FFXV team is focusing on providing a quality user experience (UX) in that everything from art to gameplay is satisfying to the player. They don't want to focus on graphics to the determent of the UX. Much of the artwork and game mechanics are tailored towards players not familiar with Final Fantasy.

There's also some information about FFXV and a Q&A session. With how badly they've handled the brand over the last decade, I've been skeptical of Square-Enix's ability to revitalize the series as a premiere AAA RPG. So it's good to see them attack problems head-on rather than stick their head in the sand.

The TLDR is - Hajime Tabata: Make Final Fantasy Great Again!

I generally like this attitude but it is giving me flashbacks to Enterprise, where Paramount tried to produce a Star Trek that appealed to more than just "Star Trek fans" but fumbled it and only succeeded in alienating everyone, even though the show ended up actually being alright after viewers had already tuned out.

What I'm saying is I don't want 15 to be the Enterprise of Final Fantasy. They need a TNG-like success that captures everything people love about the series while also being just good enough to keep them interested.

In this metaphor Lightning Returns and Bravely Default are DS9 I guess. And 13 is Voyager.

Excels
Mar 7, 2012

Your plastic pal who's fun to be with!
I thought 13-2 was an improvement over the first one in pretty much every way. The plot was goofy fun. I dressed Noel like Ezio and suddenly found him a lot more tolerable.

zedprime
Jun 9, 2007

yospos

bloodychill posted:

I generally like this attitude but it is giving me flashbacks to Enterprise, where Paramount tried to produce a Star Trek that appealed to more than just "Star Trek fans" but fumbled it and only succeeded in alienating everyone, even though the show ended up actually being alright after viewers had already tuned out.

What I'm saying is I don't want 15 to be the Enterprise of Final Fantasy. They need a TNG-like success that captures everything people love about the series while also being just good enough to keep them interested.

In this metaphor Lightning Returns and Bravely Default are DS9 I guess. And 13 is Voyager.
I've got good feelings for their future after 14ARR but I'm not sure I have any confidence in 15 because it was started back when their project management was obviously insane and who knows how much of that cruft is left after they found their footing.

Captain Baal
Oct 23, 2010

I Failed At Anime 2022
I think XV will be at least alright. The game seems solid from the demo and apparently they've fixed up some of the gamelay stuff which is also promising. I don't think the game's going to really make much use of this large world they're trying to build and the game will probably end up being navigating huge rear end fields for a lot of the game because that seems to be a thing they're going for. That being said, I'm still pretty excited for it and hope they don't gently caress it up.

Sakurazuka
Jan 24, 2004

NANI?

bloodychill posted:

I generally like this attitude but it is giving me flashbacks to Enterprise, where Paramount tried to produce a Star Trek that appealed to more than just "Star Trek fans" but fumbled it and only succeeded in alienating everyone, even though the show ended up actually being alright after viewers had already tuned out.

What I'm saying is I don't want 15 to be the Enterprise of Final Fantasy. They need a TNG-like success that captures everything people love about the series while also being just good enough to keep them interested.

In this metaphor Lightning Returns and Bravely Default are DS9 I guess. And 13 is Voyager.

13 still had worthwhile stuff though, FF XIV 1.0 was Voyager

Captain Baal
Oct 23, 2010

I Failed At Anime 2022
FFXIII was a good game and I will die on this hill

bloodychill
May 8, 2004

And if the world
should end tonight,
I had a crazy, classic life
Exciting Lemon

Sakurazuka posted:

13 still had worthwhile stuff though, FF XIV 1.0 was Voyager

FF14 1.0 was the poop Brannon Braga left in a toilet to rot.

Oh wait that's still Voyager, drat it.

All this said, I'm still looking forward to FF15 after playing the demo. It was pretty fun :unsmith:

Tae
Oct 24, 2010

Hello? Can you hear me? ...Perhaps if I shout? AAAAAAAAAH!

zedprime posted:

I've got good feelings for their future after 14ARR but I'm not sure I have any confidence in 15 because it was started back when their project management was obviously insane and who knows how much of that cruft is left after they found their footing.

Almost nothing from Toriyama's reign exists in the Tabata era's version of FF15 outside of a few design specs. They basically built the game from scratch.

Captain Baal
Oct 23, 2010

I Failed At Anime 2022
Nah, I'm sure some of Nomura's stuff is influencing Tabata, but I don't consider that a bad thing because I think Tetsuya Nomura is good.

Levantine
Feb 14, 2005

GUNDAM!!!

Baal posted:

FFXIII was a good game and I will die on this hill

There were good things about it and I certainly enjoyed it.

Tae
Oct 24, 2010

Hello? Can you hear me? ...Perhaps if I shout? AAAAAAAAAH!
That's why I said design specs. Tabata admitted in interviews that they basically had to re-work everything, probably around the time Stella was announced as removed (even though she never existed outside of concept arts).

PunkBoy
Aug 22, 2008

You wanna get through this?
I unironically would love to see Nomura's Baz Luhrmann-inspired Final Fantasy game one day.

Edit: I wonder what the reaction would be if that's what he makes the FFVII remake into.

Sakurazuka
Jan 24, 2004

NANI?

I kind of wish SE would give up on trying to make FF games in to mainstream hits but at the same time they're the only company interested in making JRPG's with anything close to cutting edge technology and the two kind of go hand in hand.

Captain Baal
Oct 23, 2010

I Failed At Anime 2022

Tae posted:

That's why I said design specs. Tabata admitted in interviews that they basically had to re-work everything, probably around the time Stella was announced as removed (even though she never existed outside of concept arts).

Stella was in the 2011 E3 trailer and a game doesn't get put into development hell for 8 years and only the design specs stay. A lot of Nomura's influence is still in the game, not even from a design perspective. That game is Nomura's baby and Tabata said he reworked everything does not mean the entire previous game was thrown out. He is still using assets they had and improving on them and this is not to forget that the entire 2014 trailer was done while Nomura was still on the project and a lot of the mechanics exhibited there like hiding and dynamic bosses are still very much a part of the game.


PunkBoy posted:

I unironically would love to see Nomura's Baz Luhrmann-inspired Final Fantasy game one day.

Edit: I wonder what the reaction would be if that's what he makes the FFVII remake into.

I'd go all in on Baz Luhrman FF7


Levantine posted:

There were good things about it and I certainly enjoyed it.

No, it was good

HD DAD
Jan 13, 2010

Generic white guy.

Toilet Rascal
If we're making the Star Trek analogy, then TNG would be X, DS9 is XII, and XIII is Voyager. XIV would be Enterprise, where is started out as a mess and then got it's poo poo together in a stellar fashion.

XI is that VHS Klingon board game.

bloodychill
May 8, 2004

And if the world
should end tonight,
I had a crazy, classic life
Exciting Lemon

HD DAD posted:

If we're making the Star Trek analogy, then TNG would be X, DS9 is XII, and XIII is Voyager. XIV would be Enterprise, where is started out as a mess and then got it's poo poo together in a stellar fashion.

XI is that VHS Klingon board game.

Arguably 7 is probably a better TNG candidate with 1 being Original Series and 4-6 being the Original Series even-numbered movies.

BENGHAZI 2
Oct 13, 2007

by Cyrano4747

bloodychill posted:

Arguably 7 is probably a better TNG candidate with 1 being Original Series and 4-6 being the Original Series even-numbered movies.

but 9 is the best one and thus khan

Captain Baal
Oct 23, 2010

I Failed At Anime 2022
Wait I was thinking of the 2013 E3 trailer with Leviathan all up in that town and you ducking for cover as the house's get lifted out of the ground. That poo poo was rad. That's probably still in the game or the assets for it have been reworked to be a Leviathan boss but in a different way.

Man ARR made Leviathan really cool

Orcs and Ostriches
Aug 26, 2010


The Great Twist
I still think "Your tombstone will read 'your everything.'" is pretty rad.

Captain Baal
Oct 23, 2010

I Failed At Anime 2022
Someone call Square-Enix and get them to do a third bout of Theatrhythm DLC with nothing but boss themes from ARR and Drakengard 3, tia.

Die Sexmonster!
Nov 30, 2005

Orcs and Ostriches posted:

I still think "Your tombstone will read 'your everything.'" is pretty rad.

It's just us here, buddy. Philistines :argh:

Sunning
Sep 14, 2011
Nintendo Guru

bloodychill posted:

I generally like this attitude but it is giving me flashbacks to Enterprise, where Paramount tried to produce a Star Trek that appealed to more than just "Star Trek fans" but fumbled it and only succeeded in alienating everyone, even though the show ended up actually being alright after viewers had already tuned out.

What I'm saying is I don't want 15 to be the Enterprise of Final Fantasy. They need a TNG-like success that captures everything people love about the series while also being just good enough to keep them interested.

In this metaphor Lightning Returns and Bravely Default are DS9 I guess. And 13 is Voyager.

It's understandable in that Square-Enix is in the same place as the other big Japanese publishers. Globally, Japanese marketshare in console gaming is the lowest it's ever been, especially in the West. If you remove Nintendo (consistently a top 4 publisher), that portion is significantly less. The reasons are innumerable and range from poor development tools to customer churn. It's why we've seen a fight (Square-Enix) or flight (Konami) reaction from Japanese publishers.

FF has always had a casual audience helping it become a commercial success. This was back when FF was a pioneer in visuals and storytelling. However, you can find great visuals and enjoyable stories in just about every AAA game on the market. These days just about any publisher with $2 million to spare can pay a CGI studio like Blur to make a great trailer that builds up hype for your game. Dead Island anyone?

The people who used to play FF now play games like Mass Effect, Witcher 3, Elder Scrolls, Fallout, Diablo 3 Ultimate Evil Edition, Destiny, or NBA 2k16. The FF series needs to win them back by keeping up with the changing standards of the market. It's unfortunate that we're slowly approaching gameplay singularity with open world action games but that's the reality of AAA game development.


zedprime posted:

I've got good feelings for their future after 14ARR but I'm not sure I have any confidence in 15 because it was started back when their project management was obviously insane and who knows how much of that cruft is left after they found their footing.

Ideally, Final Fantasy would have a development setup similar to how Call of Duty is currently developed. CoD now has three major studios heading an entry with each entry given three years. Each studio provides a new take on the series but collaborates with the other two on developing the game. So each entry gets plenty of time in development and can address short comings in previous games.

If you don't particularly like one entry (Ghosts), then you can wait another year for a new concept (Advanced Warfare). That's how it used to be with Final Fantasy in the SNES-PS1 era until developments teams were merged together.

I think even if they had a quality development pipeline, FF would still struggle against the likes of Fallout and Witcher. The competition is extremely fierce and with several entrenched major brands. Japanese publishers in particular have had an especially difficult time cracking the AAA RPG market. Nonetheless, FF could still find a place in the market and enjoy success without being a premiere RPG brand.


Tae posted:

Almost nothing from Toriyama's reign exists in the Tabata era's version of FF15 outside of a few design specs. They basically built the game from scratch.

The battle system changed from a multi-character Kingdom Hearts system to a single-character Type-0 system. Stella's character was re-written into Luna. The opening attack on the city was cut out. Writers were added to re-write the script. Only a handful of the people who worked on mentioned the original Versus reveal trailer are actually working on FFXV. It's like the joke where a the contents of a movie's script is changed but the producer keep the title except that changed as well.

Personally, I feel that Tabata's team was dealt a bad hand by inheriting FFvsXIII and all of its problems. They would've been than trying to marry a concept birthed in 2006 to the reality of current market expectations. They would've been better off publically cancelling vsXIII outright and making FFXV on a clean slate by a new development team.

I think the only reason the Versus concept survived into FFXV is because Nomura would immediately leave the company with his closest associates if they completely canned his dream game. He's very much a forward facing brand for the company and is even credited in promotional art. Even though his character designs, original concepts, and projects haven't been particularly successful for the last decade, management probably doesn't want to add another to the list of talent that has left the company. We've seen a lot of talent leave SE either because their dream project didn't get green lit (Takahashi, Tsuchida) or they don't want to be known as the guy who had his big project crash and burn (Sakaguchi, Tanaka).

Momomo
Dec 26, 2009

Dont judge me, I design your manhole
I want to believe in Tabata, since he's shown that he wants to actually like, release the game and not just showcase it. He's also been a lot more upfront about how the game's development is going, so it's not just a complete mystery as to how the game'll actually turn out. I figure the game will be serviceable but clearly hackened together, since there's really only so much he can do, and I really doubt they actually redid everything from the ground up.

Also XIII is not a good game, sorry.

Armitage
Aug 16, 2005

"Mathman's not here." "Oh? Where is he?" "He's in the Mathroom."
after that Sunscreen 'song' closed out the 1990s, I don't think I want to see a Baz Luhrmann influenced anything.

That's two extremely weird things that I've gone on record as not caring anything for in this thread.

Fister Roboto
Feb 21, 2008

Arguing over how Final Fantasy games correlate to Star Trek series might be the nerdiest thing I've ever witnessed.

Gologle
Apr 15, 2013

The Gologle Posting Experience.

<3
I really want all the old Japanese video game developers to quit making video games. It's clear they aren't good at it and never were, it's just that they were the only things we had back then. But times have changed, and the Japanese have not changed with the times to a sufficient degree. I want a scenario where they are all working under western companies to develop mobile games so I can fill my iPhone with more apps like Final Fantasy Record Keeper and XCOM.

Help Im Alive
Nov 8, 2009

What

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

In Training
Jun 28, 2008

Son of Taint Reaper

  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
  • Post
  • Reply