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Dapper_Swindler posted:from what i understand, is that its sorta of a proxie war during the new galactic cold war. The new republic is funding the resistance and the imperial empire/remnant is funding the first order. the first order seem like the star wars equivalent of neo-nazis, a rebranding of the empires past and sith poo poo. How I understood it is that First Order pretty much IS what is left of the Empire/their spiritual successor, whereas Republic/Resistance 7" split is just baffling Your interpretation makes the entire thing somewhat sensible so i'm more than willing to accept it and just explain my own as a result of head trauma
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Dec 16, 2015 23:37
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Cheesus posted:As much as I think the concept and execution of Snoke is pedestrian, this is straight up powerful: https://vid.me/wMPh The not so subtle red/blue light behind Kylo  .
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Dec 16, 2015 23:38
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BastardySkull posted:Its 11:26 on the 17th December in New Zealand and it releases on the 17th there. So yeah, a lot of people will have seen it now. This is true, I just got back from a morning showing aaaannnd: El Perkele posted:It's enjoyable, I liked the characters, the slow parts are good, the movies tries to do some of the "show, don't tell storytelling" (not very successfully, but still), parts of it are just gorgeous, it's very fantastic in setting and other stuff that make for good sci-fi schlock. The teenage love aspect is kitschy and very self-aware, but endearing. It's not a bad movie, it's entertaining, and accomplishes what it tries to accomplish. I think you'll like it. However, the movie does have issues that are very similar to Star Trek 2009 film - it's cool, until you sit down and think about it, and then it makes you all confused and a bit angry. I agree with this post 100%. I really wanted a scene where characters discussed what they wanted to happen and what was at stake if they failed for some context, but it never materialised. And yeah, I mostly came here hoping someone could explain Galactic politics. I suppose they didn't want to go too much into politics chat like the sequels did, but went way too far the other way. My best guess is the Order guys are an evil cult?
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Dec 16, 2015 23:41
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Ras Het posted:Another thing: this was much funnier than any of the earlier films, and the corny fun stuff was harmlessly corny and not like... funny looking aliens acting rude. C3PO's first appearance is just loving incredible. The thumbs up between Finn and BB8 was great too. iSheep posted:The not so subtle red/blue light behind Kylo Also he doesn't perform the evil act until the light (the Starkiller charging) literally goes out and night falls. 
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Dec 16, 2015 23:42
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Jerusalem posted:C3PO's first appearance is just loving incredible.
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Dec 16, 2015 23:45
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The first Star Wars movie had the advantage that the opening was so brilliant, the galactic struggle between the mighty Empire and the small group of Rebels became immediately clear. Now we have splinter groups and a new republic and other stuff and no one knows who is who. Would it have been too hard to clarify this in the opening scroll text ? Oh wait, today's cinema audience does not read.
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Dec 16, 2015 23:47
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Hammerstein posted:Oh wait, today's cinema audience does not read. Well I certainly don't go to the cinema to loving read.
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Dec 16, 2015 23:50
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How was the music? Are there tracks that will be as iconic as Duel of the Fates or Binary Sunset?
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Dec 16, 2015 23:52
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CJ posted:How was the music? Are there tracks that will be as iconic as Duel of the Fates or Binary Sunset? Don't forget the music during the Luke/Vader throne room fight. When they traded blows and the chorus swelled in the background made it the best jedi fight scene of the whole franchise.
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Dec 16, 2015 23:57
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Hammerstein posted:The first Star Wars movie had the advantage that the opening was so brilliant, the galactic struggle between the mighty Empire and the small group of Rebels became immediately clear. Wouldn't be that hard, 2 or 3 lines telling us who supports them and what they want would do it. Actually, I can fit that in just one: "However, in the Galactic North/South/whatever many systems have abandoned their support for the Republic for the strength of the New Order, who plot to end the Republic and declare a new Empire under their mysterious leader, Big Giant Head."
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Dec 16, 2015 23:59
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But guys, that's for the Star Wars Sequel-Prequel trilogy of novels to explain! Remember, its officially on the same level of canon as the movies. http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/The_Aftermath_Trilogy People who disliked the EU before when it was just optional get what they deserve when now its going to be required reading to understand just what the gently caress is happening in the movies. There is no escape. And at least the old EU had actual established Sci-Fi authors writing the books. The quality varied tremendously but they were more or less qualified. Now Disney is taking self published fan fiction writers and giving them the keys to the official canon. Shimrra Jamaane fucked around with this message at 00:05 on Dec 17, 2015 |
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Dec 17, 2015 00:02
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Ripper Swarm posted:Wouldn't be that hard, 2 or 3 lines telling us who supports them and what they want would do it. Actually, I can fit that in just one: The problem for me wasn't necessarily the first order (though they did seem to be very well resourced somehow) but what the hell was the resistance?
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Dec 17, 2015 00:03
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I also dug that one rear end in a top hat general who kept making GBS threads on Kylo Ren. Especially when he throws him under the bus to Snoke (that name is so awful) "We left the droid behind because Kylo Ren thought we wouldn't need it and now the Resistance has it  "Ren even gets a look on his face of,"Ahhh gently caress man why'd you have to tell him that?"
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Dec 17, 2015 00:04
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Does the ENTIRE Aftermath Trilogy take place after RotJ but before TFA? The third book doesn't come out until 2017!
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Dec 17, 2015 00:07
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Jerusalem posted:I also dug that one rear end in a top hat general who kept making GBS threads on Kylo Ren. Especially when he throws him under the bus to Snoke (that name is so awful) For some reason I always see Gonzo from the Muppet Show when I imagine the name Snoke.
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Dec 17, 2015 00:08
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GoGoGadgetChris posted:Does the ENTIRE Aftermath Trilogy take place after RotJ but before TFA? The third book doesn't come out until 2017! Correct. But it'll probably have a ton of Episode 8 plot teasers and poo poo in it.
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Dec 17, 2015 00:10
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El Perkele posted:How I understood it is that First Order pretty much IS what is left of the Empire/their spiritual successor, whereas Republic/Resistance 7" split is just baffling Therefore the Resistance would be an unofficial *wink* organization playing the peacetime defense roll once held by the Jedi.
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Dec 17, 2015 00:12
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Cheesus posted:My understanding from the EU books and spoilers is that the Republic is meant to be "legitimate" and having an army/special ops/etc is perceived as a threat to the citizens. Possibly citizens question "how are you guys any better than the Empire?" They should probably consider mutually assured destruction considering the bad guys keep blowing up planets
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Dec 17, 2015 00:15
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Hammerstein posted:For some reason I always see Gonzo from the Muppet Show when I imagine the name Snoke. God I hope somebody calls him a weirdo now.
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Dec 17, 2015 00:16
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Shimrra Jamaane posted:
The prequels did this the entire time. Sure, hyperbole, but we are not going to get name drops about old Jedi/Sith lords who are important to the current plot, or entire bad guys with no context except comics/cartoons.
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Dec 17, 2015 00:27
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Ras Het posted:The whole Mega Death Star thing murdering hundreds of billions of people at once was extremely stupid, and the Mega Death Star Planet exploding in slow motion at the end was even worse, but I think it was well compensated for by the Oedipus Jedi plotlines being really, really good. Except that Kylo probably surviving will be disappointing, because that would've been a fantastic one-off performance, and again, the planet was literally exploding when he fell. I agree. I actually really enjoyed the part of the plot about Finn, Rey, Kylo Ren and Han Solo and that stuff. I felt like the whole death star planet was tacked on as much of it happened so fast and seemed to matter so little next to the much more interesting and well executed stuff with the new characters (whom I enjoyed, except I didn't care much for Poe Dameron). I felt like the movie would have worked better if the end was all about saving Rey because they need to get to Luke (and because of how Finn feels) and stop Kylo from getting to Luke. Death Star planet was both dumb and felt like it really didn't need to be there for the movie to work, it actually had the opposite effect. It was like two different screen writers were working against each other, I dunno. The lightsaber fight actually was pretty neat. e: This movie had a serious case of "it's like poetry, it rhymes" with callbacks and references (both visual and through dialogue) and mirroring the Death Star plot of IV. The funny thing is that all the new stuff that wasn't that actually really worked and stood on its own, or at least I think so, and that makes the inclusion of all that other stuff simply baffling to me as they worked to detract from the movie every time they showed up. Randarkman fucked around with this message at 00:46 on Dec 17, 2015 |
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Dec 17, 2015 00:33
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Randarkman posted:I agree. I actually really enjoyed the part of the plot about Finn, Rey, Kylo Ren and Han Solo and that stuff. I felt like the whole death star planet was tacked on as much of it happened so force and seemed to matter so little next to the much more interesting and well executed stuff with the new characters (whom I enjoyed, except I didn't care much for Poe Dameron). I guess the Death Star planet was there because the whole film was a bombastic cover version of A New Hope, and they tried to up the game in every regard. I don't think that was a bad thing at all really (we got a very enjoyable movie out of it), but a lot of the more middling stuff felt like it was there simply for the sake of pastiche. Poe for example had zero personality and seemed to only exist so that we could get Luke looking like dude flying an X Wing with R2D2 looking like dude. e: wrt to your edit, I basically agree, but the self-referentiality was really important to how well the Ryno plot worked, so, idk, it's sorta 50/50? Cos the more I'm thinking about it the more I'm amazed by how good Adam Driver was and how well that plot turned out. (I also really wish Rey just got her jedi powers out of nowhere and isn't a secret Skywalker, cos that would be the sort of brazen twist that the mythology really needs.) Ras Het fucked around with this message at 00:46 on Dec 17, 2015 |
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Dec 17, 2015 00:41
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Ras Het posted:I guess the Death Star planet was there because the whole film was a bombastic cover version of A New Hope, and they tried to up the game in every regard. I don't think that was a bad thing at all really (we got a very enjoyable movie out of it), but a lot of the more middling stuff felt like it was there simply for the sake of pastiche. Poe for example had zero personality and seemed to only exist so that we could get Luke looking like dude flying an X Wing with R2D2 looking like dude. I feel like Rey has to have some sort of connection to the Skywalker family. My money (actualy have a bet going with the people I watched the movie with) is on her being Luke's kid, though it'd be nice if they found some other way to make that happen. Her and Kylo being related might also work well with the storyline they've established there, as to me it really feels like jealousy is a big part of his character. It'd be a big blow to him that another descendant of Vader is much more powerful with the Force than him and has gotten all that power and control that he wants for himself to prove himself to be something. He really is a pathetic character, and I kind of love it. e: I look forward to the next movie as we'll be exploring the good plotline (and characters) from this movie further and the big dumb super weapon is gone.
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Dec 17, 2015 00:54
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Randarkman posted:except I didn't care much for Poe Dameron Aw man, it didn't click before but from now on I'm going to think of Con-Air every time he's mentioned.
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Dec 17, 2015 00:56
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Ripper Swarm posted:Aw man, it didn't click before but from now on I'm going to think of Con-Air every time he's mentioned. Well, Con-Air's a fun movie. It won't measure up to how weird it is every time someone says "Snoke" though in this movie, which is quite a lot.
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Dec 17, 2015 00:58
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I really liked it. It all looked great, and the worlds seemed believable, without them needing to overexplain things. Movie works on itself too, you don't really need to see the earlier movies to get the plot, though previous exposure is needed to see all the fanservice moments. New cast was terrific. Boyega was fantastic and has great comedic timing, I liked him alot. Ridley was very good at emoting without speaking, Isaac was cool, and Driver was REALLY good as Kylo Ren. I was really worried, since I had seen him in "Girls" and really didn't care for him there, but I totally loved his potrayal of an emotionally unstable villain. His tantrums when things went wrong where he just destroys what's around him without actually killing anyone was pretty rad. Was pretty interesting that they dropped the "Kylo is the son of Han and Leia" bomb as early as they did. Makes sense I suppose. We're all jaded from that sort of plottwists from the OT so might as well get it over with quickly. Starkiller base worked differently than I had imagined it, and I have to say, I would prefer my own version. I imagined that the weapon took out the major sun in any system it was pointed to, which would cause a supernova or black hole or what-have you, something that in turn would spell the destruction of the surrounding systems. Instead it's just a Death Star laser that splits apart and takes down whatever is in the area. Same thing I guess, but I thought the name "STARKILLER" was a good indicator on what it would do. Oh well. Eagerly looking forward to VIII.
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Dec 17, 2015 00:58
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Randarkman posted:I feel like Rey has to have some sort of connection to the Skywalker family. My money (actualy have a bet going with the people I watched the movie with) is on her being Luke's kid, though it'd be nice if they found some other way to make that happen. Her and Kylo being related might also work well with the storyline they've established there, as to me it really feels like jealousy is a big part of his character. It'd be a big blow to him that another descendant of Vader is much more powerful with the Force than him and has gotten all that power and control that he wants for himself to prove himself to be something. He really is a pathetic character, and I kind of love it. It will also have a good director, instead of JJ Abrams. However you feel about this one I think Rian Johnson is a decent reason to be optimistic about 8.
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Dec 17, 2015 01:00
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CJ posted:How was the music? Are there tracks that will be as iconic as Duel of the Fates or Binary Sunset? I just listened to the soundtrack, and there's nothing on there that really scream "you will be humming this/instantly remembering this forever" but there are some highlights that might work better for me in context
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Dec 17, 2015 01:04
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Music was okay. Nothing special, other than the good ol' classics. Nothing bad, mind you. But found no real gems when I saw it. But I'll try to pay more attention to it the next time I get the chance.
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Dec 17, 2015 01:06
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BigglesSWE posted:Music was okay. Nothing special, other than the good ol' classics. Nothing bad, mind you. But found no real gems when I saw it. But I'll try to pay more attention to it the next time I get the chance. John Williams is getting pretty old. I did not really think much of the music at all during the film, it's all the normal Star Wars stuff and some new stuff which I can't really remember at all. Which is kind of disappointing as even the Prequel trilogy has tons of music in it (mostly in Episode I) that's really good and memorable. Then again, John Williams is getting old and JJ Abrams seems to go for kind of bland "epic" action scores for his movies, Star Trek 09's score was pretty bad in that regard. At least with Star Wars you have a pool of good stuff you can (and are expected) to choose from. Other than that, the sound effects were really loving good in this movie. It shouldn't be hard to go wrong with the Star Wars sound effects but everything sounded great, especially stuff with Kylo Ren and when he was using the Force to freeze blaster bolts, his lightsaber also sounded really great and the visual and sound effects during the lightsaber fight were top notch. Randarkman fucked around with this message at 01:14 on Dec 17, 2015 |
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Dec 17, 2015 01:09
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Prediction for VIII: Luke sacrifices himself, either refusing to kill Kylo or to save him from something else, and this is the lynchpin in Kylo's return to the light. He teams up with the heroes in IX. Leia and Chewie survive the whole thing.
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Dec 17, 2015 01:15
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Tender Bender posted:Prediction for VIII: Luke sacrifices himself, either refusing to kill Kylo or to save him from something else, and this is the lynchpin in Kylo's return to the light. He teams up with the heroes in IX. Leia and Chewie survive the whole thing. Do you think Luke will use the lightsaber? Somehow I think not, or atleast if he does he will come to a point where he will refuse using it, like in VI, though I would prefer the lesson from VI to have stuck rather than repeating it. e: Also character arcs like that really should be the territory of the new characters, especially arcs that mirror the ones from the original trilogy. Randarkman fucked around with this message at 01:31 on Dec 17, 2015 |
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Dec 17, 2015 01:17
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Randarkman posted:John Williams is getting pretty old. I did not really think much of the music at all during the film, it's all the normal Star Wars stuff and some new stuff which I can't really remember at all. Which is kind of disappointing as even the Prequel trilogy has tons of music in it (mostly in Episode I) that's really good and memorable. Then again, John Williams is getting old and JJ Abrams seems to go for kind of bland "epic" action scores for his movies, Star Trek 09's score was pretty bad in that regard. At least with Star Wars you have a pool of good stuff you can (and are expected) to choose from. Yeah, audio and visuals were great. I'll still buy the soundtrack I suppose, but I think it's good if people don't expect any new "Duel of Fates" kind of tracks this time around. One thing I should bring up: The lightsaber fight in the end is fantastic! They did a very interesting and intense fight without it being gimmicky and filled with cartoonished jumping and such stuff. My crowd frigging EXPLODED with cheers when the lightsaber rushed past Kylo and straight for Rey.
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Dec 17, 2015 01:26
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BigglesSWE posted:One thing I should bring up: The lightsaber fight in the end is fantastic! They did a very interesting and intense fight without it being gimmicky and filled with cartoonished jumping and such stuff. My crowd frigging EXPLODED with cheers when the lightsaber rushed past Kylo and straight for Rey. It also only went on for like 5 minutes in one location and had way more emotional impact and tension than the one in Sith.
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Dec 17, 2015 01:35
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Randarkman posted:Do you think Luke will use the lightsaber? Somehow I think not, or atleast if he does he will come to a point where he will refuse using it, like in VI, though I would prefer the lesson from VI to have stuck rather than repeating it. Yeah I think Luke's journey is done. I don't think they can resist giving us the moneyshot of Mark Hamill lighting up the lightsaber, but it'll be purely for talking about Jedi/the force or maybe waxing nostalgic about holding his father's saber again. I don't think he'll use it in combat. There'll be a scene where it looks like we're going to see him draw his saber and kick rear end (Kylo catches up to him?) but instead he does something Forcey. Maybe mirroring the temptation at the end of ROTJ but instead of grabbing his lightsaber he flings Kylo's away.
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Dec 17, 2015 01:38
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Cheesus posted:My understanding from the EU books and spoilers is that the Republic is meant to be "legitimate" and having an army/special ops/etc is perceived as a threat to the citizens. Possibly citizens question "how are you guys any better than the Empire?" from my understanding, the republic demilitarizes itself. or at least doesn't have a central army. instead, it spread its forces around for forum various system/planetary defense forces. i am guess everyone remembers what happens when the old republic got a super army and they decided to just localize it instead. now they are basically funding the space kurds aka the resistance to fight whatever Imperial resurgences their are which is what i assume the new order is. Shimrra Jamaane posted:But guys, that's for the Star Wars Sequel-Prequel trilogy of novels to explain! Remember, its officially on the same level of canon as the movies.
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Dec 17, 2015 01:38
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Tender Bender posted:Yeah I think Luke's journey is done. I don't think they can resist giving us the moneyshot of Mark Hamill lighting up the lightsaber, but it'll be purely for talking about Jedi/the force or maybe waxing nostalgic about holding his father's saber again. I don't think he'll use it in combat. There'll be a scene where it looks like we're going to see him draw his saber and kick rear end (Kylo catches up to him?) but instead he does something Forcey. Maybe mirroring the temptation at the end of ROTJ but instead of grabbing his lightsaber he flings Kylo's away. Legit would love it if Kylo takes a swing and just gets force choked like a chump.
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Dec 17, 2015 01:40
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Dapper_Swindler posted:from my understanding, the republic demilitarizes itself. or at least doesn't have a central army. instead, it spread its forces around for forum various system/planetary defense forces. i am guess everyone remembers what happens when the old republic got a super army and they decided to just localize it instead. now they are basically funding the space kurds aka the resistance to fight whatever Imperial resurgences their are which is what i assume the new order is. It's pretty bad. And yes the post New Jedi Order EU was a complete clusterfuck. Troy Denning is a giant fucklord who ruined everything. Anyway my theory for why Mark Hammil only had one short scene in the movie is that he's going to spend the next couple years getting in better shape so that he can do more stuff in the next film without looking like an old fat guy.
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Dec 17, 2015 01:48
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Shimrra Jamaane posted:It's pretty bad. And yes the post New Jedi Order EU was a complete clusterfuck. Troy Denning is a giant fucklord who ruined everything. He looks amazing already and filming starts next month.
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Dec 17, 2015 01:53
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That Aftermath book was....decent enough. But written in present tense, which was really really obnoxious to read.
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Dec 17, 2015 01:54
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