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Shame Boy
Mar 2, 2010

divabot posted:

Just five paragraphs and my brain wants a shower. Amazing.

quote:

The safe words and boundary negotiations are not an indication that all is well, but rather an indication that something is terribly wrong.

Yes Jim, that is the loving point of them, nobody just says their safeword for funsies you loving sociopath.

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Freudian
Mar 23, 2011

The presence of seatbelts and airbags in cars is not an indication that all is well, etc.

Cingulate
Oct 23, 2012

by Fluffdaddy
I'm not the kind of guy to have exciting leather sex, but isn't not having safe words really bad and basically doing it wrong?

Darth Walrus
Feb 13, 2012

Cingulate posted:

I'm not the kind of guy to have exciting leather sex, but isn't not having safe words really bad and basically doing it wrong?

Apparently, there's some BDSM subcultures where it's not a thing, and there's much more pressure on the dom rather than the sub to keep things safe and fun.

I'm 100% sure that's not why this guy is objecting, though.

Cingulate
Oct 23, 2012

by Fluffdaddy
A lot of people also have sex with strangers without protection and birth control and that I assume also kind of leads to pressure on everyone involved.

Shame Boy
Mar 2, 2010

Cingulate posted:

I'm not the kind of guy to have exciting leather sex, but isn't not having safe words really bad and basically doing it wrong?

In BDSM trust and consent are really, really important and safe words ensure it doesn't suddenly turn into rape if one member misjudges the responses of the other. So yeah.

I AM GRANDO
Aug 20, 2006

Cingulate posted:

I'm not the kind of guy to have exciting leather sex, but isn't not having safe words really bad and basically doing it wrong?

Only if you think it's bad when someone is about to graduate from violent sex to serial murder.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.
"I don't want to use safewords or negotiate boundaries" is a great big flashing red "I'm a rapist looking for victims" sign.

ikanreed
Sep 25, 2009

I honestly I have no idea who cannibal[SIC] is and I do not know why I should know.

syq dude, just syq!

Pope Guilty posted:

"I don't want to use safewords or negotiate boundaries" is a great big flashing red "I'm a rapist looking for victims" sign.

So is "I'm a dark enlightenment MRA"

The Vosgian Beast
Aug 13, 2011

Business is slow
https://ask.fm/St_Rev/answers/110089961214 In which the beliefs of a paranoid schizophrenic are reached through routes other than paranoid schizophrenia.

Remember: The Patriarchy is a conspiracy theory, but Cthulhu is real, and strong, and is my enemy.

Merdifex
May 13, 2015

by Shine
https://twitter.com/ClarkHat/status/677484294336589824

Twerkteam Pizza
Sep 26, 2015

Grimey Drawer

Ah yes, Pharma Bro is good guy

Shame Boy
Mar 2, 2010

Twerkteam Pizza posted:

Ah yes, Pharma Bro is good guy

Someone said it before but god these guys are the edgiest edgelords in the edgiverse, find any even moderately popular opinion or idea and they'll take the farthest opposite stance of it they can.

Also they linked this:
http://www.threefeloniesaday.com/Youtoo/tabid/86/Default.aspx

which, besides being a fundamental misunderstanding of how the legal system works, is pretty hilarious.

A Fancy 400 lbs
Jul 24, 2008
Yes, it's selective prosecution, please ignore the fact that he's been under investigation for multiple years before the drug price hikes got him into the news,

Curvature of Earth
Sep 9, 2011

Projected cost of
invading Canada:
$900

Parallel Paraplegic posted:

Someone said it before but god these guys are the edgiest edgelords in the edgiverse, find any even moderately popular opinion or idea and they'll take the farthest opposite stance of it they can.

Also they linked this:
http://www.threefeloniesaday.com/Youtoo/tabid/86/Default.aspx

which, besides being a fundamental misunderstanding of how the legal system works, is pretty hilarious.

Any website about arbitrary laws and prosecutions needs to begin and end with "driving while black" and the countless variants of "doing normal thing while black" that end up with black people dead, in jail, or with a criminal record.

Otherwise, it comes across as whining that, like, my cousin did this thing once, and they got away with it, and it's so not fair that I get arrested for doing the same thing. This is a free country! My taxes pay for you people!

divabot
Jun 17, 2015

A polite little mouse!
By the way, I've just had it pointed out to me ... Clark's name and twitter are no longer on the PopeHat masthead, since Randazza joined or so. Clark's last post was Nov 18. Think Ken finally had enough.

Somfin
Oct 25, 2010

In my🦚 experience🛠️ the big things🌑 don't teach you anything🤷‍♀️.

Nap Ghost

Darth Walrus posted:

Apparently, there's some BDSM subcultures where it's not a thing, and there's much more pressure on the dom rather than the sub to keep things safe and fun.

I'm 100% sure that's not why this guy is objecting, though.

gently caress it, I'll bite.

BDSM comes in two primary flavours when it comes to consent, since saying 'no' and 'stop' and the like can't always be taken literally. Some people are looking for that kind of thing, in a simulated way. There's SSC, Safe, Sane and Consensual, which means there is a safe word (which should never need to be used) and the dominant partner is expected to check in with their partner regularly to make sure they're still into it. Then there's RACK, Risk-Aware Consensual Kink, where there's no safe word but both partners share all tastes, limits and fetishes ahead of time. RACK is seen by most folks in the community as insanely risky and likely to be predatory.

Jim is going for a third way involving no negotiation or discussion, which is pretty much certain to turn into outright rape.

World War Mammories
Aug 25, 2006



jesus christ how did you run across this guy, I looked at his twitter homepage for thirty seconds and the first link I found was him trumpeting a story about how Baltimore is Doomed because those "dindus" are gonna get mad over the Freddie Gray trial

Cingulate
Oct 23, 2012

by Fluffdaddy

Somfin posted:

gently caress it, I'll bite.

BDSM comes in two primary flavours when it comes to consent, since saying 'no' and 'stop' and the like can't always be taken literally. Some people are looking for that kind of thing, in a simulated way. There's SSC, Safe, Sane and Consensual, which means there is a safe word (which should never need to be used) and the dominant partner is expected to check in with their partner regularly to make sure they're still into it. Then there's RACK, Risk-Aware Consensual Kink, where there's no safe word but both partners share all tastes, limits and fetishes ahead of time. RACK is seen by most folks in the community as insanely risky and likely to be predatory.

Jim is going for a third way involving no negotiation or discussion, which is pretty much certain to turn into outright rape.
I wonder how often people go meta-SSC/inception style. Meaning, saying "no" is part of the game, but saying your safeword is ALSO part of the game (and your partner ignoring not only your play-resistance, but also your second-level, meta-resistance), and only when you say your REAL safeword ... and so on.

Real maestros have been known to go up to 5 levels deep. It's like tantra, but with more whipping.

(Maybe it's thoughts like this that explain why I have so much time to post about internet racists instead of having exciting sex with interesting people though.)

e_angst
Sep 20, 2001

by exmarx

MizPiz posted:

It makes sense when you realize that when they say "cuckold" they mean "race traitor."

I think they really mean "porn I jerk off to way too frequently".

The Vosgian Beast
Aug 13, 2011

Business is slow

Peztopiary
Mar 16, 2009

by exmarx
Anarcho-tyranny is just tyranny. Right?

I AM GRANDO
Aug 20, 2006

Somfin posted:

gently caress it, I'll bite.

BDSM comes in two primary flavours when it comes to consent, since saying 'no' and 'stop' and the like can't always be taken literally. Some people are looking for that kind of thing, in a simulated way. There's SSC, Safe, Sane and Consensual, which means there is a safe word (which should never need to be used) and the dominant partner is expected to check in with their partner regularly to make sure they're still into it. Then there's RACK, Risk-Aware Consensual Kink, where there's no safe word but both partners share all tastes, limits and fetishes ahead of time. RACK is seen by most folks in the community as insanely risky and likely to be predatory.

Jim is going for a third way involving no negotiation or discussion, which is pretty much certain to turn into outright rape.

The Ted Bundy Way.

GottaPayDaTrollToll
Dec 3, 2009

by Lowtax

I admit, the "he should have been buying influence instead of Wu-Tang albums" tweet down the line was pretty good.

Also, if you're interested in the topic of BDSM, consent, and the issues the former has had with the latter, there was an extremely good (but extremely long) series on it called "There's A War On" that was posted a few years back. Not sure if things have changed or not since then.

Merdifex
May 13, 2015

by Shine
Holy gently caress. Scott is arguing with Fredrik DeBoer over whether nerds are as oppressed as Black people.

This is Scott's argument: http://pastebin.com/7s98agpv

quote:

Going to try to say this at greater length to avoid misintepretations.

When you said that "You can tell nerds are oppressed in our society because it's so hard to find positive coverage of Star Wars", I interpreted this as a sarcastic way of saying that since Star Wars was popular, that implied nerds could not be oppressed. The argument has an implicit premise of "If a group has a popular cultural product, they cannot be oppressed".

I was saying the implicit premise was obviously false, because groups that we both agree are oppressed, eg black people, also have popular cultural products. So the fact that nerds have Star Wars says nothing about whether they're oppressed or not.

I was not taking any stand on the object-level question of whether or not nerds are oppressed. If you ask me, I would say that "oppression" is too broad-grained a category to use here, but that certainly they face a lot of problems, bullying, harassment, and end up with a lot of issues and self-esteem issues, to the point where people should be careful about contributing to that. But that has nothing to do with why I complained about your argument. I complained about it because I thought its form (rather than its content) was silly.

I'm pretty upset that you retweeted me out of context in a way that makes me look stupid and if upon thinking about it further you decide that wasn't what I meant, I would appreciate you deleting that tweet.

And the whole thread: https://twitter.com/freddiedeboer/status/677939766982279169

The Time Dissolver
Nov 7, 2012

Are you a good person?
Shoot me and my family in the face if I ever fall so far as to want to read an argument between Scott Alexander and DeBoer.

The Vosgian Beast
Aug 13, 2011

Business is slow

The Time Dissolver posted:

Shoot me and my family in the face if I ever fall so far as to want to read an argument between Scott Alexander and DeBoer.

I, on the other hand, feel like Christmas came early.

Cingulate
Oct 23, 2012

by Fluffdaddy

Merdifex posted:

Holy gently caress. Scott is arguing with Fredrik DeBoer over whether nerds are as oppressed as Black people.
If you honestly read the pastebin as implying "Scott is arguing ... nerds are as oppressed as Black people", you are stupid.

The argument is tone deaf to the extent of bordering on the insulting of the descendants of slaves so hard that graffiti artists from insulting-land regularly create great works of art on the insulting-land-facing walls of non-insulting-land houses, but it is quite clearly not "nerds are as oppressed as Black people" or even "nerds are oppressed".

Cingulate
Oct 23, 2012

by Fluffdaddy
The superior move of course would be to bring up intersectionality.

BENGHAZI 2
Oct 13, 2007

by Cyrano4747

Cingulate posted:

If you honestly read the pastebin as implying "Scott is arguing ... nerds are as oppressed as Black people", you are stupid.

The argument is tone deaf to the extent of bordering on the insulting of the descendants of slaves so hard that graffiti artists from insulting-land regularly create great works of art on the insulting-land-facing walls of non-insulting-land houses, but it is quite clearly not "nerds are as oppressed as Black people" or even "nerds are oppressed".

Source your quotes motherfucker

Merdifex
May 13, 2015

by Shine

Cingulate posted:

If you honestly read the pastebin as implying "Scott is arguing ... nerds are as oppressed as Black people", you are stupid.

The argument is tone deaf to the extent of bordering on the insulting of the descendants of slaves so hard that graffiti artists from insulting-land regularly create great works of art on the insulting-land-facing walls of non-insulting-land houses, but it is quite clearly not "nerds are as oppressed as Black people" or even "nerds are oppressed".

I feel that you should know Scott well enough to know that when he's implicitly arguing for something, or that when he claims that a debate or argument is not motivated by something, that said debate or argument is motivated by that this. In this case, by Scott's dearly held belief in nerd oppression.

Or you could, you know, read the thread on twitter. It would be better than taking only Scott's word. Unless you're OK with comparing oppression against blacks as equivalent to oppression against nerds? It was Scott who brought that point up, after all, so if you want to defend it, go ahead.

Merdifex has a new favorite as of 01:01 on Dec 19, 2015

The Vosgian Beast
Aug 13, 2011

Business is slow

Cingulate posted:

The superior move of course would be to bring up intersectionality.

Libertarianism is the end-game of intersectionality

I have no idea what words mean. Promiscuous apples feverishly magenta convoys

Cingulate
Oct 23, 2012

by Fluffdaddy

Merdifex posted:

I feel that you should know Scott well enough to know that when he's implicitly arguing for something, or that when he claims that a debate or argument is not motivated by something, that said debate or argument is motivated by that this. In this case, by Scott's dearly held belief in nerd oppression.

Or you could, you know, read the thread on twitter. It would be better than taking only Scott's word. Unless you're OK with comparing oppression against blacks as equivalent to oppression against nerds? It was Scott who brought that point up, after all, so if you want to defend it, go ahead.
I should have specified that my claim was not about intelligence, but reading comprehension. In that vein: I'm not saying Scott's thoughts are this or that. (For what it's worth, I do believe there is little reason to assume he does think nerds are oppressed to the degree Black people are.) What I am saying is: If you honestly read the pastebin as implying "Scott is arguing ... nerds are as oppressed as Black people", your reading comprehension is bad.
I am saying this because the pastebin states rather unambiguously that "oppressed" is not the word its author would use to describe the situation of nerds.
If you do not understand this, you are stupidlacking in reading comprehension.

Woolie Wool
Jun 2, 2006


The Vosgian Beast posted:

Promiscuous apples feverishly magenta convoys

Someone mspaint this right now.

Merdifex
May 13, 2015

by Shine

The Vosgian Beast posted:

Libertarianism is the end-game of intersectionality

I have no idea what words mean. Promiscuous apples feverishly magenta convoys

Intersectionality is so flawed, it rarely takes into account neurodivergent technolibertarian nerds and how oppressed we are that our personal posts are criticized on the internet :colbert:

Cingulate posted:

I should have specified that my claim was not about intelligence, but reading comprehension. In that vein: I'm not saying Scott's thoughts are this or that. (For what it's worth, I do believe there is little reason to assume he does think nerds are oppressed to the degree Black people are.) What I am saying is: If you honestly read the pastebin as implying "Scott is arguing ... nerds are as oppressed as Black people", your reading comprehension is bad.
I am saying this because the pastebin states rather unambiguously that "oppressed" is not the word its author would use to describe the situation of nerds.
If you do not understand this, you are stupidlacking in reading comprehension.

I don't care, but if you bring up Black people when you catch just a whiff of someone, just perhaps, not believing that nerds are an oppressed group, that's some kind of absurd poo poo that this thread is made to laugh at.

Merdifex has a new favorite as of 02:58 on Dec 19, 2015

Cingulate
Oct 23, 2012

by Fluffdaddy

Merdifex posted:

Intersectionality is so flawed, it rarely takes into account neurodivergent technolibertarian nerds and how oppressed we are that our personal posts are criticized on the internet :colbert:


I don't care, but if you bring up Black people when you catch just a whiff of someone, just perhaps, not believing that nerds are an oppressed group, that's some kind of absurd poo poo that this thread is made to laugh at.
Quite different from your original statement: "Scott is arguing with Fredrik DeBoer over whether nerds are as oppressed as Black people.", and much closer to mine, which was that it's not actually wrong, but tone deaf.
Which is good, because your original post was stupid.

Curvature of Earth
Sep 9, 2011

Projected cost of
invading Canada:
$900

Merdifex posted:

Intersectionality is so flawed, it rarely takes into account neurodivergent technolibertarian nerds and how oppressed we are that our personal posts are criticized on the internet :colbert:

Are you talking about that one Bay Area techn-libertarian's personal post on Tumblr where I popped up and said being a techno-libertarian was bad? Because my activity feed is only just now recovering from that. (So. Much. Whining.)

I wasn't planning for half of the post-rationalist Tumblrsphere to censure me today, but I suppose I deserve it for opening my big fat mouth like that.

Merdifex
May 13, 2015

by Shine

Curvature of Earth posted:

Are you talking about that one Bay Area techn-libertarian's personal post on Tumblr where I popped up and said being a techno-libertarian was bad? Because my activity feed is only just now recovering from that. (So. Much. Whining.)

I wasn't planning for half of the post-rationalist Tumblrsphere to censure me today, but I suppose I deserve it for opening my big fat mouth like that.

Nothing but. They're so accustomed to holding all sorts of (frankly evil) opinions, and in a space where you're guaranteed to never have said ideas criticized.

But of course when some random "social justice" person says something about safe spaces then you're correct to decry that as being immoral and irrational. Even if this is a tumblr thing, it's ridiculous because these "post-rationalists" are used to criticizing people (sometimes personally) from all over the internet in a context in which they could never really respond.

But I've noticed that they're fine with others on tumblr criticizing them if they're neoreactionaries. (if those doing the criticizing are NRx, that is, the opposite is ridiculous and irrational)

Merdifex has a new favorite as of 04:23 on Dec 19, 2015

divabot
Jun 17, 2015

A polite little mouse!

Curvature of Earth posted:

Are you talking about that one Bay Area techn-libertarian's personal post on Tumblr where I popped up and said being a techno-libertarian was bad? Because my activity feed is only just now recovering from that. (So. Much. Whining.)

I wasn't planning for half of the post-rationalist Tumblrsphere to censure me today, but I suppose I deserve it for opening my big fat mouth like that.

I was particularly delighted with the bit where Ozy was outraged you'd say that about a post by an autistic person. How dare you!

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Peztopiary
Mar 16, 2009

by exmarx
Boo on talking about this without links, boo I say.

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