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Yukari posted:That's what I figured, though this would be in addition to a staff of Ruin, since I'll have dual implement expertise. Dual Implement Spellcaster doesn't let you benefit from both implement's effects at once anyway, it's just a damage bonus.
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Feb 11, 2016 20:43
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Staff of Ruin, though if you're a storm Sorcerer, grabbing Queen's staff in paragon is probably better because of the set bonus that you get.
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Feb 11, 2016 20:45
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I believe my DM is allowing the ability to get both properties when using 2 implements, so I would get the +damage from staff of ruin in addition to whatever else.
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Feb 11, 2016 20:51
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Disappointed in the lack of love for Half-Orc Straladin. Similar DPR to a Fighter, though obviously not as sticky (hold fast as level 3 encounter can help a little with that), and the range and versatility of DC/DS can't be overstated. Then again, Paladins do take a while to truly shine, and I'm usually thinking back more to the late heroic - mid paragon paladin I played as my first character in 4e. The party defender in my current game is an Amauntor Worshipping, Power of the Sun backbone of a radiant mafia Dragonborn CHALADIN rolling hard with an invoker and a wisdom focused cleric. Now that's fun... For them, not my poor monsters that are literally disintegrated in front of my eyes by lasers.
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Feb 11, 2016 22:23
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From a theoretical standpoint I think radiant mafia is a neat idea, but I'm pretty sure I'd hate trying to come up with challenging encounters for a well-charopped mafia. You'd have to like double the xp budget.
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Feb 11, 2016 22:32
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Yukari posted:I believe my DM is allowing the ability to get both properties when using 2 implements, so I would get the +damage from staff of ruin in addition to whatever else. Besides, couldn't you always switch which implement is the "primary" one on each attack based on which property was most useful?
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Feb 11, 2016 22:36
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Dick Burglar posted:I like radiant mafia from a theoretical viewpoint but I'm pretty sure I'd hate trying to come up with challenging encounters for a well-charopped mafia. You'd have to like double the xp budget. At least they have to use their standard to perform the basic attack to trigger the Power of the Sun. Unfortunately, the party as has a Bravelord with Direct the Strike, allowing both the Invoker and Paladin to trigger it off-turn... Level 16 they're fighting two or three solos at a time because gently caress me Morning lord's level 16 feature... And that point everyone has access to radiant weapons... And even if they don't want that, Pervasive Light is only a feat away. This is of course assuming we ever get that far, which we probably won't. Thankfully.
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Feb 11, 2016 22:41
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4E isn't really a game where you can really have a character that outshines the others, unless all the others are bad classes with poor choices. If you're dead-set on not being conspicuously better than everyone else, though, the best way to gently caress that up for yourself is playing a hybrid. Hybrids are basically stupid, and the "recommended" hybrids are so because they break the intended limitations of hybrids. Play [any leader] and just support your friends' successes.
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Feb 11, 2016 22:49
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OneThousandMonkeys posted:4E isn't really a game where you can really have a character that outshines the others, unless all the others are bad classes with poor choices. If you're dead-set on not being conspicuously better than everyone else, though, the best way to gently caress that up for yourself is playing a hybrid. Hybrids are basically stupid, and the "recommended" hybrids are so because they break the intended limitations of hybrids. Hybrid Cleric/Ranger, pick up Warning Strike at 7, Tactical Warpriest Paragon Path, heavy blade opportunity at 11, and twin-strike enemies as an OA. All day err'yday. Also, you have Paladin level AC and eventually the ability to mark. Your mark punishment? Opportunity Attack. You see where I'm going with this. Edit: Spiked Chain Training + Blade Dancer PP for light blade shenanigans, reach, and pure DPR. Will also get you Paladin AC, just at 16, not 11. Mecha Gojira fucked around with this message at 23:29 on Feb 11, 2016 |
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Feb 11, 2016 23:15
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If u wanna support your whole party be a petpetpet shaman/protector and have each of ur pets buddy up to people and make them attack more/better
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Feb 12, 2016 00:13
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Jolyne Cujoh posted:If u wanna support your whole party be a petpetpet shaman/protector and have each of ur pets buddy up to people and make them attack more/better Disappointed you didn't also suggest to fluff the pets as stands.
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Feb 12, 2016 00:18
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OneThousandMonkeys posted:4E isn't really a game where you can really have a character that outshines the others, unless all the others are bad classes with poor choices. You can absolutely make a striker or a controller that just absolutely trivializes the game for everybody else, to the point where it stops being 'the adventuring group' and starts being 'ranger and friends' or the like.
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Feb 12, 2016 00:32
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Khizan posted:You can absolutely make a striker or a controller that just absolutely trivializes the game for everybody else, to the point where it stops being 'the adventuring group' and starts being 'ranger and friends' or the like. I don't think it's as drastic as some people claim, but then again I have seen a party ranger shut down an encounter on the first turn, but to his credit he hit a hotstreak with those d20's and just critical'd the centerpiece monster at least twice between the four for five goddamn attacks he made that round. This was like level 12, though, and I had a Paladin with Lyander Windrider, so I didn't care because my cool thing was I could basically fly every other encounter while delivering judgment with my mighty lightning sword. These crazy bizarre or exceptionally powerful builds don't start showing up until much, much later, though, not until at least you get your paragon path. These players are new, so they're probably starting from the beginning and don't have to worry so much about it. And by then, they'll have learned the game enough to do their own crazy bizarre combo or pick their own crazy paragon path and build. I know rangers and Invokers can halt an encounter, but I also know there are fighter builds that put some controllers and strikers to shame, Paladin builds than can lock down an entire encounter, and hell, even Warlords can take the spotlight. Like I said, I've got the beginnings of a radiant mafia, a Bravelord, and a greatbow ranger all in the same party but I can still genuinely challenge them. They always win, but I can at least know how to scare them or boost their ego. That's basically the budget of an encounter to an encounter +2 at level 3. And again, I've seen them take down a level 4 solo dragon at level 2, so gently caress'em.
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Feb 12, 2016 03:34
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So our 4e goon group just finished Keep on the Shadowfell, and I have a bunch of statblocks on reframing the monsters into being "MM3-compliant". Would anyone be interested in those? It was interesting experiment, I don't know if I'd do it again. Certainly the Slaying Stone module is better.
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Feb 12, 2016 05:03
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Lemon Curdistan posted:Disappointed you didn't also suggest to fluff the pets as stands. one of the stand rules is that there's only one stand per person!! Gotta be accurate to the source material.
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Feb 12, 2016 05:17
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gradenko_2000 posted:So our 4e goon group just finished Keep on the Shadowfell, and I have a bunch of statblocks on reframing the monsters into being "MM3-compliant". Would anyone be interested in those? 
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Feb 12, 2016 06:07
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Okay, so this is the document of my encounter notes for the Keep on the Shadowfell * The defense numbers have been adjusted to be compliant with MM3 * The HP counts have been reduced even more than in MM3, to the tune of roughly 3 less HP per level, based on this Blog of Holding post * The damage expressions have been increased according to this "Always Level 1" damage schema. I kept the added damage as a second "+x", so for example, if you were looking at the Kobold Dragonshield's melee attack: pre:Short sword, standard, at will, melee [[d20+7]] to hit vs AC, [[1d6+3+1]] damage * I didn't make notes for the Graveyard encounter anymore because I realized that the group was never going to go there. * The power statblocks have been formatted to be plug-and-play with roll20. You can copy-paste "[[d20+7]] to hit vs AC, [[1d6+3+1]] damage" and that's the whole attack right there.
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Feb 12, 2016 08:01
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How was the Irontooth clusterfuck?
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Feb 12, 2016 08:13
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Wasn't really a problem. The group had a Druid and a Wizard and they were able to shut him down pretty hard.
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Feb 12, 2016 09:00
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Mecha Gojira posted:At least they have to use their standard to perform the basic attack to trigger the Power of the Sun. Unfortunately, the party as has a Bravelord with Direct the Strike, allowing both the Invoker and Paladin to trigger it off-turn... The rest of my party doesn't really use Radiant damage besides our cleric who is unfortunately mostly a heal bot, and as far as I can find there aren't really any ki focuses to provide it but now that I know Pervasive Light exists I'm curious whether it'd be worth it to grab a divine multiclass feat to grab it as my paragon path is Radiant Fist.
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Feb 12, 2016 09:44
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Yeah, I don't think there is a radiant ki focus, but I forget what Radiant Fist gives. If I remember correctly it gives you radiant options anyway, so unless you were going for a different damage type, I think you are covered without pervasive light.
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Feb 12, 2016 10:09
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Mecha Gojira posted:Yeah, I don't think there is a radiant ki focus, but I forget what Radiant Fist gives. If I remember correctly it gives you radiant options anyway, so unless you were going for a different damage type, I think you are covered without pervasive light. It does give a couple radiant options, the first is an encounter power that gives whatever is hit by it a vuln 5 radiant debuff, the other is a level 20 daily power, and other than that you can spend an action point to give a radiant damage bonus equal to your wisdom bonus to your attacks until eont, and at level 16 your Flurry of Blows can do Radiant Damage if you want it to.
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Feb 12, 2016 10:18
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I'd pick up a multiclass and pervasive light if you're really worried about it, but Radiant Mafia needs a reliable at will way to create the vulnerability. The encounter power from Radiant Fist might not be enough to persuade you to pick up the feat, especially with radiant flurry of blows once a round by 16. You can always ask your cleric to pick up Power of the Sun to go with Lance of Faith, though if she's willing to play along. Then I'd definitely consider it. Another way is to retrain out of ki focuses and use weapliments like daggers or staves so you can get access to the radiant weapon. I don't know what your build is or how important unarmed is to you, though. Mecha Gojira fucked around with this message at 11:48 on Feb 12, 2016 |
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Feb 12, 2016 11:11
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Quick question about a pretty basic houserule idea I just had. Usually it's a minor action to draw a potion and another to drink it, and I think we all agree that's silly and it should be a minor to drink a potion period. Now I'm looking at Quick Draw and items like the Potion Bandolier - if you houserule the potion use thing, would it be reasonable to bump the effects of these up to something like "drink a potion as a free action once per round"? Any shenanigans I'm missing that this would open the door for? Should it be restricted to your own turn?
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Feb 12, 2016 16:35
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For a storm sorc, between Voice of Thunder and Lightning Fury, which one is preferred?
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Feb 12, 2016 19:22
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Eopia posted:The rest of my party doesn't really use Radiant damage besides our cleric who is unfortunately mostly a heal bot, and as far as I can find there aren't really any ki focuses to provide it but now that I know Pervasive Light exists I'm curious whether it'd be worth it to grab a divine multiclass feat to grab it as my paragon path is Radiant Fist. For radiant fist I'm partial to the paladin's Soldier of Virtue feat on a Wis-based monk, which will give you something like Heal or Religion as a skill, Virtue's Touch as a once per day way to remove a dangerous condition with a touch (which you can reflavor as some sort of mystic touch thing) and access to holy symbols as implements, including the Sun Disk of Pelor, which turns all damage into radiant.
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Feb 12, 2016 19:38
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Yukari posted:For a storm sorc, between Voice of Thunder and Lightning Fury, which one is preferred? Lightning fury, always. Being able to ignore immunity is amazing. You will never have to worry about resistances until maybe level 19, and even then it's probably only 1 or 2 points of damage ignored. Plus the powers themselves are stupid good. With gifts of the queen, you also pair up with exceptionally with radiant mafia.
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Feb 12, 2016 19:48
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berenzen posted:Lightning fury, always. Being able to ignore immunity is amazing. You will never have to worry about resistances until maybe level 19, and even then it's probably only 1 or 2 points of damage ignored. Plus the powers themselves are stupid good. I doubt that I'll get to play with Radiant Mafia, but if I use the crown's ability to change the damage to radiant from lightning, does it change the keywords on the power?
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Feb 12, 2016 20:23
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Yukari posted:I doubt that I'll get to play with Radiant Mafia, but if I use the crown's ability to change the damage to radiant from lightning, does it change the keywords on the power? No, it just changes the damage type, the keyword still stays the same. But the entire Gifts of the Queen set is amazing. The staff will give you an eternal +2 attack bonus, slippers work really well with all the sliding powers you have, and the ring is one of the best rings that you'll get until mid- to late-epic. As for the helm and the bracelets, there's not a lot of competition, and they give +1 damage. The 5 set is kinda meh, but it allows you to include yourself in your blasts with a chance at negating the damage. But the thing is, aside from the staff and ring, there isn't a lot of competition for the slots, so grab them anyway if you can. berenzen fucked around with this message at 20:35 on Feb 12, 2016 |
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Feb 12, 2016 20:26
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Yukari posted:I doubt that I'll get to play with Radiant Mafia, but if I use the crown's ability to change the damage to radiant from lightning, does it change the keywords on the power? It does, but it just adds the radiant keyword to the power. It's still a "lightning" power, you just changed the damage type to radiant and picked up a keyword. That's why it's so deadly powerful. Works the same way as elemental weapliments like the lightning/flaming/frost weapons that change damage types.
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Feb 12, 2016 20:30
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My Lovely Horse posted:Quick question about a pretty basic houserule idea I just had. Usually it's a minor action to draw a potion and another to drink it, and I think we all agree that's silly and it should be a minor to drink a potion period. Now I'm looking at Quick Draw and items like the Potion Bandolier - if you houserule the potion use thing, would it be reasonable to bump the effects of these up to something like "drink a potion as a free action once per round"? Any shenanigans I'm missing that this would open the door for? Should it be restricted to your own turn? I would definitely restrict it to your own turn just to avoid slowing down the game, but otherwise I think it should be fine?
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Feb 12, 2016 20:33
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Speaking of Radiant Mafia, one of my gaming groups recently switched to running D&D 4e starting at Paragon, and the party is a Half-Elf Tempest Fighter with heavy Bardic multiclassing (me), a hybrid Half-Elf Seeker/Avenger (which is effectively a striker) depending on some shakey rules interpretations to work but the group agreed it was more interesting to try than shut down, a Kalashtar Telepath Psion, and a Human Laser Cleric with the Morninglord PP. If the rest of the party doesn't optimize around it, do we have to worry about the Morninglord's crazy Vuln 10 feature when it comes up (they also have Power of the Sun)? Rest of the party is slightly to moderately optimized, I think, and the Morninglord doesn't seem too over the top buildwise.
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Feb 12, 2016 22:03
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gourdcaptain posted:Speaking of Radiant Mafia, one of my gaming groups recently switched to running D&D 4e starting at Paragon, and the party is a Half-Elf Tempest Fighter with heavy Bardic multiclassing (me), a hybrid Half-Elf Seeker/Avenger (which is effectively a striker) depending on some shakey rules interpretations to work but the group agreed it was more interesting to try than shut down, a Kalashtar Telepath Psion, and a Human Laser Cleric with the Morninglord PP. If the rest of the party doesn't optimize around it, do we have to worry about the Morninglord's crazy Vuln 10 feature when it comes up (they also have Power of the Sun)? Rest of the party is slightly to moderately optimized, I think, and the Morninglord doesn't seem too over the top buildwise. Avengers have 77 radiant powers and Seeker has 1 ever (because why should a Seeker be good at anything?). That's where the sting is going to come from. The psion might get Brilliant Thought? That's about it unless you the fighter are making some interesting item/class pickups.
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Feb 12, 2016 22:16
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Mecha Gojira posted:It does, but it just adds the radiant keyword to the power. It's still a "lightning" power, you just changed the damage type to radiant and picked up a keyword. That's why it's so deadly powerful. So if I have a lightning/thunder power, and I use that ability, it'll be a lightning/thunder/radiant power and thus get benefits from my lightning and thunder based feats?
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Feb 12, 2016 22:17
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Yukari posted:So if I have a lightning/thunder power, and I use that ability, it'll be a lightning/thunder/radiant power and thus get benefits from my lightning and thunder based feats? Yes, it's possible to make builds that hit 4-5 different keywords if you are obsessive enough.
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Feb 12, 2016 22:28
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gradenko_2000 posted:So our 4e goon group just finished Keep on the Shadowfell, and I have a bunch of statblocks on reframing the monsters into being "MM3-compliant". Would anyone be interested in those?
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Feb 12, 2016 22:35
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OneThousandMonkeys posted:Avengers have 77 radiant powers and Seeker has 1 ever (because why should a Seeker be good at anything?). That's where the sting is going to come from. The psion might get Brilliant Thought? That's about it unless you the fighter are making some interesting item/class pickups. Ah. Pretty much all the Avenger/Seeker's radiant damage is going to be painful oath based, their entire build is based around using the Distant Vengeance feat to be able to use Oath with all the Seeker RBA powers and then stack Primal Eye on top of that for more damage, so they're actually taking as few Avenger powers as possible. It's basically the group's best optimizer going for something weird so they can have fun with esoteric building without hopefully showing everyone else up. I'm... Probably not going to take a Radiant weapon? It's kinda out of theme for my characters fluff and we've got house rules in place removing the benefit of the item bonus to damage. (Everyone gets their inherent bonus to attack/damage rolls again as an item bonus to damage so no one feels pressure to take Iron Armbands of Power or such.)
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Feb 12, 2016 22:38
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Radiant weapons are just good period. The feat bonus to damage lets you free up your arms slot from Iron Armbands and the ranged equivalent, and of course there are so many enemies with radiant vulnerability anyway. Plus who doesn't want to swing a lightsaber? Or beam axe. Or laser rifle. Edit: Sunblades are more thematic, though, if you want to go heavy blade. No extra damage, but you get to shine bright light in a ten square radius. Mecha Gojira fucked around with this message at 22:45 on Feb 12, 2016 |
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Feb 12, 2016 22:40
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Mecha Gojira posted:Radiant weapons are just good period. The feat bonus to damage lets you free up your arms slot from Iron Armbands and the ranged equivalent, and of course there are so many enemies with radiant vulnerability anyway. Plus who doesn't want to swing a lightsaber? Or beam axe. Or laser rifle. Agreed on Radiant Weapons being good, but the item bonus wouldn't stack with the houserule I mentioned in the previous post. I'm using a double sword, so I can't use a Sunblade anyway. We're experimenting with some heavy houserule tweaking in this game (in addition to Inherent Bonuses), I wrote up custom CBLoader mods with the DM to basically give everyone expertise bonuses to all attacks without feats and run MBAs/RBAs off a stat of your choice at chargen (with full stat to damage) so everyone can take a decent opportunity attack or fallback ranged attack if they need to. (Which actually saved me a feat, since I'm using Daring Blade to run Fighter attacks off CHA to use with my skills and because it sounded cool, as well as poaching one of the Skald at-wills with dilletante so my OAs/mark punishments on a hit give someone in 5 squares a +2 power bonus to hit on their next turn.)
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Feb 12, 2016 22:49
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Have you considered the Drow Long Blade? Between Tempest Fighter and the Shock Trooper PP, you can boost those suckers up to the equivalent of bastard swords while being heavy thrown weapons. Opens up some REALLY interesting Cleave options.
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Feb 12, 2016 22:53
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