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All of this has me giddy for getting the fix for X-wings that we haven't actually gotten yet.  When Adaptability and Guidance Ships drop, I'm thinking of dropping VI from Luke and Wes, replacing it with Adaptability, and using the spare two points to take the Flechette of Wes and add a Proton to Wedge with Guidance Chip. I might miss the extra point of health it gives me, but the idea of a Proton Torpedo alpha strike with Wedge/Predator/Chips after Wes has stripped tokens is a beautiful thing. That has a better than even chance of blowing a TIE FIghter/Interceptor/Z-95/Syck out of the sky in one shot, regardless of pilot (without Stealth Device, then it's just a good chance and not a better than even). It has a non-zero chance of turning a HWK-290 or K-fighter into a puff of incandescent gas, too.
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Jan 18, 2016 19:35
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So is this worth a shot? I'm new to the game and a friend is starting up with me. He's looking at a Han/Poe list to start out and I want to try out a three Ace imperial list that's not too tricky to play: "Omega Leader" (21) Juke (2) Comm Relay (3) Twin Ion Engine Mk. II (1) Soontir Fel (27) Push the Limit (3) Autothrusters (2) Stealth Device (3) Royal Guard TIE (0) Darth Vader (29) Veteran Instincts (1) Homing Missiles (5) Advanced Targeting Computer (1) Twin Ion Engine Mk. II (1) TIE/x1 (0) Total: 99 View in Yet Another Squad Builder
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Jan 18, 2016 19:39
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pbpancho posted:Couple repaints, done in between Imperial Assault minis Sick. Sick. Sick. Kai Tave posted:In March there's going to be a tournament down in Vancouver and I'm gonna try to carpool down there with my other two regulars both of whom have expressed an interest in competing at and watching a tournament respectively. Vancity, BC? Where at? I'm far from a tournament player but the prospect of leaving Vancouver Island and going over to the mainland for a tourny is really appealing. Strobe posted:When Adaptability and Guidance FTFY AndyElusive fucked around with this message at 19:51 on Jan 18, 2016 |
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Jan 18, 2016 19:49
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TKIY posted:So is this worth a shot? I'm new to the game and a friend is starting up with me. He's looking at a Han/Poe list to start out and I want to try out a three Ace imperial list that's not too tricky to play:
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Jan 18, 2016 19:50
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I think people are overestimating the usefulness of chips in alpha strike builds personally. Having enough ships to get off 3 Missiles or torpedoes means you're bringing generic, low PS ships. Which means you're going to have a very hard target locking anything at all while keeping it out at range 2. Cluster missiles will be a bit better, but suffer from needing to modify two sets out rolls which chips can't do. If you face another swarm, I think they'll do quite well, but otherwise I think Strobe has the right idea for them: fit on an ace to up their first strike potential, where possible. Trick is finding an ace that doesn't need the mod slot for something else.
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Jan 18, 2016 19:54
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The Gate posted:I think people are overestimating the usefulness of chips in alpha strike builds personally. Having enough ships to get off 3 Missiles or torpedoes means you're bringing generic, low PS ships. Which means you're going to have a very hard target locking anything at all while keeping it out at range 2. Cluster missiles will be a bit better, but suffer from needing to modify two sets out rolls which chips can't do. You can fit three Red Squad Vets with Predator and Proton Torpedoes into 99 points. You can fit 4 Rookie Pilots with Torps for 100. There are ways to put out stupid amounts of torpedoes with good modifiers. You can afford to lose one or two and still melt an ace. The RSVs in particular are really good at this because Tallon Rolls are loving awesome and let you stay within range 2-3 after a turnaround on the joust.
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Jan 18, 2016 19:56
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Strobe posted:All of this has me giddy for getting the fix for X-wings that we haven't actually gotten yet. Adaptability is letting me squeeze the TLT into my XXY list while keeping Poe at PS9. Shout-out to my Scum ships that I buy solely for a pair of upgrade cards, ayo StarViper/Mist Hunter. TKIY posted:So is this worth a shot? I'm new to the game and a friend is starting up with me. He's looking at a Han/Poe list to start out and I want to try out a three Ace imperial list that's not too tricky to play Han is cool. Title/Predator/Gunner/3PO/Engine Upgrade and he's done. Fun times. Roll a lot of dice. Poe fits in his regen build neatly. I think you to go 99 points with VI, 98 with Adaptability (unreleased). MEANWHILE, THE EMPIRE... Twin Ion Engine is a wasted point on Omega Leader, imo. It's better to keep it for an initiative bid than it is to make his speed-2 banks green, since speed-1 banks are already green and he has no other banks. A two-point initiative bid with two PS9s and a PS8 feels aggressive but decent. Also! To get to that 2-point initiative bid, we're dropping the Homing Missiles, Twin Ion Engine, and Veteran Instincts from Darth Vader and giving him Predator and Engine Upgrade. Or you could keep him with VI for the PS11 to trump Poe Dameron and that clears up enough points to get Omega Leader a Stealth Device (99 points total) or an Engine Upgrade (100 points total). I vote for Stealth Device. Your call.
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Jan 18, 2016 19:58
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I want chimps to put them on crackshot Ndru and just one-shot ties erryday.
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Jan 18, 2016 19:59
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Sure, but they've got a hard time getting a target lock to fire the torpedoes in the first place, is what I'm saying. They have to move before any ace, which prevents getting a lock entirely, or gives the ace a chance to rush into close or turn aside and run. Granted range 1 from 3 RSVs isn't a great place to be. I was considering a gimmick 4 AC Advanced build with chimps and concussion missiles, but the issue of actually getting the lock to fire with is holding me back.
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Jan 18, 2016 20:02
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hoiyes posted:I want chimps to put them on crackshot Ndru and just one-shot ties erryday.
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Jan 18, 2016 20:03
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I actually think that Long-Range Scanners is gonna be pretty sweet, but then, my plan with LRS is to do an early lock-on and then SLAM around the map until I can obliterate you with super-munitions. (aka a bad plan)
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Jan 18, 2016 20:05
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hoiyes posted:I want chimps to put them on crackshot Ndru and just one-shot ties erryday. I'm thinking more glitterstim Lone Wolf N'Dru with Clusters and Chimps. Then he has a little more survivability and might last past the first round. Still reasonably cheap, too. One of my scum list options at the moment is Dengar with that N'Dru and another z blocker. I think it might work well. guts and bolts posted:I actually think that Long-Range Scanners is gonna be pretty sweet, but then, my plan with LRS is to do an early lock-on and then SLAM around the map until I can obliterate you with super-munitions. (aka a bad plan) LRS is difficult - it was going to be good, until Chimps came out and just utterly eclipsed it for basically all the ships that might have used it (and more besides) and now, unless something major changes between now and Imp Vets, it's just going to be obsolete on release which sucks. Getting the lock before engaging is nice, but being able to regain it when in close is much more long-term useful (particularly with FCS involved), and Chips actually give you a very strong dice mod to boot. The only thing I'm possibly considering with it is throwing it on Deathrain and making a Vessery/Crackshot/TIED/Tractor Beam version of my current list using Deathrain instead of Redline. Deathrain is nowhere near as terrifying with missiles and torps, but as a spotter for Vessery he'd then be excellent, and still no slouch with a Cluster Missile in close. And he'd throw bombs around like hallowe'en candy, and not needing FCS frees him to take Advanced Sensors and overlay Proximity Mines and Conner Nets on top of one another for Vessery to throw people at.  The real trouble with LRS is that it's really not tough to stay within range 2 of something like Redline, at which point lol, sure, you got one lock on me, but you can never get another, so if I weather your first Cluster Missile, or have Expert Handling, you're hosed for good.
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Jan 18, 2016 20:12
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thespaceinvader posted:Homing Missiles are not worth the points; you want an Engine Upgrade on Vader, fortunately there are two in the Falcon. If you have points spare after all this (and the TIE Mk2 isn't really needed on OL either) then Proton Rockets on Vader are what you want, not Homing Missiles. Putting Predator (or indeed Juke) on Vader is also solid, you can get some very reliable damage out of him. Your Fel is fine. Okay that makes sense. guts and bolts posted:Twin Ion Engine is a wasted point on Omega Leader, imo. It's better to keep it for an initiative bid than it is to make his speed-2 banks green, since speed-1 banks are already green and he has no other banks. A two-point initiative bid with two PS9s and a PS8 feels aggressive but decent. Also! To get to that 2-point initiative bid, we're dropping the Homing Missiles, Twin Ion Engine, and Veteran Instincts from Darth Vader and giving him Predator and Engine Upgrade. Or you could keep him with VI for the PS11 to trump Poe Dameron and that clears up enough points to get Omega Leader a Stealth Device (99 points total) or an Engine Upgrade (100 points total). I vote for Stealth Device. Your call. I missed that, I thought the TIE/fo had 3-banks on the dial. Makes sense on the other points too. List building is very different in Wangs from what I'm used to, and I'm still wrapping my head around economy of action stuff. So let's try this then: "Omega Leader" (21) Juke (2) Comm Relay (3) Soontir Fel (27) Push the Limit (3) Autothrusters (2) Stealth Device (3) Royal Guard TIE (0) Darth Vader (29) Predator (3) Advanced Targeting Computer (1) Engine Upgrade (4) TIE/x1 (0) Total: 98 View in Yet Another Squad Builder
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Jan 18, 2016 20:13
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thespaceinvader posted:LRS is difficult - it was going to be good, until Chimps came out and just utterly eclipsed it for basically all the ships that might have used it (and more besides) and now, unless something major changes between now and Imp Vets, it's just going to be obsolete on release which sucks. Getting the lock before engaging is nice, but being able to regain it when in close is much more long-term useful (particularly with FCS involved), and Chips actually give you a very strong dice mod to boot. The hypothetical gimmick here is that you throw 6 red dice at a man and then SLAM away forever again, acquiring target locks when you're range 4+ away and then spamming SLAM maneuvers until you can shoot your Advanced Proton Torpedoes again. I don't think it's good.
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Jan 18, 2016 20:15
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LRS on Omega Leader to save action economy for focus? Sure he can't reacquire in a knife fight but you never spend it anyway?
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Jan 18, 2016 20:16
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The Gate posted:Sure, but they've got a hard time getting a target lock to fire the torpedoes in the first place, is what I'm saying. They have to move before any ace, which prevents getting a lock entirely, or gives the ace a chance to rush into close or turn aside and run. Granted range 1 from 3 RSVs isn't a great place to be. Yes that's generally the point. You don't fire the torpedoes on the opening salvo unless your opponent grossly miscalculates and ends up at the edge of range 2. If they do, it's a dead ace. The torpedoes are for use the turn after, when the versatility from a tallon roll or k turn means that it's goddamn near impossible to block you, and also similarly very difficult to get out of range 3 or stay in range 1 if they don't want you to.
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Jan 18, 2016 20:16
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Otisburg posted:LRS on Omega Leader to save action economy for focus? Sure he can't reacquire in a knife fight but you never spend it anyway? LRS requires torpedo and missile slots. Omega Leader has exactly zero of either.
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Jan 18, 2016 20:17
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Strobe posted:LRS requires torpedo and missile slots. Omega Leader has exactly zero of either. Oh right. Yeah seems chimps better serve anyone who could take it.
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Jan 18, 2016 20:18
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LRS kinda works on Bombers since they have a 5-k to get a huge disengage range but chimps is still way better on them.TKIY posted:I missed that, I thought the TIE/fo had 3-banks on the dial. Makes sense on the other points too. List building is very different in Wangs from what I'm used to, and I'm still wrapping my head around economy of action stuff. The TIE/fo does have 3-banks as well as green 2-banks. No 1-banks. I think that guy might have mistaken him for the TIE Advanced, but those also have 3-banks so I dunno. Every TIE in the game has 3-banks, actually. TIE Mk. II is still unnecessary on Omega Leader, though.
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Jan 18, 2016 20:22
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Or you could waste, say, forty-two (!!) points on a K-Wing with Miranda that runs Advanced Proton Torpedoes, Assault Missiles, and Extra Munitions with LRS. Her primary doesn't qualify her for the crit bonus on Chimps anyway. Acquire lock-ons, SLAM around like a jerk, shoot Assault Missiles at swarms (or anyone) and Advanced Proton Torpedoes at aces (or anyone). Maybe I just think it's funny to have a K-Wing going Fast and Furious until it's time to insta-kill a ship, then going home and having a cookout at Dom's place.
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Jan 18, 2016 20:23
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Ojetor posted:The TIE/fo does have 3-banks as well as green 2-banks. No 1-banks. I spaced out. You still only change one set of banks (3 this time instead of 1) to green, which is my general point of Why You Don't Really Need Twin Ion Engine On Omega Leader.
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Jan 18, 2016 20:25
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thespaceinvader posted:I'm thinking more glitterstim Lone Wolf N'Dru with Clusters and Chimps. Then he has a little more survivability and might last past the first round. Still reasonably cheap, too. I've been play testing this version, and with some mediocre dice it's quite possible to only get a couple of 3 hit attacks. It's also easier for an opponent to stay at range three and do a couple of damage and then dart into range one and blow Ndru away. The final nail in the coffin for this build for me was that getting the positioning for his bonus, in many cases meant doing sub optimal moves with my other ships, that wouldn't have been a problem if he fired at range 3. I'm definitely thinking homing and crackshot is better for the purposes. It also depends on what ships you're bringing. Homing crack is better paired with a z swarm for smashing the poe/soontirs that are tough for 2 dicers, while the cluster missiles might be better for others.
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Jan 18, 2016 20:31
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Ojetor posted:LRS kinda works on Bombers since they have a 5-k to get a huge disengage range but chimps is still way better on them. Eh, it sucks with a 5k to disengage, because you won't be able to get a lock because you're stressed, and then the target will have closed with you again so you can't get it again. Missing out on the crit bonus really isn't an issue IME so far. Reliably getting every die you throw to hit is much more useful (albeit, that's with Redline).
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Jan 18, 2016 20:32
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thespaceinvader posted:Eh, it sucks with a 5k to disengage, because you won't be able to get a lock because you're stressed, and then the target will have closed with you again so you can't get it again. We do get this really cool 5 skill Bomber pilot in Imperial Vets. Slap on Adrenaline Rush for the Merge.
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Jan 18, 2016 20:34
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thespaceinvader posted:Eh, it sucks with a 5k to disengage, because you won't be able to get a lock because you're stressed, and then the target will have closed with you again so you can't get it again. Which is why I said "kinda". Comedy option: Use Toman Bren with Adrenaline Rush to turn all your 5k's white.
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Jan 18, 2016 20:35
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Strobe posted:We do get this really cool 5 skill Bomber pilot in Imperial Vets. Slap on Adrenaline Rush for the Merge. Yeah, Tomax might conceivably be able to use it if he wasn't using Crack Shot every round like a sensible person.
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Jan 18, 2016 22:05
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AndyElusive posted:Sick. Sick. Sick. Vancouver WA I'm afraid. I live in the sticks, and the Wang scene is decidedly lacking.
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Jan 18, 2016 22:36
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bunnyofdoom posted:So tonight, in my quest to make a valuable graz list, I am gonna run this tonight at my FLGS Giving Graz a Tractor Beam in that list won't do you much good, both of the other ships are higher PS than him and won't benefit from it. Being able to move the other ship will have uses certainly but you're not going to get much damage out of it. Even if you put VI on Graz that will only benefit Kavil if you remove his VI, assuming you hit. Tractor Beams are going to be better used with ships lower PS than the shooter, or TIE Defenders who can use it combined with their primary. EDIT: ↓↓↓↓  I guess if maybe you mean that putting a tractor beam token on a ship that is going to be attacked by Graz would be good, then yeah I guess but that's not really something specific to Graz. Admiral Joeslop fucked around with this message at 23:05 on Jan 18, 2016 |
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Jan 18, 2016 22:43
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Not to mention that Graz doesn't have a cannon slot to equip a tractor beam so
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Jan 18, 2016 23:00
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I meant the tractor beam from a high ps pilot could pull someone into Graz's arc.
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Jan 18, 2016 23:34
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Much more helpful to Talonbane. But you need to get the PSes right.
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Jan 18, 2016 23:40
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Can I be the dumb noob who needs to ask what Chimps are
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Jan 19, 2016 00:17
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Waffles Inc. posted:Can I be the dumb noob who needs to ask what Chimps are A hilarious typo. 
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Jan 19, 2016 00:22
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Waffles Inc. posted:Can I be the dumb noob who needs to ask what Chimps are Guidance Chips, Guidance....Chimps. 
kingcom fucked around with this message at 00:34 on Jan 19, 2016 |
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Jan 19, 2016 00:32
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Guidance...cimps?
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Jan 19, 2016 00:38
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Guidance Cripes
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Jan 19, 2016 00:39
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Helper Monkeys.
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Jan 19, 2016 00:41
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thespaceinvader posted:Much more helpful to Talonbane. But you need to get the PSes right. Remember Graz's ability is he gets an extra green dice if his attacker is in his arc.
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Jan 19, 2016 00:47
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bunnyofdoom posted:Remember Graz's ability is he gets an extra green dice if his attacker is in his arc. Talonbane gets an extra die in defence at range 3 and an extra die of attack at range 1. It's going to be about 50:50 on which is easier to arrange, but Talonbane you can also help in the offence if you're somehow shooting your t-beam before he shoots.
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Jan 19, 2016 00:56
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plester1 posted:A hilarious typo. ah word, thanks
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Jan 19, 2016 01:33
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