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I hate the movie's depiction of orcs as nasty victims of radiation poisoning. Way less subtle than the book. Same for the way they show the evil men and the ring wraiths.
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Jan 6, 2016 16:14
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cheerfullydrab posted:I hate the movie's depiction of orcs as nasty victims of radiation poisoning. Way less subtle than the book. Same for the way they show the evil men and the ring wraiths. It was that or degraded and repulsive versions of the (too Europeans) least lovely Mongol types.
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Jan 6, 2016 22:19
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A line from the Fellowship that has bugged the hell out of me, when Frodo is just setting off from the Shire: "Walking for pleasure, why didn't I drive?" Wat?
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Jan 9, 2016 15:20
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Thunder Moose posted:A line from the Fellowship that has bugged the hell out of me, when Frodo is just setting off from the Shire: Driving is a thing you can do with carts! Sam drove the cart with all the furniture, for example.
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Jan 9, 2016 15:29
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VanSandman posted:Driving is a thing you can do with carts! Sam drove the cart with all the furniture, for example. Thought that was Merry?
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Jan 9, 2016 15:56
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Yeah the words "drive" and "car" were in use well before their modern definitions, and meant the same thing, just applied to animal-powered vehicles.
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Jan 9, 2016 16:00
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Think "cattle drive," but in a not-The Far Side way. From the Old English "drifan" - originally, "to push from behind." joat mon fucked around with this message at 16:17 on Jan 9, 2016 |
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Jan 9, 2016 16:15
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Lemniscate Blue posted:Thought that was Merry? Could be! I don't remember perfectly.
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Jan 9, 2016 16:17
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Prolonged Priapism posted:Yeah the words "drive" and "car" were in use well before their modern definitions, and meant the same thing, just applied to animal-powered vehicles.
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Jan 9, 2016 23:08
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Runcible Cat posted:The line, "Aragorn and Legolas went now with Éomer in the van" confused the hell out of me as a kid. Why hadn't the van been mentioned before? Wasn't it really bumpy driving over the plain? Where were they getting the petrol? Travelling in a fried-out Kombi... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XfR9iY5y94s If I were only a little more bored I'd work out some alternate lyrics.
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Jan 10, 2016 16:49
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I met a strange lady, She made me nervous. She took me in, and told me "In place of the Dark Lord you will set up a Queen. And I shall not be dark, but beautiful and terrible as the Morning and the Night! Fair as the Sea and the Sun and the Snow upon the Mountain! Dreadful as the Storm and the Lightning! Stronger than the foundations of the earth. All shall love me and despair!”
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Jan 10, 2016 16:55
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Celeborn as the guy stood behind her dishing out Vegemite sandwiches is far too good a mental images not to share.
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Jan 10, 2016 18:59
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Runcible Cat posted:The line, "Aragorn and Legolas went now with Éomer in the van" confused the hell out of me as a kid. Why hadn't the van been mentioned before? Wasn't it really bumpy driving over the plain? Where were they getting the petrol? This is amazing. I think the only genuine anachronism that slipped through in LOTR is where Gandalf's dragon firework "passed over Bywater like an express train", which always stuck out to me like a sore thumb. Once you notice it, you can't un-notice it.
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Jan 11, 2016 00:23
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webmeister posted:This is amazing. That and Lobelia's umbrella. You don't notice either because the hobbits otherwise feel so Edwardian.
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Jan 11, 2016 00:59
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:That and Lobelia's umbrella. You don't notice either because the hobbits otherwise feel so Edwardian. What's wrong with umbrellas? If the Chinese could make them in 600 BC Hobbits surely could make one.
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Jan 11, 2016 01:23
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Yeah the umbrella never seemed weird to me. The express train reference does but an umbrella is the sort of thing you can just come up with.
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Jan 11, 2016 01:52
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webmeister posted:This is amazing. I think that's sort of like how later on someone is described as Mongoloid(?) in appearance.
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Jan 11, 2016 02:10
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i81icu812 posted:What's wrong with umbrellas? If the Chinese could make them in 600 BC Hobbits surely could make one. Tolkien specifically mentions the umbrella as an anachronism in the Letters.
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Jan 11, 2016 02:18
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Umbrellas didn't exist in Britain until I don't know when, and lotr is a mythology of Britain.
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Jan 11, 2016 03:53
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potatoes
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Jan 11, 2016 16:18
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Levitate posted:potatoes The elves brought them back from Valinor, obviously.
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Jan 11, 2016 16:23
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Potatoes are implied in The Children of Húrin as well, though never named.
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Jan 11, 2016 23:19
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Potatoes, like pipe-weed, are *clearly* Tolkien's translations for then-extant middle earth plants.
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Jan 12, 2016 02:24
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:Potatoes, like pipe-weed, are *clearly* Tolkien's translations for then-extant middle earth plants. Agreed. Also Children of Hurin is insanely good.
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Jan 12, 2016 03:27
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:Potatoes, like pipe-weed, are *clearly* Tolkien's translations for then-extant middle earth plants. Granted. How about express trains?
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Jan 12, 2016 03:51
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joat mon posted:Granted. How about express trains?
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Jan 12, 2016 04:31
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Native Americans had no horses or ate them all into extinction until the Spanish started losing track of theirs. Nonetheless they had robust mythical integration of the horse into their cultures by the time we got into the plains states. If they can do it, so can old man Tolkien.
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Jan 12, 2016 07:33
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This actually reminds me of this post in the Star Trek thread:Duckbag posted:90% of the internet doesn't know the origins of the term Mary Sue and are just using it as a dead metaphor. Dead metaphors are phrases like "by and large" that used to suggest a specific image but don't anymore ("by" and "large" describe angles at which the wind hits the sails of a ship. A ship that sails well by and large can sail in most any wind. We still use the phrase all the time, but most people don't know it's a metaphor.) Another example is the phrase "fish out of water." As George Orwell pointed out, the first time you hear the phrase, you'll probably picture that poor fish, but once it's become a cliche to you, you stop picturing the fish and the metaphor starts to die. It made me think of how "express train" was a visual cue that has ceased to mean much for us in the modern world, particularly people who don't spend a lot of time in city transit. We think "express train" means "particularly fast train". But what Tolkien was probably going for (whether intentionally or because he fell prey to a cliché) was the much more physically specific idea of "a train that's not stopping at this station", i.e. one that's rushing past you on the platform at full speed without giving a gently caress if you're inches away from it, displacing wind with such force as to knock you over. If a suburbanite were to use a train as a metaphor the "express" aspect of it probably wouldn't enter into the picture; he'd just say "steam locomotive" or something. But "express train" has special meaning that will only really resonate with someone who's stood on a subway platform waiting for a local. Data Graham fucked around with this message at 17:25 on Jan 12, 2016 |
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Jan 12, 2016 17:22
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Potatoes and pipe-weed are fairly easy to reconcile diegetically if we drop the idea that Middle-Earth is imminently prehistorical or prehistorical at all. Like athelas, they're a relic of Numenorean civilization.
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Jan 12, 2016 19:51
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Data Graham posted:It made me think of how "express train" was a visual cue that has ceased to mean much for us in the modern world, particularly people who don't spend a lot of time in city transit. We think "express train" means "particularly fast train". But what Tolkien was probably going for (whether intentionally or because he fell prey to a cliché) was the much more physically specific idea of "a train that's not stopping at this station", i.e. one that's rushing past you on the platform at full speed without giving a gently caress if you're inches away from it, displacing wind with such force as to knock you over. If a suburbanite were to use a train as a metaphor the "express" aspect of it probably wouldn't enter into the picture; he'd just say "steam locomotive" or something. But "express train" has special meaning that will only really resonate with someone who's stood on a subway platform waiting for a local. Well, "train" has been around a lot longer than the locomotive. Maybe he mean a long train of wagons pulled by oxen at 2 or 3 mph? One that's not stopping at this station just, you know, more slowly? Or possibly express as in being pulled by fast horses rather than plodding oxen? Dozens of fast horses pulling metal wheeled wagons at 10-12 mph would be a hell of a racket and quite scary to rural shire folk. e: VVVV Hush. Murgos fucked around with this message at 21:59 on Jan 12, 2016 |
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Jan 12, 2016 21:31
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Murgos posted:Well, "train" has been around a lot longer than the locomotive. Maybe he mean a long train of wagons pulled by oxen at 2 or 3 mph? One that's not stopping at this station just, you know, more slowly? It's not a particularly apt metaphor for magical firework rockets whizzing past your head though
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Jan 12, 2016 21:50
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Maybe Gandalf's fireworks actually move at 2-3mph and that is one of the reasons they are considered amazing and remarkable.
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Jan 12, 2016 22:10
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we could also probably enjoy some dope rear end books and not jerk off about the few anachronisms the author left in them (though I'm sure this thread is down with that)
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Jan 13, 2016 01:03
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Levitate posted:we could also probably enjoy some dope rear end books and not jerk off about the few anachronisms the author left in them (though I'm sure this thread is down with that) What is with this attitude?
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Jan 13, 2016 01:14
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Levitate posted:we could also probably enjoy some dope rear end books and not jerk off about the few anachronisms the author left in them (though I'm sure this thread is down with that) We can do both, OP
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Jan 13, 2016 01:16
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The translator of TLOTR used "express train" in the place of an even more anachronistic and confusing metaphor. There I solved the issue.
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Jan 13, 2016 02:21
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SHISHKABOB posted:What is with this attitude? it's cool I'm just making fun of the people who legit get upset at Tolkien for those lines
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Jan 13, 2016 02:46
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euphronius posted:The translator of TLOTR used "express train" in the place of an even more anachronistic and confusing metaphor. I had been thinking along the same lines as data graham, and the only pre industrial equivalent that came to mind was juggernaut, which would have been problematic for a few reasons. There really isn't a word for, " parallel but really, really close to a cavalry charge."
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Jan 13, 2016 03:38
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"A huge gust of wind," there you go, I'm the new Tolkien
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Jan 13, 2016 06:02
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Nessus posted:"A huge gust of wind," there you go, I'm the new Tolkien Lightning bolt? Avalanche? The sound Fatty Bolger makes when cannonballing into the Brandywine?
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Jan 13, 2016 17:09
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