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Here's how lovely Brazilian media is: "Brazilian GDP is the worst among 11 of the top 20 world economies" joepinetree fucked around with this message at 23:22 on Dec 1, 2015 |
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Dec 1, 2015 23:16
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joepinetree posted:Here's how lovely Brazilian media is: lmao
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Dec 1, 2015 23:18
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joepinetree posted:Here's how lovely Brazilian media is: lol, that took some effort to write
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Dec 1, 2015 23:26
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dilma is the worst female president Brazil has ever had. disgraceful
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Dec 2, 2015 00:57
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Polidoro posted:It is much harder to fraud paper ballot. I don't know how it is everywhere else, but here you'd need to have people from every party and the army on your side to alter the results. With electronic voting you need just a handful of people and there are multiple points where you can alter the results. Not to mention that electronic voting means opening the door to a third (probably foreign) party to the electoral process. Method-wise a method that uses paper and electronic method may be the safest (which Brazil uses in some sense, as the electronic urn vote lists are printed in 5 copies right after the voting finishes and kept in different locations), but that doesn't change the fact that election fraud is mostly a civic culture issue. I mean this: quote:you'd need to have people from every party and the army on your side to alter the results Election frauds used to happen here in Brazil in the early 20th century because ALL parties frauded elections and tolerated each other doing it. If an important election showed signs of being "off", our parties would most likely protest, demand investigations and even re-votings nowadays. I guess this stems from the post 90s democratizations in South America, people were really sick of rigged elections and the political winners when the dictatorships collapsed didn't really have any reason to outright rig elections, it's one of the few things that apparently changed for the better down here. Of course, you can still manipulate the gently caress out of people into voting in you, but i don't think actual election fraud is seriously considered by political parties as a valid strategy except maybe in really small interior cities. The blowback would be too much. bagual fucked around with this message at 03:00 on Dec 2, 2015 |
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Dec 2, 2015 02:06
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PT has decided to vote for the continuation of the investigation of Eduardo Cunha, and as a result, Eduardo Cunha has accepted one of the impeachment requests against Dilma. Now it will be a matter of who will be able to get more votes, through the usual shady deals.
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Dec 2, 2015 22:15
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So can somebody give me a rundown to why Brazil is in an economic crisis?
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Dec 4, 2015 10:31
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This is Rio de Janeiro: "Iraqui man survives 2 wars, comes to Rio and is robbed"
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Dec 4, 2015 12:53
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punk rebel ecks posted:So can somebody give me a rundown to why Brazil is in an economic crisis? Commodity prices are down.
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Dec 4, 2015 16:41
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Again, commodity prices are only a very small part of it. Exports are less than 15% of the Brazilian economy. The bulk of the Brazilian economy is domestic consumption and government expenditures. The basic reason for the boom in the first place was government investment, cash transfers and cheap credit keeping up the demand side. That model was reaching its natural limit, coupled with domestic inflation and a tightening of international credit markets. The result is that the expansionary cycle was coming to an end. But then a couple of things made the situation go from just a recession to a serious economic meltdown. A major corruption scandal has involved pretty much every single major Brazilian company that does business with the government, essentially freezing most public works, and the credit situation at home and abroad has had to force the government into further spending cuts.
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Dec 4, 2015 17:35
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Não tem crise
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Dec 4, 2015 17:53
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I'm not as economically fluent as I'd like to be, but the "cheap credit" part of it has always struck me as a very important factor in the current crisis Brazil faces. We started hearing a lot about this "new middle class", the once-poor people of Brazil that started making and spending money...except a lot of that spending was done via credit lines. Government pushed it and Brazilian banks were happy to oblige - we have insane credit card interest rates here, after all, and we love our "installment plans". Of course, while that heated up our economy at first, it stalled up as debt caught up with people. The rest of the story is pretty much as joepinetree described: we hit a recession that was aggravated by a tumultuous political background, and I'm sitting at home typing this poo poo at 3pm holding an (even more than usual) useless Advertising degree.
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Dec 4, 2015 17:57
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I need to pass on a concurso next year or else I'm hosed haha
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Dec 4, 2015 18:20
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TheLovablePlutonis posted:I need to pass on a concurso next year or else I'm hosed haha Lol, arent most of them canceled, people that were approved are taking years to get the job and even some people that got in are at a risk of being downsized? Goondolences. On the other side I had a really hard year professionally speaking, lost a lot of contracts and yet this has been the year that I made the most money overall, mostly because I'm paid in dollars.
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Dec 4, 2015 19:00
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Yeah I inscribed for as many confirmed editals as I could and even so they might be cancelled. Heard that there's one to work at the Senate going on though, with a base salary of 11k a month so you bet I'm gonna get on that gravy train.
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Dec 4, 2015 19:10
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 So, here is PT filing for the impeachment of Fernando Henrique Cardoso's second mandate (1998-2002). Michel Temer(PMDB), the one holding the file and looks like a happy devil, is the current Vice-president.
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Dec 4, 2015 21:31
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The impeachment is only going to get voted on congress after carnival next february. Globo is going to keep talking about it non-stop and bring as many law experts that agree with it as possible while not mentioning all the other experts that say the impeachment has no legal ground. The impeachment is going to be the most talked about issue on the news for the next months. People are going to forget all the scandals other people like Aecio and Cunha are involved in, the impeachment is going to replace everything else. Next carnival is going to be the "impeachment carnival" and I bet the media is going to do their best to make it look as if everyone on the streets is in favor of booting Dilma. Buckle up for major media manipulation.
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Dec 4, 2015 22:13
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So essentially:
Is that right?
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Dec 5, 2015 03:02
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Yes, but the corruption scandal is also a part of it because essentially every major brazilian corporation has been caught in it and virtually all of them depend on government contracts to keep going.
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Dec 5, 2015 04:47
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Kanthulhu posted:The impeachment is only going to get voted on congress after carnival next february. Globo is going to keep talking about it non-stop and bring as many law experts that agree with it as possible while not mentioning all the other experts that say the impeachment has no legal ground. The impeachment is going to be the most talked about issue on the news for the next months. People are going to forget all the scandals other people like Aecio and Cunha are involved in, the impeachment is going to replace everything else. The usual suspects (istoé and veja) already have covers claiming that the impeachment is the only thing that will save the economy.
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Dec 7, 2015 17:59
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Brazilian media normally loves to publish anything that comes out about Brazil in international media. Last month all major publications, for example, published stories about how Dilma fell some positions in forbes "most influential" list. Well, try and find any major outlet talking about this: http://www.forbes.com/sites/kenrapoza/2015/03/25/why-impeaching-brazils-president-dilma-is-a-bad-idea/ joepinetree fucked around with this message at 21:05 on Dec 7, 2015 |
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Dec 7, 2015 18:27
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TheLovablePlutonis posted:The usual suspects (istoé and veja) already have covers claiming that the impeachment is the only thing that will save the economy. Yeah, I've seen those. If I'm not mistaken, Veja had a 24 page special in which it argued that even if the impeachment had no legal grounds it still would be good for the country. They don't give a poo poo about the law at all.
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Dec 7, 2015 22:08
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How much of this economic crisis is due to the ruling party?
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Dec 7, 2015 23:41
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punk rebel ecks posted:How much of this economic crisis is due to the ruling party? This is impossible to answer. Yes, the PT has fumbled a number of key economic decisions, but they were also always limited in terms of reforms they could introduce (proposals to make taxes more progressive always died in committee, for example), and a lot of the reasons for the crisis is reaching the limits of the economic policy that created the previous boom. The corruption scheme that has deepened the crisis is a multi-party affair, with the leadership of nearly all major parties involved.
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Dec 8, 2015 01:02
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This does make me wonder, what can be done to stop corruption? Because I think it is not endemic only in LA or under developed nation, it's just rampant there, but it it present everywhere. Maybe it is just a part of the bureaucracy associated with democracy, that we will have to live with forever? I foresee a lot of retroactive purges with the new government in Argentina. Corruption scandals will start popping up everywhere.
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Dec 8, 2015 02:36
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Markovnikov posted:This does make me wonder, what can be done to stop corruption? Because I think it is not endemic only in LA or under developed nation, it's just rampant there, but it it present everywhere. Maybe it is just a part of the bureaucracy associated with democracy, that we will have to live with forever? i doubt that in the history of mankind there has ever been a corruption free government, just due to human nature and the fact that there are so many cogs in the machine, one is bound to mess up. And yeah, after that La Nacion article that told people to stop seeking revenge against the military men who headed the coup, I fully expect some revisionism, and a lot of new scandals to suddenly pop up, quite a few of them fake too.
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Dec 8, 2015 11:46
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ArfJason posted:i doubt that in the history of mankind there has ever been a corruption free government, just due to human nature and the fact that there are so many cogs in the machine, one is bound to mess up. And yeah, after that La Nacion article that told people to stop seeking revenge against the military men who headed the coup, I fully expect some revisionism, and a lot of new scandals to suddenly pop up, quite a few of them fake too. True that but in some places, like Brazil, it is something special. I dont think there are many places in the world where corruptions is so widespread and common. Not only on the government either: there seems to be a tendency to dishonesty here at every level and class of society, from the most miserable to the richest. And PT cant get away with "oh it is a systemic issue it was like this when we got here, we just played along!" after spending the decades before getting to power raging against corruption and posing as the only alternative to it.
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Dec 8, 2015 12:13
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Markovnikov posted:This does make me wonder, what can be done to stop corruption? Because I think it is not endemic only in LA or under developed nation, it's just rampant there, but it it present everywhere. Maybe it is just a part of the bureaucracy associated with democracy, that we will have to live with forever? Good news - it's not quite so bad in Latin America as you suspect according to this:  I don't know exactly what their methodology is (cba to read all the documentation), but it just popped up on the World Bank twitter today coincidentally.
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Dec 8, 2015 12:52
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Reported request for bribes is the key here. It seems more like companies that are reporting officials who are trying to charge for access. It's not going to encompass the kind of corruption like the petrobras scandal where both sides are complicit and basically colluding to rip off the government.
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Dec 8, 2015 13:13
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Markovnikov posted:This does make me wonder, what can be done to stop corruption? Because I think it is not endemic only in LA or under developed nation, it's just rampant there, but it it present everywhere. Maybe it is just a part of the bureaucracy associated with democracy, that we will have to live with forever? Reducing inequality and alternating government. Less inequality means people from different walks of life have a shot at key government, etc. positions, which prevents certain groups from just transforming the state into a rent extracting institution. Democratic power alternating gives parties an incentive to promote transparency. Both explain to a large extent why what is going on in Brazil is going on. The remarkable thing about the situation in Brazil isn't the extent of the corruption, but the fact that it is being investigated. For all we know, the scheme has been going on for decades. But now people are being arrested and held accountable. The main problem is that there has been a clear pattern in terms of who is arrested. As a party that is mostly supported by lower classes and lower level public servants, PT politicians don't have the same connections and protection among higher level courts that other parties have (compare Janot's actions' versus Brindeiro's during FHC's government). And while there is alternating governments at the top level of the government, there are parts of the coalition that are always in power (e.g., PMDB). That is, it is a positive thing that PT politicians are being held accountable and being arrested. But we need true political turnover to have true accountability. As long as we are guaranteed to have PMDB as the king maker in Brazilian politics, they will be untouchable.
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Dec 8, 2015 15:56
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hoiyes posted:Reported request for bribes is the key here. It seems more like companies that are reporting officials who are trying to charge for access. It's not going to encompass the kind of corruption like the petrobras scandal where both sides are complicit and basically colluding to rip off the government.
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Dec 8, 2015 15:59
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As an aside, Temer leaked a letter he sent to Dilma earlier this week. The letter is first of all telling in its content, in which he complains that PMDB and his allies did not have enough positions in the government (which is something amazing in that it is not true but also openly admits the "key positions for support" deal). The main take away from it is that Temer is now openly campaigning for the impeachment.
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Dec 8, 2015 16:17
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So what good has Argentina's previous government done to the country? IIRC the election was reasonable close, but I heard nothing but bad things about Argentina from residents.
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Dec 8, 2015 17:29
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punk rebel ecks posted:So what good has Argentina's previous government done to the country? IIRC the election was reasonable close, but I heard nothing but bad things about Argentina from residents. Well, they stabilized the economy in the aftermath of 2001 after a period of extreme turbulence with governments rising and falling within weeks. They also created a lot of social programs which have significantly improved the lives of many low-income Argentinians.
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Dec 8, 2015 19:39
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FreshlyShaven posted:Well, they stabilized the economy in the aftermath of 2001 after a period of extreme turbulence with governments rising and falling within weeks. They also created a lot of social programs which have significantly improved the lives of many low-income Argentinians. This. The middle and upper classes are just salty that they can't buy their precious dollars and that the poors are getting something for once. "They get their free money and they don't work so now we don't have anyone to build buildings!!!" <-- a thing I heard my mother literally say. That said, a lot of that growth was probably achieved by printing money, which lead to inflation, which lead to currency exchange controls, which leads to hosed up import/export balances. So as always, it's not all upside. Don't worry, our lord and saviour Macri (PBUH) will just roll it all back so the middle class can go back to its Miami vacations.
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Dec 8, 2015 19:48
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The Kirchner administration had sound ideas in theory that were just lukewarm in practice. Removing admission exams from universities and doing literally nothing else about it (instead of trying to, you know, fix the secondary school system, for example) is an example of that. Kinda reminds me of North Korea at times. "WE MADE OUR FIRST TRUCK, OUR IDEOLOGY IS SOUND AND POWERFUL, WE DON'T NEED CAPITALISM!" *truck can only move forwards*
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Dec 8, 2015 20:02
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joepinetree posted:As an aside, Temer leaked a letter he sent to Dilma earlier this week. The letter is first of all telling in its content, in which he complains that PMDB and his allies did not have enough positions in the government (which is something amazing in that it is not true but also openly admits the "key positions for support" deal). The main take away from it is that Temer is now openly campaigning for the impeachment. 
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Dec 8, 2015 20:18
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lmao
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Dec 8, 2015 20:46
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Markovnikov posted:This. The middle and upper classes are just salty that they can't buy their precious dollars and that the poors are getting something for once. "They get their free money and they don't work so now we don't have anyone to build buildings!!!" <-- a thing I heard my mother literally say. That is a lot of the anti-PT feeling in Brazil. There is clearly a nostalgia for the late 90s when the the dollar was 82 cents, you could have 3 live in maids for 200 bucks and the majority of low wage employment was cash only, off the books, and you could get 2% a month ROI by investing in CDs. Just about the easiest way to break the ice with an upper middle class Brazilian nowadays is to complain about your maid and how they aren't like the old times, when they would work 14 hours a day 6 days a week. Not that PT hasn't really messed up. But if you are genuine in relation to fighting corruption and graft, your plan doesn't revolve around giving the PMDB more power. And as I am saying this, the opposition elected the bulk of the impeachment commission. At this point, odds are it will come down to the wire, with intense back dealing in the senate.
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Dec 8, 2015 21:54
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Markovnikov posted:Don't worry, our lord and saviour Macri (PBUH) will just roll it all back so the middle class can go back to its Miami vacations. It is my strong belief that the intention behind putting a lot of these plans in motion (a lot of which are good in implementation regardless of motive, such as the Universal Subsidy per Child) was an electoral strategy. Had they seriously believed that the plans were good in and of themselves, then they would have legislated the plans into existence (or ratified them once already in place) through proper laws, and made them necessitate a parliamentary process in order to be overturned. This is of course no excuse to a lot of the people who oppose these plans precisely because of pearl-clutching reasons.
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Dec 8, 2015 23:22
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