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at the date posted:In 2011, I went to a seven-week manual machining "job training" thingy in Fort Worth (paid for by the Texas Workforce Commission). The curriculum was finished by the end of week 3, I spent the next 2 weeks making a little twin wobbler steam engine, and I had three job offers in hand by week 5. All I needed were prescription safety glasses and steel-toed work boots. I just borrowed tools on the job for my probation period. I spent 7 hours a day(plus travel), 5 days a week, for 6 months doing my training at BCIT. A full third of my class never made it to the end, and a few more failed. Exactly four people from my class(which ended in April) have work. Two of those are in retail, and the other two had jobs lined up before they ever went into school. So you're a lucky bastard. On the other hand, my schooling counts as 500 hours towards my second year! So only 500 more to go before I can actually get work in my trade! I've been turned away from about a third of the places I've applied at, and then told to come back when I have my second year, job 100% guaranteed. But nobody will give you the time of day until you've got that second year, let alone a job.
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Nov 24, 2015 04:27
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I was a moldmaker for about 3 years before I decided to get off the floor and into building spacecraft, so yeah I'll answer questions if you have them. E: I don't get to cut things anymore and it makes me sad.
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Nov 24, 2015 05:19
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MohawkSatan posted:Up here, machining is a recognized trade. Which means it requires schooling. Getting hired as anything more than a shop helper without the piece of paper that says you're qualified and won't gently caress things up straight up doesn't happen. On top of that, without getting your Red Seal, your qualifications count for literally nothing outside of your home province. If you were really lucky, someone would hire you at around $4-$5 an hour less than what you'd normally be earning(basing this off of what welders/mechanics/carpenters normally get without their red seal). Your work ethic doesn't count for poo poo, if you never get a chance to work and prove yourself. MohawkSatan posted:I spent 7 hours a day(plus travel), 5 days a week, for 6 months doing my training at BCIT. A full third of my class never made it to the end, and a few more failed. Exactly four people from my class(which ended in April) have work. Two of those are in retail, and the other two had jobs lined up before they ever went into school. I assume you're both talking about the foundation course. I don't know if machining is different from HD mechanic....ing....but I did the foundation course and still found that most employers don't count it for poo poo. I basically had to elbow my way into the trade by taking a position as a "driver/mechanic" (mostly driver), then using those "technically an apprentice" hours to get an actual apprentice job somewhere else, then using that experience to go back to my original employer as an actual mechanic. Also our current washboy finished his foundation course like a year ago, although I expect he will get signed as an apprentice relatively soon. And this is in a trade full of old guys about to retire, that desperately needs needs new apprentices. What I'm saying is, don't expect the foundation course to be a magical job-opening key that will get you hired and working in your field automatically. You've got a better chance than someone who hasn't taken it, but the fact is tons of places don't want to hire first years. I'm sitting a little better now but I'm still basically keeping my head down and trying not to get fired until I have enough hours to challenge the red seal exam.
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Nov 24, 2015 07:00
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I got paid 40hrs/week + benefits to go to community college full time for free for 2 1/2 years plus an extra 1,000 hours of continuing ed shop time beyond the school's Associate in Applied Science degree and could stack on as many night classes as I wanted and had a guaranteed job at the end. The shocking thing is that all this glorious socialism happened in South Carolina. E: oh and since I was on the company payroll from day one the entire time I was loving about in school counted toward vacation seniority shame on an IGA fucked around with this message at 07:17 on Nov 24, 2015 |
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Nov 24, 2015 07:13
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MANGOSTEEN CURES P posted:I got paid 40hrs/week + benefits to go to community college full time for free for 2 1/2 years plus an extra 1,000 hours of continuing ed shop time beyond the school's Associate in Applied Science degree and could stack on as many night classes as I wanted and had a guaranteed job at the end. Up here this is called a "union job." You might get one of these but some days it seems like they just do everything in their power to keep new blood out. Actually, a lot of unions will hire apprentices. I almost got a union job, the hiring manager wanted me, but there was a guy already in the union who wanted the position, so he had priority.
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Nov 24, 2015 07:30
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MohawkSatan posted:Up here, machining is a recognized trade. Which means it requires schooling. Getting hired as anything more than a shop helper without the piece of paper that says you're qualified and won't gently caress things up straight up doesn't happen. On top of that, without getting your Red Seal, your qualifications count for literally nothing outside of your home province. If you were really lucky, someone would hire you at around $4-$5 an hour less than what you'd normally be earning(basing this off of what welders/mechanics/carpenters normally get without their red seal). Your work ethic doesn't count for poo poo, if you never get a chance to work and prove yourself. Back in the day, machining was a proper trade here, too. Nowadays, when I tell people what I do, 85% of them think I put machines together? It's really sad the way manufacturing has kind of moved into obscurity here. It's the same way with auto mechanics here. Any bum can open up a shop, or you can usually get a job just with experience. There are classes you can take and everything, but as far as I can tell, it's definitely not required.
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Nov 24, 2015 15:27
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Blacksmithing questions! And some machining. I ordered a really nice Guillotine tool that holds different dies. Basic use is for fullering dies, but it'll hold anything that can be made out of 2 1/2" by 1/2" plates. It comes with a round die and a flat die, but I'm wondering about some of my own dies made. Curious what I can expect to pay in the US for some simple machine work, and what I can expect as just "some guy off the street" instead of a big corporate client. Second, what kind of hardy tools are my fellow blacksmiths fond of? I made a hot cut chisel out of a trailer hitch ball, and now I'm curious what other tools would be useful. I looked on ebay, and the only other common tool I see is a twisting fork.
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Nov 24, 2015 16:16
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Pagan posted:Blacksmithing questions! And some machining. What would the dies look like, exactly? What kind of material? Hard or soft? And whereabouts are you located?
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Nov 24, 2015 16:31
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A good cutoff hardie really is a great thing to have on hand (make it a single bevel and cut with the "good" part of the stock on the unbevelled side), I made myself some stakes and got a lot of use out of those too (a smallish square-faced stake is great for awkward things where the rest of the anvil would otherwise get in the way). Fullering hardies are also extremely useful if you find yourself doing a lot of drawing by hand and want to make your job easier.
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Nov 24, 2015 16:50
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A Proper Uppercut posted:What would the dies look like, exactly? What kind of material? Hard or soft? And whereabouts are you located? I'm in Rhode Island, and this is my early christmas present to myself http://yesteryear-forge.myshopify.com/products/g2-guillotine-fullering-tool-1
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Nov 24, 2015 20:35
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Pagan posted:I'm in Rhode Island, and this is my early christmas present to myself Hey cool! I'm in southern Massachusetts (for some reason I thought you were local, though I'm not sure why), and while we don't do any conventional machining in our shop, we send stuff out all the time, and I have a lot of friends in the trade. Those looks like pretty basic stuff. If there's any shapes in particular you're looking for, make up some sketches and I can get you a quote if you want.
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Nov 24, 2015 21:03
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MohawkSatan posted:If you get into any sort of machining, go for CNC. Dear gods, go for CNC. I did my training for my first year's apprenticeship as a manual machinist here in Canada, and let me tell you; being a 1st year manual machinist means there is no such thing as work. Unless you already have a job lined up when you get into it, you are effectively hosed. There will be no work, because almost nobody is willing to hire first years. If you do find one of the rare places willing to take on a newbie, then you'd better have a full set of tools, which will run you a couple of grand(which you won't have because you won't have had any work), or say goodbye to that. If you find a place that will hire you, not require you have several grand in tools before doing your 1st day's work, and not require that you be CNC trained, then you should also buy a lottery ticket and start saving those solid gold eggs you've been making GBS threads out. ive been up on that indeed.ca all day in regards to these things and it is making me want to excavate a dugout in high park so i can afford rent going into the future
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Nov 24, 2015 23:31
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Pagan posted:Blacksmithing questions! And some machining. It looks like that thing will take any die made out of 2" wide by 1/2" thick steel stock. I recommend you go to a steel supplier, buy ~10' of steel stock, cut off some pieces and make your own dies. For simple shapes you should be fine with a clean cut and some file work. If you get higher-carbon steel you can harden the dies in your forge. Most youtube videos I see of fuller+die work the smith made the dies themselves, unless we're talking about Krupp making ship engine shafts or something. For the scale you're at I say just get some steel the right size and go for it.
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Nov 25, 2015 19:46
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A Proper Uppercut posted:Hey cool! I'm in southern Massachusetts (for some reason I thought you were local, though I'm not sure why), and while we don't do any conventional machining in our shop, we send stuff out all the time, and I have a lot of friends in the trade. Those looks like pretty basic stuff. If there's any shapes in particular you're looking for, make up some sketches and I can get you a quote if you want. Ditto, Pagan, drop me the drawings and I can get quotes from my shops too.
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Nov 28, 2015 21:44
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I want to heat treat some tool steel. Is there an easy way to make a little oven to get the steel up to the 1333 degrees I need to get it to Austenite? The stuff I am working on is about .875 diameter, and about 2 inches long. My acetylene torch can get it glowing orange, but I don't think it gets hot enough. Can I use a mapp gas tank and some fire brick or something to get it going to temp?
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Nov 29, 2015 20:50
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That sounds hot enough to me already, but it depends on the lighting. Borax melts at ~1360f and the magnetic point is about 60 degrees higher than that, give either of those tests a shot before looking for a hotter torch, imo.
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Nov 29, 2015 22:22
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Brekelefuw posted:I want to heat treat some tool steel. Is there an easy way to make a little oven to get the steel up to the 1333 degrees I need to get it to Austenite? I thought (and this is the thread to correct me if I'm wrong) that "non-magnetic" and "hot enough to harden" were the exact same thing?
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Nov 30, 2015 02:18
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Pagan posted:I thought (and this is the thread to correct me if I'm wrong) that "non-magnetic" and "hot enough to harden" were the exact same thing? As far as I know, they are. My acetylene torch can't get the metal hot enough to penetrate the steel fully to go non magnetic. That was the first test I did when I heated my first piece.
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Nov 30, 2015 04:20
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Your actual flame doesn't have to be the temperature you're trying to reach (although a Mapp gas flame is 5300 F which is plenty hot): what you need is to add energy to an insulated area faster than it can escape. For a single-time one-use project you can be super-ghetto and probably get there. Go buy a dozen bricks. Stack them up to make a little cavity just a bit larger than your workpiece. Make a hole to feed the mapp torch in, and a hole not exactly opposite it for the air to escape. Preheat, shove in your piece, block off the entrance, and just let it run for ten or fifteen minutes. Ordinary bricks aren't firebrick and they may crack if there's moisture in them, but they'll retain enough heat and act as a good enough insulator to get you the extra couple hundred degrees or so that you need. Alternatively, just heap up a bunch of charcoal in your charcoal grill, get some good hot coals, bury your workpiece in it, and then hold a hairdryer close enough to force a good amount of air into the coals (but not close enough to melt the dryer or burn your hand. Be careful!) and let that go for a while. Even better would be if you have a leaf blower. If you're feeling creative, find some non-galvanized metal pipe you can blow air through into the fire.
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Nov 30, 2015 07:55
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On this same note, we were trying to harden some 18g 4130 last night. Hit 1650 on the pyrometer in the bottom of the kiln, and quenched as fast as possible in water. We were expecting "hard and brittle", but got "somewhat less flexible, maybe". Did we gently caress up somewhere or are our expectations off re: hard and brittle?
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Nov 30, 2015 15:50
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Splizwarf posted:On this same note, we were trying to harden some 18g 4130 last night. Hit 1650 on the pyrometer in the bottom of the kiln, and quenched as fast as possible in water. We were expecting "hard and brittle", but got "somewhat less flexible, maybe". Did we gently caress up somewhere or are our expectations off re: hard and brittle? I might be completely wrong about this, but as far as I know the 30 in the 4130 represents that the metal has around .30% carbon in it. Which doesn't sound like a lot but something like 1090 has .90% and is going to be quite a bit harder. I think the problem you are seeing is from its lower carbon amount. For example I made two knives one out of the mild steel that home depot has and one out of o1 tool steel, which has a carbon content range of .80 - 1%. After heat treating it I wanted to see how tough they were. The mild steel when bent stayed bent, the tool steel sprang back and when I put to much force the tool steel snapped. Gealar fucked around with this message at 19:33 on Nov 30, 2015 |
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Nov 30, 2015 19:29
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Leperflesh posted:Your actual flame doesn't have to be the temperature you're trying to reach (although a Mapp gas flame is 5300 F which is plenty hot): what you need is to add energy to an insulated area faster than it can escape. For a single-time one-use project you can be super-ghetto and probably get there. Insulation is the way to go. Brek, go to Canadian tire and go to the far back aisle (usually on the right side of the entrance past the electrical fixtures). There's an aisle with all kinds of miscellaneous hardware bits, they usually have fireplace repair supplies there scattered amongst the replacement oven elements and door gaskets along with the broken dreams of Canadian suburbia. You can get a few fire bricks at a reasonable price without having to buy a pallet full. You'll find uses for these after this project. Also: Trick I've found useful for hardening: let the heat soak. Don't just get it up to temp and immediately quench, let it sit there for a minute and then throw it in the water/oil. If it doesn't work at first, do it again. But yeah, 30 points of carbon isn't going to get super hard unless it's some really fancy alloy.
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Nov 30, 2015 21:15
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Slung Blade posted:Insulation is the way to go. Brek, go to Canadian tire and go to the far back aisle (usually on the right side of the entrance past the electrical fixtures). There's an aisle with all kinds of miscellaneous hardware bits, they usually have fireplace repair supplies there scattered amongst the replacement oven elements and door gaskets along with the broken dreams of Canadian suburbia. You can get a few fire bricks at a reasonable price without having to buy a pallet full. You'll find uses for these after this project. Will do. Crappy Tire is down the road from my work.
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Nov 30, 2015 22:25
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Yeah, turns out we missed "for an hour" in the explanation. Herp derp learning process. v v
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Nov 30, 2015 22:29
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Here is a little sample of what my process is for building my trumpets. I am making more videos as I go. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h0BzuZzIEeM Bending the bells https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EhiyIKHHpkM Drawing the tapered leadpipe tube.
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Nov 30, 2015 22:43
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That was awesome, and the elementary school band music for the second one was just perfect. Next up: how do you make the bell to begin with?
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Dec 1, 2015 00:28
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Currently I don't have the money or space to get a spinning lathe and tooling, so I have them made for me in Germany to my specs and to the bending and finishing myself.
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Dec 1, 2015 01:21
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Splizwarf posted:Yeah, turns out we missed "for an hour" in the explanation. Herp derp learning process. v You need to heat soak it for an hour before hardening? Holy gently caress. Man I would just use a different steel. Why do you need to use this specific alloy?
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Dec 1, 2015 17:59
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I didn't pick it, guy wants spring steel for a Wisby-style coat of plates for Battle of Nations. vv Since I posted that, I went back to my books and couldn't find anything about an hour, but he says his documentation calls for a water quench after 1 hour at 1650f, then a half hour temper at 500f finished by room temp air cooling. This time around it's his money, so I'm only going to argue if I have a well-documented argument. I have previous armoring experience but we're both pretty new at the hot side of metalwork.
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Dec 1, 2015 18:41
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Hey dudes. I'm a forensic metallurgist at a big aerospace company. I don't have any experience with any artisan work but I've done time in a melt shop at a minimill as well. Just popping in to say hello, this is a cool thread that's new to me.
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Dec 2, 2015 01:42
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I was p dead-set on a name-brand 220V MIG welder, but a reasonably-portable dual-voltage arc/MIG/TIG machine for 200 dollars off and with a no-questions asked return policy... well, shucks, how can I say no to that, store brand or no? 25% at 145A max is kind of lame, but idk how much that would really end up bottlenecking me realistically speaking if I can cheat a lil more out of that with fluxcore and don't intend to do serious production work with it.
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Dec 2, 2015 01:53
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Lawnie posted:Hey dudes. I'm a forensic metallurgist at a big aerospace company. I don't have any experience with any artisan work but I've done time in a melt shop at a minimill as well. Just popping in to say hello, this is a cool thread that's new to me. Is that anything like an instron jockey? What is forensic metallurgy?
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Dec 2, 2015 04:16
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Random Number posted:Is that anything like an instron jockey? What is forensic metallurgy? Might be better known as failure investigator. Essentially I work in a lab to figure out how metal components fail, but you get really familiar with alloy systems, processing techniques, that sort of thing. You have to understand how something was made to figure out how it may have broken in many cases. Sorry if that's not very specific, I find it kind of hard to describe.
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Dec 2, 2015 04:39
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i started a new repousse project and part of the sheet just crumbled halfway through and revealed a big gnarly firescale inclusion that's loving me up something fierce what i'm saying is, you're the guy who issues refunds, right
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Dec 2, 2015 04:49
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Lawnie posted:Might be better known as failure investigator. Essentially I work in a lab to figure out how metal components fail, but you get really familiar with alloy systems, processing techniques, that sort of thing. You have to understand how something was made to figure out how it may have broken in many cases. Ah, so you're very busy what with all the fireballs lately, got it.
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Dec 2, 2015 05:44
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Lawnie posted:Might be better known as failure investigator. Essentially I work in a lab to figure out how metal components fail, but you get really familiar with alloy systems, processing techniques, that sort of thing. You have to understand how something was made to figure out how it may have broken in many cases. That sounds pretty neat. Do you get down to like electron microscope images to say poo poo like "Yeah, interstitial poo poo's hosed" or something like that? Doping gone wrong? Do you have to deal with things like monocrystalline turbine blades? My best friend from high school is big into materials science and I'm in production, so it's always a good time when we get to talking.
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Dec 2, 2015 08:34
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Do you know anything about cryogenic treatment of copper alloys? Lots of debate in my field about whether or not it actually does anything.
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Dec 2, 2015 12:19
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Rotten Cookies posted:That sounds pretty neat. Do you get down to like electron microscope images to say poo poo like "Yeah, interstitial poo poo's hosed" or something like that? Doping gone wrong? Do you have to deal with things like monocrystalline turbine blades? My best friend from high school is big into materials science and I'm in production, so it's always a good time when we get to talking. I use an SEM extensively to characterize fracture modes, microstructure, chemistry, damage (in-service or otherwise) or anything else that requires large depth of field at high magnification. It's not powerful enough to observe atomic structure like your interstitial poo poo/doping example (you'd need a TEM for that) but I regularly look at stuff at 20k X magnification. The SEM is also good for debris characterization and sometimes microstructure evaluation. I do indeed work some with single crystal turbine blades, and know a little about their manufacture. Some of the properties achieved in those things are unbelievable. Brekelefuw posted:Do you know anything about cryogenic treatment of copper alloys? Lots of debate in my field about whether or not it actually does anything. I'm not familiar with that technique though I've heard of it used for other alloys and heat treatments. Copper isn't a very common alloy in a gas turbine. Generally, stainless steel is used for tubing, etc. that might otherwise use copper.
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Dec 2, 2015 14:53
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Lawnie posted:
Anything non-proprietary that you can tell us about how those are made? poo poo's fascinating. Also I'm glad you found us 
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Dec 2, 2015 21:36
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Motronic posted:elementary school band music You mean you don't instantly recognize Portsmouth Synfonia? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hpJ6anurfuw "This was recorded by the Portsmouth Sinfonia in an experiment where all the members of the orchestra would swap instruments with each other and attempt to play them to the best of their ability."
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Dec 3, 2015 19:04
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