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Welp. Saw the Force Awakens today, drooled over how beautiful the white TIE fighters are.  Immediately bought $50 worth of X-Wing stuff just so I can play with them. Although now I have no excuse to make fun of jivjov for his X-Wing collection when I have a ship I drool over now.
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Dec 20, 2015 02:49
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This just means I get to fly Poe Dameron and Wedge Antilles against you. I'm a happy goon.
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Dec 20, 2015 02:50
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Duct Tape posted:Anyone else really hoping to see a miniature for Kylo Ren's Command Shuttle? Each scene it was in made me want to fly a little one around to blast It seems like the doorstop-shaped troop landers are not much bigger then a fighter, maybe HWK-290-sized? And the Resistance has the weird sideways brick command ship thingy to exploit as a large ship, as well.
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Dec 20, 2015 02:59
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Not sure how much use a troop transport would be in X-wing though...
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Dec 20, 2015 03:15
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jivjov posted:Not sure how much use a troop transport would be in X-wing though... The shuttle exists.
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Dec 20, 2015 03:30
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bunnyofdoom posted:The shuttle exists. Yeah...but that at least has visible guns.
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Dec 20, 2015 03:31
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It won't be in the game, the TIE shuttle title for the bomber does the same job. Is what I would say if FFG didn't constantly double up on redundant ships 
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Dec 20, 2015 03:34
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The rebel transport exists. No reason to think they couldn't do something similar to that and pack in a fancy TIE or something.
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Dec 20, 2015 03:41
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Just put 6 TIE/FOs on the table today. drat it was sexy as hell.
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Dec 20, 2015 05:13
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I ran this at a tournament today: https://geordanr.github.io/xwing/?f=Galactic%20Empire&d=v3!s!62:18:5:15:M.1;187:152,153:-1:1:;28:18:5:15:M.5 This list murders anything that relies on actions to survive. I think I'm in love. I'm still not sold on Soontir as the third prong, though. I desperately wanted a blocker in the first game. I'm super tempted to drop Soontir for 3x academy pilots...
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Dec 20, 2015 05:48
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KO Derf posted:Just put 6 TIE/FOs on the table today. drat it was sexy as hell. Yes it was, even if I happened to be on the receiving end of it. At least my Integrated Astromechs kept me going a little longer.
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Dec 20, 2015 05:55
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Chemmy posted:They can't be shot at until you deploy them (behind the enemy), I think. Correct. If the ship they're docked to dies they get to deploy then take a point of damage, but otherwise, docked ships are not in play at all until they're launched, so they can't be affected by anything, or do anything. Madurai posted:It seems like the doorstop-shaped troop landers are not much bigger then a fighter, maybe HWK-290-sized? And the Resistance has the weird sideways brick command ship thingy to exploit as a large ship, as well. The only other one I wonder about is Han's giant freighter that swallows the Falcon. We've all been hankering for a huge Scum ship, after all...
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Dec 20, 2015 09:36
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thespaceinvader posted:The only other one I wonder about is Han's giant freighter that swallows the Falcon. We've all been hankering for a huge Scum ship, after all...
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Dec 20, 2015 14:46
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Yvonmukluk posted:Yes, but I always figured they'd either invent something new like they did with the Raider or just raid the EU (maybe grabbing the Crusader-Class Corvette from Forces of Corruption, for instance-they already grabbed the Assault Frigate from Empire at War for Armada. Han's ship is only ever identified with Han & Chewie, not any other organisation, and we don't have much grasp of its capabilities. Assault frigate is from Rebellion. A sadly underated game
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Dec 20, 2015 15:32
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Okay, read the rules, crafted some theory, and ended up with this probably terrible abomination: Tetran Cowall (24) Push the Limit (3) Royal Guard TIE (0) Shield Upgrade (4) Hull Upgrade (3) Carnor Jax (26) Push the Limit (3) Hull Upgrade (3) Gamma Squadron Pilot (TIE Bomber) (18) Proton Bombs (5) Adv. Proton Torpedoes (6) Assault Missiles (4) Total: 99 pts General idea is to use the Interceptors to harry the opponent into range of the Bomber's heavy weaponry. I could turn the Proton Bombs into a Seismic Charge to upgrade the bomber pilot to Captain Jonus, and something is telling me that I'm probably missing the point of TIE fighters by beefing Tetran's defenses up that much and I should drop a bunch of upgrades to squeeze a cheap TIE in there, but hopefully it's not the worst first outing.
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Dec 20, 2015 18:35
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Ordnance generally is a little low-rent and difficult to work and Bombers generally are held to be a little weak. Interceptors are almost always fielded with Push the Limit/Stealth Device/Autothrusters; they're flimsy as poo poo when they get hit, and it's cheaper and better to make them much, much harder to hit by getting out of arcs and/or having focus and evade tokens, than it is to mitigate the damage. ANd if you're going to buff up one pilot and not the other of two identical ships, you almost always want the buffed one to be the more expensive, higher-pilot-skill one. The bomber will get a lot better once Long Ranged Sensors come out and it can reliably have TL/Focus together for missile firings. All that being said, it looks like a list you would have fun playing, though it's never going to be very competitive; you wouldn't want to run it for a tournament but for a home game or a weekly club game it'll do fine.
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Dec 20, 2015 18:44
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The Lord of Hats posted:General idea is to use the Interceptors to harry the opponent into range of the Bomber's heavy weaponry. I could turn the Proton Bombs into a Seismic Charge to upgrade the bomber pilot to Captain Jonus, and something is telling me that I'm probably missing the point of TIE fighters by beefing Tetran's defenses up that much and I should drop a bunch of upgrades to squeeze a cheap TIE in there, but hopefully it's not the worst first outing. It's a good idea, but unfortunately ordnance isn't quite that spectacular. So you might want to keep it to a minimum. Loading up your interceptors is a good idea, and since you're limited in cards right now (Starter kit, a TIE Bomber, Imperial Aces), I think you should consider beefing up Jax and moving to a higher Pilot Skill Bomber. Leave Tetran as is, add Royal Guard and Shield Upgrade to Jax. That leaves you with 30 points for a TIE Bomber. So maybe Jonus (even though you don't really get his benefit) with determination and a torpedo and bomb, or Rhymer with a single torpedo/missile. Or if you are up for proxying cards, it's a whole new world of things you can add.
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Dec 20, 2015 18:52
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BTW, be up for proxying cards, or just printing out lists from the list builder. How do you know what you want to buy if you don't play it first?
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Dec 20, 2015 18:53
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Duplicate post
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Dec 20, 2015 18:54
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Yeah, just working with what little I've got here so I don't have the tools to get the Interceptors really moving. I'll definitely keep that in mind, though, probably switch some stuff around. It'll at least be fun to doodle around with as I inevitably get my rear end kicked. What ship would I get Stealth Device and Autothrusters from, anyways?
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Dec 20, 2015 18:57
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So what's wrong with ordnance? (I have yet to play the game yet so assume I don't know anything!)
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Dec 20, 2015 19:06
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The Lord of Hats posted:What ship would I get Stealth Device and Autothrusters from, anyways? You can use the squad builders as they have that info, or you can check the wiki: http://xwing-miniatures.wikia.com/wiki/Stealth_Device (Slave 1 and M3-A) http://xwing-miniatures.wikia.com/wiki/Autothrusters (StarViper)
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Dec 20, 2015 19:08
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ghetto wormhole posted:So what's wrong with ordnance? (I have yet to play the game yet so assume I don't know anything!) It's generally range limited (sometimes extremely), and has poor action economy. You have to take a target lock in order to fire most ordnance, but firing the ordnance spends the target lock (with one exception) and leaves you with no or very little ways to modify your dice. It's generally better to save your modifiers for primary weapon attacks unless you have a way to generate more actions or somehow keep target locks between shots (Redline with FCS, Colonel Vessery).
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Dec 20, 2015 19:16
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The Lord of Hats posted:Yeah, just working with what little I've got here so I don't have the tools to get the Interceptors really moving. I'll definitely keep that in mind, though, probably switch some stuff around. It'll at least be fun to doodle around with as I inevitably get my rear end kicked. KO Derf posted:You can use the squad builders as they have that info, or you can check the wiki: ghetto wormhole posted:So what's wrong with ordnance? (I have yet to play the game yet so assume I don't know anything!) Generally, it's way overcosted. Some bombs are worth it if you can position them right, but with the exception of Proton Rockets, every single missile and torpedo is almost always not worth taking, because you get a single big attack (which is great) typically without many dice mods because it needs a TL or Focus to be spent to fire it, and the enemy in arc, which means that without some kind of action multiplication to let you get TL/Focus in the same turn, you're doing a big attack with poor mods, which works out about the same as a small attack with mods, and it's costing you half a ship. Proton Rockets are good because they don't need a TL and don't SPEND the focus, so you generally get a 5-die attack on any ship that's going to equip them (basically A-wings and TIE Defenders) and A-wings in particular get a lot out of them - but OTOH, they cost a-wings 2 points more, because you could have had Chaardan Refit in the same slot....
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Dec 20, 2015 19:19
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Homing Missiles are also extremely cool, because you keep the Target Lock and you also prevent using evade tokens. Also the M3-A is the cheapest way to get both a Mangler Cannon and a Stealth Device so it gets points for that, even if the ship itself sucks.
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Dec 20, 2015 19:22
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ghetto wormhole posted:So what's wrong with ordnance? (I have yet to play the game yet so assume I don't know anything!) Most of them require spending a Target Lock to fire, which requires an action to acquire. The benefits they give aren't significantly better than you'd have gotten by spending that action to focus, or using that lock for the rerolls. Where the benefits are good enough, they aren't really worth the points you're spending on a single attack. Homing Missiles don't spend your lock, but are expensive as hell. Their Advanced variety are very limited by their range requirement, and Missile platforms generally lack the tools to dictate range. Proton Rockets are expensive as hell on A-Wings and only really usable otherwise on TIEs Advanced, which have better toys these days.
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Dec 20, 2015 19:22
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Poopy Palpy posted:Most of them require spending a Target Lock to fire, which requires an action to acquire. The benefits they give aren't significantly better than you'd have gotten by spending that action to focus, or using that lock for the rerolls. Where the benefits are good enough, they aren't really worth the points you're spending on a single attack. Homing Missiles don't spend your lock, but are expensive as hell. Their Advanced variety are very limited by their range requirement, and Missile platforms generally lack the tools to dictate range. Proton Rockets are expensive as hell on A-Wings and only really usable otherwise on TIEs Advanced, which have better toys these days. Defenders can do Prockets as well pretty effectively, but unfortunately for them the fixes being issued next wave will not really help with ordnance for them, as one relies on using cannons and primary weapons, and the other takes aware the missile slot. I really want ordnance to be better D: Just from my time playing the Rogue Squadron games where a single proton torp would murder a TIE fighter in one shot.
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Dec 20, 2015 19:25
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The thing is, for a lot of ships, all you get for spending all that stuff to make it good is one dice on one attack. A proton torpedo on an X-wing gives you a wonderful one extra die and you lose your TL modification to do so. That's four points, on one attack. You can make that attack better, but then you might as well get predator/lone wolf/etc. and use it on your primary attack. Many people vastly overvalue getting an extra dice on an attack, which is why they try to shove expose in wherever they can.
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Dec 20, 2015 19:26
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Panzeh posted:The thing is, for a lot of ships, all you get for spending all that stuff to make it good is one dice on one attack. A proton torpedo on an X-wing gives you a wonderful one extra die and you lose your TL modification to do so. That's four points, on one attack. You can make that attack better, but then you might as well get predator/lone wolf/etc. and use it on your primary attack. Ordnance's high alpha can come in handy if you blow an enemy ship out of space before it fires. It doesn't really matter if you used two Torpedoes to blow up a TIE fighter, you're still coming out ahead in the points, and now you have normal attacks while the enemy does not. Upgrades like Predator go a long way toward making ordnance useful, too, for the ones that require spending target locks (and once again are also useful after the ordnance has been spent). My second favorite thing to do with ordnance (that isn't Miranda with Jan helping out on a Homing Missile) is put a Proton Torpedo on Wedge with Predator. Four dice against one (potentially two) fewer defense dice with a reroll and a focus to a crit hurts. You have a pretty good chance of blowing TIE Fighters and Z-95s out of the sky with one shot, and anything with low shields will hurt really bad.
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Dec 20, 2015 19:35
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Yeah, and I'm really not sure FFG have quite got the balance right on this issue either. I mean, Punishing One will be TWELVE points (i.e. an entire z95) for +1 die on primary weapon. I mean, it does put Dengar on a par with Han for cost, and his ability is probably on a par as well, but it feels like they've probably undercosted him without the title maybe? I mean, it will be plausible to run 3 punishing ones, with Dengar/title and two generics, and I can't see that being outright bad... E: I am super looking forward to Punishing One though. It seems likely to rival PTL superdash for Scum and yes, all the yes. thespaceinvader fucked around with this message at 19:39 on Dec 20, 2015 |
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Dec 20, 2015 19:36
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The breakpoint between 2 and 3 dice is a lot more important than 3 to 4. I think 12 points is entirely fair.
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Dec 20, 2015 19:41
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thespaceinvader posted:Yeah, and I'm really not sure FFG have quite got the balance right on this issue either. I mean, Punishing One will be TWELVE points (i.e. an entire z95) for +1 die on primary weapon. I mean, it does put Dengar on a par with Han for cost, and his ability is probably on a par as well, but it feels like they've probably undercosted him without the title maybe? I mean, it will be plausible to run 3 punishing ones, with Dengar/title and two generics, and I can't see that being outright bad... You could run three JumpMasters, but i'm not sure it would be a great idea. But, yes, Scum got their Super Dash and it will be awesome.
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Dec 20, 2015 19:43
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thespaceinvader posted:Yeah, and I'm really not sure FFG have quite got the balance right on this issue either. I mean, Punishing One will be TWELVE points (i.e. an entire z95) for +1 die on primary weapon. I mean, it does put Dengar on a par with Han for cost, and his ability is probably on a par as well, but it feels like they've probably undercosted him without the title maybe? I mean, it will be plausible to run 3 punishing ones, with Dengar/title and two generics, and I can't see that being outright bad... Nobody's going to pay the financial or points cost to run three big ships whose primary weapons are stuck at 2 red dice is the thing. How many Wild Space Fingers do you generally see people running? Punishing One, the title, costs as much as a Headhunter, sure. So does Outrider + HLC. Dengar + Punishing One is the same points cost as Dash + Outrider + a Mangler Cannon (going with 3 dice for comparison's sake even though very few people use Mangler on Dash) so points wise the title seems appropriately coated for what's essentially a Scum Outrider.
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Dec 20, 2015 19:46
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sarmhan posted:The breakpoint between 2 and 3 dice is a lot more important than 3 to 4. I think 12 points is entirely fair. I know it's important, what I wonder is whether the base cost should be higher, which in turn would make the upgrade cost less. 45 points sounds about right for Dengar (though it's difficult to tell for sure without more spoilers) but sub-33 points for a large ship with 9HP and barrel roll is going to make for some potentially hilarious blockers. Probably sub-30, if previous costings for similar ships are anything to go by (i.e. 2 points per increase in PS, which would leave the lowest cost ones at 27 points each...) In a way the cost of the title is actually relatively irrelevant, as its cost should be precisely the difference between what a single JumpMaster costs without and with, so the costs of the ship without and with are far more important.
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Dec 20, 2015 19:47
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thespaceinvader posted:I know it's important, what I wonder is whether the base cost should be higher, which in turn would make the upgrade cost less. 45 points sounds about right for Dengar (though it's difficult to tell for sure without more spoilers) but sub-33 points for a large ship with 9HP and barrel roll is going to make for some potentially hilarious blockers. Probably sub-30, if previous costings for similar ships are anything to go by (i.e. 2 points per increase in PS, which would leave the lowest cost ones at 27 points each...) To be fair, this is basically what the Millenium Falcon title should've been, rather than how they structured that particular expansion and the pilots.
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Dec 20, 2015 19:48
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Panzeh posted:You could run three JumpMasters, but i'm not sure it would be a great idea. Dengar with Glitterstim is going to be beautiful. Arcdodge at PS9 pop stim, two shots and all the defences with free focus. Double stress, sure, but you probably wipe someone out into the bargain.
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Dec 20, 2015 19:53
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bunnyofdoom posted:Assault frigate is from Rebellion. A sadly underrated game Actually, we're both right! The Assault Frigate Mark. I appeared in Rebellion, but Empire At War introduced the Assault Frigate Mk. II, which is the one that FFG used for Armada. 
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Dec 20, 2015 19:56
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I have the beginnings of a potentially pretty fun list, and I'd like a little input on what to fill the last points with. Poe Dameron (31) [39] R5-P9 (3) Push the Limit (3) Autothrusters (2) Red Ace (29) [38] R2-D2 (4) Comm Relay (3) Autothrusters (2) Total: 77 Yes, it's the unkillable pair of X-wings. The problem is that with as hard to take down as the two of them are, their offense is only that of two X-wings, and if I have anything else along with it'll get focused down pretty hard because it'll probably be easier to kill. So, my question is: Do I add a Gold with an Ion Cannon for some crowd control, or do I add Dutch to help boost the offense with TLs all around? I could also swap Autothrusters off Poe for Integrated Astromech, which would free me up to 25 points. That's enough for a Blue Squad Rookie with a 1 point Astro (likely R5) and Integrated Astromech. Strobe fucked around with this message at 00:09 on Dec 21, 2015 |
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Dec 20, 2015 23:56
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Strobe posted:I have the beginnings of a potentially pretty fun list, and I'd like a little input on what to fill the last points with. Biggs is the answer. The only thing worse than two things that take forever to kill are two things that you can't even shoot for the first pass or two.
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Dec 21, 2015 00:17
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ConfusedUs posted:Biggs is the answer. The only thing worse than two things that take forever to kill are two things that you can't even shoot for the first pass or two. Biggs is the epitome of X-wing fragility. I don't have the points for anything to put on him, which means no integrated, no durability enhancements, nothing. I will be able to rely on him for, at most, one round of firing. X-wings hate being focused on. Biggs was good back when the game had exactly one 3 Red ship. Now that 3 Red ships are absolutely everywhere, he's not as good. Strobe fucked around with this message at 00:37 on Dec 21, 2015 |
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Dec 21, 2015 00:25
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