|
This whole situation screams how good these dolts had it before putting themselves in the spotlight after having read their criminal histories. So many of them had their freedom from the law on the basis of restriction of weapons or other court orders. They were able to have their weapons & do whatever stupid poo poo they wanted - like joining a role playing state militia - in private, but decided to stand up for a doomed cause in an incredibly stupid, public manner. So now pictured with weapons, that many are banned from possessing, tromping around like wanna-be soldiers, including a few who are on the thin edge of stolen valor. Because they're in the spotlight the media is rooting out their actual history and publishing it for everybody to realize how terrible they are as people. They all seem to be akin to hick-role players who made up their noble anti-government, freeman fighter history upon aligning with their local 'militia' & nobody in their group bothers to fact check one another so long as it gives with 'gently caress the gov'ment.  ' These dolts had relatively un-encombered lives despite their criminal histories and decided to air it out for everybody to see in the name of a cause that was doomed to fail from the get go. The best part of all of this is the calamity of their uncoordinated actions that they had so well planned and masturbated too leading up to the actual clusterfuck that has unfolded. If it had only gone the way of Lavoy's book... Oh well at least on of his 25 kids can pick up the slack for dad Fight on you 4 brave souls on top of that snowy, dildo littered hill. The Dildo Hill event will be one for the history books next to Ruby Ridge & Waco. You'll see. onemanlan has issued a correction as of 15:15 on Feb 4, 2016 |
#
?
Feb 4, 2016 15:09
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 28, 2024 11:36 |
|
|
whoa
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2016 15:18
|
|
|
A Stupid Baby posted:Brown and his family were definitely hardline christian freaks, but he actually had a fairly disproportionate amount of non-christians and even atheists (fairly rare at the time, esp in KS) in his group. I think there were 2 atheist brothers in the group that ended up at Harper's Ferry. He also had financial ties to and a relationship with Emerson/Thoreau's group. Everyone knows about Harper's Ferry, but a lot of people are unaware that before that, John Brown fitted himself and a large anti-slavery militia with claymores and went around killing pro-slavery settlers in Kansas to prevent it from becoming a slave state. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pottawatomie_massacre just one episode in a largely undocumented spree of violence. dude owned.
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2016 15:19
|
|
|
TacticalUrbanHomo posted:Everyone knows about Harper's Ferry, but a lot of people are unaware that before that, John Brown fitted himself and a large anti-slavery militia with claymores and went around killing pro-slavery settlers in Kansas to prevent it from becoming a slave state. My grandpa 
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2016 15:20
|
|
|
A Stupid Baby posted:They certainly didn't want the slaves hanging around and a lot of them favored shipping everyone left back to Africa Ahhh, the Australian Solution. It worked so well, many Australians don't even know there was a period when our country had slavery.
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2016 15:23
|
|
|
Alan Smithee posted:My favorite quote about the civil war. I don't know if it was by a goon but I heard it from a good anyway: those who know nothing about the civil war think it was about slavery. Those who know a little about the civil war know it was about state's rights. Those who know a lot about the civil war know it was about slavery It might actually be Dave Barry, there's a bit in his book on american history that goes something like "in grade school you learn the Civil war was about slavery, then in junior high you learn it was actually about many factors like state's rights, in high school you learn it was about economics, and then you learn in college that, well, really it was just about slavery all along." I mean he's probably not the first or the only to make that observation but that's the first time I heard it. TacticalUrbanHomo posted:Everyone knows about Harper's Ferry, but a lot of people are unaware that before that, John Brown fitted himself and a large anti-slavery militia with claymores and went around killing pro-slavery settlers in Kansas to prevent it from becoming a slave state. It's kind of hilarious that people were still using old rear end weapons just because there weren't always enough guns or ammunition. He was also far from the only one running militias, Kansas and Missouri had groups from both states riding across the border and killing folk and razing cities (most of the violence took place in KS, since Missouri was already guaranteed to be a slave state, and Kansas would be determined by internal vote) Here's my favorite book on the conflict. It might be a bit ball-washy since it kind of sets out to paint Brown as a (somewhat personally flawed) hero but I'd agree with that position personally so A Stupid Baby has issued a correction as of 15:38 on Feb 4, 2016 |
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2016 15:36
|
|
|
A Stupid Baby posted:It's kind of hilarious that people were still using old rear end weapons just because there weren't always enough guns or ammunition. kind of, but probably on the less interesting side of historical episodes of anachronistic weapon use
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2016 15:41
|
|
|
His use of broadswords was more influenced by scripture IIRC They had guns with them at the time.
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2016 15:44
|
|
|
Why were slave states so worried about slavery not expanding into the new states? How would that affect business for them? Wouldn't new states having a free labor force keep them from being competitive with the South?
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2016 16:07
|
|
|
Liquid Dinosaur posted:Why were slave states so worried about slavery not expanding into the new states? How would that affect business for them? Wouldn't new states having a free labor force keep them from being competitive with the South? It was about maintaining the balance of free vs slave states in congress. Otherwise, the free states would eventually have the political power to end slavery through legislation or amendment.
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2016 16:08
|
|
|
Liquid Dinosaur posted:Why were slave states so worried about slavery not expanding into the new states? How would that affect business for them? Wouldn't new states having a free labor force keep them from being competitive with the South? then free states would outnumber slave states in congress, and would start doing things like passing laws saying maybe it's not cool to use a person like property
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2016 16:09
|
|
|
Mr. Pumroy posted:then free states would outnumber slave states in congress, and would start doing things like passing laws saying maybe it's not cool to use a person like property See: if republicans own both house, Senate, and presidency: REPAEAL OBUMMERCARE could happen
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2016 16:18
|
|
|
TacticalUrbanHomo posted:kind of, but probably on the less interesting side of historical episodes of anachronistic weapon use Don't forget that in the run-up to the Civil War, various local governments were stocking up on pikes, really long spears, since they didn't expect to have enough guns. John Brown stocked up on pikes for the Harper's Ferry raid in expectation of having hundreds more slaves uprising then he'd have guns for. And in Georgia, Governor Joe Brown stocked up pikes to arm troops, figuring the frontline guys would have guns and then the reserve force could charge in with spears. The idea was not well-received: http://hsgng.org/legacy/pages/joebrownpike.htm
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2016 16:22
|
|
|
yeah the popular sovereignty clause of the kansas nebraska act was supposed to calm things down by giving the choice of expanding slavery to the settlers in the territories but unsurprisingly it lead to people massacring each other eg bleeding kansas to help their side win you have to be extremely stupid to think it was about anything other than slavery which probably explains the lost cause myth is so popular in the south
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2016 16:23
|
|
|
are the tarptastic four still holding out? i wonder what they do all day
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2016 16:31
|
|
|
XMNN posted:yeah the popular sovereignty clause of the kansas nebraska act was supposed to calm things down by giving the choice of expanding slavery to the settlers in the territories but unsurprisingly it lead to people massacring each other eg bleeding kansas to help their side win also pretty much everywhere else in the western civilized world had already abolished slavery and americans still looked to europe for a lot of their culture and ideas
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2016 16:37
|
|
|
Tricky D posted:It was about maintaining the balance of free vs slave states in congress. Otherwise, the free states would eventually have the political power to end slavery through legislation or amendment. And they would oppose slavery and vote for its abolition due to a combination of "instead of zero-pay slaves we'd prefer our states be full of low-pay poor white Americans and European immigrants" and "while we are incredibly racist and would not welcome black people into our communities, literally owning human beings is super not okay"?
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2016 17:12
|
|
|
The feds unsealed the indictment against the Tarp Rangers: http://media.oregonlive.com/oregon-standoff/other/2016/02/04/INDICTMENTBUNDYS.pdf
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2016 17:58
|
|
|
wtf is up with that signature
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2016 18:06
|
|
|
Liquid Dinosaur posted:And they would oppose slavery and vote for its abolition due to a combination of "instead of zero-pay slaves we'd prefer our states be full of low-pay poor white Americans and European immigrants" and "while we are incredibly racist and would not welcome black people into our communities, literally owning human beings is super not okay"? The three-fifths compromise gave slave states representative power in excess of their voting population and was thus unpopular in the north.
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2016 18:10
|
|
|
Posture Pal posted:The feds unsealed the indictment against the Tarp Rangers:
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2016 18:16
|
|
|
theflyingorc posted:I'll have to search for the article, but we definitely have evidence it was going on. If i forget to look it up tomorrow, pm me if you would ARGH I can't find the article I read previously and it's driving me crazy. The one detail I remember strongly is that a young black girl wrote a letter to FDR asking him to come save her brother, because some men stole him and forced him to work on their farm. FDR was president during the 30s and 40s so, uh, that's pretty bad
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2016 18:17
|
|
|
XMNN posted:wtf is up with that signature Ulillillia strikes again
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2016 18:18
|
|
|
theflyingorc posted:ARGH I can't find the article I read previously and it's driving me crazy. The one detail I remember strongly is that a young black girl wrote a letter to FDR asking him to come save her brother, because some men stole him and forced him to work on their farm. I think it was this one. Lady wrote to Teddy Roosevelt to try and free her boy. No reply, letter found in the archives. Well written article, makes me want to read the book. http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=89051115 winnydpu has issued a correction as of 18:27 on Feb 4, 2016 |
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2016 18:21
|
|
|
winnydpu posted:I think it was this one. Lady write to Teddy Roosevelt to try and free her boy. No reply, letter found in the archives. Well written article, makes me want to read the book. I found some of that one, but the original article I read wasn't talking about "Slavery Under Another Name". To some degree, literal slavery still occurred at least for another 40-50 years in small pockets. It's just been years since I read the article and using terms like "america" and "slavery" don't narrow down your search results much. :\
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2016 18:25
|
|
|
XMNN posted:are the tarptastic four still holding out? Pretty much the same thing they would do any other day, try to take over the world
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2016 18:27
|
|
|
lol they better hope thats the only charge or some of these people are fuuuucked heres another armed stand off where they got the impeding federal officers charge and some other stuff some of these people are probably guilty of https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edward_and_Elaine_Brown quote:As a result of the events during the standoff, Edward and Elaine Brown were indicted on January 21, 2009, [big list of charges]
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2016 18:32
|
|
|
XMNN posted:are the tarptastic four still holding out? Their daily routine probably resembles something between Sartre's "No Exit" and Beckett's "Endgame."
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2016 18:32
|
|
|
Proper signature for Willy Williams
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2016 18:44
|
|
|
you're all still slaves
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2016 18:48
|
|
|
roymorrison posted:you're all still slaves https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ONKi2S6YBSU
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2016 18:49
|
|
|
theflyingorc posted:I found some of that one, but the original article I read wasn't talking about "Slavery Under Another Name". To some degree, literal slavery still occurred at least for another 40-50 years in small pockets. It's just been years since I read the article and using terms like "america" and "slavery" don't narrow down your search results much. :\ I mentioned sharecropping before, but I remembered another form that popped up, especially in the American South during in the Reconstruction and into the post-war period, and that's chain gangs and convict labor. That poo poo was notorious and it heavily slanted toward imprisoning blacks, as well as poor whites.
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2016 19:39
|
|
|
XMNN posted:lol they better hope thats the only charge or some of these people are fuuuucked Man, you skipped the best part! quote:The Browns were arrested by undercover officers, who were invited by the Browns into the Brown residence on the evening of Thursday, October 4, 2007. "[B]efore the couple realized they weren't supporters, they were already under arrest." A local television station quoted U.S. Marshal Monier as saying: "Ultimately, this open-door policy that they [the Browns] seemed to have which allowed the Browns to have some supporters bring them supplies, welcome followers and even host a picnic—this proved to be their undoing… They invited us in. We escorted them out."
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2016 20:03
|
|
|
Not to put too many more tangents up this thread, but I'm reminded of what Chelsea Handler did when she was filming her Racism segment. Chelsea went to Tallahassee and walked up to a bunch of Civil War re-enactors getting ready to re-enact something (the Southern side) and when she asked them what the Civil War was about, they instantly answered 'states rights.' Hokayyyy... They went on to say slave owners weren't cruel as a general principle, and that slaves were happy and that they even had stories of content and happy slaves handed down from generation to generation. Then they got uppity and accused her of bringing in 'hurtful' stereotypes into the conversation. After this, she walks across the street to a food stand with funnel cakes and barbecue run by black folks (which is telling in of itself as they didn't seem to have any white customers other than Chelsea) and she asks them if they knew any 'happy' slave stories. They pretty much answered that slavery was horrible and they had absolutely no 'happy stories' to tell about it, none of their ancestors were happy about it, but it may have been the only thing they knew. The barbecue cook calls Chelsea cute, but also remarks that only in this day and age could he have made that comment without getting thrown in the nearby river. The segment exits with Chelsea noting that if the Civil War re-enactors are insufferable now, imagine what they were like 50-100 years ago, she also says she wants to live in a world where a person of any color can hit on her. Binary Badger has issued a correction as of 20:11 on Feb 4, 2016 |
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2016 20:07
|
|
|
MisterOblivious posted:Man, you skipped the best part! I was just going to post that exact quote. Here's another one from the post-trial timeline: quote:On June 18, the Browns host a press conference at their home with Randy Weaver, whose wife and 14-year old son had been killed by federal agents during a standoff in Ruby Ridge, Idaho, in 1992. Weaver voices his support for the Browns, and the Browns reiterate their intentions to avoid arrest by the government ed. lol: Edward-Lewis: Brown, Creditor Holder-in-due-Course with unlimited commercial liability and Elaine-Alice:Brown, Creditor Holder-in-due-Course with unlimited commercial liability posted:
count_von_count has issued a correction as of 21:05 on Feb 4, 2016 |
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2016 20:34
|
|
|
Lol that brown case. The sheriff and police should protect me, but I won't contribute money to their paychecks. They provide me no service
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2016 20:56
|
|
|
Posture Pal posted:The feds unsealed the indictment against the Tarp Rangers: That charge of conspiracy to impede an officer from carrying out their duties carries a max sentence of 6 years: https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/372 I assume in theory they could be charged separately for each officer they conspired to impede? Which, since they ostensibly planned to maintain control of the facility forever, would include the entire staff of the wildlife refuge and perhaps more? Edit: I guess not, or the indictment wouldn't just say "Count 1: Conspiracy to Impede Officers" and leave it at that. McNerd has issued a correction as of 21:42 on Feb 4, 2016 |
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2016 21:27
|
|
|
McNerd posted:That charge of conspiracy to impede an officer from carrying out their duties carries a max sentence of 6 years: I guess the FBI escorted some ranchers onto the refuge to do some irrigation work. Now because Fry is a dumbass who doesn't understand much of anything he got all paranoid about it and thought they were lying.
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2016 21:42
|
|
|
so, uh (from under a picture on OregonLive)quote:Rancher Cliven Bundy speaks to media while standing along the road near his ranch Wednesday, Jan. 27, 2016, in Bunkerville, Nev. Cliven Bundy and his wife Carol Bundy were returning from a trip to visit the family of LaVoy Finicum, a 55-year-old rancher from Cane Beds, Ariz., who died Tuesday after law enforcement officers initiated a traffic stop near the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge. It's unclear what happened in the moments before his death. (AP Photo/John Locher) hey FBI, next time Cliven goes somewhere, please arrest him like you did his son. Thanks.
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2016 21:45
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 28, 2024 11:36 |
|
|
onemanlan posted:The Dildo Hill event will be one for the history books next to Ruby Ridge & Waco. You'll see. Dildo Hill will be Obama's Waterloo. You just wait and see.
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2016 21:51
|
|
