CanPol Megathread: Big Changus

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InfiniteZero: Sep 11, 2004; PINK GUITAR FIRE ROBOT; College Slice

Rime posted:

I've started seeing this movement as the last blow against lingering Victorian puritanism in society. Here's hoping we can stop freaking out over naked tits and dongs in a generation or three.

In Manitoba, the right to form a GSA was passed provincially in 2013 and the leader of the PCs poo poo his pants and claimed that not allowing students to shame each other would mean that free throw shooters at basketball games could not be taunted.

It certainly had nothing to do with his own faith and track record of voting against gay marriage, referring to women as "fickle" and calling atheists "infidels".

The punchline is that Manitoba will almost assuredly make him the premier asap in the spring.

:barf:

# ? Jan 14, 2016 23:01

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# ? May 22, 2024 06:23

DariusLikewise: Oct 4, 2008; You wore that on Halloween?

Don't forget

MERRY CHRISTMAS ATHEIST INFIDELS

and that classic Halloween is a gift from Satan rant.

4 years of Pallister is going to be a riot.

# ? Jan 14, 2016 23:08

Dreylad: Jun 19, 2001

Helsing posted:

I guess this makes me sound even more like a crotchety old man but the way movies are created under the guidance of money grubbing executive producers really calls to mind how in 1984 Winston Smith's department would assemble machine-written pulp novels for the Proles to consume. It's the decentralized imperatives of the Allmighty dollar rather than some nefarious Big Brother pulling the strings but the output doesn't seem all that markedly different.

Anyway, speaking to your lager point: I agree very strongly that High School is a big part of the problem but I would place the emphasis on our refusal to invest sufficiently in education and our tendency to structure education in a way that makes learning much more tedious and boring than it should be.

Our over crowded and underfunded public education system can't entirely decide what it wants to be. The early model for our education system was intended to train students for factory life: you show up on time, change positions to the sound of a bell, learn to obey petty authority and to suppress your natural desire to go run around outside.

Since then we've tried to change the system to encourage creativity and learning and critical thinking but the original intention of the people who designed the school system was to breed docility not creativity. And a general lack of interest in actually paying for good universal education, plus the strong bureaucratic bias toward continuity rather than radical change, makes it very hard to imagine how the school system could easily be fixed.

Well I think the "decentralized imperatives of the Almighty Dollar" fits the After Ford era more than it does the rule of Big Brother. :v:

I only posted that example not to dismiss your concerns, but only point out that these aren't new concerns, and this moral debate plays out constantly in modern societies. Japan has been grappling with the same issues for a while, for example.

I'm glad to see more takedowns of YA fiction, although I think that's more because I don't particularly like it. I have to remind myself that there's plenty of adult fiction crap, from mysteries to a glut of terrible fiction. Adult colouring books don't really factor, I think, because they're more about meditation/presentism/whatever new age philosophy people pursue.

I take it you've seen (or maybe not!) Ken Robinson's take on school and education, because you're following a critique very similar to his. If not, here's an animated version of his lecture because we're all literal children who need moving pictures to understand things.

The problem is, I think, that no matter how much we try to reform schooling, the underlying structure of grades and classic disciplinary divisions prevent any real shift in how children think about learning and education. Those underpinning structures were created for factory work, and have never been addressed. Education is also fairly resistant to reform, I think, as there's a significant conservative element that challenges any kind of reform, and reform itself can be driven by corporate interest. See the brouhaha over Common Core in the USA.

# ? Jan 14, 2016 23:47

Rime: Nov 2, 2011; by Games Forum

There are two ways to look at the ongoing decline of "smart people":

- Rage that the education system is rigged to push as many bodies through as possible. A system graduating students who can barely read english at a 3rd grade level, let alone comprehend the deeper themes and concepts of what they are reading, let alone express that comprehension in legible writing of their own. Surely this is only a systemic failure which can be cured with more money and resources.

- Accept, as the education system quietly has (so as not to inflame the left) that the bulk of the population is inherently lacking in an as-yet unlocated "spark of intelligence", one which will set them apart in life and instead redirect resources towards those students who do display such qualities. Acknowledge that, no, every child is not a special snowflake destined for greatness and that such an attitude does a disservice to those few who actually are such.

The majority of humanity is made up of animals who have little care for anything beyond when they will next eat, drink, and gently caress. They display no desire to better themselves or seek anything beyond their own pleasures. They are never going to be great philosophers, artists, or destined for anything except serving until they die in the labor grinder which keeps our capitalist system afloat. The internet should have given rise to a generation of unbelievably well educated youth, minds brighter than any who have come before, instead we got endless reposts from loving Buzzfeed.

It's not a failure of our education system, it's a failure of our society. We cherish and idolize the crass and idiotic, we crave the most easily digestible entertainment and despise challenges, and we raise children like cattle. Don't blame the education system, blame parenting, and accept that true intelligence is the rarest of human traits.

# ? Jan 15, 2016 00:16

Baronjutter: Dec 31, 2007; "Tiny Trains"

So there's some "cool smart person gene" and we should just give up trying to create more of these people and just focus on bettering the natural elites?
If it's not a gene, should we not invest money and resources into identifying and unlocking this "spark" in as many of the population as possible?

Who knows, maybe a lot of it is genetic and there's no helping those mass-media consuming sheeple with poor taste in pop culture. Or maybe it's mostly a lovely education system and society we should try to make better?

# ? Jan 15, 2016 00:22

Wistful of Dollars: Aug 25, 2009

Oil up? Cut out way to prosperity.

Oil down? Cut our way to prosperity.

:kheldragar:

# ? Jan 15, 2016 00:37

cowofwar: Jul 30, 2002; by Athanatos

Rime posted:

There are two ways to look at the ongoing decline of "smart people":

- Rage that the education system is rigged to push as many bodies through as possible. A system graduating students who can barely read english at a 3rd grade level, let alone comprehend the deeper themes and concepts of what they are reading, let alone express that comprehension in legible writing of their own. Surely this is only a systemic failure which can be cured with more money and resources.

- Accept, as the education system quietly has (so as not to inflame the left) that the bulk of the population is inherently lacking in an as-yet unlocated "spark of intelligence", one which will set them apart in life and instead redirect resources towards those students who do display such qualities. Acknowledge that, no, every child is not a special snowflake destined for greatness and that such an attitude does a disservice to those few who actually are such.

The majority of humanity is made up of animals who have little care for anything beyond when they will next eat, drink, and gently caress. They display no desire to better themselves or seek anything beyond their own pleasures. They are never going to be great philosophers, artists, or destined for anything except serving until they die in the labor grinder which keeps our capitalist system afloat. The internet should have given rise to a generation of unbelievably well educated youth, minds brighter than any who have come before, instead we got endless reposts from loving Buzzfeed.

It's not a failure of our education system, it's a failure of our society. We cherish and idolize the crass and idiotic, we crave the most easily digestible entertainment and despise challenges, and we raise children like cattle. Don't blame the education system, blame parenting, and accept that true intelligence is the rarest of human traits.

No. Learned people aren't better or more genetically fit, it's just that society has made university a requirement for high level jobs so a lot of people just put in the requisite effort to get to where they want to go and don't give a poo poo about actually learning along the way because that's not their goal.

The problem is that people aren't pursuing their interests or passions; they are being pushed through a system of requirements.

# ? Jan 15, 2016 01:10

Kraftwerk: Aug 13, 2011; i do not have 10,000 bircoins, please stop asking

cowofwar posted:

No. Learned people aren't better or more genetically fit, it's just that society has made university a requirement for high level jobs so a lot of people just put in the requisite effort to get to where they want to go and don't give a poo poo about actually learning along the way because that's not their goal.

The problem is that people aren't pursuing their interests or passions; they are being pushed through a system of requirements.

Yeah it's this. I often get told I have above average intelligence but that I'm wasting it and part of that reason is because I want my paycheque and all the nice things it can afford to buy me.

If I followed my passions I'd be a pauper right now.

All I wanted to do was study history. That was my real interest but you can't do gently caress all with that stuff so I had to do my major instead and I hated my life all the way through it. I felt like University was a prison sentence and I often dreaded the exam results and final grade reports like someone on death row does when the results of their appeals come in.

# ? Jan 15, 2016 01:23

Jordan7hm: Feb 17, 2011; Lipstick Apathy

You should have studied history nobody gives a poo poo what your crappy major is in when you aren't going into a technical profession anyway.

# ? Jan 15, 2016 01:31

Rime: Nov 2, 2011; by Games Forum

There's an appreciable difference between people who are smart, but follow a boring career in order to survive, and people who are just plain idiots.

The difference being that the former will do things in their own time to broaden their horizons, lacking any profit motive, they'll study history or philosophy or take up a novel hobby. The latter go to work, watch netflix, pump out a kid annually and get high. This is fine, because it's the latter group which lives paycheque to paycheque and keeps our economy functioning through rampant consumerism. Our civilization relies on a healthy base of people too dumb to realize there is anything better to strive for in life.

You can't fix this poo poo short of some horrific gattaca-esque debacle (yes, I'm aware of the irony of this comparison given the plot), it's human nature, it has been since we swung out of the trees.

# ? Jan 15, 2016 01:32

The Dark One: Aug 19, 2005; I'm your friend and I'm not going to just stand by and let you do this!

In "Canadian media continue to circle the drain" news, the Chronicle Herald is going to start withholding bylines for journalists and photographers as a prelude to its planned lockout. Smooth way to ease its readership over to anonymous scab workers, I guess.

quote:

The largest independent daily newspaper in Canada has told staff it is removing reporter bylines "indefinitely," ahead of a possible lockout or strike, according to the paper's union.

The Chronicle Herald is negotiating a new collective agreement with the Halifax Typographical Union, which represents 61 newsroom staff. The union says management wants to lay off a third of the newsroom.

Reporters and photographers withheld bylines earlier this week to protest a decision by Herald management to file a lockout notice before two final days of negotiations with a provincially appointed conciliator. A work stoppage could come as a soon as Jan. 23.

Management emailed editors and union staff late Tuesday afternoon, union vice president and Herald reporter Francis Campbell said.

"It goes on to say, 'To avoid confusion, bylines will be withheld from all stories and replaced with The Chronicle Herald'," Campbell said of the emailed memo.

# ? Jan 15, 2016 01:51

Juul-Whip: Mar 10, 2008

They have a readership?

# ? Jan 15, 2016 01:55

Newfie: Oct 8, 2013; 10 years of oil boom and 20 billion dollars cash, all I got was a case of beer, a pack of smokes, and 14% unemployment.
Thanks, Danny.

What do you do when you have the worst deficit and your province is back to pre-oil boom levels of total debt? Ask the internet of course!

"drewfoundland" posted:

Resettle Dildo into Broad Cove
As we know, Newfoundland and Labrador is awash in red ink - much of which comes from the infrastructure costs required to service so many small communities. To remedy this, I propose we consider a more robust resettlement program.

As an initial experiment, we should start by moving the community of Dildo into the neighbouring town of Broad Cove. Both communities are close to St. John's, so it will be easy for bureaucrats to watch it happen and evaluate the process before rolling it out on a larger scale across the province. It would also be an easy resettlement, since all Dildo has to do to get to Broad Cove is sail down Spread Eagle Bay. Since both towns are so close already, there will be very little mess to mop up afterwards. And if it goes well, it might lay the foundation of a future population growth strategy. But most importantly, moving Dildo into Broad Cove will be a powerful symbol of the sort of things the government expects from people in these hard times.

# ? Jan 15, 2016 02:55

de_dust: Jan 21, 2009; she had tiny Italian boobs.
Well that's my story.

El Scotch posted:

It's horrendous that the loving wombles that have been running Alberta allowed the Heritage fund to wither and starve over the decades.

When you look at Norway, it's an outrage that there aren't tens of billions in there, let alone the 700-whatever billion the Norwegians have.

It really should be a law that X amount needs to go into the heritage fund no matter how many morons yell about wanting it all right now.

In a province that really only produces beef and oil it's an absolute necessity for I dunno... something called LONG TERM PLANNING.

# ? Jan 15, 2016 02:59

Helsing: Aug 23, 2003; DON'T POST IN THE ELECTION THREAD UNLESS YOU JOE BIDEN

jm20 posted:

Are you sure you read adult novels? This screams of being a facebook comment scholar.

That was supposed to be an obvious self parody (not to say I don't stand by everything I wrote up that point) but apparently my regular posts are already so shrill that this wasn't clear to you or Dreyland or probably anyone else. :eng99:

Rime posted:

There's an appreciable difference between people who are smart, but follow a boring career in order to survive, and people who are just plain idiots.

The difference being that the former will do things in their own time to broaden their horizons, lacking any profit motive, they'll study history or philosophy or take up a novel hobby. The latter go to work, watch netflix, pump out a kid annually and get high. This is fine, because it's the latter group which lives paycheque to paycheque and keeps our economy functioning through rampant consumerism. Our civilization relies on a healthy base of people too dumb to realize there is anything better to strive for in life.

You can't fix this poo poo short of some horrific gattaca-esque debacle (yes, I'm aware of the irony of this comparison given the plot), it's human nature, it has been since we swung out of the trees.

Well, first of all I don't think people are anywhere near as dumb or lacking in ambition as you're suggesting. I think humans, by reflex, find ways to inject meaning and significance into the cultural objects they consume. My concern isn't so much that people are irredeemably dumb, it's more that I think our culture has gone a bit too far toward celebrating pure escapism.

I'd add that, insofar as people are as dumb as you're suggesting, that's a byproduct of their environment, not their genetics. I think this is pretty easy to see by simply looking at the huge variations produced across time and space by different cultures or education systems. Certainly genetics places certain limits on our intellects, and no doubt some people are inherently better at problem solving or pattern recognition or memory than others, but this whole "everyone is just a total moron and we can never fix it, it's our nature" schtick really just comes off as a lazy way to of pretending you're some kind of super genius. I mean, sure, you're not saying you're a genius, you're just saying everyone else is really stupid, but I think just about everyone understands what you're not so subtly implying.

I've lived a funny life, in that I have friends and family who run the gamut form the 1% down to the semi-homeless, and if there's one thing you notice when moving between these different crowds then it's the fact that while, on the one hand, intelligence and wealth are absolutely not correlated in any way, you nevertheless definitely can tell when someone has gone through an elite education. Upbringing and environment matter a great deal in shaping the person you become. Trying to pretend its all a genetic lottery is silly.

Dreylad posted:

Well I think the "decentralized imperatives of the Almighty Dollar" fits the After Ford era more than it does the rule of Big Brother. I only posted that example not to dismiss your concerns, but only point out that these aren't new concerns, and this moral debate plays out constantly in modern societies. Japan has been grappling with the same issues for a while, for example.

I'm glad to see more takedowns of YA fiction, although I think that's more because I don't particularly like it. I have to remind myself that there's plenty of adult fiction crap, from mysteries to a glut of terrible fiction. Adult colouring books don't really factor, I think, because they're more about meditation/presentism/whatever new age philosophy people pursue.

I take it you've seen (or maybe not!) Ken Robinson's take on school and education, because you're following a critique very similar to his. If not, here's an animated version of his lecture because we're all literal children who need moving pictures to understand things.

The problem is, I think, that no matter how much we try to reform schooling, the underlying structure of grades and classic disciplinary divisions prevent any real shift in how children think about learning and education. Those underpinning structures were created for factory work, and have never been addressed. Education is also fairly resistant to reform, I think, as there's a significant conservative element that challenges any kind of reform, and reform itself can be driven by corporate interest. See the brouhaha over Common Core in the USA.

I don't have much to say except that I broadly agree with you and that I will have to check out the video you linked. Thanks for the thoughtful reply.

I will say, regarding some Young Adult lit, that much of it seems much better than the young adult literature of previous generations. There's arguably a lot more moral complexity and nuance in The Hunger Games (based on the summaries of it I've heard) than the stodgy Anglican moralism of C.S. Lewis. I think in many ways the books children read these days are much better than they ever have been: the problem is the adults who keep reading these books and don't seem inclined to branch out.

# ? Jan 15, 2016 03:29

Kafka Esq.: Jan 1, 2005; "If you ever even think about calling me anything but 'The Crab' I will go so fucking crab on your ass you won't even see what crab'd your crab" -The Crab(TM)

Newfie posted:

What do you do when you have the worst deficit and your province is back to pre-oil boom levels of total debt? Ask the internet of course!

gently caress Newfoundland.

# ? Jan 15, 2016 03:34

cowofwar: Jul 30, 2002; by Athanatos

Rime posted:

There's an appreciable difference between people who are smart, but follow a boring career in order to survive, and people who are just plain idiots.

The difference being that the former will do things in their own time to broaden their horizons, lacking any profit motive, they'll study history or philosophy or take up a novel hobby. The latter go to work, watch netflix, pump out a kid annually and get high. This is fine, because it's the latter group which lives paycheque to paycheque and keeps our economy functioning through rampant consumerism. Our civilization relies on a healthy base of people too dumb to realize there is anything better to strive for in life.

You can't fix this poo poo short of some horrific gattaca-esque debacle (yes, I'm aware of the irony of this comparison given the plot), it's human nature, it has been since we swung out of the trees.

The people you are describing act that way because they are stuck in a poverty trap. They cannot self actualize because their fundamental needs were or are not met and therefore their behavior has been shaped as a result in to what you describe.

# ? Jan 15, 2016 03:42

cowofwar: Jul 30, 2002; by Athanatos

Newfie posted:

What do you do when you have the worst deficit and your province is back to pre-oil boom levels of total debt? Ask the internet of course!

So uh everyone realizes this is just a word play joke comment right? Bring people from Dildo down Spread Eagle in to Broad Cove?

# ? Jan 15, 2016 03:43

Stretch Marx: Apr 29, 2008; I'm ok with this.

cowofwar posted:

So uh everyone realizes this is just a word play joke comment right? Bring people from Dildo down Spread Eagle in to Broad Cove?

Kafka Esq. posted:

gently caress Newfoundland.

# ? Jan 15, 2016 03:50

namaste friends: Sep 18, 2004; by Smythe

Kafka Esq. posted:

gently caress Newfoundland.

Empty quotin dis

# ? Jan 15, 2016 04:00

CLAM DOWN: Feb 13, 2007

Is any province actually good

# ? Jan 15, 2016 04:15

Dreylad: Jun 19, 2001

is Montreal a province

# ? Jan 15, 2016 04:19

vyelkin: Jan 2, 2011

CLAM DOWN posted:

Is any province actually good

Well let's see.

BC: Vancouver, Christy Clark, hippies, retirees, rednecks
Alberta: truck equity, oil, oil, oil, the Canadian Tea Party kudatah
Saskatchewan: oil, potash, Brad Wall
Manitoba: the most racist place in the country, about to elect an insane homophobic religious zealot
Ontario: http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3748577&userid=113727
Quebec: xenophobic, also the Quebec Liberals
New Brunswick: no economic opportunities except for Stretch Marx's cool indoor farm thing, also old and racist
PEI: responsible for giving us Mike Duffy, thought golf courses were a sustainable industry to subsidize
Nova Scotia: no economic opportunities, also old and racist
Newfoundland: oil, no other economic opportunities, also old and racist

I hear the Yukon is nice.

# ? Jan 15, 2016 04:26

de_dust: Jan 21, 2009; she had tiny Italian boobs.
Well that's my story.

Dreylad posted:

is Montreal a province

It's barely even a city.

Yukon is a relaxing place. Canada's Alaska.

# ? Jan 15, 2016 04:32

namaste friends: Sep 18, 2004; by Smythe

Montreal should become a city state like Singapore.

# ? Jan 15, 2016 04:37

namaste friends: Sep 18, 2004; by Smythe

de_dust posted:

It's barely even a city.

Yukon is a relaxing place. Canada's Alaska.

Lol yeah you must be naturally repellent to flies

So tranquil and pastoral u guys

# ? Jan 15, 2016 04:38

Petanque: Apr 14, 2008; Ca va bien aller

Cultural Imperial posted:

Montreal should become a city state like Singapore.

I'm on board

# ? Jan 15, 2016 05:45

PT6A: Jan 5, 2006; Public school teachers are callous dictators who won't lift a finger to stop children from peeing in my plane

If my local closet-case Bishop Fred Henry didn't make you lose your lunch, have some more evidence of why religion should go get hosed:

http://www.cbc.ca/beta/news/world/anglican-communion-same-sex-1.3404736

Seriously, how can you defend this nonsense? Our progressive churches, which always get used as a counter example to my thesis that religion is poisonous, are now basically being pushed around by a bunch of backward assholes. Remind me again why this is a thing we shouldn't treat with utmost contempt...

# ? Jan 15, 2016 05:54

Edgar Quintero: Oct 5, 2004; POTENTIALLY DANGEROUS
DO NOT GIVE HEROIN

THC posted:

They have a readership?

"Canadian Journalism is dying" seems to be a theme this week.

I just finished listening to this episode of Canadaland. While speaking of the Post Media cuts the interview seemed to take on a strange tone. In this and a few other pieces on the decline of Canadian journalism there's a very grim yet sincere sense that they are saying goodbye to each other. Having grown up being taught that news papers were important societal institutions, it is surreal to hear the host and the Post Media woman basically saying: "if you have the intellect and the skill, why would you go into journalism in this country?"

http://m.therecord.com/news-story/6230120-postmedia-to-accelerate-and-hike-cost-cuts

quote:

The head of Canada's largest newspaper empire says the company is accelerating its intentions to cut costs as it continues to bleed advertising, print circulation and digital media revenue.

"There's no doubt our industry continues to face significant pressures from the shifting competitive landscape and the changing behaviour and appetite of audiences," said Paul Godfrey, chief executive of Postmedia Network Canada Corp. (TSX:PNC.B), in an investor call Wednesday. Godfrey said the company, which owns the National Post, the Toronto Sun and other major Canadian newspapers, is now aiming for cost reductions of $80 million by mid-2017 � up from its previous goal of $50 million in cuts by the end of 2017.

That having been said, gently caress The Sun and The National Post and Postmedia in general. Still, tons of skilled journalists are apparently obsolete. It just makes me wary of a future where all of our news is from lovely bloggers.

Edgar Quintero fucked around with this message at 06:22 on Jan 15, 2016

# ? Jan 15, 2016 06:14

Risky Bisquick: Jan 18, 2008; PLEASE LET ME WRITE YOUR VICTIM IMPACT STATEMENT SO I CAN FURTHER DEMONSTRATE THE CALAMITY THAT IS OUR JUSTICE SYSTEM.; Buglord

What % are the proposed cost reductions at post media in terms of their operating costs?

# ? Jan 15, 2016 06:21

Stretch Marx: Apr 29, 2008; I'm ok with this.

Communocracy posted:

That having been said, gently caress The Sun and The National Post and Postmedia in general. Still, tons of skilled journalists are apparently obsolete. It just makes me wary of a future where all of our news is from lovely bloggers.

In a world where information can be passed very cheaply and easily that was basically always going to be the end result. The only real way to counter it is to help people like Helsing get popular to help counter assholes. Culture is a fluid thing. Instead of fighting it accept the changes and figure out how to make them work.

# ? Jan 15, 2016 06:48

namaste friends: Sep 18, 2004; by Smythe

I'm genuinely shocked you loving people give a poo poo about Canadian journalism. Note that Luke kawa works for Bloomberg there is absolutely no need to read any Canadian papers and lol if you actually watch the CBC

# ? Jan 15, 2016 07:06

CLAM DOWN: Feb 13, 2007

but CI, where else can I read about assfish

http://www.cbc.ca/beta/news/canada/british-columbia/assfish-royal-bc-museum-display-1.3404806

# ? Jan 15, 2016 07:08

Whiskey Sours: Jan 25, 2014; Weather proof.

PT6A posted:

Remind me again why this is a thing we shouldn't treat with utmost contempt...

It's not.

# ? Jan 15, 2016 07:14

Helsing: Aug 23, 2003; DON'T POST IN THE ELECTION THREAD UNLESS YOU JOE BIDEN

CanPol I know we don`t always agree on everything, but I feel like the following story has something for everyone.

quote:

'Freedom and liberty' not enough to save Galt's Gulch Chile libertarian community from bureaucracy and internal dissent

Brian Hutchinson | September 26, 2014 | Last Updated: Jan 24 7:14 PM ET
More from Brian Hutchinson | @hutchwriter

Jeff Berwick values �freedom and liberty� and that, he says, makes him an anarchist libertarian. He wears the label proudly. So do his devoted followers, men and women who share his profound distrust of government. �Anyone who wants to see a very free world does not want government,� says the 43-year-old Edmonton native. �I also don�t like being extorted or being aggressed against by others.�

He doesn�t much care for Canada, either. �There aren�t many countries in the world less free,� declares the libertarian guru. North Korea, Cuba, Belarus, the U.S.: That�s about it. Aggressive statism was a big reason he quit Canada in 2003. After losing a fortune in the 2000-01 technologies stock crash, Mr. Berwick sold the Vancouver-based Internet-based financial news service he had founded, embraced �anarcho-capitalism� and then left.

A few years ago he landed in Chile, where, an hour�s drive west of Santiago, he was shown a kind of paradise, an agricultural setting in which a community free of convention and state interference would be built. Or so he thought, and promoted as such.

Mr. Berwick and two partners called their community Galt�s Gulch Chile (GGC), a nod to that freedom-seeking character and enclave depicted in Atlas Shrugged, the classic libertarian novel by Ayn Rand. The partnership secured land, sketched out designs, subdivisions and property lots, and then sold the heck out of it to freedom-starved folk up north. Some forked over tens of thousands of dollars for a slice a freedom they would never see.

What was supposed to be an unfettered freedom place became a real estate debacle, and, in the words of one observer, �another dumb gringo story.� GGC is now tied up in knots, thanks to internecine bickering and a bungled approach to Chilean laws and local requirements, including zoning permits, water rights and property title. The founding partnership has fractured, with each party threatening to run to the courts � the dreaded state apparatus � for redress.

The ironies aren�t lost on anyone: Bureaucracies and internal dissent reduced a libertarian idyll to pixie dust. Allegations of fraud, rumours of skulduggery started swirling last month. This week, investors told the National Post they�ve been left in the dark. And they want their money back.

�It�s my fault,� says Mr. Berwick.

�We hoped to attract those trying to defect from more unfree countries like the U.S. and Canada to live in a place amongst like-minded people who believe in freedom,� he explained during an interview conducted this week via email.

He used libertarian connections and an investment-related website he edits, The Dollar Vigilante, to promote the Chilean project. In May 2013, he pitched GGC to his readers. Mr. Berwick gave a breathless account of his first visit to a property halfway between Santiago and the Pacific Ocean.

�We were in the the middle of what appeared to be a virtually untouched valley completely enveloped by pristine mountains, rugged terrain, rolling hills and endless vistas. My god, this IS Galt�s Gulch,� he wrote.

He also announced a �special pre-sale� of lots ranging from 1.25 to five acres, with �incredibly hard-to-believe� prices: US$48,500 to $145,000. More remarkable were the �prime estate-sized lots� ranging from 15 to 25 acres, available for $400,000. Purchasers of these larger lots would become �Founder�s Club� members and best of all, they would �recoup from GGC their full purchase price within three years. � Yes, you read that right,� Mr. Berwick gushed.

The $400,000 payments would be considered loans to GGC, to be repaid from revenues from other sources, such as an adjacent 125-acre organic lemon and avocado farm that GGC had apparently acquired.

Wendy McElroy is a Canadian writer and �individualist anarchist and feminist� who lives with her husband on a farm near Owen Sound, Ont. She met Mr. Berwick at a conference in 2012, and he introduced her to the GGC concept.

After conducting �a great deal of research,� Ms. McElroy and her husband purchased an option to acquire a 1.25-acre lot at Galt�s Gulch. She won�t disclose the price. In April, she travelled to GGC for a �celebration� event, and she even gave a speech. Within hours, she says, she and her husband decided to ask for a refund. She claims that zoning applications for GGC had not been filed with local authorities.

�Needless to say, no refund ensued,� she says. Late last month, she went public, publishing on a libertarian news website a devastating account of GGC.

She does not blame the debacle on Mr. Berwick, who, for his part, points an accusing finger at a former partner, Ken Johnson, a California real estate agent. Reached at the GGC property in Chile, Mr. Johnson blames Mr. Berwick. He says things could still work out and GGC may yet be built, but adds that anyone who wants a refund will eventually get their money back.

For his part, Mr. Berwick now acknowledges he had concerns about the GGC venture and his partnership, even before his aggressive sales promotion began. There were questions about water rights, zoning and land-use restrictions on the more than 6,000 acres of land GGC claimed to have acquired.

�I decided that since I was already roped into this by association I had two choices,� he wrote last month in The Dollar Vigilante, once Ms. McElroy�s account was published. �To stop promoting GGC and go public with the reasons why I was uncomfortable or to continue to promote it and hope it works. I chose the latter and very quickly money began flooding into the project��

It has not worked out. Mr. Berwick told the National Post this week that he has no role anymore at GGC, and has �no idea what the status is. I have been on the outside looking in for about a year now.�

He�s looking forward to other opportunities, such as Anarchapulco, an international libertarian event he plans to host next February in Acapulco. Just don�t expect to find him back in Canada. �I try to spend as little time there as possible,� he says.

# ? Jan 15, 2016 07:57

Kafka Esq.: Jan 1, 2005; "If you ever even think about calling me anything but 'The Crab' I will go so fucking crab on your ass you won't even see what crab'd your crab" -The Crab(TM)

cowofwar posted:

So uh everyone realizes this is just a word play joke comment right? Bring people from Dildo down Spread Eagle in to Broad Cove?

# ? Jan 15, 2016 15:10

flakeloaf: Feb 26, 2003; Still better than android clock

Helsing posted:

CanPol I know we don`t always agree on everything, but I feel like the following story has something for everyone.

"Another dumb gringo story"... that's perfect. The only thing it's missing is bitcoins.

# ? Jan 15, 2016 15:20

Postess with the Mostest: Apr 4, 2007; Arabian nights
'neath Arabian moons
A fool off his guard
could fall and fall hard
out there on the dunes

flakeloaf posted:

"Another dumb gringo story"... that's perfect. The only thing it's missing is bitcoins.

More not mentioned than missing.

quote:

But as a wanderer in the frontier of the enlarging bitcoin community, it didn't feel particularly outlandish. If Berwick's company, Bitcoin ATM, doesn't succeed at making its pseudonymous device, someone likely will soon. Bitcoin is getting more real by the second. In March alone, we saw its value triple, and its market capitalization pass $1 billion.

While the Bitcoin ATM concept gathered a lot of attention, some rightly scrutinized Berwick's claims. Sure, Berwick hailing bitcoin as potentially a "multi-billion-dollar business" is perhaps speaking a bit hastily. While Business Insider seems a little more satisfied after Berwick responded to some of their skepticism, plenty of questions surrounding the ATM project remain unanswered�including those regarding regulations and licensing, government cooperation, functionality, exchange rates, social demand, fees, etc.

# ? Jan 15, 2016 15:27

flakeloaf: Feb 26, 2003; Still better than android clock

Ikantski posted:

More not mentioned than missing.

I was totally kidding, I had no idea he was actually into that too.

# ? Jan 15, 2016 15:35

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# ? May 22, 2024 06:23

Fried Watermelon: Dec 29, 2008

The issue with YA novels is that they all push a similar message. Take Hunger Games for example. It highlights a dystopian society with a controlling government, with the one true hero being used as a pawn throughout.

This gets children used to the idea that the government is not to be trusted and that they will be used as a pawn in their lives. They will expect the government to be corrupt, they will expect to be watched. They will see this as the status quo. They will see how one individual cannot change the system. These types of YA novels normalize controlling governments so younger children will say "at least our government isn't as bad as the Hunger Games one!". There is no subtext other than "You will be used by both sides", "you have no control".

In 1984 and Brave New World, the protagonists were shown not as heroes but normal for their society but with critical minds. Individually they failed by either death or embracing the new order. In my mind these novels were used as warnings to what possibly could come.

It's possible I am misreading and misunderstanding the idea behind Hunger Games, but that is what I took away. Even how the movies are portrayed, it's a story about Katniss, the hero and how she is being used throughout. It even seems like the advertising is more focused on Jennifer Lawrence than the actual theme of the book.

Looking back into my High School education I'm glad I was forced to read books like 1984, Lord of the Flies, Animal Farm, To Kill a Mocking Bird, etc. Speaking with my GF, who is a teacher, she herself has not read many of these books, and they don't mention them in many of her classes.

The reality that these books are STILL controversial and being subject to bans is horrific.

# ? Jan 15, 2016 15:41

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > CanPol Megathread: Big Changus

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