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It left a really bad taste in my mouth for sure, but the stuff they were putting out before the first Russo reboot with Sid as the champ was a lot worse. What was the deal with Goldberg at that time? Seems weird that they would turn the top baby face heel and keep the title off him forever.
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Jan 4, 2016 19:09
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Who cares about that vanilla midget, it's all about the guy with the book: the Big Dog Kevin Nash
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Jan 4, 2016 19:11
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1st AD posted:It left a really bad taste in my mouth for sure, but the stuff they were putting out before the first Russo reboot with Sid as the champ was a lot worse. I like Sid but he keeps forgetting his scissors
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Jan 4, 2016 19:22
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I used to spend a lot of time in wrestling chat rooms, and when the finger poke episode happened there was an overwhelmingly positive reaction to the angle. People thought it was great and reinvigorated WCW. It turns out that we were all idiots. I thought WCW was going to win the ratings that night. It was when WCW lost that it became very apparent that they were in a lot of trouble.
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Jan 4, 2016 19:31
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CopywrightMMXI posted:I used to spend a lot of time in wrestling chat rooms, and when the finger poke episode happened there was an overwhelmingly positive reaction to the angle. People thought it was great and reinvigorated WCW. It turns out that we were all idiots. I thought WCW was going to win the ratings that night. It was when WCW lost that it became very apparent that they were in a lot of trouble. But WCW did win the ratings war that night? Spoilered just in case: “While the big switch of audiences to see The Rock vs. Mankind is much remembered, what is forgotten, is a Goldberg run-in on Nitro & Austin run-in on RAW were going on at the same time for the overrun. Goldberg saw Nitro bring its audience back, going from a 4.6 to a 6.5, taking many of those viewers back from Raw which went from a 5.9 to a 5.1. The growth of the final segment of Nitro, was an incredible 2.1 million viewers, among the biggest growth periods in history. Between the two shows on that night during the overrun, there were 13,827,000 viewers watching wrestling.” - Dave Meltzer
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Jan 4, 2016 19:58
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Raw won the night overall, 5.7 to 4.9. Nitro just had a big increase for the closing angle. I believe the last night that Nitro won the ratings was when they replayed the Goldberg/DDP Halloween Havoc match.
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Jan 4, 2016 20:14
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The thing is, those ratings are still drat impressive. It's still baffling that they wouldn't just accept their somewhat lower rating that was still higher than most shows will ever achieve
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Jan 4, 2016 20:20
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The wrestling universe is full of people who let hubris get in the way of good business.
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Jan 4, 2016 20:23
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Vince would kill someone on live TV if he could get any of those ratings listed, even a 4.6
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Jan 4, 2016 20:32
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Chris James 2 posted:Vince would kill someone on live TV if he could get any of those ratings listed, even a 4.6 Speaking of ratings, here is WCW's ratings before and after the Georgia Dome: Jul 97 (3.43) Aug 97 (4.30) Sep 97 (4.14) Oct 97 (4.15) Nov 97 (4.07) Dec 97 (4.06) Jan 98 (4.52) Feb 98 (4.80) Mar 98 (4.66) Apr 98 (4.63) May 98 (4.00) Jun 98 (4.00) Jul 98 (4.67) Aug 98 (4.98) Sep 98 (4.62) Oct 98 (4.65) Nov 98 (4.24) Dec 98 (4.25) Jan 99 (4.85) Feb 99 (4.68) Mar 99 (4.05) Apr 99 (4.17) May 99 (3.40) If the [REDACTED] was so harmful, why didn't it take effect in January or February instead of May?
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Jan 4, 2016 20:36
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In Nash's YouShoot he explains the idea behind the Fingerpoke -- Nash beats Goldberg, drops the title right away in a farce, never mentions beating the streak again. This (plus the accusations from Liz) eats at Goldberg until he loses it and turns heel, and he was supposed to get a stable in the margin somewhere too. It's not what happened so whatever. Anyway there's definitely a lot of false information about the Fingerpoke out there. I remember seeing a number of people who thought that was the first night WCW lost in the ratings and they never bounced back (granted they never did win the ratings war again after the post-HH Nitro, but ratings for Jan 11 99 were better than the Jan 4 show).
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Jan 4, 2016 20:59
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Abrasive Obelisk posted:Speaking of ratings, here is WCW's ratings before and after the Georgia Dome: The moment itself is iconic as its representative of the farce that WCW was turning itself into. It also was the penultimate Nitro that came close to beating Raw in the ratings as well. Ratings lag a bit, as it took a few months of little to no followup for the fans to finally turn away from the show for good. This was the immediate aftermath: Goldberg was screwed out of the title at Starrcade. He gets a modicum of revenge at Souled Out in a particularly horrible match, but does not challenge for the title until the end of April. Hogan doesn't start feuding with Goldberg after Souled Out, he feuds with Flair for Uncensored and Spring Stampede. Goldberg finally get a title shot on Nitro, but by this point in the 5 months since he lost the title, the title has changed hands 5 times to 5 different wrestlers, and none of the programs involved Goldberg. Then he lost in a 4-way match, and was clear out of title contention until Halloween Havoc.
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Jan 4, 2016 21:16
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DynamiteKidd posted:In Nash's YouShoot he explains the idea behind the Fingerpoke -- Nash beats Goldberg, drops the title right away in a farce, never mentions beating the streak again. This (plus the accusations from Liz) eats at Goldberg until he loses it and turns heel, and he was supposed to get a stable in the margin somewhere too. Even if they went through with this it's a terrible plan. The point should have been Goldberg going through every member of the NWO before destroying Hogan again and getting his title back. Turning Goldberg heel was as retarded as turning Hogan face.
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Jan 4, 2016 21:23
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Whatever happened with that NITRO BRAND PERFUME that Heenan buried ? Did it really smell like poo poo?
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Jan 4, 2016 21:32
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Big Coffin Hunter posted:Even if they went through with this it's a terrible plan. The point should have been Goldberg going through every member of the NWO before destroying Hogan again and getting his title back. Turning Goldberg heel was as retarded as turning Hogan face. At least with Goldberg we know he didn't write the lovely angle for himself
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Jan 4, 2016 21:35
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One of the lessons of WCW is that when the product is hot overall, you can make a lot of mistakes that won't immediately come back to bite you in the rear end. So I don't know if it's possible to point to one event in WCW as the turning point, but the Fingerpoke made it clear that they were out of ideas besides "The nWo wins everything and shits on everyone else, forever."DynamiteKidd posted:In Nash's YouShoot he explains the idea behind the Fingerpoke -- Nash beats Goldberg, drops the title right away in a farce, never mentions beating the streak again. This (plus the accusations from Liz) eats at Goldberg until he loses it and turns heel, and he was supposed to get a stable in the margin somewhere too. Halloween Jack fucked around with this message at 21:41 on Jan 4, 2016 |
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Jan 4, 2016 21:38
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Big Coffin Hunter posted:Even if they went through with this it's a terrible plan. The point should have been Goldberg going through every member of the NWO before destroying Hogan again and getting his title back. Turning Goldberg heel was as retarded as turning Hogan face. I swear I heard Nash say this was the basic plan, setting up waves of heels for Goldberg to destroy.
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Jan 4, 2016 21:43
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corn in the bible posted:Whatever happened with that NITRO BRAND PERFUME that Heenan buried ? Did it really smell like poo poo? It smells very cinnamon-y
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Jan 4, 2016 22:28
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The most WCW moment was when it turned out the NWO trademark was owned by a gay clothing store
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Jan 4, 2016 23:30
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Big Coffin Hunter posted:Even if they went through with this it's a terrible plan. The point should have been Goldberg going through every member of the NWO before destroying Hogan again and getting his title back. Turning Goldberg heel was as retarded as turning Hogan face. You mean like when he faced Raven and his flock?
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Jan 4, 2016 23:32
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When I was a kid me and my granddad used to watch WCW, so I kept watching it after he died. The week after the finger poke was the first time I switched over to RAW for a segment. Hogan poked the mark out of me.
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Jan 5, 2016 00:55
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Sushi in Yiddish posted:Happy Fingerpoke of Doom day, everyone. Nope, Hogan/Flair's double-turn and the ensuing Nash/Savage feud for the title was way more devastating.
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Jan 5, 2016 01:27
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laz0rbeak posted:Nope, Hogan/Flair's double-turn and the ensuing Nash/Savage feud for the title was way more devastating. Plus DDP's title win without any buildup and heel turn didn't help. I think it was after that (and the logo change) that the plummet to the end really started.
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Jan 5, 2016 01:32
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Vertical Lime posted:Plus DDP's title win without any buildup and heel turn didn't help. I think it was after that (and the logo change) that the plummet to the end really started. That was also the last really good WCW ppv
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Jan 5, 2016 01:56
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Vertical Lime posted:Plus DDP's title win without any buildup and heel turn didn't help. I think it was after that (and the logo change) that the plummet to the end really started. God DDP's heel turn was so insufferable. After what, 2-3 years of working his way up the card, feuding with Savage, winning the US title, working with Goldberg at Havoc... they make him winning the belt an afterthought, turn him heel, and have him drop the title to babyface Kevin Nash a month later. And this in a company that by 1999 was running out of babyfaces not named Goldberg that were worth anything. Just a really terrible idea.
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Jan 5, 2016 15:20
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laz0rbeak posted:Just a really terrible idea. Terrible yes, but still not quite as bad as trying to turn Goldberg heel...and Sting...and Rey Mysterio...and Jim Duggan (although that kinda worked a little bit).
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Jan 5, 2016 18:14
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Shiki Dan posted:Terrible yes, but still not quite as bad as trying to turn Goldberg heel...and Sting...and Rey Mysterio...and Jim Duggan (although that kinda worked a little bit). Don't forget about the Hogan/Flair double turn
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Jan 5, 2016 18:27
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Every time I watch WCW, I have an urge to take my car to Pepboys and buy something from Duralast and Valvoline.
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Jan 11, 2016 02:47
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Do they all wear Mechanix gloves there?
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Jan 11, 2016 03:06
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Halloween Jack posted:One of the lessons of WCW is that when the product is hot overall, you can make a lot of mistakes that won't immediately come back to bite you in the rear end. So I don't know if it's possible to point to one event in WCW as the turning point, but the Fingerpoke made it clear that they were out of ideas besides "The nWo wins everything and shits on everyone else, forever." The nWo thing is a great example of wrasslin booking gone horribly wrong. It should have wrapped up neatly in 3 years but greed got in the way. The fingerpoke was ballsy because they assumed nWo could do progressively more heinous stuff and it'd draw.
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Jan 11, 2016 03:45
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coconono posted:The nWo thing is a great example of wrasslin booking gone horribly wrong. It should have wrapped up neatly in 3 years but greed got in the way. The fingerpoke was ballsy because they assumed nWo could do progressively more heinous stuff and it'd draw. it should have neatly wrapped up after sting beat hogan at starrcade '97 it should have neatly wrapped up after goldberg beat hogan for the title in the georgia dome it should have neatly wrapped up after flair beat bischoff at the last show in '98 but it never did
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Jan 11, 2016 06:24
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It worked once before, so it MUST keep working FOREVER!! see: top Babyface vs McMahon family
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Jan 11, 2016 07:10
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Tomorrow night is 1-4-1999 in case you were not aware. Raw will be taped so you should watch Nitro.
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Jan 11, 2016 19:22
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dsriggs posted:It worked once before, so it MUST keep working FOREVER!! Eh at least Babyface vs McMahon feuds eventually atop and they drop off TV for a bit. The nWo blew past 3 good stopping points and petered out after Hogan hosed up his knee and Hall was run over by a car.
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Jan 11, 2016 19:28
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ayn rand hand job posted:The nWo blew past 3 good stopping points and petered out after Hogan hosed up his knee and Hall was run over by a car. Now that I think about it, they should have lasted just long enough to create nWo Japan.
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Jan 11, 2016 19:48
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MassRafTer posted:Tomorrow night is 1-4-1999 in case you were not aware. Raw will be taped so you should watch Nitro. what time do you guys do that?
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Jan 11, 2016 20:01
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MassRafTer posted:Tomorrow night is 1-4-1999 in case you were not aware. Raw will be taped so you should watch Nitro. But Scott Norton can't be there cause he has to defend his title in the Dome that morning! corn in the bible posted:what time do you guys do that? 8 EST/ 1 GMT
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Jan 11, 2016 20:15
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Halloween Jack posted:I'm not sure exactly when the nWo should have wrapped up, but it definitely was before they'd been around for three years. Nah that would have been too early, nWo Japan was formed in December '96. By that point they were clearly building up a big Sting feud. There was still money to be made and it wasn't stale.
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Jan 11, 2016 20:21
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Well I wouldn't want to miss that, if only because it's funny to say that, in retrospect, Sting's peak was a year when he didn't actually wrestle or cut promos or do anything but a few run-ins for, what, 11 months? Just saying nWo Japan was necessary.
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Jan 11, 2016 21:29
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Halloween Jack posted:I'm not sure exactly when the nWo should have wrapped up, but it definitely was before they'd been around for three years. When Sting beat Hogan is when it should have wrapped up. Give Hogan his rematch with the stip that if Sting wins again the NWO is disbanded. But lol at Hogan ever doing something like that.
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Jan 11, 2016 21:57
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