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If you guys really really wanna target Wilbur, just Flashbang him. That's it. That's the secret.
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Jan 26, 2016 19:35
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Daktari posted:I know you guys say not to restart, but I keep doing it anyways.
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Jan 26, 2016 19:35
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Daktari posted:Had the 2 starting morons + a leper. They had great skills for 2nd/3rd row, ie their stuns, come hither's, with the damage stuff. okay, but what was your setup + strategy in that fight, the one that destroyed you? because the 2-thug 2-fusillers group is really really easy to lock down with any doublestun or pull/push attack and if you had PD + BH you had both. having access to two is good redundancy; early on your ACC is going to suck so if you're relying on only one to prevent damage you're going to get hosed by misses and dodges. being able to lock down 2-3 people with only 1-2 actions of your own is really good because it means you're not taking nearly as much damage and you still have people available to damage things and remove enemies from the fight.
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Jan 26, 2016 19:37
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victrix posted:I feel like this game is drawing in a lot of people who don't play or aren't used to games with permanent consequences, and it's driving OCD 100% perfectionist rpg save-every-potion-until-the-last-fight types absolutely bonkers when something goes wrong. The game is interesting in that in order to succeed you have to kind of treat all the adventurers like resources. But the game does a really good job of giving them character, even more so if you name them something personal like a movie character you like or after a family member. So you end up not wanting to let your resources die.
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Jan 26, 2016 19:39
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Lives in Darkest Dungeon are to be spent. Not wasted, but also not necessarily saved.
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Jan 26, 2016 19:40
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My secret confession is that a lot of times I'll retool and level skills with the intent to try a new formation, then forget to actually toggle the skills. This leads to an awkward fight where I realize I didn't actually enable the right skills, and everybody has to grabass a bit and take more damage/stress than was probably necessary. Then, because ~Seize this Momentum~ I just get right the gently caress back to marching forward and forget to make the changes AGAIN, repeat for like 4 loving hallway fights until I open up the character sheet and make the changes. Also abomination supremacy, even if he's more expensive to level up
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Jan 26, 2016 19:42
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President Ark posted:okay, but what was your setup + strategy in that fight, pd/bh to stun, joink out of position. In rough priority, stun shooters, joink shooters forward, heal, dot shooters, stab available (pri shooters). I'm only going to learn if I don't restart, aren't I?
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Jan 26, 2016 19:52
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Daktari posted:I'm only going to learn if I don't restart, aren't I? yes because you don't get acccess to some really really important poo poo until you've been running dungeons for long enough quote:In rough priority, stun shooters, joink shooters forward, heal, dot shooters, stab available (pri shooters). that looks basically good but keep in mind you can see which enemies have actions available. if you can make an attack that isn't necessarily going to kill anything or make an attack that'll gently caress up some dude's turn who hasn't gone yet, do the latter
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Jan 26, 2016 19:53
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Lyrax posted:If you guys really really wanna target Wilbur, just Flashbang him. That's it. That's the secret. I still don't get why everyone insists on targeting Wilbur first. I mean, you look at the big pig, he's got no resistance to blight OR bleed on ANY level, right? Could just be Prince that has none. Basically, the idea is to add dots and straight damage the big pig. Assuming you can keep good health up, Wilbur's only problem is that he marks anybody. And after big pig dies, I think it's just an AoE with a slight stun chance?
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Jan 26, 2016 19:54
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 Unless you are playing some sort of weird self imposed Iron Man challenge, Do Not loving Restart Level 1 blacksmith upgrades trivialize the newbie runs, much less having a party that actually has the skillset you want unlocked and upgraded. I seriously do not understand why I keep reading people restarting the entire game every few pages. Do not do this. The Hamlet is your character, not your party members
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Jan 26, 2016 19:55
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Macaluso posted:The game is interesting in that in order to succeed you have to kind of treat all the adventurers like resources. But the game does a really good job of giving them character, even more so if you name them something personal like a movie character you like or after a family member. So you end up not wanting to let your resources die. Eh, the fact that each hero is just a default template of that class with some random quirks added makes it very easy to replace them, in my opinion. What makes me not want to lose any characters is that it's a pain grinding them back up.
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Jan 26, 2016 19:55
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widespread posted:I still don't get why everyone insists on targeting Wilbur first. I mean, you look at the big pig, he's got no resistance to blight OR bleed on ANY level, right? Could just be Prince that has none. because we've been trained for years in other RPGs that if there's a fight where you have a Big Guy In Front And Little Guy In Back you should kill the little guy first
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Jan 26, 2016 19:55
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widespread posted:I still don't get why everyone insists on targeting Wilbur first.
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Jan 26, 2016 19:56
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protomexican posted:Ves-PD-MaA-HM(Dismas) go to face the Swine God. Round 1, everyone gets stunned except MaA, who Bellows. Then the Swine God uses his AoE, which crits Dismas to Death's Door from full health. Wilbur's second move marks Dismas and another character; it ends up being a Death Blow to Dismas. I'm not about to try and kill a Champion tier boss who's still at full health with a not-full party, so luckily I bail. Sadly, Dismas was holding two of my favorite trinkets, the Ancestor's Map and the Highwayman's Buckle. Internet Kraken posted:I don't think you can blame the game if you haven't learned from the previous two swine fights not to attack Wilbur. If you find this kind of thing as funny as I do I really suggest watching people streaming Darkest Dungeon, it's full of moments like this.
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Jan 26, 2016 19:56
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President Ark posted:because we've been trained for years in other RPGs that if there's a fight where you have a Big Guy In Front And Little Guy In Back you should kill the little guy first I really hope they had this conversation at Red Hook while they designed that fight, giggling maniacally as they implemented it
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Jan 26, 2016 19:58
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Kly posted:If you find this kind of thing as funny as I do I really suggest watching people streaming Darkest Dungeon, it's full of moments like this. I watched a youtube video the other day of a guy saying over and over "I cannot possibly win these fights". Rather than retreating, he kept mashing his guys into the enemy until he lost everything. He'd been playing the game for over a loving year.
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Jan 26, 2016 20:00
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If they had designed the Swine King fight to not have Wilbur and just have the Swine King take two actions a round and have the first action always be to mark your guys, nobody would ever have these
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Jan 26, 2016 20:00
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Mzbundifund posted:If they had designed the Swine King fight to not have Wilbur and just have the Swine King take two actions a round and have the first action always be to mark your guys, nobody would ever have these That's basically the prophet in a nutshell and there are no good prophet stories, so yeah
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Jan 26, 2016 20:03
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I read ahead on what the Prophet does and made a team of Arbalest/Houndmaster/Gravedigger/Hellion and just mashed the poo poo out of him with marks and back row targeting attacks. Start off with the double mark on arbalest and houndmaster and just spam Dagger Throw/Iron Swan/Sniper Shot until he dies 3 turns later. Also just a fantastic party in general. edit: Iron swan is just one of my favorite attacks ever. As far as I know it's the only melee class attack that can be used from the front row on the very back row and it always seems to crit with Hellion's awesome crit boosting equips.
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Jan 26, 2016 20:08
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victrix posted:I really hope they had this conversation at Red Hook while they designed that fight, giggling maniacally as they implemented it There's no way the decision to make Wilbur's mark able to stun wasn't a deliberate choice to goad you into hitting him and getting your face chopped off
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Jan 26, 2016 20:12
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Daktari posted:I know you guys say not to restart, but I keep doing it anyways. While any comp can run through low level dungeons, some compositions handle bad luck better than others. A vest/pd/bounty/maa is honestly not a very good comp. Its doable you'll have long fights which just means there are more ways for things to go wrong. The way DD is set up right now you want burst damage and specifically burst damage on the back rows. As you say : Daktari posted:pd/bh to stun, joink out of position. So as you can see its going to take several turns to work through the enemies, mean while they are exposing you to lots of attacks which means damage + stress + chance for things to go badly. On the other hand, say you had a composition of like, ves,gr,gr,cr. Your two GR can lunge on the first turn, often even taking the first move before any enemy action due to their high speed. This will kill at least one enemy, maybe two. A high roll on their base damage will one hit a back liner. On the other hand with your comp is far more likely to miss (MA/BH 85% accuarcy on their attacks) and don't have the damage range to 1 hit an enemy with out a crit. So you should build comps that have good back row reach and high damage so you have shorter fights and can take out the more critical targets.. Your comp has neither which is why you struggled. Your lineup isn't bad, but it does make you more susceptible to poor luck simply because fights will take longer. Now of course, you won't be able to pick and choose to build good parties initially because your stage coach is low. Which again, is one of the reason why you shouldn't restart. Its hard to build optimal comps early in the game because the pool you have to draw from will be so sparse. Similarly your supply of trinkets will let even level 0 characters be a lot more powerful. The hellion's iron swain for example, goes from good to amazing when it can reliably one-hit enemies due to the damage trinkets you can put on her. Economy of action. Legacyspy fucked around with this message at 20:27 on Jan 26, 2016 |
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Jan 26, 2016 20:21
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They should add retreat barks bc honestly maybe having your custom-named Bounter Hunter "OG 24/7 HOOKMASTER" yell "we should retreat!" after one person died and two others are on death's door will get the point across. Unspeakable Commune is the worst "no ambush" skill, though maybe it's another indirect way of nerfing the abomination since you can't use Vestal's Sanctuary or the Cursader's Vigil. There's another one isn't there? Anyway, 3 time cost seems kind of high for something that also stresses out your party. Sanctuary is incredible for long missions by the way -- it gives crazy health / stress heals to death's door people so you can bounce back hard from a struggling mission.
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Jan 26, 2016 20:25
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i thought wilbur could aoe stun in the Swine God fight without the big guy being dead, but i've never fought it so idk in any event, 
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Jan 26, 2016 20:27
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Highwayman has Bandit's Sense, which prevents the ambush and also increases your chance of surprising enemies. I'm pretty sure the houndmaster has an almost identical skill.
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Jan 26, 2016 20:27
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RoboCicero posted:Sanctuary is incredible for long missions by the way -- it gives crazy health / stress heals to death's door people so you can bounce back hard from a struggling mission. When I sent my third-string team into the ridiculously long Darkest Dungeon endurance mission this bailed my rear end out in a huge way. Highwayman and Houndmaster also have no-ambush skills, so it's not like the Abomination is that hard up for options. Occultists and Houndmasters are both very good companions for abom anyhow.
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Jan 26, 2016 20:28
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DOWN JACKET FETISH posted:i thought wilbur could aoe stun in the Swine God fight without the big guy being dead, but i've never fought it so idk he can stun 2, but not 3
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Jan 26, 2016 20:29
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I know everybody hates that bandit gunman guy but this little prick's always at the top of my Must Kill list.
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Jan 26, 2016 20:30
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victrix posted:Hamlet is your character, not your party members
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Jan 26, 2016 20:32
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Bad Seafood posted:I know everybody hates that bandit gunman guy but this little prick's always at the top of my Must Kill list. yeah if you could ever hit the fucker apparently being a dead noble makes you a master of evasion?? 
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Jan 26, 2016 20:33
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DOWN JACKET FETISH posted:yeah if you could ever hit the fucker Dismas are you sticking your gun in the hellion's armpit again? Look man, we don't care what you get up to in your off time but this is not appropriate workplace behavior IMHO
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Jan 26, 2016 20:35
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I've actually found some value in immediately restarting your game, but it has less to do with doing badly and more to do with doing better. A pitch black tutorial run has a high chance of scoring you enough deeds to upgrade your stagecoach twice right off the bat for four fresh recruits as early as week two (verses ordinarily only being able to upgrade it once, getting three new guys, and having to send back in one of the guys who just got back). It's not a huge advantage since most people will be able to upgrade the stagecoach again by week two or three anyway, but it's a nice little bonus to get you started. If you're already in up your knees though, there's no point in turning back.
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Jan 26, 2016 20:42
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DOWN JACKET FETISH posted:i thought wilbur could aoe stun in the Swine God fight without the big guy being dead, but i've never fought it so idk Thought this was gonna be Undertale fanart for a second.
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Jan 26, 2016 20:49
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Dumb question, but say you lose all your higher level guys and have to rely on level 0-1s. Will the game continue to throw veteran levels, or will it drop back to apprentice levels? Asking for a friend.
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Jan 26, 2016 20:54
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There will still be high level dungeons offered, but the game will never ONLY offer high level dungeons. You'll always have apprentice level available.
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Jan 26, 2016 20:57
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at this point I think the fact that this game draws in some laughable idiocy about its mechanics is some kind of meta commentary comparable to the Ancestor going mad by way of bad decisions and refusing to halt said decisions. Internet Kraken posted:I watched a youtube video the other day of a guy saying over and over "I cannot possibly win these fights". Rather than retreating, he kept mashing his guys into the enemy until he lost everything. poo poo like this is amazing. Also, this: victrix posted:The Hamlet is your character, not your party members This is OP-worthy. Recently wrote a bunch of poo poo in a review about this game and I had the same view of things. restarting is the dumbest loving thing you can do because the whole point of why this is actually easier than certain roguelikes is that The Hamlet's upgrades eventually make your battles easier and your characters stronger.
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Jan 26, 2016 21:01
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victrix posted:The Hamlet is your character, not your party members This is OP worthy.
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Jan 26, 2016 21:11
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Now you, like me, are a part of this place.
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Jan 26, 2016 21:13
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Also, if you are struggling to keep your lower level dudes alive investing in lowering the cost of blacksmith and guild upgrades is a good idea. It's much less painful to train up a bunch of new level 1s and 2s when their upgrades cost half the original price.
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Jan 26, 2016 21:18
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Likewise, focusing on the bar & cloister over any of the other things gives you plenty of cheap and effective stress treatment. Also, learning when to cure stress, when to let heroes just sit, and when to keep pushing them into dungeons goes a long way. Like, I spent the first couple weeks doing low light/supply runs and just kicking out the first few heroes that topped out on stress and I've never had to worry about money since. I haven't even sold a trinket at this point.
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Jan 26, 2016 21:23
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I only ever pay to use the tavern/church whenever one of my guys gets afflicted. Eventually you get enough people that you can just send out a different team each time and let people destress naturally. Also maybe run jesters instead of listening to people who say they're bad???
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Jan 26, 2016 21:56
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