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To be fair Stone Ocean was super uncomfortable with any other race of people too as long as they were background characters. Bunch of fuckin goblin lookin motherfuckers
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Jan 25, 2016 05:49
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Weren't Wes and Enrico supposed to be black?
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Jan 25, 2016 05:51
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i like the fan interpretation of hermes having brown skin at the very least. thanks
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Jan 25, 2016 05:53
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Baal posted:Weren't Wes and Enrico supposed to be black? No, just Italian. The KKK guys assumed Wes was black because they thought his black stepfather was his actual father.
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Jan 25, 2016 05:55
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I could never really tell. If it was mentioned they were Italian, I completely forgot.
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Jan 25, 2016 05:56
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Wow, I thought they were biracial, hence the lynching and Enrico being more black looking than Wes. I missed the part where they were definitely italian, but I assumed that anyway from the name. I kind of had a hard time following their backstory
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Jan 25, 2016 06:00
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Remember that Araki must have at least one Italian Character in each arc.
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Jan 25, 2016 06:14
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I've always seen them as half black, since saying Pucci is not is completely ridiculous, and one of the girls in the flashback mentions Wes' tan skin.Johnny Joestar posted:i like the fan interpretation of hermes having brown skin at the very least. thanks Her family owned a Mexican resturaunt, so I don't really think this is a fan interpretation.
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Jan 25, 2016 06:14
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I liked Yukako as a character but she really didn't get to do much aside from alternately terrifying Koishi and getting saved by him. Her counterpart in Jojolion had a really proactive intro, which gives me high hopes. Jojolion having a large female cast in general is good because then the representation isn't riding all on one or two characters as in most of the other arcs.
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Jan 25, 2016 06:25
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jojolion has a really good cast in general and i like seeing any of them do things. even joshuu. only sometimes. stop being a creepy turd, joshuu.
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Jan 25, 2016 06:26
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Alopex posted:I liked Yukako as a character but she really didn't get to do much aside from alternately terrifying Koishi and getting saved by him. Her counterpart in Jojolion had a really proactive intro, which gives me high hopes. Jojolion having a large female cast in general is good because then the representation isn't riding all on one or two characters as in most of the other arcs. I'm definitely excited about her counterpart. I liked the Cinderella arc in DIU. I dunno, when I try to justify my affection for her I don't have a lot to say so maybe it's just that I felt like SDC was lacking in that regard so it's nice to have someone with an interesting power, even if it's not really utilized well. Yo, imma blob - I agree with you about relying upon that as a plot device for women. It's a pet peeve of mine in fiction, I'm hoping that it's kinda done in JJL now so the story sticks to cool stuff instead. 
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Jan 25, 2016 06:44
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Yeah, Lucy Steel was baller but they used sexual assault against her so often that it makes it hard to recommend to people sometimes. I don't really think I understood that Cinderella arc. So Koichi didn't like Yukako that much, but she ended up changing her face, which... actually worked? And then the end where Yukako's actual face isn't in the ones Koichi can pick, and it just kinda ends there? I'm guessing that's because of Duwang, cause otherwise, that whole story gave me a really bad vibe.
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Jan 25, 2016 06:48
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The vibe I got from it was that Yukako was trying to force a change in her life for Koichi, Koichi got sucked into it, and Cinderella was playing a bit of a trickster role to get the kids to understand what they were really doing. Things go south with The Rules and Koichi maybe should've been more weirded out but by that point Morioh was basically anime Twin Peaks so he rolled with it. Cinderella relented because she really didn't want to scar Yukako so much as help the girl and Koichi get on the same page. So Yukako shows that she's trying to catch Koichi's eye in a weird but not felonious way and Koichi sees that effort and appreciates the intent even if made for a surreal day. Haven't read 4 in a bit though so I could be misremembering some/most of that As for the attacks on Lucy I took it as part of the Western grit vibe and that she was, what, a 14-year-old swept up in the madness SBR becomes. So while I can't say I enjoyed the threats against her I felt like it showed her navigating her way through a world full of danger from both a "people of power looking to exert their influence" Stand World stance and a "people with more strength looking to exploit the perceived weak" Western World stance. And then she makes it through and blows up Dio's head and it's great.
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Jan 25, 2016 07:01
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the stand's power was to alter people's features and their ~fate~ or whatever was tied to those changes. the stand user was using the ability to make money, and when yukako neglected to do what she was told it messed up and she got angry at the stand user, who decided to give yukako a 'chance' at putting things right by picking the right features out of the ones provided. the catch was that there was no right option, and the point was to teach yukako a lesson. then she gave the choice to koichi, who went on to say that it didn't matter and that he'd care for her no matter what. so the stand user put everything right again because yukako seemed to learn something by actually trusting koichi and not trying to force the matter. that and the stand user thought it was touching. it was mostly a fairytale kinda thing, which is fitting given the stand's general influence. i don't know if your translation was poo poo or something but it was pretty clear. the whole relationship between koichi and yukako is the odd part and i think part of it is due to how nuts araki made yukako at first. he probably went a little too far to the extreme when trying to break the mold. also lucy getting threatened w/ sexual assault is bad because it's an incredibly loving lazy way to go 'wow this character is in danger!!!' that's pretty much only ever exclusively reserved for women for whatever reason and doesn't really add much that couldn't have been accomplished by, i don't know, pretty much any other kind of threat? and was super creepy because on top of everything else she's 14? it's genuinely bad and only detracts from an otherwise really good arc. it's some poo poo that bad dude writers have some weird fascination with. there's plenty of ways to demonstrate that a 14 y/o is in above her head and up against a bunch of really loving dangerous people that don't involve sexual assault. also the depiction of scarlet valentine is loving baffling and weird.
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Jan 25, 2016 07:15
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Johnny Joestar posted:also lucy getting threatened w/ sexual assault is bad because it's an incredibly loving lazy way to go 'wow this character is in danger!!!' that's pretty much only ever exclusively reserved for women for whatever reason You're right, but you saying that jogged my memory about Ringo Roadagain and how he nearly got raped by that potato-eating guy in his flashback. So, like, SBR is the arc where terrible things nearly happen to little kids, because the Old West was gritty like that. Or something. I feel a bit bad saying SBR is my favorite arc now, but I still really like it even with its weird problems.
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Jan 25, 2016 07:22
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i actually did forget the ringo thing but that's probably because i never much cared for ringo. i don't like it being used in general, especially if it involves kids.
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Jan 25, 2016 07:24
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I guess there's a mean part of me that doesn't mind any given plot element per se so long as the story flows.
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Jan 25, 2016 07:29
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Johnny Joestar posted:i actually did forget the ringo thing but that's probably because i never much cared for ringo. i don't like it being used in general, especially if it involves kids. Especially when they do it like five times too. At least Stephen Steel got a chance to prove himself as Not A Creep, I guess.
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Jan 25, 2016 07:36
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Momomo posted:Especially when they do it like five times too. At least Stephen Steel got a chance to prove himself as Not A Creep, I guess. yeah, there's like this weird fascination with it in the arc for some reason. welp, it's the wild west or some strange cobbled-together version of something that's already pretty much 90% fantasy as it is, time to throw in some people who want to have sex with children to show how brutal it is! there's a good element of stephen steel showing himself to marry her just because he wants to protect her and it's one of the easiest ways to do that, but then for some reason araki decided to take things further? i don't know. overall those bits are fairly small compared to the rest of everything else, but it says a lot about how well the other stuff is told because if it was mediocre and all the bad poo poo was in there as well i don't think the arc would be as highly ranked as it is.
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Jan 25, 2016 07:44
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i forgot that Lucy was subjected to the rape stuff, other than Valentine's wife and the hosed up baby thing (which are still bad). as for Joushuu, i honestly would not care if he melted for good because i can't imagine that gross little rapist having any sort of character comeback.
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Jan 25, 2016 08:03
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Adlai Stevenson posted:I guess there's a mean part of me that doesn't mind any given plot element per se so long as the story flows. Nah I getcha on that. It doesn't bug me so much with Ringo but I dunno, I identify with Ringo a lot so I like him. And the thing I do have to say about the other folks is that even if I dislike that plot device, I appreciate the fact that the characters twined in with that in Jojo aren't wholly defined by that and are still pretty great characters. Lucy Steel is a great character and I love SBR.
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Jan 25, 2016 08:28
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DicktheCat posted:I just read the newest Jojolion, and drat does original Josuke and Kira have some mighty sameface. Maybe because they need to look enough like Gappy to remain recognizable as his progenators, but drat if I could only tell them apart by clothes. Araki forgets Kira's hair swoosh over his face a bunch in this chapter, so that compounds the Josuke face. He can't settle on a Kira face though, his first appearance is a lot different to now. Particularly bad when we see Josefumi's picture and Karera identifies Josuke based on the fact he looks like Josefumi but he doesn't and the pic has Kira looking peak Josuke. The same face leads part of me to think a twist is going to be that Josefumi isn't the base body, Kira is, even though they found his corpse because it gets that bad at times.
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Jan 25, 2016 08:31
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dogsicle posted:i forgot that Lucy was subjected to the rape stuff, other than Valentine's wife and the hosed up baby thing (which are still bad). as for Joushuu, i honestly would not care if he melted for good because i can't imagine that gross little rapist having any sort of character comeback. As much as I hate Joushuu, he thought he was going along with what Yasuho was telling him. I mean yeah it was gross and lovely and honestly made me feel kinda uncomfortable but I don't think the guy would intentionally rape someone. His character is meant to be stupid, not evil.
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Jan 25, 2016 12:01
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She was very clearly freaking out and in no fit state to consent, so taking advantage of that is rape.
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Jan 25, 2016 12:15
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Hitlersaurus Christ posted:As much as I hate Joushuu, he thought he was going along with what Yasuho was telling him. I mean yeah it was gross and lovely and honestly made me feel kinda uncomfortable but I don't think the guy would intentionally rape someone. His character is meant to be stupid, not evil. Yasuho doesn't even like him prior to the incident, so i dunno why he should get a pass for being oblivious and self-absorbed about their relationship to the point that he does that. That's exactly a real-world problem dudes have when it comes to sexual assault.
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Jan 25, 2016 15:18
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like yeah, i don't think Joushuu is meant to be evil, and there are enough variables to the creation of the scene that i'm not trying to read anything into it yet, but the whole thing is sorta hanging over him now. if it were a dropped plot thread (it already feels like it has been a long time) that might be the best of a bad situation, but we won't know for years.
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Jan 25, 2016 15:33
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They realize they can't put him right, and Hato says 'hey, Jobin has lots of jars for his, like, beetles, keep him in that!' and they do so until Jobin picks up a cool new specimen and evicts little bro to make room. Joshuu insists that Yashuo continue to take him to classes, so she carries him around in a bag and people start asking why she has a bag that makes wheezing and groaning noises constantly.
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Jan 25, 2016 16:22
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  The detailing on his GACTs 
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Jan 25, 2016 18:17
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Hitlersaurus Christ posted:As much as I hate Joushuu, he thought he was going along with what Yasuho was telling him. I mean yeah it was gross and lovely and honestly made me feel kinda uncomfortable but I don't think the guy would intentionally rape someone. His character is meant to be stupid, not evil. Josuke Higashikata posted:She was very clearly freaking out and in no fit state to consent, so taking advantage of that is rape. Yeah Joshuu is less "stupid" and more a Nice Guy who feels entitled to Yasuho just because he likes her and they're "friends." Not once has he actually taken her feelings into account or had a moment of clarity where he realizes he's acting like a douchebag. I know that's also kind of the same thing as "stupid" but framing it like that doesn't describe it well. He's an entitled brat.
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Jan 25, 2016 18:18
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I have mixed feelings about Joshuu in that his stupidity, obliviousness, and self-absorption are actually pretty funny: I liked seeing him wheeze and groan about how a cool new dude usurped his place in the family household and watching him try to screw Gappy over on the swindlers' road, and I loved his interactions with Jobin during the beetle fight. Maybe at some point he'll grow up, but I'd be okay with Yasuho just continuing to be this arc's bro instead. The sexual assault thing was just awful, though, and the fact that nobody knows/remembers exactly what happened means that he's probably never going to get any comeuppance for it, so narratively it's just this stupid, unnecessary little blip in the plot that I guess we're supposed to laugh at because Yasuho ended the incident by knocking him out with a toilet lid.Johnny Joestar posted:also lucy getting threatened w/ sexual assault is bad because it's an incredibly loving lazy way to go 'wow this character is in danger!!!' that's pretty much only ever exclusively reserved for women for whatever reason and doesn't really add much that couldn't have been accomplished by, i don't know, pretty much any other kind of threat? and was super creepy because on top of everything else she's 14? it's genuinely bad and only detracts from an otherwise really good arc. it's some poo poo that bad dude writers have some weird fascination with. there's plenty of ways to demonstrate that a 14 y/o is in above her head and up against a bunch of really loving dangerous people that don't involve sexual assault. also the depiction of scarlet valentine is loving baffling and weird.
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Jan 25, 2016 18:20
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I just made it through diamond is unbreakable Wowsers that finale
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Jan 25, 2016 18:26
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I'd love to talk more about rape in SBR, but I just got my Kira figure in and I wanted to let you all know that he's now seated in a place of power. 
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Jan 25, 2016 18:27
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Scarlet Valentine is such a loving weird character, but I thought she was pretty funny up until the sexual assault happened.
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Jan 25, 2016 18:29
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I find it hard to stay mad at anybody who gets murdered via balloon animal.
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Jan 25, 2016 18:30
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Naerasa posted:I'd love to talk more about rape in SBR, but I just got my Kira figure in and I wanted to let you all know that he's now seated in a place of power. He is perfect
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Jan 25, 2016 18:33
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Eonwe posted:I just made it through diamond is unbreakable Bites the Dust is so good I've gone back to read it like twice since finishing the manga myself. I can't wait to read the anime thread when it airs.
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Jan 25, 2016 18:46
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Baal posted:Scarlet Valentine is such a loving weird character, but I thought she was pretty funny up until the sexual assault happened. i feel like part of it boils down to 'araki doesn't know what women do when in relationships with each other' because it sure as hell feels like it to me. like, i get that it's jojo's and all, but the poo poo she was doing was just weird and i'm not sure why it needed to be included in the way it was.
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Jan 25, 2016 18:58
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Scarlet acting weird was just fanservice for the sake of it, given that being in UJ allows him to write for an adult audience. He's not trying to write a relationship between "President's wife who will abuse her power to fulfil sexual fantasies and attractive young woman". Araki's not necessarily always trying to write realistic people in his manga about punch ghosts. It was included because it doesn't harm anything unless you're overly sensitive. Araki better follow through on "Between Josuke and Yasuho, eros is inevitable" from his manga instruction manual.  4 balls deep or bust.
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Jan 25, 2016 19:21
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Even from a fanservice perspective that whole character is just loving weird. It's a scene that comes out of nowhere, provides nothing, and isn't even really that sexy because Scarlet's behavior is just so loving chaotic. She's just a really weird character from every avenue.
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Jan 25, 2016 19:31
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the dude has a really weird history with women in the comic and the first time he has one that's vaguely relevant to the plot and is stated to be anything but straight she ends up being really goddamn weird and not even remotely realistic, not to mention that she's another person who wants to do poo poo with a 14 year old. it's pretty natural for people to look at that and go 'haha what the gently caress is this'.
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Jan 25, 2016 19:40
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