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Yeah I was perusing those reviews the other day and the rapey serial killer thing, which wasn't great even at the time, really has not aged well.Cnut the Great posted:And none of Mark Hamill's lines as Luke have ever ended up as in-jokes on the Internet because of their inherent silliness. It's almost like if you go in determined to mock the easily-mockable, preposterously written, soapy ham-fest that is Star Wars, you're going to find exactly what you're looking for! Even back then, even with all that, I still knew there was something wrong with the acting from the both of them. Exchanges and interactions that I had been looking forward to came across bewildering and stilted instead. For every moment of genuine, engaging expressiveness that mostly came when Anakin needed to shout about something, there were entire scenes of them sounding alternately bored and confused. The sand scene has been mocked to death already, but even scenes of greater character relevance -- like when he speaks to Watto, the man who owned him for nine years -- come across like he just got woken up from a nap and wanted to get back to it. And then Episode III, which is just such a grab-bag of effective and embarrassing scenes. Just for instance, the moment where Anakin finds out that Palpatine is Darth Sidious may as well have been a moment where Anakin finds out Palpatine watches Top Chef (at least from Christensen's end; McDiarmid was fantastic). "You know the dark side?" he asks stalely, as if prodding the Sith Lord for recipe suggestions, and then reveals this catastrophic news to Mace Windu with the same toneless mumble. It was terrible. And it wasn't the the sort of terrible you could blame on the dialogue -- which was tense, sparse, and to-the-point -- only on the delivery. To date I still find the prequels interesting and can talk (and have talked) a lot about the sorts of interesting things that they portray, but I also can't watch these sorts of scenes without fantasizing about how much better they could have been with, yes, better direction and production, but just a better actor, period. Imagine someone like Leonardo DiCaprio having been picked to handle Anakin's role, or, in a contemporary context, someone like Domhnall Gleason. Jack Gladney posted:Wasn't she elected queen? I guess that means she's good at politics because she's a kid who was elected leader of a planet. Implicit in this is that she didn't grow up as royalty? quote:ANAKIN This really should've stayed in the film. It would've made her marriage with Anakin a bit more natural since we would've learned earlier in the film that marriage is what she's been seeking all along and she's really only a Senator out of obligation at this point...and then the crisis she's been trying to solve only gets worse so it's not like she can just say "Alright guys have fun with this mess while I drink space margaritas in my space beach house. Take it away, Jar Jar!" The attitude is also reflected in Episode III when she takes to being pregnant with, well, great enthusiasm after being assured that her husband wants the same thing. The happiest we ever see Padme is when she's with her family (another deleted scene) and when she's talkin' babies. BrianWilly fucked around with this message at 04:44 on Jan 12, 2016 |
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Jan 12, 2016 04:38
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= High Comedy
= High Drama
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Anakin is highly emotionally distraught during those scenes watch them again on a blue ray on a real tv. Those scenes being with Palaptine when he admits to being a Sith Lord.
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Jan 12, 2016 04:41
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Empress Theonora posted:RLM's weird jokes about torturing and murdering women creep me out so much I almost want to like the prequels out of spite. They get pretty excessive yeah. I get what they were aiming for (use their horror b-movie experience to provide the framework of an old serial killer freaking out at movies, and also Mike's ability to talk like a slob) but they probably could have turned it down a bit (and they did; to the best of my knowledge nothing in BotW, HitB, or the post-star wars Plinkett reviews dwell on killing/torturing women for jokes).
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Jan 12, 2016 04:42
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you can't rent them for less than 20 bucks. So no thank you.
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Jan 12, 2016 04:42
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CelticPredator posted:you can't rent them for less than 20 bucks. So no thank you.  you are truly a Star Wars fan.
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Jan 12, 2016 04:45
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BrianWilly posted:As with a lot of things, Padme's life and personality is something that appears much more in concept, in the screenplay, than in the finished film. The AOTC script sheds a lot about Padme's history and origins. That bit highlights even more that she's always been attracted to helping refugees. Anakin isn't strictly a refugee, but he's a kid in need and grows up to be her "type."
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Jan 12, 2016 04:46
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euphronius posted:
fine with it.
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Jan 12, 2016 04:47
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homullus posted:That bit highlights even more that she's always been attracted to helping refugees. Anakin isn't strictly a refugee, but he's a kid in need and grows up to be her "type."
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Jan 12, 2016 04:48
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BrianWilly posted:Yeah, and also "it was my conviction that reform was possible." She wants to fix this guy so bad. Yeah this emotion is well seen when he later admits to you know killing all the Jedi and swearing allegiance to her arch nemesis. While she is pregnant. Whoops.
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Jan 12, 2016 04:51
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BrianWilly posted:Yeah, and also "it was my conviction that reform was possible." She wants to fix this guy so bad. It's also a tried and true story trait, and extremely common in real life, AND helps her passive acceptance of Anakin being a crazy murderer make sense. Important character-defining moments like this being gutted down to a point that renders a character nonsensical is a big reason why I believe that the films had production issues (which is a bit easier to swallow than "Lucas is a hack fraud"). In the finished work it makes absolutely zero sense that she's all "cool, i'm fine that you murdered children, whiny mentally ill bodyguard." I mean, it feels like any normal person without an attraction towards lost causes would immediately tell their real bodyguard "holy poo poo that guy murdered an entire tribe. Don't ever let him near me again, also tell his boss." Neurolimal fucked around with this message at 04:59 on Jan 12, 2016 |
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Jan 12, 2016 04:55
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Hey I got a question -- was fake-Amidala being blown up at the start of Episode 2 supposed to be shocking? It kind of feels like it was supposed to be a big surprise but I couldn't care if she lived or died, also they reveal it's a ruse immediately after. edit: I feel the same way watching that scene that I did in the two reveals in Force Awakens
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Jan 12, 2016 04:59
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Neurolimal posted:They get pretty excessive yeah. I get what they were aiming for (use their horror b-movie experience to provide the framework of an old serial killer freaking out at movies, and also Mike's ability to talk like a slob) but they probably could have turned it down a bit (and they did; to the best of my knowledge nothing in BotW, HitB, or the post-star wars Plinkett reviews dwell on killing/torturing women for jokes). Their knowledge of cultural politics is still pretty poor: check out their review of Red Tails and how Marvin Van Peebles' career proves that Hollywood is a color-blind meritocracy, or how savagely Mike goes after their only female guest critic on Half in the Bag for defending romantic comedies as the only kind of film available for women to really make or enjoy. He mocks her because he thinks romantic comedies are bad and that she's wrong for enjoying light films about romance over Taxi Driver. They're right on the edge of complaining about "SJWs" ruining their fun because racism is over.
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Jan 12, 2016 05:11
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BrianWilly posted:Real human persons ITT seriously trying to say they enjoyed Hayden Christensen's acting with real English words. Accusations like this help no one. Take arguments in good faith.
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Jan 12, 2016 05:11
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Yeah. It's at this precise specific point that you know you're reaching too hard.
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Neurolimal posted:I mean, it feels like any normal person without an attraction towards lost causes would immediately tell their real bodyguard "holy poo poo that guy murdered an entire tribe. Don't ever let him near me again, also tell his boss." That might seem like commonsense, but - first example that comes to mind - Chris Kyle wasn't immediately divorced after claiming to have murdered American civilians during Hurricane Katrina. Padme's reaction is highly realistic in a way that's rare even in 'sophisticated' crime dramas.
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Jan 12, 2016 05:12
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Jack Gladney posted:Their knowledge of cultural politics is still pretty poor: check out their review of Red Tails and how Marvin Van Peebles' career proves that Hollywood is a color-blind meritocracy, or how savagely Mike goes after their only female guest critic on Half in the Bag for defending romantic comedies as the only kind of film available for women to really make or enjoy. He mocks her because he thinks romantic comedies are bad and that she's wrong for enjoying light films about romance over Taxi Driver. They're right on the edge of complaining about "SJWs" ruining their fun because racism is over. lmao gently caress those assholes
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Jan 12, 2016 05:22
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Just walking down some halls.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sufkBRdROr4&t=155s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mm854yq38jY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nStx_RD4tx8 I'm the exact same lighting in 3 different areas.
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Jan 12, 2016 05:26
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Maxwell Lord posted:Accusations like this help no one. Take arguments in good faith. That's not exactly what I meant, anyway. I don't think anyone is trolling, exactly, when they say they say Christensen was as good an actor as Hamill or something. They are certainly reaching too hard to try to defend the prequels, though. 
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Jan 12, 2016 05:31
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I think it's not a stretch to say Hayden Christiansen as Anakin was a better actor than Mark Hamill as Luke. Certainly he was portraying a much more difficult character.
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Jan 12, 2016 05:33
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Jack Gladney posted:Their knowledge of cultural politics is still pretty poor: check out their review of Red Tails and how Marvin Van Peebles' career proves that Hollywood is a color-blind meritocracy, or how savagely Mike goes after their only female guest critic on Half in the Bag for defending romantic comedies as the only kind of film available for women to really make or enjoy. He mocks her because he thinks romantic comedies are bad and that she's wrong for enjoying light films about romance over Taxi Driver. They're right on the edge of complaining about "SJWs" ruining their fun because racism is over. Mike's entire gimmick as Plinkett and in HitB is as an awful person rendered sociopathic by the wasteland that is Milwaukee. Also there's more than one female guest in HitB, also a good third of the BotW episodes feature a woman (obsessed with farting). I don't think they believe that racism is over, just that Red Tails could have lost producer faith for other reasons. (which I'm likely to believe; emotional films about family/brotherhood featuring an all-black casts do very well, Tyler Perry's built an entire career on the concept).
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Jan 12, 2016 05:34
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Jack Gladney posted:Their knowledge of cultural politics is still pretty poor: check out their review of Red Tails and how Marvin Van Peebles' career proves that Hollywood is a color-blind meritocracy, or how savagely Mike goes after their only female guest critic on Half in the Bag for defending romantic comedies as the only kind of film available for women to really make or enjoy. He mocks her because he thinks romantic comedies are bad and that she's wrong for enjoying light films about romance over Taxi Driver. They're right on the edge of complaining about "SJWs" ruining their fun because racism is over. This was years ago, by the way. Before the social culture stuff was prevalent. Stuff that was funny and fine for most then isn't the case now. They don't do any of this outside of poking fun at SJW from time to time because they can be obnoxious. Not so much that social issues are bad. Sometimes they say a controversial thing. But it's usually at the expense of like...old people. CelticPredator fucked around with this message at 05:38 on Jan 12, 2016 |
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Jan 12, 2016 05:35
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CelticPredator posted:This was years ago, by the way. Before the social culture stuff was prevalent. In all fairness they do make jokes at the expense of cultural sensitivity (they originally made a joke in some review that offended some fans that went nuclear, so they tiptoed around it another time and other fans went nuclear, so now they dont giveva poo poo and make a lot of jokes about _____-shaming, like Mini-Kiss-Shaming). I'm not going to claim balding old nerds are paragons of progression, just that overall they're more aware and progressive than they're being protrayed (especially Jack and Rich).
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Jan 12, 2016 05:39
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Jack Gladney posted:or how savagely Mike goes after their only female guest critic on Half in the Bag for defending romantic comedies as the only kind of film available for women to really make or enjoy. He mocks her because he thinks romantic comedies are bad and that she's wrong for enjoying light films about romance over Taxi Driver. Which video is this?
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Jan 12, 2016 05:41
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CelticPredator posted:
Don't forget Rich saying offensive stuff towards Asians! Everyone else does look uncomfortable when he does that though to their credit.
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Jan 12, 2016 05:41
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What's your number/black ninja. Black Ninja part is a masterpiece.
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Jan 12, 2016 05:42
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I can think of so many of my own fingers I'd rather cut off than to watch Taxi Driver.
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Jan 12, 2016 05:46
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I want to read SMG's interpretation of The Jar.
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Jan 12, 2016 05:49
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I don't think they're malicious or reactionary, just well-meaning white guys who have never really been outside of their comfort zone and don't think things through sometimes. And I don't think Mike is playing a depressed misanthrope so much as he really has depression that he self-medicates with beer.
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Jan 12, 2016 05:49
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Neurolimal posted:In all fairness they do make jokes at the expense of cultural sensitivity (they originally made a joke in some review that offended some fans that went nuclear, so they tiptoed around it another time and other fans went nuclear, so now they dont giveva poo poo and make a lot of jokes about _____-shaming, like Mini-Kiss-Shaming). I'm not going to claim balding old nerds are paragons of progression, just that overall they're more aware and progressive than they're being protrayed (especially Jack and Rich). Hey now, you don't have to be old to be a balding nerd!
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Jan 12, 2016 05:50
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Jack Gladney posted:I don't think they're malicious or reactionary, just well-meaning white guys who have never really been outside of their comfort zone and don't think things through sometimes. And I don't think Mike is playing a depressed misanthrope so much as he really has depression that he self-medicates with beer. I can def. agree with this. Though if we're placing bets on who's secretly depressed I'd go with Rich: apparently he's talked a few times on their videogame channel about how unhappy he is with the state of his body  On the bright side, at least he looks better with the facial hair 
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Jan 12, 2016 05:52
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Jack Gladney posted:I don't think they're malicious or reactionary, just well-meaning white guys who have never really been outside of their comfort zone and don't think things through sometimes. And I don't think Mike is playing a depressed misanthrope so much as he really has depression that he self-medicates with beer. Mike has been noticeably happier in the past year's worth of videos. He loved The Force Awakens and Jurassic World, and he even seemed to go easy on horrid movies like Terminator Genysis. He even laughed in a recent video! He seems to be in brighter spirits overall.
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Jan 12, 2016 05:52
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George Lucas on the set of Attack of the Clones: That T-shirt has a quote from a piece The New Yorker published just prior to the theatrical re-release of the original trilogy in 1997. It's a summation of the writer's opinion about the original Star Wars: "....a film with comic-book characters, an unbelievable story, no political or social commentary, lousy acting, preposterous dialogue, and a ridiculously simplistic morality. In other words, a BAD MOVIE." The reason he never took the criticisms about the acting and dialogue in the prequels very seriously is because he'd already heard all the same poo poo before, except it used to be about the originals. Sure, most people liked the originals when they first came out, but there was also always a small group of cynics hanging around shouting about how much Star Wars sucked, how it relied too much on special effects, and how riddled it was with bad acting and terrible dialogue. Over the years, this small group of cynics became larger and larger, until, as is the way with these things, they slowly and subtly started to become a more dominant influence on the culture. No one wanted pulp fantasy and fairy tales anymore; they wanted gritty, "realistic" thrillers with hard-boiled antiheroes spouting ironic one-liners. It got to the point where he re-released the original movies, and now there were people in major publications making GBS threads all over them, claiming the only reason the originals got a pass was because they came out at the right time and got everyone swept up in the moment. So now, with all this in his mind, he goes to make the prequels, doing largely the same thing he's always done. He finishes Episode I, everyone goes to see it, initial reactions from people seem to be pretty positive...but then over the course of the next couple of days a narrative has taken hold about what an awful disappointment it is, how it relies too much on special effects, and how it's riddled with bad acting and terrible dialogue. Lucas goes on record as saying he's not that surprised at the reaction, and indeed there are quotes from before the movie was even released where he says he's expecting half the audience to hate it. Seems to me the prequel backlash just confirmed to Lucas that the cynical mindset he encountered back when he made the originals was simply on a cultural upswing. And I think he was right. Stylistically, the prequels and the originals aren't that different from each other. The contemporary criticisms of both trilogies are pretty much exactly the same; they're so similar it's eerie. The only thing that changed is the how loud the criticisms got. Cnut the Great fucked around with this message at 06:01 on Jan 12, 2016 |
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Jan 12, 2016 05:57
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Jack Gladney posted:I don't think they're malicious or reactionary, just well-meaning white guys who have never really been outside of their comfort zone and don't think things through sometimes. I think it's a matter of them not really caring what people think. That's part of what makes it funny; they often subvert it by pointing out, subtly or not, that someone somewhere will bitch about it. They do this on purpose because it's generally funny when people get riled up about things, especially social justice on the internet. It's usually tongue-in-cheek as well I might add, which by the way tends to force people to go "wait what" and actually reflect on what's being said in ways that people who are vehemently all about social justice on the internet can't (because they usually they flip their poo poo, talk about how offended they are, and condescend anyone who dares question even the most minuet things being said: all things that usually shut down the 'listening intently to the other side' part of the brain). I think it might actually be a bit patronize to just write them off as "silly white guys that don't know what they're talking about", because talk like that (not specifically you doing it, mind) is the fastest way to get that particular demographic to stop caring about particular grievances and actively begin to undermine you. Basically, it's more of a schtick played up for laughs than you might realize.
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Jan 12, 2016 06:17
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I'm only ironically being racist.
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Jan 12, 2016 06:18
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George Lucas sounds like a cool guy.
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Jan 12, 2016 06:21
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Motto posted:George Lucas sounds like a cool guy. except the part where he withholds the original versions of his movies. That's lovely.
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Jan 12, 2016 06:24
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korusan posted:I think it's a matter of them not really caring what people think. That's part of what makes it funny; they often subvert it by pointing out, subtly or not, that someone somewhere will bitch about it. They do this on purpose because it's generally funny when people get riled up about things, especially social justice on the internet. I'm talking about their review of Red Tails where they say that a movie self-consciously calculated to feature black characters isn't necessary because exploitation films prove that Hollywood is no longer racist, not their self-conscious prodding about Harrison Ford being old. In that review they seem to have a fairly superficial understanding of Hollywood being very racist, though George Lucas seems to understand that point very well.
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Jan 12, 2016 06:25
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CelticPredator posted:except the part where he withholds the original versions of his movies. That's lovely. I thought the rumor was that the original masters are damaged or something? Because if not, it seems like Disney would be releasing those originals ASAP. I gotta imagine there's gold in them thar hills.
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Jan 12, 2016 06:26
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Once again, that was a long time ago, before the social stuff became a lot more known.
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Jan 12, 2016 06:26
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Serf posted:I thought the rumor was that the original masters are damaged or something? Because if not, it seems like Disney would be releasing those originals ASAP. I gotta imagine there's gold in them thar hills. Maybe true for ANH, the others have decent copies. The bigger issues are 1) Fox has control over the first six films until at least 2020 (they have ANH in perpetuity) and 2) Star Wars fans will buy anything with Star Wars on it so there's literally no reason to release the originals. The Blu-Ray sales of the OT which were "utterly terrible" (in terms of perceived quality) were still much higher than most franchises.
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Jan 12, 2016 06:28
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CelticPredator posted:Once again, that was a long time ago, before the social stuff became a lot more known.  What "social stuff"? Are you trying to say racism was a little-known subject back in the far-off time of 2012?
Motto fucked around with this message at 06:32 on Jan 12, 2016 |
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Jan 12, 2016 06:30
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