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Night10194 posted:Why would someone be so upset about this game? Did it kill his dog or something? I'd bet it's a defense mechanism for all the people who spout on about how casuals are ruining the game market for them hard core gamers, but when they actually get a game that's hard and punishing, it's clear that they're not actually cut out for it.
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Jan 21, 2016 23:34
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MinibarMatchman posted:the answer is "video games" but seriously it's a vocal minority that feel betrayed that they can't exploit the same poo poo as they could last year.
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Jan 21, 2016 23:37
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I actually love this game. Loved it in early access, loving it in release. The only thing I would fix/change about the RNG is your starting party. If you make a new town and your healer doesn't have the right skills and the next 3 days of coach mates have no healing skills at all, you may as well reset the game. I even had it where my healer went crazy on the first outing, sent her for fixing, and then she disappeared and never came back. Meanwhile my coach was every non-healer in the game for days afterward. A bad start is a REALLY bad start and having those depend on RNG is a bad idea. The rest of the game is fine and awesome though.
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Jan 21, 2016 23:40
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A game full of horrible abominations against nature, yet one of the formations I dread seeing the most is some rear end in a top hat bandits.
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Jan 21, 2016 23:45
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Internet Kraken posted:A game full of horrible abominations against nature, yet one of the formations I dread seeing the most is some rear end in a top hat bandits. Man is the real monster.
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Jan 21, 2016 23:45
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DaveKap posted:I actually love this game. Loved it in early access, loving it in release. The only thing I would fix/change about the RNG is your starting party. If you make a new town and your healer doesn't have the right skills and the next 3 days of coach mates have no healing skills at all, you may as well reset the game. I even had it where my healer went crazy on the first outing, sent her for fixing, and then she disappeared and never came back. Meanwhile my coach was every non-healer in the game for days afterward. A bad start is a REALLY bad start and having those depend on RNG is a bad idea. The rest of the game is fine and awesome though. They did make it slightly better. The first mission in the Ruins is now a preset dungeon with softball enemy encounters, so you get a more or less guaranteed successful mission and an extra week's worth of recruits before you have to tackle "real" missions. gigawhite posted:Fuuuuck this is the mode I really want to be playing but I don't know if I'll really want to play through the game after beating it once. Anyone know if there's a flag in the .ini I can change so I can access NG+ off the bat? I'd just edit it to give you way more experience and money so you can speed through the game the first time, then set things back to normal for the "real" run. Tackling NG+ without knowing what you're getting into seems like a recipe for a lot more time wasted than playing through it twice.
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Jan 21, 2016 23:49
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Most of the time the RNG has been on my side. When I get hosed, it's my fault for getting too greedy and not retreating from the labyrinth soon enough.
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Jan 21, 2016 23:50
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Man I gotta stop forgetting to buy any shovels/torches. I remember everything else, but I occaisionally forget one of the two most important things (other than food, I usually have hella food).
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Jan 21, 2016 23:54
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im doing runs without torches and lemme tell ya its a hellva lot more fun to unfuck those
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Jan 21, 2016 23:55
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Darkest Dungeon's RNG is no better or worse than any other RPG's RNG, it's just that the results are more important. If you had the sort of exponential stat gain most RPGs feature nobody would be complaining about it. I respect the devs for recognizing that sometimes smaller numbers are better than bigger ones.
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Jan 21, 2016 23:55
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I love those giant loving crabs in the Cove. There's nothing quite like going "what is this 2 damage pinch attack", resisting the bleeds 2 times, then letting one through and realizing you have a 5 turn 8 damage bleed and the fucker's still alive and pinching away.
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Jan 21, 2016 23:57
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Had a run where I beat 2 shamblers AND the Collector. The Collector actually popped in 2 hallway squares after I beat the second shambler. Wish there was an achievement for something like this. I'd like to think the Shambler keeps getting called and at this point he's like "Nope nope gently caress this RNG bullshit I'm out" Panfilo fucked around with this message at 23:59 on Jan 21, 2016 |
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Jan 21, 2016 23:57
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Nah, the Darkest Dungeon RNG is pretty severe, even in comparison to other offenders, like FTL. For instance, I lost my first Occultist in the first battle in a cove mission due to him getting crit 3 times in a row, then immediately taking a deathblow from the bleeding damage. There was literally nothing I could do to stop that. That's part of the fun, though. Dealing with the outcome of less than favorable scenarios.
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Jan 21, 2016 23:58
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Bad Seafood posted:Darkest Dungeon's RNG is no better or worse than any other RPG's RNG, it's just that the results are more important. If you had the sort of exponential stat gain most RPGs feature nobody would be complaining about it. I think most people don't have any idea how proper randomness 'feels' compared to human intuition. This disjunction is why weather forecasters fudge their numbers, or why fire emblem/XCOM (on Easy/Normal anyway) had fudge factors built into their RNG. When a dev uses an honest RNG, people just can't handle it.
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Jan 22, 2016 00:00
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Broken Cog posted:Nah, the Darkest Dungeon RNG is pretty severe, even in comparison to other offenders, like FTL.
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Jan 22, 2016 00:03
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Broken Cog posted:Nah, the Darkest Dungeon RNG is pretty severe, even in comparison to other offenders, like FTL.
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Jan 22, 2016 00:05
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DaveKap posted:It's stuff like this that can piss you off, yes, but it's also what makes the game good because it makes successful runs feel MORE successful than normal and you're paying attention to each and every run as an important point in your dungeoning career. Few games can really get that feeling right. RNG swings both ways. I've sent parties that has ~70 stress in dungeons, only to have them steamroll so hard, get so many good curios they completed the dungeon with pretty much zero stress. I've had a Bounty Hunter chain crit bandit overseers and kill them in 2 hits. I've had runs where enemies never even got a shot off, and several times the 'kill all enemies in rooms' short mission had only 1 room encounter in the very first room allowing me to beat it in 3 minutes.
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Jan 22, 2016 00:11
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The thing about the whole 'this fucken' RNG' sentiment, is half the time it's coupled with a refusal to acknowledge you took a poo poo composition and your run should be abandoned. There are a lot of games out there that have coached people to just keep on pushing because success is inevitable, but that's not how a real strategy/tactics game should work. Retreat should be viable and at times necessary. Like the rage quitter, he decided to run a 3 man party against a boss depending on Vestal heals to keep him just off Death's Door, get outta here with the RNG complaint, your run was on the way out before you even jumped into the ring with the Necro.
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Jan 22, 2016 00:13
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Panfilo posted:RNG swings both ways. I've sent parties that has ~70 stress in dungeons, only to have them steamroll so hard, get so many good curios they completed the dungeon with pretty much zero stress. I've had a Bounty Hunter chain crit bandit overseers and kill them in 2 hits. I've had runs where enemies never even got a shot off, and several times the 'kill all enemies in rooms' short mission had only 1 room encounter in the very first room allowing me to beat it in 3 minutes. Yeah, I was having a tough time on my first venture into the Weald when my Grave Robber pirouetted through like 3 attacks in a row, critted twice, got me the time to get my crusader off death's door, and then I discover 'Oh actually despite only being 4 rooms in you won.'
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Jan 22, 2016 00:14
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ZypherIM posted:
Are you talking about long missions specifically? 16 torches and 3 stacks of food seems like overkill. I don't think I ever take more than 1 stack of each to short/medium missions.
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Jan 22, 2016 00:18
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The occultists heal is probably the place where RNG can really gently caress with you the most. It can crit for 40 when you've been barely scratched and then heal for 0 several times while you're bleeding out. Still one of my favorite classes but I'd be lying if I said I never got angry at those 0 heals.
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Jan 22, 2016 00:19
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- CRIT! (0) - Bleed [one turn later] - bleed sound - DEATHBLOW Haven't had that one happen yet but oh I bet that one would be just enraging
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Jan 22, 2016 00:22
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Ciaphas posted:- CRIT! (0) lost an arbalest to that i laughed and finished the dungeon anyway
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Jan 22, 2016 00:24
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Ciaphas posted:- CRIT! (0) plague doctors are an occultists best friend
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Jan 22, 2016 00:28
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Megasabin posted:Are you talking about long missions specifically? 16 torches and 3 stacks of food seems like overkill. I don't think I ever take more than 1 stack of each to short/medium missions. Yes someone was specifically asking about long mission provisioning. Rng in this game really only screws you hard if you refuse to accept that it has happened. Like you never lose someone to a heart attack from "RNG", and most deaths from damage are also not from "RNG". There is a lot of control you have, and sometimes the correct answer is bailing. Now in NG+ that may be different, bad coach sets and bad luck making you have to leave could be more costly there (though losing a week is less costly than losing any hero above level 1). As of several patches ago occultists can't actually crit for 0. You can still get a 0 heal and a bleed though! If you're running an occultist and someone dies from a 0-heal and bleed this is a classic example of a bad party setup or poor in combat usage of a good party. (You should have something in place for a 100% heal to pull someone off death's door. Even throwing a plague doc heal will do it)
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Jan 22, 2016 00:28
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Bad Seafood posted:Darkest Dungeon's RNG is no better or worse than any other RPG's RNG, it's just that the results are more important. If you had the sort of exponential stat gain most RPGs feature nobody would be complaining about it. I think the RNG may be better than others only because if you are willing to accept that something is doomed or a bad situation you can just get out of there pretty reliably
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Jan 22, 2016 00:31
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Ciaphas posted:- CRIT! (0) Lost a HM while fighting the second Flesh that way today. It suddenly became a rather stressful fight.
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Jan 22, 2016 00:39
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I kinda tuned out of updates for some time while waiting for the game to leave early access, but wasn't there some change a while back about how damage bonuses and penalties work? Pretty sure that you can't just stack huge buffs on grapeshot anymore, but I don't remember why.
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Jan 22, 2016 00:41
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I forgot how fun this game is, even when it's absolutely kicking my rear end. I haven't played in a long time, like since before they added Houndmasers, Man-At-Arms, corpses, a bunch of stuff. Now that it's finally out of early access I figured I'd play it again. I've been playing it all day. The sound effects, and the art and the attack animations are so satisfying. Also I appreciate it letting me turn off all this poo poo:  edit: Like drat, corpses are just tedious and that second one, holy cow why would anyone want that
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Jan 22, 2016 00:43
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Broken Cog posted:Nah, the Darkest Dungeon RNG is pretty severe, even in comparison to other offenders, like FTL. sure there was: stack speed
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Jan 22, 2016 00:43
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Ciaphas posted:- CRIT! (0) That was actually my first death way back when I started playing. The rest of the party followed soon after. And then I discovered the retreat option 
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Jan 22, 2016 00:43
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Macaluso posted:edit: Like drat, corpses are just tedious and that second one, holy cow why would anyone want that I get this but corpses are actually a cool and good mechanic that encourages you to do other things than just meatgrind the front row
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Jan 22, 2016 00:46
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corpses are really good for back row hitters
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Jan 22, 2016 00:47
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Operant posted:I get this but corpses are actually a cool and good mechanic that encourages you to do other things than just meatgrind the front row Corpses encouraged me to turn corpses off actually
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Jan 22, 2016 00:50
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Macaluso posted:
Corpses are more than just tedious. I mean they are an intentional mechanic that alters gameplay in significant ways, adding depth. Without them, you are basically just playing easy mode.
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Jan 22, 2016 00:53
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Megasabin posted:Without them, you are basically just playing easy mode. Well yeah
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Jan 22, 2016 00:55
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Megasabin posted:Are you talking about long missions specifically? 16 torches and 3 stacks of food seems like overkill. I don't think I ever take more than 1 stack of each to short/medium missions. Meanwhile, I only take 8 Food/8 Torches to Shorts, 12 both to Mediums. Yet I'm always taking at least three of everything JUST IN CASE. I'm thinking of lowering it to two for mediums and one for shorts.
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Jan 22, 2016 00:55
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Corpses can be used to your advantage as well so learning to play around them is pretty handy. I wish your party left corpses too though 
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Jan 22, 2016 00:56
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Corpses are really good and I honestly feel like I'd be bored with combat without them. I honestly don't get why people dislike them.
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Jan 22, 2016 00:57
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Corpses off actively makes some classes worse, and can remove options during a fight to make the fight easier. Like with a corpse I can push a claw cultist back to spot 3 leaving a corpse in slot 2, now he only has a weak 'stumbling scratch' attack to do on his next turn. Unless you're just trolling us completely, then well done. It is the one option that adds significant depth to the game, the only reason you can turn it off is to shut up the people that wouldn't stop crying when they were introduced.
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Jan 22, 2016 00:58
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