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Kraftwerk
Aug 13, 2011
i do not have 10,000 bircoins, please stop asking

Alright I've confirmed that I'm being set up to fail in this market. I'm getting no support or training and my location is severely short staffed so any orders I close are not being processed in time and I'm losin my accounts.

I'm gonna divert my cold calls to sales directors for major companies in the area and see if I can get a new job. The product is now me.

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lazercunt
Oct 26, 2007

It was a narcotics raid, not a Fritos raid.

Kraftwerk posted:

Alright I've confirmed that I'm being set up to fail in this market. I'm getting no support or training and my location is severely short staffed so any orders I close are not being processed in time and I'm losin my accounts.

I'm gonna divert my cold calls to sales directors for major companies in the area and see if I can get a new job. The product is now me.

Be sure to gut the territory first and quote everyone right at your list price instead of whatever your normal markup is for your book of business.

yospos cru: Wit_sponge, relative_q, roguestar, Model M, Sir_Donkeypunch, tom collins, three, rufo, camh, homeless snail, sex offendin link, pik_d, graph, scaevolus, schultzi, mrbucket, the evan
what it do
DEAD KEN POST REPLACER

Lyon
Apr 17, 2003
Our fiscal year doesn't end until March 31st but one of my bigger deals that was hanging out there assumed we were calendar year and asked for some discounts to get the deal inked before 12/31. My manager was more than happy to oblige to get it locked in and it is still quarter end so I'm sure this helped him too. Going to be a nice to pay off all my Christmas spending easily this year since I should see the commission in January now.

lazercunt
Oct 26, 2007

It was a narcotics raid, not a Fritos raid.

Lyon posted:

Our fiscal year doesn't end until March 31st but one of my bigger deals that was hanging out there assumed we were calendar year and asked for some discounts to get the deal inked before 12/31. My manager was more than happy to oblige to get it locked in and it is still quarter end so I'm sure this helped him too. Going to be a nice to pay off all my Christmas spending easily this year since I should see the commission in January now.

Honestly I can tell which of my clients know my calendar is my fiscal, and I'm always honest about it. We are a publicly traded company, we have targets to hit, and earnings to report.

That being said, I'll be working with my current clients to move their business into the first half of the year for my own sanity, as my business is essentially all Jan 1 now.

yospos cru: Wit_sponge, relative_q, roguestar, Model M, Sir_Donkeypunch, tom collins, three, rufo, camh, homeless snail, sex offendin link, pik_d, graph, scaevolus, schultzi, mrbucket, the evan
what it do
DEAD KEN POST REPLACER

Waroduce
Aug 5, 2008
So Ive moved into a SLED bidding position for my company where I fill out and present RFPs and bids. When I win I turn into the project manager on it where I run everything. is anyone in a similar positions or can recommend some books on project management?

I just won and deployed one of the top 10 largest school districts in the nation, and it was hell for me trying to track, organize, deploy, assign teams, build out routes and delivery schedules and stuff. I know theres an easier way.


I also have some compensation questions if anyone is sorta familiar with how this sort of stuff generally works. Im 25 and this is still my first job outta college. Im not super business savvy.

Snatch Duster
Feb 20, 2007

by FactsAreUseless

Waroduce posted:

So Ive moved into a SLED bidding position for my company where I fill out and present RFPs and bids. When I win I turn into the project manager on it where I run everything. is anyone in a similar positions or can recommend some books on project management?

I just won and deployed one of the top 10 largest school districts in the nation, and it was hell for me trying to track, organize, deploy, assign teams, build out routes and delivery schedules and stuff. I know theres an easier way.


I also have some compensation questions if anyone is sorta familiar with how this sort of stuff generally works. Im 25 and this is still my first job outta college. Im not super business savvy.

The bigger question is why the company is having a sales rep be a project manager. You should be more focused on bringing in new revenue instead of insuring what you sold is done, which obviously distracted you for many hours if not days or weeks, resulting in less sales for you and the company. There should be another person at the company as a project manager. Perhaps ask older reps or your manager on how they would tackle this sort of thing.

Snatch Duster fucked around with this message at 20:36 on Dec 29, 2015

DogsCantBudget
Jul 8, 2013
Anyone willing to review a resume to help me make my 3 months of SE experience look powerful and captivating to be able to score a different SE job?

Snatch Duster
Feb 20, 2007

by FactsAreUseless

DogsCantBudget posted:

Anyone willing to review a resume to help me make my 3 months of SE experience look powerful and captivating to be able to score a different SE job?

Do you know your numbers? Cuz they are the only thing that matters really.

DogsCantBudget
Jul 8, 2013

Snatch Duster posted:

Do you know your numbers? Cuz they are the only thing that matters really.

I was in it for 3 months...in a non commission demonstration based role...There were no numbers to talk about. I did a total of ~20 demos during that time, none of which were end-stage or culminated in a sale.

DogsCantBudget fucked around with this message at 23:56 on Jan 16, 2016

lazercunt
Oct 26, 2007

It was a narcotics raid, not a Fritos raid.

DogsCantBudget posted:

I was in it for 3 months...in a non commission demonstration based role...There were no numbers to talk about. I did a total of ~20 demos during that time, none of which were end-stage or culminated in a sale.

But how much was each demo worth? poo poo, if my role was only doing demos, and my demos were good, I'd say I moved $2,000,000 through my stage of the pipeline successfully. It isn't your fault the prospect wasn't qualified, the rep can't close, etc.

yospos cru: Wit_sponge, relative_q, roguestar, Model M, Sir_Donkeypunch, tom collins, three, rufo, camh, homeless snail, sex offendin link, pik_d, graph, scaevolus, schultzi, mrbucket, the evan
what it do
DEAD KEN POST REPLACER

Snatch Duster
Feb 20, 2007

by FactsAreUseless

DogsCantBudget posted:

I was in it for 3 months...in a non commission demonstration based role...There were no numbers to talk about. I did a total of ~20 demos during that time, none of which were end-stage or culminated in a sale.

Uh, so what did you do in the down time between demonstrations?

DogsCantBudget
Jul 8, 2013

Snatch Duster posted:

Uh, so what did you do in the down time between demonstrations?

Prep for other demos, read sales books(since I had just moved into sales), listen/sit in on other peoples demos, learn how to use Salesforce a bit(since I had never used it before), lear more about the product, read white papers, etc.

Also I wrote a custom tool that the team will continue to use on a day to day basis even after my departure.

DogsCantBudget fucked around with this message at 02:30 on Jan 18, 2016

shut up netface
Jun 15, 2008
I'm really really excited that I had found this thread.

Currently I am a live product demonstrator for high end consumer appliances. in a nutshell, I convince people to purchase a 500 dollar blender. I had a great year in 2015, I'm currently ranked 32/180 demonstrators in the east coast, however I don't feel as if this is a long term gig. I've been here for 2.5 years, see no chance of moving up the ladder, and due to the fact that I have to cover nearly ALL of my own travel expenses, I'm looking to make a change at some point in the future.


HOWEVER- I don't have a traditional sales background, I was looking to break into more of outside sales, seeing how inside sales makes me want to eat a loving bullet. Is there a way to transmute my unorthodox skills into something more palatable for employers, or find specific niches that would be a good fit?

Snatch Duster
Feb 20, 2007

by FactsAreUseless

DogsCantBudget posted:

Prep for other demos, read sales books(since I had just moved into sales), listen/sit in on other peoples demos, learn how to use Salesforce a bit(since I had never used it before), lear more about the product, read white papers, etc.

Also I wrote a custom tool that the team will continue to use on a day to day basis even after my departure.

Here is a small write up I would use on my resume if I had your experience

- Gave 30 product demos in 60 days
- Move $XXX through pipeline
- Wrote custom X tool
- Salesforce CRM trained
- SPIN and Strong sales trained


Besides that you don't have much. Being a product demo/slide deck sales guy sucks. My suggestion is finding an outside sales gig or a gig that you control the entire process from cold lead to demo to close. That way you have skills at every stage of the sale cycle, which makes you a better catch for sales directors. As it is right now, most companies are trying to turn their sales team into the model in Predictable Revenue, which worked very well for Salesforce.

shut up netface posted:

I'm really really excited that I had found this thread.

Currently I am a live product demonstrator for high end consumer appliances. in a nutshell, I convince people to purchase a 500 dollar blender. I had a great year in 2015, I'm currently ranked 32/180 demonstrators in the east coast, however I don't feel as if this is a long term gig. I've been here for 2.5 years, see no chance of moving up the ladder, and due to the fact that I have to cover nearly ALL of my own travel expenses, I'm looking to make a change at some point in the future.


HOWEVER- I don't have a traditional sales background, I was looking to break into more of outside sales, seeing how inside sales makes me want to eat a loving bullet. Is there a way to transmute my unorthodox skills into something more palatable for employers, or find specific niches that would be a good fit?

2.5 years as a product demonstrator is quiet long. I am surprised you couldn't move into another position, gently caress even a trainer would be better. My suggestion is finding a company like Hibu (they sell digital marketing) who love their sales folks, give large base salaries, and great commissions. From what I understand of their org they have three positions; Outside sales rep, product demo, and retention. Product demonstrator is typically reserved for outside sales rep to move into once they understand the product really well, but you don't want to fall back into product demo trap again.


I guess my advice fits for both of you, find a company like Hibu, that will give you a shot at outside sales. Most of these outside sales type of companies are going to be marketing agencies since SaaS and hardware like do poo poo ton of marketing so they can bring in leads for their sales teams. Or you'll end up working for a regional company selling prosthetic limbs or drugs. These marketing qualified leads, as you experienced, are typically poo poo. While the outside sales guys get to bring in the sales they want to pursue, which typically are bigger deals.

shut up netface
Jun 15, 2008

Snatch Duster posted:


2.5 years as a product demonstrator is quiet long. I am surprised you couldn't move into another position, gently caress even a trainer would be better. My suggestion is finding a company like Hibu (they sell digital marketing) who love their sales folks, give large base salaries, and great commissions. From what I understand of their org they have three positions; Outside sales rep, product demo, and retention. Product demonstrator is typically reserved for outside sales rep to move into once they understand the product really well, but you don't want to fall back into product demo trap again.


Thanks!
I actually have trained, however it doesn't exactly offer any perks aside form dealing with someone who is completely green, its a huge hassle, and I don't normally do it. Admittedly, I have worked there 2.5 years on and off, once working for a horrendous print ad sales job for a niche market magazine for a month and a half. Holy poo poo never again. I'll gloss over that in the resume of course. I will scope out Hibu,

shut up netface fucked around with this message at 20:17 on Jan 18, 2016

Snatch Duster
Feb 20, 2007

by FactsAreUseless

shut up netface posted:

Thanks!
I actually have trained, however it doesn't exactly offer any perks aside form dealing with someone who is completely green, its a huge hassle, and I don't normally do it. Admittedly, I have worked there 2.5 years on and off, once working for a horrendous print ad sales job for a niche market magazine for a month and a half. Holy poo poo never again. I'll gloss over that in the resume of course. I will scope out Hibu,

Training wasn't a full time position or part of management path? That is very odd and worrying. Print advertising is horrible, its not the 90s anymore. So companies like Yellow Pages and Hibu aka Yellow Book, have moved over to digital. The cushy sales gigs there are outside sales one where you bring in new business and the other one is the retention, where you move over existing print clients to digital. Base is $52k + about $10k in benefits, if I recall.

shut up netface
Jun 15, 2008

Snatch Duster posted:

Training wasn't a full time position or part of management path? That is very odd and worrying. Print advertising is horrible, its not the 90s anymore. So companies like Yellow Pages and Hibu aka Yellow Book, have moved over to digital. The cushy sales gigs there are outside sales one where you bring in new business and the other one is the retention, where you move over existing print clients to digital. Base is $52k + about $10k in benefits, if I recall.

it's a commission only gig, you're completely independent, and you'll usually work 5-10 days straight, then have approx the same time off, and management is extremely hands off. These take place from opening to closing in retail venues (primarily costco). Admittedly, its an unorthodox line of work but in 2015 i made a rough calculation on my gross income for the year and it was pretty much the same as Hibu.


I intend on doing better than I did last year, however I'm planning on doing some serious life changes (getting engaged) in 2016 so I feel as if I'm at a crossroads.

Kraftwerk
Aug 13, 2011
i do not have 10,000 bircoins, please stop asking

Any tips on how to market myself better for a new outside sales position? My company has basically thrown me to the wolves and my sales director still hasn't given me any training programs. I'm brand new to the sales world and I thought I'd get some proper sales training. That was not the case. I'm probably secure for the rest of the year after they firm up what kind of numbers I'll need to meet. But I've been fruitlessly getting the door slammed in my face over and over and the only business I am even coming CLOSE to securing is a 200 grand deal to our competitor who is reselling our product with his own margin added in.

There's already been talk way up high in my organization about why we aren't "Going out and getting" the apparently vast opportunities the Canadian manufacturing sector has. (There really aren't any).

I am still better positioned compared to my old job but I'll be honest this company is a gong show. The sooner I get into SaaS or some other kind of business and get subjected to a proper training program the better I can develop my sales career. As it stands I'm spinning my wheels. I lost 3 deals due to the price of our product in spite of initial customer excitement. One company was pumped to get our product until the purchasing manager vetoed the decision and bought cheaper crates from our competitor.

So how do I get a new job when I can't even post numbers to prove I'm a good catch? Will I need to take a pay cut and slave away in inside sales for a bit before I can get back to a nicer job?

Snatch Duster
Feb 20, 2007

by FactsAreUseless

shut up netface posted:

it's a commission only gig, you're completely independent, and you'll usually work 5-10 days straight, then have approx the same time off, and management is extremely hands off. These take place from opening to closing in retail venues (primarily costco). Admittedly, its an unorthodox line of work but in 2015 i made a rough calculation on my gross income for the year and it was pretty much the same as Hibu.


I intend on doing better than I did last year, however I'm planning on doing some serious life changes (getting engaged) in 2016 so I feel as if I'm at a crossroads.

At Hibu, i know this to be a fact since my brother works there, he makes 52k base and commissions is netting him 112k last year. He roughly worked 5 - 10 hours a week from home. He is by no means the top 20% in the company.

Snatch Duster
Feb 20, 2007

by FactsAreUseless

Kraftwerk posted:

Any tips on how to market myself better for a new outside sales position? My company has basically thrown me to the wolves and my sales director still hasn't given me any training programs. I'm brand new to the sales world and I thought I'd get some proper sales training. That was not the case. I'm probably secure for the rest of the year after they firm up what kind of numbers I'll need to meet. But I've been fruitlessly getting the door slammed in my face over and over and the only business I am even coming CLOSE to securing is a 200 grand deal to our competitor who is reselling our product with his own margin added in.

There's already been talk way up high in my organization about why we aren't "Going out and getting" the apparently vast opportunities the Canadian manufacturing sector has. (There really aren't any).

I am still better positioned compared to my old job but I'll be honest this company is a gong show. The sooner I get into SaaS or some other kind of business and get subjected to a proper training program the better I can develop my sales career. As it stands I'm spinning my wheels. I lost 3 deals due to the price of our product in spite of initial customer excitement. One company was pumped to get our product until the purchasing manager vetoed the decision and bought cheaper crates from our competitor.

So how do I get a new job when I can't even post numbers to prove I'm a good catch? Will I need to take a pay cut and slave away in inside sales for a bit before I can get back to a nicer job?

There is always a better sales job out there. Knowing your numbers, and having good ones, isn't that big of deal but it does help prove you know your poo poo and that you are a professional. I went from inside sales call center to an outside sales position, then moved into manager within two years. The trick is finding the right company. I would recommend finding a company that has growth potential that you can directly affect with your sales. That way when it is time for promotion or increase in salary, you have really strong case since you directly affected the companies growth.

Kraftwerk
Aug 13, 2011
i do not have 10,000 bircoins, please stop asking

Agreed. The worst thing that happened to me was finding out shortly after I was hired that I wouldn't be allowed to sell into the United States. You can't sell precision engineered industrial packaging in huge volumes if you don't have any high volume factories to sell to in the first place.

I'm gonna try and see if there's any startups or new entrants hiring and try to get in that way. I have over 4-5 years of big corporation experience so that may be very helpful even if my actual sales experience isn't that great right now. All I want to do is learn to be a better salesman and have more opportunities to practice it. Feels like I'm getting nowhere cold calling randoms and expecting them to give up their existing supplier relationships for a product that can't even add that much value right now. Packaging is such a bullshit industry.

Snatch Duster
Feb 20, 2007

by FactsAreUseless

Kraftwerk posted:

Agreed. The worst thing that happened to me was finding out shortly after I was hired that I wouldn't be allowed to sell into the United States. You can't sell precision engineered industrial packaging in huge volumes if you don't have any high volume factories to sell to in the first place.

I'm gonna try and see if there's any startups or new entrants hiring and try to get in that way. I have over 4-5 years of big corporation experience so that may be very helpful even if my actual sales experience isn't that great right now. All I want to do is learn to be a better salesman and have more opportunities to practice it. Feels like I'm getting nowhere cold calling randoms and expecting them to give up their existing supplier relationships for a product that can't even add that much value right now. Packaging is such a bullshit industry.

I recommend finding a company that you'll be selling a service instead of materiel product. SaaS is easy enough but be prepared for stiff competition, cold calls, and specialized sales roles.

shut up netface
Jun 15, 2008

Snatch Duster posted:

At Hibu, i know this to be a fact since my brother works there, he makes 52k base and commissions is netting him 112k last year. He roughly worked 5 - 10 hours a week from home. He is by no means the top 20% in the company.

Well... poo poo. That's not a lateral move. I'm going to keep my eyes peeled for openings within NJ/pa. Admittedly the positions in the pacific Northwest are tempting.

Any possibility of any referral?:heysexy:

shut up netface fucked around with this message at 22:54 on Jan 19, 2016

Kraftwerk
Aug 13, 2011
i do not have 10,000 bircoins, please stop asking

Any of you guys ever heard of Concur? I hear they're hurting for staff to expand their marketshare. I've been ahead of the game on this and know that Concur seems like a pretty great system to have in most organizations that want to move away from the usual excel spreadsheet expense management system. Would probably be a little tough to convince some of the smaller and more old school firms to go with it but I see a lot of growth potential here if I get in now. I also think it's neat how it is a part of the SAP umbrella and I think streamlining something like expense management with your ERP is a great idea and can go a long way to improving a business and saving time.

I personally would love to have Concur so I don't have to collect easy to lose receipts and scan them all from a photocopier to send to accounting.

Any thoughts?

Kraftwerk fucked around with this message at 05:42 on Jan 21, 2016

lazercunt
Oct 26, 2007

It was a narcotics raid, not a Fritos raid.

Kraftwerk posted:

Any of you guys ever heard of Concur? I hear they're hurting for staff to expand their marketshare. I've been ahead of the game on this and know that Concur seems like a pretty great system to have in most organizations that want to move away from the usual excel spreadsheet expense management system. Would probably be a little tough to convince some of the smaller and more old school firms to go with it but I see a lot of growth potential here if I get in now. I also think it's neat how it is a part of the SAP umbrella and I think streamlining something like expense management with your ERP is a great idea and can go a long way to improving a business and saving time.

I personally would love to have Concur so I don't have to collect easy to lose receipts and scan them all from a photocopier to send to accounting.

Any thoughts?

You get the benefit that it's easy as gently caress to cold call people when you are SAP, because you are SAP. I'd wonder if SAP's account management teams are going to let you prospect into their clients though, so you probably won't have cross-selling opportunities if you are prospecting new business.

In other news, just got my variable comp number from December. 10k coming my way on 1/31, woo. I transacted some really weird business at the end of the year anyway so I hope its right.

yospos cru: Wit_sponge, relative_q, roguestar, Model M, Sir_Donkeypunch, tom collins, three, rufo, camh, homeless snail, sex offendin link, pik_d, graph, scaevolus, schultzi, mrbucket, the evan
what it do
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Gravitee
Nov 20, 2003

I just put money in the Magic Fingers!
My company uses Concur and it's awful for making travel plans. The expense tracking is fairly easy. Just my two cents.

ObsidianBeast
Jan 17, 2008

SKA SUCKS

Gravitee posted:

My company uses Concur and it's awful for making travel plans. The expense tracking is fairly easy. Just my two cents.

This is exactly my experience as well. The app is decent, you can take pictures of receipts, although recently we've been using Expensify which will parse the receipts for you with an OK degree of success. Booking travel through concur is garbage, though it's mostly because people who don't travel make crappy travel policies that you can't get around in Concur.

Snatch Duster
Feb 20, 2007

by FactsAreUseless

shut up netface posted:

Well... poo poo. That's not a lateral move. I'm going to keep my eyes peeled for openings within NJ/pa. Admittedly the positions in the pacific Northwest are tempting.

Any possibility of any referral?:heysexy:

Sorry for not getting back to you sooner, was probated for a week lol.

My brother would do a referral. email me at snatchduster at gmail dot com with your name and poo poo.

Alfalfa
Apr 24, 2003

Superman Don't Need No Seat Belt
I took a new "sales" job at the start of January and although the pay is good, I'm not actually selling (or ever will be selling). I prospect for appointments all day on the phone and when I do book an appointment our account executives go to the meeting.

Then my commission is based off if they close the deal or not.

I want to be in a sales role where I'm doing all aspects of the sales process.

My question is, should I list this on my resume, and what should I say so it doesn't read like I just did telemarketing?

Snatch Duster
Feb 20, 2007

by FactsAreUseless

Alfalfa posted:

I took a new "sales" job at the start of January and although the pay is good, I'm not actually selling (or ever will be selling). I prospect for appointments all day on the phone and when I do book an appointment our account executives go to the meeting.

Then my commission is based off if they close the deal or not.

I want to be in a sales role where I'm doing all aspects of the sales process.

My question is, should I list this on my resume, and what should I say so it doesn't read like I just did telemarketing?

What you are doing is appointment setting aka New Business Development.

Most companies start off green sales people in this type of role, to see if they can take rejection. Most companies are moving to this type of sales specalization, and NBD is its own field outright. Not all great NBD make good closers, but all great closers are decent NBDs. At least, that is the theory.

The system is broken down quiet well in Predictable Revenue.
http://predictablerevenue.com/

EDIT: Hunter/Farmer/Fishers is the break down. The Executives aka closers are called Hunters. Farmers are Account Managers, people growing the account. The fishers/nets are NBD who grab as many leads/small deals as possible.

Snatch Duster fucked around with this message at 00:50 on Feb 3, 2016

Alfalfa
Apr 24, 2003

Superman Don't Need No Seat Belt

Snatch Duster posted:

What you are doing is appointment setting aka New Business Development.

Most companies start off green sales people in this type of role, to see if they can take rejection. Most companies are moving to this type of sales specalization, and NBD is its own field outright. Not all great NBD make good closers, but all great closers are decent NBDs. At least, that is the theory.

The system is broken down quiet well in Predictable Revenue.
http://predictablerevenue.com/

It's not so much what I'm doing that bothers me. It's more that this was not the role discussed at all during the interview process and definitely does not play to my strengths (especially in selling). NBD I'm fine with and I'm really fine with rejection.

What I'm not fine with, is not being able to come up with the solution or find out a prospects actual problems and let them know how I/the product or service/our company can help them.

I will say having to do nothing but NBD behind a phone for a few weeks has definitely helped reenergize my desire to sell, compared to when I ran my gym and wasn't worried so much on that side of things.

Edit: also there is no strategy or training in place to move someone from the NBD role into an AE or manager role, which is another red flag to me.

Kraftwerk
Aug 13, 2011
i do not have 10,000 bircoins, please stop asking

Alfalfa posted:

It's not so much what I'm doing that bothers me. It's more that this was not the role discussed at all during the interview process and definitely does not play to my strengths (especially in selling). NBD I'm fine with and I'm really fine with rejection.

What I'm not fine with, is not being able to come up with the solution or find out a prospects actual problems and let them know how I/the product or service/our company can help them.

I will say having to do nothing but NBD behind a phone for a few weeks has definitely helped reenergize my desire to sell, compared to when I ran my gym and wasn't worried so much on that side of things.

Edit: also there is no strategy or training in place to move someone from the NBD role into an AE or manager role, which is another red flag to me.

The way you talk about the titles and what you were hired for reminds me an awful lot of the job I passed on at Salesforce. There's a massive turnover rate at that company and a lot of people have wanted out. Do your time there for about a year or two and then bail to a better position in another company.

I have to do the entire sales process in my company including project management for the account when the sale is complete. I'd rather have these specialized roles instead.

Lyon
Apr 17, 2003
Do you have experience running the full sales cycle for a product? You obviously had to do this at your gym but I mean specifically previous corporate experience at another company where you ran the full sales cycle for a product/service? If not then this is probably a good stepping stone. My first sales job was doing appointment setting then I used that to transition to true inside sales at another company (running full sales cycle for smaller products and existing customers) and then finally I transitioned from inside sales to outside sales at that company. Appointment setting/NBD is fairly traditional way to start a sales career.

If you already have a large amount of sales experience then doing pure appointment setting/NBD sounds like something you aren't super interested in so you might want to start looking for a different position.

Edit: Also I used to love reading your posts in W&W... should probably make my way back there since non stop travel for the last 4 years has not done well for my physical fitness.

devoir
Nov 16, 2007
I vaguely remember Alf doing some kind of all-in-one field sales role years ago. That kind of thing is pretty different to the structure sales pipeline it sounds like you've been put into. If you were sold (pun not intended) a different position than the one you're at, and you feel you have the experience to be an account exec, then it sounds like you need to transition to another org.

Edit: Rather than double post, going to see whether anyone else is in a technical sales/sales engineer role. Curious about different perspectives as I try to take my successful first year in this type of role and really double down on bringing a lot of value to my engagement in opportunities, rather than just being the guy that does a killer demo.

devoir fucked around with this message at 04:07 on Feb 3, 2016

ObsidianBeast
Jan 17, 2008

SKA SUCKS

devoir posted:

I vaguely remember Alf doing some kind of all-in-one field sales role years ago. That kind of thing is pretty different to the structure sales pipeline it sounds like you've been put into. If you were sold (pun not intended) a different position than the one you're at, and you feel you have the experience to be an account exec, then it sounds like you need to transition to another org.

Edit: Rather than double post, going to see whether anyone else is in a technical sales/sales engineer role. Curious about different perspectives as I try to take my successful first year in this type of role and really double down on bringing a lot of value to my engagement in opportunities, rather than just being the guy that does a killer demo.

I've been a mix of a pre-sales and post-sales engineer for the past 5 years for a few different startups. Being an SE in a smaller company is a lot different than a large company, so if you can give a better description of the size of the team then it might affect the advice.

I think the biggest thing that I've learned is being sure of yourself without being a know-it-all. People are looking to you to be the expert in your product, and to be knowledgable about the industry you're in, but you have to recognize when someone is an expert in their own right and try to mesh that. I've seen some SEs be too iffy on their statements, which gives off the impression that you don't know what you're talking about, but I've seen the opposite which makes you sound like you're full of poo poo. It's a fine line, but helps build that trust that you're not trying to screw them over.

Anyway, I'd be glad to share my experiences if you've got some specific topics you want to dive into, and I'd love to hear from others.

Snatch Duster
Feb 20, 2007

by FactsAreUseless

Alfalfa posted:

It's not so much what I'm doing that bothers me. It's more that this was not the role discussed at all during the interview process and definitely does not play to my strengths (especially in selling). NBD I'm fine with and I'm really fine with rejection.

What I'm not fine with, is not being able to come up with the solution or find out a prospects actual problems and let them know how I/the product or service/our company can help them.

I will say having to do nothing but NBD behind a phone for a few weeks has definitely helped reenergize my desire to sell, compared to when I ran my gym and wasn't worried so much on that side of things.

Edit: also there is no strategy or training in place to move someone from the NBD role into an AE or manager role, which is another red flag to me.

If you were in Portland area I would say come on into my agency for an interview. We have two positions open, a NBD and AE role. I would think your experience would fit for the AE position.

Alfalfa
Apr 24, 2003

Superman Don't Need No Seat Belt

Lyon posted:

Do you have experience running the full sales cycle for a product? You obviously had to do this at your gym but I mean specifically previous corporate experience at another company where you ran the full sales cycle for a product/service? If not then this is probably a good stepping stone. My first sales job was doing appointment setting then I used that to transition to true inside sales at another company (running full sales cycle for smaller products and existing customers) and then finally I transitioned from inside sales to outside sales at that company. Appointment setting/NBD is fairly traditional way to start a sales career.

If you already have a large amount of sales experience then doing pure appointment setting/NBD sounds like something you aren't super interested in so you might want to start looking for a different position.

Edit: Also I used to love reading your posts in W&W... should probably make my way back there since non stop travel for the last 4 years has not done well for my physical fitness.

My first sales job I was the outside sales rep for one of the bigger neutraceutical companies in the country.

I worked all of Houston and southern Louisiana selling to doctors and medical offices.

I did 90% of my own prospecting and lead generation, meeting with DM's, creating solutions, and asking for the decision.

In these 3 jobs (that, my gym, and this current one), I can fully say I have experience with every type of sales role from doing it all, just selling to hot prospects that went through the sales funnel, and now just filling the sales funnel).

Alfalfa
Apr 24, 2003

Superman Don't Need No Seat Belt

Snatch Duster posted:

If you were in Portland area I would say come on into my agency for an interview. We have two positions open, a NBD and AE role. I would think your experience would fit for the AE position.

Have any contacts in Houston? lol

devoir
Nov 16, 2007

ObsidianBeast posted:

I've been a mix of a pre-sales and post-sales engineer for the past 5 years for a few different startups. Being an SE in a smaller company is a lot different than a large company, so if you can give a better description of the size of the team then it might affect the advice.

I think the biggest thing that I've learned is being sure of yourself without being a know-it-all. People are looking to you to be the expert in your product, and to be knowledgable about the industry you're in, but you have to recognize when someone is an expert in their own right and try to mesh that. I've seen some SEs be too iffy on their statements, which gives off the impression that you don't know what you're talking about, but I've seen the opposite which makes you sound like you're full of poo poo. It's a fine line, but helps build that trust that you're not trying to screw them over.

Anyway, I'd be glad to share my experiences if you've got some specific topics you want to dive into, and I'd love to hear from others.

My company went public in the last 12 months and I think our publicly-stated headcount puts us at under 1000 people. My immediate team, addressing a particular market segment based on target company size, is about six people. I work with an account executive force that's quite a few times that size, with some loose relationships defining the accounts I work on.

Your advice resonates pretty well with the things I think have gotten me to where I am, as well as what I'll continue to hold close as I continue forward. I should probably contextualize and say I've got over a decade of technical roles, a lot of them customer facing, just nothing that has formally been sales-orientated.

I have a challenge right now with the volume of work coming my way. Part of it is the market demand and making sure that our scaling is sustainable, part of it is I've been able to generate personal demand from the sales executives based on my past performance. This is all important work, and bringing the correct level of preparation and strategy to each opportunity is the thing that occupies the most of my non-customer facing time. This extends into trying to figure out how to keep better customer notes, how to better frame my prep time with AEs, getting enough clarity on how the next meeting moves us towards our longer term goal, etc. The opportunities I work on range from a simple "one-and-done" demo through to really long-term engagements where we have the initial purchase and need to plot out 12-24 months worth of timeline for account expansion across other business units, other products in our platform, etc.

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ObsidianBeast
Jan 17, 2008

SKA SUCKS

devoir posted:

My company went public in the last 12 months and I think our publicly-stated headcount puts us at under 1000 people. My immediate team, addressing a particular market segment based on target company size, is about six people. I work with an account executive force that's quite a few times that size, with some loose relationships defining the accounts I work on.

Your advice resonates pretty well with the things I think have gotten me to where I am, as well as what I'll continue to hold close as I continue forward. I should probably contextualize and say I've got over a decade of technical roles, a lot of them customer facing, just nothing that has formally been sales-orientated.

I have a challenge right now with the volume of work coming my way. Part of it is the market demand and making sure that our scaling is sustainable, part of it is I've been able to generate personal demand from the sales executives based on my past performance. This is all important work, and bringing the correct level of preparation and strategy to each opportunity is the thing that occupies the most of my non-customer facing time. This extends into trying to figure out how to keep better customer notes, how to better frame my prep time with AEs, getting enough clarity on how the next meeting moves us towards our longer term goal, etc. The opportunities I work on range from a simple "one-and-done" demo through to really long-term engagements where we have the initial purchase and need to plot out 12-24 months worth of timeline for account expansion across other business units, other products in our platform, etc.

Time management is something I'm always trying to work on. It's tough when working with multiple sales reps as they are often strong personalities who aren't usually afraid to ask for you to take care of their accounts. It's nice when you find a pairing that you like, syncing with the AEs makes the whole process go much smoother. I've gotten a lot better about keeping my calendar up-to-date so folks know exactly what I'm already booked for, including blocking off time if I need to do some planning or work outside of meetings, that way I can always point people to my calendar so they don't double-book me.

It sounds like you're doing a lot of planning that (assuming you're in software/tech) could lead you into an Architect-type role in the future. I personally enjoy the variety of work in sales engineering, between demos, POCs, custom development, and working with different customers who have different environments and needs. I also get to work with multiple different internal groups, between sales, engineering, marketing, and support. Overall I really dig it, and it seems to have opened up a lot of opportunities for me.

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