Transitchat honeypot

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what is the best form of transit
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Bloody: Mar 3, 2013

Green line averages around 330k a day iirc

# ? Jan 21, 2016 05:58

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# ? May 28, 2024 18:39

Asymmetric POSTer: Aug 17, 2005

the dc metro is a joke and shouldn't be the near the top of any list except "most incompetently run"

# ? Jan 21, 2016 06:00

Asymmetric POSTer: Aug 17, 2005

Bloody posted:

Green line averages around 330k a day iirc

even if you add in the green line the dc metro is more than double the size in terms of track length

BITCH

# ? Jan 21, 2016 06:02

Notorious b.s.d.: Jan 25, 2003; by Reene

mishaq posted:

even if you add in the green line the dc metro is more than double the size in terms of track length

dc metro doesn't know whether it's commuter rail, or mass transit. it's priced in between the two. there's more miles between stops than one expects on mass transit, and fewer than associated with commuter rail

bart has the same "problem"

the 1970s were a weird, weird time

# ? Jan 21, 2016 06:24

Asymmetric POSTer: Aug 17, 2005

Notorious b.s.d. posted:

dc metro doesn't know whether it's commuter rail, or mass transit. it's priced in between the two. there's more miles between stops than one expects on mass transit, and fewer than associated with commuter rail

bart has the same "problem"

the 1970s were a weird, weird time

thats because mass transit in the us is bad except for nyc, chicago, and boston maybe

# ? Jan 21, 2016 06:46

Bloody: Mar 3, 2013

mbta ridership is 1.3 million per day in a msa of 4.7 million people

don't "boston maybe" that

# ? Jan 21, 2016 07:13

Bloody: Mar 3, 2013

also considering dc metro is half commuter rail lets toss in the mbtas 368 miles of commuter rail track to that track length total

# ? Jan 21, 2016 07:14

Bloody: Mar 3, 2013

http://www.apta.com/resources/statistics/Pages/RidershipArchives.aspx heres a lot of data

# ? Jan 21, 2016 07:17

Bloody: Mar 3, 2013

i have very strong positive feelings about the mbta

# ? Jan 21, 2016 07:18

Bloody: Mar 3, 2013

which is hosed up because boston blows rear end

# ? Jan 21, 2016 07:18

Jimmy Carter: Nov 3, 2005; THIS MOTHERDUCKER
FLIES IN STYLE

mishaq posted:

helsinki's public transportation app/mobile site owns so hard and all the scheduling is updated in real time based on current conditions

you can also take a public bus from downtown helsinki to the airport for like �5 and they run super frequently from various parts of the city

turns out you can grab helsinki's transit data out of the air if you're rad enough

http://www.windytan.com/2013/11/broadcast-messages-on-darc-side.html

# ? Jan 21, 2016 07:26

infernal machines: Oct 11, 2012; we monitor many frequencies. we listen always. came a voice, out of the babel of tongues, speaking to us. it played us a mighty dub.

t dot doesn't have their own transit app, but they have an open api for tracking and scheduled arrivals

most of the surrounding municipalities just publish scheduled times, but in t.o. the system is pretty accurate

# ? Jan 21, 2016 07:33

EIDE Van Hagar: Dec 8, 2000; Beep Boop

Jimmy Carter posted:

turns out you can grab helsinki's transit data out of the air if you're rad enough

[url]http://www.windytan.com/2013/11/broadcast-messages-on-darc-side.html[/

[quote="Jimmy Carter" post="455241717"]
turns out you can grab helsinki's transit data out of the air if you're rad enough

http://www.windytan.com/2013/11/broadcast-messages-on-darc-side.html

this is super cool and is the only use of all that phase shift key poo poo i learned in my RF class so far

# ? Jan 21, 2016 08:00

Cygni: Nov 12, 2005; raring to post

Notorious b.s.d. posted:

the 1970s were a weird, weird time

in retrospect, the DC/SF style systems probably offered a good balance of pandering to suburban voters while also offering urban benefits. in the long term, the construction and maintenance costs of electrified, grade separated heavy rail are probably worth it for the high ridership and dense development it can handle.

shame that Atlanta's similar system couldnt grow like its cousins but, you know, racists.

# ? Jan 21, 2016 08:14

qirex: Feb 15, 2001

I took MARTA a couple times, and it was pretty much the same as BART, even the Atlanta bus I took was OK which really surprised me.

# ? Jan 21, 2016 08:30

Asymmetric POSTer: Aug 17, 2005

Bloody posted:

also considering dc metro is half commuter rail lets toss in the mbtas 368 miles of commuter rail track to that track length total

then thrown in VRE/MARC which goes all the way to West Virginia :getin:

# ? Jan 21, 2016 14:26

Asymmetric POSTer: Aug 17, 2005

marta is exactly like bart in terms of the design/style of the system

it just doesn't go anywhere

# ? Jan 21, 2016 14:27

Asymmetric POSTer: Aug 17, 2005

Jimmy Carter posted:

turns out you can grab helsinki's transit data out of the air if you're rad enough

http://www.windytan.com/2013/11/broadcast-messages-on-darc-side.html

yeah i saw this before and it's cool

# ? Jan 21, 2016 14:29

distortion park: Apr 25, 2011

mishaq posted:

yeah i think the fraud potential would make it too difficult to do in its current form

anything that resolves the fraud problem delays the time between scanning the nfc chip and when the gates open

Doesn't seem to be a problem in London. Contactless payment just works if you have a contactless credit/debit card. Only downside is that it spams your bank statements instead of wrapping them up into weekly bunches.

# ? Jan 21, 2016 14:52

distortion park: Apr 25, 2011

Live arrival times make a huge difference to usability and should be a priority for networks which don't have them.

# ? Jan 21, 2016 14:53

Asymmetric POSTer: Aug 17, 2005

pointsofdata posted:

Doesn't seem to be a problem in London. Contactless payment just works if you have a contactless credit/debit card. Only downside is that it spams your bank statements instead of wrapping them up into weekly bunches.

id be interested to see how they do the authorization/response fast enough to not create queues at the gates

# ? Jan 21, 2016 15:01

Metrication: Dec 12, 2010; Raskin had one problem: Jobs regarded him as an insufferable theorist or, to use Jobs's own more precise terminology, "a shithead who sucks".

'Since the oyster readers cannot write to a contactless card, the reader when touching out is unable to display the fare charged for the journey, as the card does not have the starting point stored in it. This is calculated overnight once the touch in and touch out information is downloaded from the gates and collated.'

the gate is a computer

# ? Jan 21, 2016 15:14

Asymmetric POSTer: Aug 17, 2005

Metrication posted:

'Since the oyster readers cannot write to a contactless card, the reader when touching out is unable to display the fare charged for the journey, as the card does not have the starting point stored in it. This is calculated overnight once the touch in and touch out information is downloaded from the gates and collated.'

the gate is a computer

so what stops me from using an expired/invalid contactless debit card that has no money

# ? Jan 21, 2016 15:17

minivanmegafun: Jul 27, 2004

Metrication posted:

'Since the oyster readers cannot write to a contactless card, the reader when touching out is unable to display the fare charged for the journey, as the card does not have the starting point stored in it. This is calculated overnight once the touch in and touch out information is downloaded from the gates and collated.'

the gate is a computer

yeah we have the same bullshit problems with Ventra and there are only three fare points (bus, train, and train from O'Hare)

add this to Cubic.txt

# ? Jan 21, 2016 15:22

Metrication: Dec 12, 2010; Raskin had one problem: Jobs regarded him as an insufferable theorist or, to use Jobs's own more precise terminology, "a shithead who sucks".

mishaq posted:

so what stops me from using an expired/invalid contactless debit card that has no money

dunno mate but apparently the computer knows and shows you a little red light

'Sometimes payments may be declined by your card issuer, this may be because your card account does not have enough funds to pay for your journey.

If you get a red light when you touch your card on a reader, our staff will be able to tell you if your card issuer has declined payment.'

# ? Jan 21, 2016 15:26

Shaggar: Apr 26, 2006

mishaq posted:

id be interested to see how they do the authorization/response fast enough to not create queues at the gates

I wonder if they have some custom deal for it. or more likely since its England the state has access to your bank balance and they store it in the machines.

# ? Jan 21, 2016 16:00

Asymmetric POSTer: Aug 17, 2005

Metrication posted:

dunno mate but apparently the computer knows and shows you a little red light

'Sometimes payments may be declined by your card issuer, this may be because your card account does not have enough funds to pay for your journey.

If you get a red light when you touch your card on a reader, our staff will be able to tell you if your card issuer has declined payment.'

# ? Jan 21, 2016 16:00

Metrication: Dec 12, 2010; Raskin had one problem: Jobs regarded him as an insufferable theorist or, to use Jobs's own more precise terminology, "a shithead who sucks".

quote:

For TfL, its whole payment system -- which has always been built in-house -- is a source of huge pride, particularly as public service IT projects have often otherwise ended in disaster. "We feel very proud that our record of delivering IT is not part of that horror story," TfL's customer service director Shashi Verma told Wired.co.uk.

In order to adapt TfL's payment system to cope with contactless, a huge makeover has taken place. Whereas currently all of the payment processing takes place in the reader using the information stored on the card, the process has now been moved into the back office.

Oyster has always been prepared for the moment that contactless cards started to become commonly used from the time banks first started to discuss them, which was around 2007. Because they use a common underlying protocol and the same top-level standard as NFC, the readers are already compatible with pretty much all of the technology people are starting to use to make payments with now. "We are agnostic to form factor," claimed Verma.

What is different about the system is its application and the security system behind it. Generally in the world of contactless payments -- the retail world -- the price is known before the payment is made, whereas with TfL, the price is not known until the end of the journey and ultimately the end of the day or the week. This meant that the organisation was forced to create an entirely different model to the one used in retail -- a model that tackled the challenges that a public transport system presented.

It's no easy feat to start building such a complex payment system and ensuring that it remains safe and that people feel safe using it. TfL did it in conjunction with the banks and Mastercard, Visa and American Express. It is called the Transit Transaction System. This means TfL could license it to other metropolitan areas that want to take advantage of the model -- and there are currently several countries that are showing interest in it.

The way that the model works is that a zero-value transaction is generated at the reader. All the reader will do is complete a check that the card is a genuine payment payment and record the journey. At this stage, a token replaces the bank card information to ensure encryption and the payment is generated in the back office. The system has been designed so that only TfL will know what journeys you have done, and your bank will only know how much you've spent on London travel. Customers can register their bank card with their account, much as they can with an Oyster Card already, but only once at registration will the card information be accessed -- from that point the information will be replaced by a token.

The front end of the system -- the card readers and the bits you will interact with everyday -- are being maintained by a company called Cubic. TfL itself though will be handling the back end of the system; whereas the front end never really needs to change, the back end does. This also means that ticketing logic can be refined and adjusted more easily. "It seemed important for us to have the ability to react to change and to deliver those changes quickly to our customers. To do that for us it seemed that the best way was to deliver this piece of the system ourselves," said Sebastien Losq, who headed up the project.

The agency took a similar attitude to building the system in the first place. The team worked out that they could develop it for around a third of the cost of outsourcing it. The estimates TfL received edged up towards the �60 million mark, but in the end, the system was built for �11 million and is the largest example of Agile development in the public sector.

TfL has been cautious about server space given that the demand for its services is only likely to grow over the coming years. It is able to handle 20 million transactions per day. It is not cloud-based, but is running in its own data centres in a virtualised environment and in a test was capable of running eight weeks of all of London's Oyster data through the system in six hours.

a clever COMPUTER works everything out

# ? Jan 21, 2016 16:05

Metrication: Dec 12, 2010; Raskin had one problem: Jobs regarded him as an insufferable theorist or, to use Jobs's own more precise terminology, "a shithead who sucks".

a VERY clever computer 😂

# ? Jan 21, 2016 16:06

minivanmegafun: Jul 27, 2004

interlocking switches and signals in the Loop are hosed up. my train is standing in a station a couple stops outside

the Loop is honestly a dumb idea but it's a huge source of civic pride so it's not going anywhere

# ? Jan 21, 2016 16:15

Captain Foo: May 11, 2004; we vibin'
we slidin'
we breathin'
we dyin'

Bloody posted:

which is hosed up because boston blows rear end

Actually, Boston is good

and the MBTA works4me but lmao i don't commute on it

# ? Jan 21, 2016 16:25

Shaggar: Apr 26, 2006

Metrication posted:

a clever COMPUTER works everything out

do you have to register your card before it will work?

# ? Jan 21, 2016 17:05

Malcolm XML: Aug 8, 2009; I always knew it would end like ｔｈｉｓ．

Shaggar posted:

I wonder if they have some custom deal for it. or more likely since its England the state has access to your bank balance and they store it in the machines.

they do a pre charge auth for 1p then reconcile it a day later with your trips

I don't recall how they check for auth but I'd guess that since the max trip cost is like 10 pounds they just check if you can auth at least that

# ? Jan 21, 2016 17:05

Malcolm XML: Aug 8, 2009; I always knew it would end like ｔｈｉｓ．

Shaggar posted:

do you have to register your card before it will work?

no but you can if you want to see journey history

# ? Jan 21, 2016 17:06

Progressive JPEG: Feb 19, 2003

Bloody posted:

i have very strong positive feelings about the mbta

does green line go past lechmere yet? I remember seeing condo listings for somerville circa 2007 where the future green line was pretty much the main thing mentioned

# ? Jan 21, 2016 18:53

Progressive JPEG: Feb 19, 2003

Captain Foo posted:

Actually, Boston is good

and the MBTA works4me but lmao i don't commute on it

lovely roads, lovely bike access, lovely transit? why not all three?

# ? Jan 21, 2016 18:55

Bloody: Mar 3, 2013

Progressive JPEG posted:

does green line go past lechmere yet? I remember seeing condo listings for somerville circa 2007 where the future green line was pretty much the main thing mentioned

lol nope that got axed

# ? Jan 21, 2016 19:07

Shaggar: Apr 26, 2006

Progressive JPEG posted:

lovely roads, lovely bike access, lovely transit? why not all three?

bicycles are not transport.

# ? Jan 21, 2016 19:39

The Puppet Master: Apr 9, 2005; Would you fuck me? I'd fuck me. I'd fuck me hard.

"recreational vehicles"

The Puppet Master fucked around with this message at 22:00 on Jan 21, 2016

# ? Jan 21, 2016 20:04

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# ? May 28, 2024 18:39

Tatsujin: Apr 26, 2004; EVERYONE EXCEPT THE HOT WOMEN

minivanmegafun posted:

interlocking switches and signals in the Loop are hosed up. my train is standing in a station a couple stops outside

the Loop is honestly a dumb idea but it's a huge source of civic pride so it's not going anywhere

lol im really glad i came into work a little early today and missed that crazy poo poo by an hour

and yeah they finally removed a stop on the loop it doesn't need loving 8 or 9 or whatever

# ? Jan 21, 2016 21:25

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