CanPol Megathread: Big Changus

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Risky Bisquick: Jan 18, 2008; PLEASE LET ME WRITE YOUR VICTIM IMPACT STATEMENT SO I CAN FURTHER DEMONSTRATE THE CALAMITY THAT IS OUR JUSTICE SYSTEM.; Buglord

vyelkin posted:

There are three big problems I see with this map.

1) It is not inflation-adjusted, which means have-not provinces right now come off looking far worse than provinces that were have-nots in 1957 but haves today.

2) It singles out one portion of federal transfer payments without recognizing that all provinces receive billions of dollars in transfer payments besides equalization. But for the less financially literate people who are sharing this on facebook, it seems like certain provinces are paying and paying and paying and never getting anything back, which while technically true under equalization alone is not actually representative of the larger financial picture. I would hazard a guess that a large number of Canadians don't realize that the Canada Health Transfer and Canada Social Transfer are separate things from Equalization payments, and so simply don't realize that even though Alberta is not receiving any equalization payments, they are still receiving $5.8B in transfer payments that are paid for through Canada-wide taxation.

3) Equalization as the name of a specific transfer payment program only came into being in 1957, but the federal government has been making equalization-like transfers since Confederation. So when this image says "lifetime" amounts, what it means is "amounts since 1957" which, while technically true, is again misleading because if you don't know the history of the equalization program it's easy to fall into easy mental traps like thinking this means since the beginning of time and implies that, for example, Alberta has been being exploited forever when actually Alberta was a huge recipient of federal transfers in the mould of equalization, it just happened before 1957 so isn't recognized here.

Again, everything about the map is technically accurate. As far as I can tell it is indeed an accurate map of lifetime provincial equalization payments. But it's very disingenuous because it leads the reader to conclusions that aren't actually true unless that reader already knows a lot about the history and inner workings of transfer payments, the equalization program in specific, and the way money changes over time.

e: and population/per capita which slipped my mind when I was writing this but Ikantski brought up, that too.

http://www.freealberta.com/transfer_payments.html

# ? Feb 11, 2016 16:27

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# ? May 18, 2024 20:12

PT6A: Jan 5, 2006; Public school teachers are callous dictators who won't lift a finger to stop children from peeing in my plane

Ikantski posted:

They don't factor populations which are a big component

vyelkin posted:

There are three big problems I see with this map.

1) It is not inflation-adjusted, which means have-not provinces right now come off looking far worse than provinces that were have-nots in 1957 but haves today.

2) It singles out one portion of federal transfer payments without recognizing that all provinces receive billions of dollars in transfer payments besides equalization. But for the less financially literate people who are sharing this on facebook, it seems like certain provinces are paying and paying and paying and never getting anything back, which while technically true under equalization alone is not actually representative of the larger financial picture. I would hazard a guess that a large number of Canadians don't realize that the Canada Health Transfer and Canada Social Transfer are separate things from Equalization payments, and so simply don't realize that even though Alberta is not receiving any equalization payments, they are still receiving $5.8B in transfer payments that are paid for through Canada-wide taxation.

3) Equalization as the name of a specific transfer payment program only came into being in 1957, but the federal government has been making equalization-like transfers since Confederation. So when this image says "lifetime" amounts, what it means is "amounts since 1957" which, while technically true, is again misleading because if you don't know the history of the equalization program it's easy to fall into easy mental traps like thinking this means since the beginning of time and implies that, for example, Alberta has been being exploited forever when actually Alberta was a huge recipient of federal transfers in the mould of equalization, it just happened before 1957 so isn't recognized here.

Again, everything about the map is technically accurate. As far as I can tell it is indeed an accurate map of lifetime provincial equalization payments. But it's very disingenuous because it leads the reader to conclusions that aren't actually true unless that reader already knows a lot about the history and inner workings of transfer payments, the equalization program in specific, and the way money changes over time.

e: and population/per capita which slipped my mind when I was writing this but Ikantski brought up, that too.

Who gives a gently caress? You're pissing and moaning about a map that even you admit is technically accurate, and I would disagree with the assertion that it's made to be in any way misleading. If people are idiots that can't interpret maps, like this one, which are simple as they can possibly be, the problem is with their broken brains, not with the map in question.

You can criticize Brad Wall and his followers for a lot of things that aren't just slights you've conjured up in your head, so why focus on something as inconsequential as this map, which even you admit is accurate?

# ? Feb 11, 2016 16:30

Risky Bisquick: Jan 18, 2008; PLEASE LET ME WRITE YOUR VICTIM IMPACT STATEMENT SO I CAN FURTHER DEMONSTRATE THE CALAMITY THAT IS OUR JUSTICE SYSTEM.; Buglord

PT6A posted:

Who gives a gently caress? You're pissing and moaning about a map that even you admit is technically accurate, and I would disagree with the assertion that it's made to be in any way misleading. If people are idiots that can't interpret maps, like this one, which are simple as they can possibly be, the problem is with their broken brains, not with the map in question.

You can criticize Brad Wall and his followers for a lot of things that aren't just slights you've conjured up in your head, so why focus on something as inconsequential as this map, which even you admit is accurate?

His map is pandering to widespread sentiment in the region. Are you inferring the region as a whole are 'idiots' as you suggest then? I would've expected that a resident of the greatest province in the dominion such as yourself would think much more highly of your fellow Albertans and Sasquatches.

# ? Feb 11, 2016 16:37

Postess with the Mostest: Apr 4, 2007; Arabian nights
'neath Arabian moons
A fool off his guard
could fall and fall hard
out there on the dunes

PT6A posted:

Who gives a gently caress?

Toronto gets more federal money than Regina, its bullshit, they're both cities!!

# ? Feb 11, 2016 16:46

PT6A: Jan 5, 2006; Public school teachers are callous dictators who won't lift a finger to stop children from peeing in my plane

jm20 posted:

His map is pandering to widespread sentiment in the region. Are you inferring the region as a whole are 'idiots' as you suggest then? I would've expected that a resident of the greatest province in the dominion such as yourself would think much more highly of your fellow Albertans and Sasquatches.

I think it's okay to be upset with the disparity in equalization while still accepting that Alberta receives other forms of federal support. It's less okay now that the Prime Minister has promised a huge amount of money for infrastructure development in Alberta, mind you.

Also, if you think I don't like calling my fellow Albertans a bunch of ignorant loving morons, you obviously haven't been paying attention. The average Albertan is somewhere between Rhesus macaque and lowland gorilla in intelligence. And I don't mean one of the ones that's learned sign language, either...

# ? Feb 11, 2016 16:49

namaste friends: Sep 18, 2004; by Smythe

I don't even know who the gently caress Brad wall is and I'm pretty sure it doesn't matter either

# ? Feb 11, 2016 16:51

PT6A: Jan 5, 2006; Public school teachers are callous dictators who won't lift a finger to stop children from peeing in my plane

Cultural Imperial posted:

I don't even know who the gently caress Brad wall is and I'm pretty sure it doesn't matter either

He's the idiot king of Saskatchewan, and a window into what Alberta would look like in an alternate universe where we'd voted for ~~Dumbo the Elephant~~ Brian Jean and the Wildrose party.

# ? Feb 11, 2016 16:53

Hexigrammus: May 22, 2006; Cheech Wizard stories are clean, wholesome, reflective truths that go great with the marijuana munchies and a blow job.

PT6A posted:

Also, if you think I don't like calling my fellow Albertans a bunch of ignorant loving morons, you obviously haven't been paying attention. The average Albertan is somewhere between Rhesus macaque and lowland gorilla in intelligence. And I don't mean one of the ones that's learned sign language, either...

I wish you'd quit slandering macaques. They're highly social, inventive and very cool little monkeys.

# ? Feb 11, 2016 17:00

Chicken: Apr 23, 2014

PT6A posted:

He's the idiot king of Saskatchewan, and a window into what Alberta would look like in an alternate universe where we'd voted for ~~Dumbo the Elephant~~ Brian Jean and the Wildrose party.

Brad Wall used to be relatively left wing. He didn't get along with Harper, he didn't shut down any crown corporations, didn't lower taxes too much (if at all?) during the resource boom, wasn't overtly racist. Exactly what you'd expect from somebody on the center-right. Since Notley and Trudeau, he seems to have gone a little crazy.

# ? Feb 11, 2016 17:03

ZShakespeare: Jul 20, 2003; The devil can cite Scripture for his purpose!

You should all be glad for this map. Please help convince Alberta to leave the country.

# ? Feb 11, 2016 17:18

Risky Bisquick: Jan 18, 2008; PLEASE LET ME WRITE YOUR VICTIM IMPACT STATEMENT SO I CAN FURTHER DEMONSTRATE THE CALAMITY THAT IS OUR JUSTICE SYSTEM.; Buglord

quote:

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/hamilton/news/tim-bosma-trial-trailer-with-truck-left-unsecured-during-police-transport-1.3441914?cmp=rss

Tim Bosma trial: Trailer with truck left unsecured during police transport

Box fell out of trailer onto highway and was run over by police car

New topic, Law enforcement exceptionalism extends beyond the RCMP to the OPP.

# ? Feb 11, 2016 17:41

PhilippAchtel: May 31, 2011

PT6A posted:

Who gives a gently caress? You're pissing and moaning about a map that even you admit is technically accurate, and I would disagree with the assertion that it's made to be in any way misleading. If people are idiots that can't interpret maps, like this one, which are simple as they can possibly be, the problem is with their broken brains, not with the map in question.

Personally, I found the discussion about different kinds of transfers and how equalization payments are only a part to be much more interesting than whatever point it is you think you're making here, so to each their own. :shrug:

# ? Feb 11, 2016 17:47

PT6A: Jan 5, 2006; Public school teachers are callous dictators who won't lift a finger to stop children from peeing in my plane

I agree that the discussion about various forms of federal support other than equalization is interesting, and it's an important discussion to have, but it's one that doesn't involve that map, which is both accurate and wholly irrelevant.

# ? Feb 11, 2016 17:50

Monaghan: Dec 29, 2006

Chicken posted:

Brad Wall used to be relatively left wing. He didn't get along with Harper, he didn't shut down any crown corporations, didn't lower taxes too much (if at all?) during the resource boom, wasn't overtly racist. Exactly what you'd expect from somebody on the center-right. Since Notley and Trudeau, he seems to have gone a little crazy.

I posted that chart earlier. Now that he can't coast on the oil boom, he's Brad's just trying to bring up " hey us westerners hate the loving east" poo poo that prairie politicians use all the time when things go south.

Ikantski posted:

Toronto gets more federal money than Regina, its bullshit, they're both cities!!

He elaborates on this in his facebook post his own loving info indicates that we maybe receive a percent less in equalization payments relative to our population size and people in my province are still pissed off about it. gently caress this place.

Monaghan fucked around with this message at 18:04 on Feb 11, 2016

# ? Feb 11, 2016 17:59

PhilippAchtel: May 31, 2011

PT6A posted:

I agree that the discussion about various forms of federal support other than equalization is interesting, and it's an important discussion to have, but it's one that doesn't involve that map, which is both accurate and wholly irrelevant.

"Wholly irrelevant"? God only knows why you think it was drafted in the first place.

# ? Feb 11, 2016 18:07

namaste friends: Sep 18, 2004; by Smythe

lol an actual premier of a province is posting poo poo unironically on facebook

# ? Feb 11, 2016 18:12

PT6A: Jan 5, 2006; Public school teachers are callous dictators who won't lift a finger to stop children from peeing in my plane

PhilippAchtel posted:

"Wholly irrelevant"? God only knows why you think it was drafted in the first place.

To show the distribution of equalization payments. It's fine if you think that it should be "total federal support received," but it's not, and the fact that the map you're talking about is not the map you want to talk about is not a failing of the map.

# ? Feb 11, 2016 18:13

namaste friends: Sep 18, 2004; by Smythe

maybe christy can release the next budget on facebook

# ? Feb 11, 2016 18:13

Fried Watermelon: Dec 29, 2008

ZShakespeare posted:

You should all be glad for this map. Please help convince Alberta to leave the country.

Then they would have no one to bitch about when they gently caress up again!

# ? Feb 11, 2016 18:13

vyelkin: Jan 2, 2011

PT6A posted:

To show the distribution of equalization payments. It's fine if you think that it should be "total federal support received," but it's not, and the fact that the map you're talking about is not the map you want to talk about is not a failing of the map.

Okay, but why do you think Brad Wall posted a map showing the distribution of equalization payments?

# ? Feb 11, 2016 18:13

Risky Bisquick: Jan 18, 2008; PLEASE LET ME WRITE YOUR VICTIM IMPACT STATEMENT SO I CAN FURTHER DEMONSTRATE THE CALAMITY THAT IS OUR JUSTICE SYSTEM.; Buglord

Cultural Imperial posted:

maybe christy can release the next budget on facebook

She should release it while doing Yoga Day on the bridge

# ? Feb 11, 2016 18:14

infernal machines: Oct 11, 2012; we monitor many frequencies. we listen always. came a voice, out of the babel of tongues, speaking to us. it played us a mighty dub.

The author is dead! There's no such thing as intent!

We can only judge the work by its literal content.

# ? Feb 11, 2016 18:14

cowofwar: Jul 30, 2002; by Athanatos

Cultural Imperial posted:

lol an actual premier of a province is posting poo poo unironically on facebook

I assume this is because no one actually is interested in what he has to say outside mouth breathing retards on social media.

# ? Feb 11, 2016 18:18

CLAM DOWN: Feb 13, 2007; nesaM killed Masen

Christie Clark is hilarious right now tbh, slamming Alberta is always awesome but she and her party couldn't govern their way out of a wet paper bag.

# ? Feb 11, 2016 18:22

DariusLikewise: Oct 4, 2008; You wore that on Halloween?

Cultural Imperial posted:

maybe christy can release the next budget on facebook

Only if its done on a 300x600px infographic or else you will lose everyones attention

# ? Feb 11, 2016 18:25

PT6A: Jan 5, 2006; Public school teachers are callous dictators who won't lift a finger to stop children from peeing in my plane

vyelkin posted:

Okay, but why do you think Brad Wall posted a map showing the distribution of equalization payments?

Presumably to make a point about the equalisation payment system specifically. It's possible to disagree with elements of that system while agreeing with the system of payments from federal to provincial government overall.

# ? Feb 11, 2016 18:44

namaste friends: Sep 18, 2004; by Smythe

I'm reading that Toronto thinks its on par with London and decided to build an express train from the airport. half a billion dollars and no one's taking it. lol you loving wannabes

# ? Feb 11, 2016 19:15

namaste friends: Sep 18, 2004; by Smythe

https://twitter.com/VanHumane/status/697841786731954176

Excellent. gently caress rural culture

# ? Feb 11, 2016 19:21

ZShakespeare: Jul 20, 2003; The devil can cite Scripture for his purpose!

Cultural Imperial posted:

https://twitter.com/VanHumane/status/697841786731954176

Excellent. gently caress rural culture

You didn't put scare quotes around "culture"

# ? Feb 11, 2016 19:22

namaste friends: Sep 18, 2004; by Smythe

https://twitter.com/stephenfgordon/status/697845039079280641

:lol:

# ? Feb 11, 2016 19:22

HookShot: Dec 26, 2005

Cultural Imperial posted:

https://twitter.com/VanHumane/status/697841786731954176

Excellent. gently caress rural culture

Good. Abbotsford is the biggest hole.

# ? Feb 11, 2016 19:33

Risky Bisquick: Jan 18, 2008; PLEASE LET ME WRITE YOUR VICTIM IMPACT STATEMENT SO I CAN FURTHER DEMONSTRATE THE CALAMITY THAT IS OUR JUSTICE SYSTEM.; Buglord

I brought it up once, BOD had no comment. Our budget is going to look like -20B or -30B this year.

# ? Feb 11, 2016 19:35

velvet milkman: Feb 13, 2012; by R. Guyovich

Cultural Imperial posted:

https://twitter.com/stephenfgordon/status/697845039079280641

This is absolutely shocking news.

# ? Feb 11, 2016 19:36

cowofwar: Jul 30, 2002; by Athanatos

No one takes the UP express because it's like $30.

# ? Feb 11, 2016 20:23

namaste friends: Sep 18, 2004; by Smythe

The Heathrow Express is 36 GBP return. :shrug:

But i thought toronto was world class like london

# ? Feb 11, 2016 20:25

Daynab: Aug 5, 2008

# ? Feb 11, 2016 21:09

Risky Bisquick: Jan 18, 2008; PLEASE LET ME WRITE YOUR VICTIM IMPACT STATEMENT SO I CAN FURTHER DEMONSTRATE THE CALAMITY THAT IS OUR JUSTICE SYSTEM.; Buglord

quote:

https://www.facebook.com/charlie.angus.58/posts/10153853553821215

Charlie Angus [NDP MP]

I have known Jian Ghomeshi casually for 25 plus years. What did I learn from the trial? 1) That a woman who remembers being beaten is not considered credible because she didn't know the make of his car. 2) That famous people can afford lawyers known as "Hannibal Lecter" for their ability to take sexual assault witnesses apart. 3) That Jian won't bother to refute any of the charges because as some law expert says: "There are many reasons why an accused elects not to call evidence. One of them is that the complainants have been destroyed in cross-examination.'' 4) That Jian flourished as a predator in what should have been the safest organization in the country and that the legal system continues to fail women and 5) that nobody close to Jian even pretends he is innocent, and somehow this isn't an issue -- the women are.

# ? Feb 11, 2016 21:26

namaste friends: Sep 18, 2004; by Smythe

cmon, you can't possibly listen to de coutere's testimony and think this dumb bitch wasn't trying to shake down ghomeshi and failed

# ? Feb 11, 2016 21:28

Risky Bisquick: Jan 18, 2008; PLEASE LET ME WRITE YOUR VICTIM IMPACT STATEMENT SO I CAN FURTHER DEMONSTRATE THE CALAMITY THAT IS OUR JUSTICE SYSTEM.; Buglord

Cultural Imperial posted:

cmon, you can't possibly listen to de coutere's testimony and think this dumb bitch wasn't trying to shake down ghomeshi and failed

Reva Seth, a lawyer and best-selling author, wrote about what she says was her own violent encounter with Ghomeshi on The Huffington Post. In her post, Seth anticipates the victim-blaming question of why she didn�t do anything about the assault in the immediate aftermath: �As a lawyer, I'm well aware that the scenario was just a �he said/she said� situation. I was aware that I, as a woman who had had a drink or two, shared a joint, had gone to his house willingly and had a sexual past, would be eviscerated.�

Maybe they are trying to shake him down like those Cosby accusers, that guy is a quaalude saint.

# ? Feb 11, 2016 21:34

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# ? May 18, 2024 20:12

namaste friends: Sep 18, 2004; by Smythe

some dude punches you in the head and chokes you during sex you scream and run off

next day you decide to sext him?

poor victim

# ? Feb 11, 2016 21:35

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