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SuperMechagodzilla posted:What you're pushing here is a New Age/Jungian balance of 'natural' masculine and feminine 'principles', which is very distinct from actual feminism as combating exploitation. Deep-seated archetypal identities, "Men are from Mars, Women Are From Venus", right? This means that you have absolutely misunderstood the prequels. It's as Zizek warns: No, he's saying that the mistake is dividing emotion along a male/female binary in the first place along with devaluing what is assigned to the female side. He is not claiming these to be essential categories but rather disagreeing that there are essential categories.
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Feb 13, 2016 23:16
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Who's that blue guy hanging out with the emperor in Episode III?
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Feb 13, 2016 23:17
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That's Mas Amedda. He's a senator who apparently has some kind of special role in opening and closing sessions. He was also Valorum's right hand dude in TPM but he's basically thick with Sheev from the word go and had a full, triumphant career following the declaration of the Empire and dissolution of the Senate.
Harime Nui fucked around with this message at 23:46 on Feb 13, 2016 |
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Feb 13, 2016 23:44
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Harime Nui posted:That's Mas Amedda. He's a senator who apparently has some kind of special role in opening and closing sessions. He was also Valorum's right hand dude in TPM but he's basically thick with Sheev from the word go and had a full, triumphant career following the declaration of the Empire and dissolution of the Senate. He's probably working with palps from before then and was part of the "bereaucrst" holy gently caress I cannot spell this word Bureaucrats there gently caress
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Feb 13, 2016 23:51
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lmao I checked his wookiepedia and yep it literally says "he was elected to be Chancellor Valorum's right hand man because the Senators knew he'd keep the Chancellor occupied with procedural bullshit"
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Feb 13, 2016 23:54
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He is literately a demon-bureaucrat, in cahoots with space-hitler edit: it's a bad word and i hate it too
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Feb 14, 2016 00:13
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Black Bones posted:He is literately a demon-bureaucrat, in cahoots with space-hitler A Demoncrat undermining the Republican government
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Feb 14, 2016 00:36
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He has a few lines in the Clone Wars cartoon. His job is literally to be an "unbiased" politician hanging around Palpatine who just so happens to agree with everything Palpatine wants in a very eloquent and diplomatic way.
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Feb 14, 2016 00:47
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quote:This all brings us back to the familiar preoccupation with 'care-levels' and 'deep' inner feeling. The flipside of your unbridled FEELING is an unbridled TERROR at the threat of 'trolling' and other harassment. And this is of course closely aligned to the concept of war on terror. You are possibly the only
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Feb 14, 2016 02:23
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Neo Rasa posted:He has a few lines in the Clone Wars cartoon. His job is literally to be an "unbiased" politician hanging around Palpatine who just so happens to agree with everything Palpatine wants in a very eloquent and diplomatic way. I don't remember any thing he says, if he said anything, in the movies, but he's so obviously an evil jackass corrupt politician guy.
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Feb 14, 2016 02:29
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"The supreme chancellor requests a recess." "Order! We must have order!" "You must appoint a commission!" "Control of the senate must be maintained." Some of the scrapped commtech lines for the Mas Amedda action figure. If they included Episode 2 there's the pivotal line 'This is a crisis!'
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Feb 14, 2016 03:49
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I'm still like 35 pages behind in this thread, but (from where I am) Cnut said something a little while ago that I wanted to address. Cnut, I appreciate your posting for the most part, but it does seem you are a lot harsher on TFA than on the prequels, and I mean maybe it's illustrating absurdity by being absurd, taking the piss out of prequel haters by ragging on the new movie in the same way they do on the prequels, and if so I'm sorry for giving away the game, but when talking about TFA you kind of sound like those prequel haters who take everything in a tactical-realism sense. The example that brought me to this post is when you were talking about Poe acting sassy to Kylo Ren. I mean if you bring it back to ANH, Leia watches her home planet get blown up and then a few scenes later is making snide comments about Luke's height, Han's lack of planning, and Chewie's appearance. Just having a little trouble reconciling, and I suppose maybe you could think ANH is weak on that score as well. But if it were something in the prequels, my conjecture is that you might spend spend a bit more effort on it rather than just retroactively trying to justify your visceral reaction like so many of the prequel haters do for those movies. If I'm off base feel free to correct me. I'll probably read your reply in about a week when I reach this part of the thread again, haha.
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Feb 14, 2016 04:02
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So just re-watched AotC and with my wife for the first time. It continues the trend of being, quote "Hella Asian" in her words, but more pressingly it makes me dislike TFA slightly more as tons of weight is put on a weapon Luke uses and loses once and Anakin can't keep in a single contiguous piece or give a drat about for more than a single action sequence. The romance is also pretty good and Hayden kills it (and the sand people) playing a young, immature individual who is not getting the support he needs from his parental figures and who alternates between overconfidence in his abilities and staggering self-doubt over his actions and behavior.
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Feb 14, 2016 04:19
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EX-GAIJIN AT LAST posted:The example that brought me to this post is when you were talking about Poe acting sassy to Kylo Ren. I mean if you bring it back to ANH, Leia watches her home planet get blown up and then a few scenes later is making snide comments about Luke's height, Han's lack of planning, and Chewie's appearance. Just having a little trouble reconciling, and I suppose maybe you could think ANH is weak on that score as well. But if it were something in the prequels, my conjecture is that you might spend spend a bit more effort on it rather than just retroactively trying to justify your visceral reaction like so many of the prequel haters do for those movies. A few people have been alleging that we only prefer the prequel over TFA because we are 'thinking harder about them'. Again, it's that preoccupation with care-levels and 'laziness', over truth. The dialogue with Poe at the start of the film is designed to undercut the Kylo Ren character, while Leia absolutely does not make quips about the Death Star blowing up her family. That's the difference. Leia undercuts her rescuers, because the entire joke is that - even though she's a victim - she's not the wonderful person that Luke had fantasized about. In fact, I don't really recall any scene in the six-film saga where a character comments on the ridiculousness of the premise, as if it's Galaxy Quest. Like, nobody ever says "why are you wearing robes instead of a space suit? lol" or "this space station is really badly designed! lol" As a contrast, TFA has repeated jokes about how Chewie never uses his crossbow, the silliness of everyone wearing masks, the bad design of the death star, "why does everyone want to go back to Tatooine", and so-on.
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Feb 14, 2016 05:13
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TFA dispensed with Lucas' dialogue style. Star Wars now sounds like it was written with modern audiences in mind which is in stark contrast to the rest of the SW movies.
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Feb 14, 2016 05:45
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Y Kant Ozma Diet posted:TFA dispensed with Lucas' dialogue style. Star Wars now sounds like it was written with modern audiences in mind which is in stark contrast to the rest of the SW movies. Caveat: The First Order talks like the OT / PT, further solidifying them as relics clinging to their dark past, while the Resistance is full of cool teens that i want to blog about
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Feb 14, 2016 06:00
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It's not bad that TFA, a movie which was not directed or written by George Lucas, is directed and written differently from movies that are directed and written by George Lucas.
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Feb 14, 2016 06:35
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Empress Theonora posted:It's not bad that TFA, a movie which was not directed or written by George Lucas, is directed and written differently from movies that are directed and written by George Lucas. Well yeah, except for the part where it's significantly worse.
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Feb 14, 2016 06:44
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Jerkface posted:Caveat: The First Order talks like the OT / PT, further solidifying them as relics clinging to their dark past, while the Resistance is full of cool teens that i want to blog about To add to this; there's a narrative readon for Starkiller to be destroyed so quickly after its introduction. There's much to read into the fact that the Resistance were originally supposed to have a ship designed to bust Death Stars. It fits well into the overall theme of the majority of new characters representing Star Wars fans. Once the blu-ray is out and people get over their nostalgic feels I'm certain that there is plenty of nuance in TFA that is currently being handwaved away. Edit: If you consider the character motivations with the fact that they're all fans Rey's development makes even more sense; she starts out on a dead planet full of decaying old Good Star Wars, playing with her old merchandise to recall what she believed to be the high point in the universe/franchise. Eventually she gets dragged to a comic-con, see her heroes, and is invited to create New Star Wars. She is worried about making Extended Universe and a general fear of change, which causes her to try to retreat back to Old Star Wars but it is too late; she has already signed the contract and is taken to Starwars: Star Killer. From there she utilizes her fan knowledge to survive, watches her idol get fired, and her buddy barely remain on the set defending her, which spurs her to accept her role as the protagonist of New Star Wars. Neurolimal fucked around with this message at 06:58 on Feb 14, 2016 |
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Feb 14, 2016 06:50
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SuperMechagodzilla posted:A few people have been alleging that we only prefer the prequel over TFA because we are 'thinking harder about them'. Again, it's that preoccupation with care-levels and 'laziness', over truth. Leia makes fun of Vader and Tarkin to their faces right before they blow up Alderaan. Making quips about Alderaan isn't really an apt comparison to Poe's jokes.
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Feb 14, 2016 07:16
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Neurolimal posted:To add to this; there's a narrative readon for Starkiller to be destroyed so quickly after its introduction. There's much to read into the fact that the Resistance were originally supposed to have a ship designed to bust Death Stars. It fits well into the overall theme of the majority of new characters representing Star Wars fans. That sounds much better than what was actually in the film.
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Feb 14, 2016 07:16
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Yikes if you need the blu-ray to remember the film 2 months later. It's probably a good idea to distinguish between writing and its delivery. The dialogue in Force Awakens is kind of unremarkable and mainly employed as a sound effect. Like you could replace a good amount of it with various adverbs: "talks excitedly", 'talks calmly", etc. As usual, concrete examples are important. I grabbed a copy of the script and randomly selected to one of the few parts where two characters actually have a conversation: Rey: Where am I? Kylo: You're my guest. Rey: Where are the others? Kylo: You mean the murderers, traitors and thieves you call friends? You'll be relieved to hear that I have no idea. ... You still want to kill me. Rey: That happens when you're being hunted by a creature in a mask. Kylo: Tell me about the droid. Rey: He's a BB unit with a selenium drive and a thermal hyperscan vindicator. Kylo: He's carrying a section of a navigational chart. We have the rest, recovered from archives of the Empire. We need the last piece. And somehow you convinced the droid to show it to you. You. A scavenger. This dialogue is... not good. It's loaded with exposition, and it's only on the eighth line that we get to the meat of the conversation. The unseen BB8 is being held up as some kind of ultimate judge of character and Kylo resents not being selected. That aspect is just dropped in there clumsily, because why is he going on about this during an interrogation? Kylo's specific disdain for 'scavengers' comes out of nowhere and is never referenced again. This is a lot of stuff to be told and not shown. Keep in mind that this is the characters' second interaction, and the first time that Rey even speaks to Kylo. Rey has effectively no idea who Kylo even is. How does she know he's the one hunting her, and that he wears a mask all the time? Also why is Kylo mad at BB8 on a personal level? He hasn't interacted with him either. ThePlague-Daemon posted:Leia makes fun of Vader and Tarkin to their faces right before they blow up Alderaan. Making quips about Alderaan isn't really an apt comparison to Poe's jokes. Actually, it's totally apt, because Leia's jokes are used to accentuate her powerlessness. Leia doesn't deliver any particularly witty insult. She just calls Tarkin a smelly coward, because it's all impotent acting-out. You can tell because, seconds later, she's like "No! Alderaan is peaceful. We have no weapons. You can't possibly..." On the other hand, Poe is just like "lol this is awkward. Why are you wearing a mask lol?". And everyone just ignores him. You'd think this would set up some kind of personal conflict between the two that would come into play later. SuperMechagodzilla fucked around with this message at 08:09 on Feb 14, 2016 |
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Feb 14, 2016 08:05
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Why the gently caress any one would want to mimic Lucas' style (or shortcomings) is beyond me. That poo poo was dated in 1977.
Yaws fucked around with this message at 08:23 on Feb 14, 2016 |
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Feb 14, 2016 08:18
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She was hunted through a forest by a creature in a mask and ultimately captured & tortured by said creature in a mask. She does not say "Wow you have been hunting me for so long and you always wear a mask". This also comes after she was hunted by the first order on Jakku & had her force vision showcasing a creature in a mask who then appears in her haunted forest to apprehend her. Was she not sufficiently hunted, and kylo ren not sufficiently masked enough for you to buy that dialogue? This is very similar to Cnut crabbing that the main characters are not hard edged enough or damaged enough due to their circumstances, some sort of straight verisimilitude angle that has not existed in the sci-fantasy that is star wars. Edit: I also really like that dialogue, besides being well delivered by the charismatic & fun main actors of this series, it show cases the distinct difference between Kylo & Vader, showing the real gap between them that Kylo wishes did not exist. Jerkface fucked around with this message at 08:46 on Feb 14, 2016 |
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Feb 14, 2016 08:38
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tactical idealism
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Feb 14, 2016 08:42
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Yaws posted:Why the gently caress any one would want to mimic Lucas' style (or shortcomings) is beyond me. That poo poo was dated in 1977. Luckily, he had talented people around him to reign him in. The PT shows Lucas completely uninhibited and the results weren't pretty. Here are three lines of dialogue: Leia: Governor Tarkin. I should have expected to find you holding Vader's leash. I recognized your foul stench when I was brought on board. Tarkin: Charming to the last. You don't know how hard I found it, signing the order to terminate your life. Leia: I'm surprised that you had the courage to take the responsibility yourself! Lucas immediately establishes these characters' relationships and clarifies the fact that, despite what we saw in the opening scene, Tarkin is the one responsible for the attack on the diplomatic vessel. Also, this dialogue reinforces the theme that Vader is, even in A New Hope, something of a neutral character - not exactly part of the Empire, but something that the Empire keeps restrained - like the sewer monster that will come into play later. We also get Leia's basic opposition to the Empire. She perceives Tarkin is the source of the evil that is all around them, while also being the type of guy who typically just does as he's told. Saying that signing someone else's death warrant is the most courageous thing he's ever done is a pretty good burn. But Tarkin is unphased because he simply has all these resources as his disposal, and maintains an 'upper-class' demeanor. Jerkface posted:Was she not sufficiently hunted, and kylo ren not sufficiently masked enough for you to buy that dialogue? Correct. The hunting sequence lasts all of half a minute, and this dialogue takes place before any torture. Rey was not being hunted before that forest scene; BB8 was, and she just went with him. Also, Rey somehow knows Kylo's mask is a personal sticking point, when we see hundreds of people in the movie wearing masks as a part of their job - including her. SuperMechagodzilla fucked around with this message at 08:51 on Feb 14, 2016 |
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Feb 14, 2016 08:47
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SuperMechagodzilla posted:Correct. The hunting sequence lasts all of half a minute, this dialogue takes place before the torture. Rey was not being hunted before that forest scene; BB8 was, and she just went with him. She is hunted through a forest, frozen in place, has her mind forcibly probed by the force, and is then space roofied. By a creature... in a mask. It does not matter that other people wear masks in star wars when one dressed in all black terminator walks towards her effortlessly stopping her attempts to shoot him with a red evil laser sword. The same one she saw murder dozens of dudes in a force vision as well as foresee The same creature who is then wearing a mask inside the space ship interrogation room that he has chained her up & creepily watched her sleep in. This is just a straight misunderstanding of the dialogue. Rey wanted to kill him when he was hunting her in the forest, in his mask. She still wants to stop him now, because he did the thing that happened. He says "Wow you still want to kill me even though ive only just got you locked up & we're talking like normal now?" and she goes YES because you just hunted me through a forest while wearing a mask and kidnapped me. Shes telling him the consequences of his hosed up actions. Edit: And of course Kylo is annoyed that the droid with the map to his destiny fell into the hands of a scavenger, and the droid decided to show said scavenger the map to his destiny. He thinks he is the chosen one, remember, who can fulfill what Vader started. That lightsaber BELONGS to ME! BB-8 was supposed to roll up and give up the goods to ole Kylo. Jerkface fucked around with this message at 09:20 on Feb 14, 2016 |
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Feb 14, 2016 08:58
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Jerkface posted:She is hunted through a forest, frozen in place, has her mind forcibly probed by the force, and is then space roofied. By a creature... in a mask. It does not matter that other people wear masks in star wars when one dressed in all black terminator walks towards her effortlessly stopping her attempts to shoot him with a red evil laser sword. The same one she saw murder dozens of dudes in a force vision as well as foresee Kylo Ren wearing a mask is the least distinctive, in the context of Star Wars, of the descriptive elements you've applied to him. Why is the mask more worth mentioning than freezing, probing, roofieing, black terminatoring, effortless stopping, evil laser swording, murdering, interrogating, chaining, or creepily watching? Well, because the mask is important to him, because of Vader. Not anything to do with the person whose dialog it is.
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Feb 14, 2016 09:28
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Jerkface posted:She is hunted through a forest, frozen in place, has her mind forcibly probed by the force, and is then space roofied. By a creature... in a mask. It does not matter that other people wear masks in star wars when one dressed in all black terminator walks towards her effortlessly stopping her attempts to shoot him with a red evil laser sword. The same one she saw murder dozens of dudes in a force vision as well as foresee A plot synopsis isn't an interpretation. I understand that Kylo is the bad guy in the movie and Rey is the good guy, etc. The point is that Rey's very first line of dialogue spoken to Kylo (besides the 'where am I?' stuff) is this: "[The desire to kill is] what happens when you're being hunted by a creature in a mask." Not only is this supremely clunky and unquotable, it's not the kind of thing you say to someone you're actually afraid of. 'Creature' is used in a derogatory way, to say - as everyone else already knows - that Kylo is lame. Rey is not terrified, and she is certainly not bolstering his ego by calling him a big scary creature. To underline this, the brief forest chase scene is simply not a scary scene. It's barely even an action scene. The other point is that 'hunted' is an inapt word choice. Try "chased" instead. Rey is theoretically insulting Kylo, but positions herself as a frightened prey animal. Then the next line, she's doing the 'name, rank, and serial number' thing. Like what is even going on here. You have made it clear that you have the fun charismatic actors, and this latest post stresses that it's hosed UP that Rey would be CAPTURED because you care a lot about her teen emotions. But that's back to my point that the delivery by the actors is the only thing that matters. The actress could be dictating a recipe for banana bread. SuperMechagodzilla fucked around with this message at 09:40 on Feb 14, 2016 |
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Feb 14, 2016 09:34
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Sir Kodiak posted:Kylo Ren wearing a mask is the least distinctive, in the context of Star Wars, of the descriptive elements you've applied to him. Why is the mask more worth mentioning than freezing, probing, roofieing, black terminatoring, effortless stopping, evil laser swording, murdering, interrogating, chaining, or creepily watching? Well, because the mask is important to him, because of Vader. Not anything to do with the person whose dialog it is. Because a 'creature in a mask' sounds better than 'a creature that freezes people'. Because both our heroes give up their masks in the first act and don't put them on again. Because the mask is part of a horrific force vision our protagonist undergoes. Because it renders her capture & probing impersonal. Because the audience has just spent the entire first half of the movie watching this petulant masked creature stomp around. Masks are important in star wars. I again do not buy this versimilitudinous stance where because background extras may wear masks we have to give up the symbolism of the mask itself in our main & supporting characters. The imperial forces always being made up of masked enforcers. The clone army hiding behind their protostorm trooper helmets. Boba Fett, Jango Fett, Vader, Leia's bounty hunter costume, Grievous, etc.
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Feb 14, 2016 09:39
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Jerkface posted:Because a 'creature in a mask' sounds better than 'a creature that freezes people'. Because both our heroes give up their masks in the first act and don't put them on again. Because the mask is part of a horrific force vision our protagonist undergoes. Because it renders her capture & probing impersonal. Because the audience has just spent the entire first half of the movie watching this petulant masked creature stomp around. Masks are important in star wars. I again do not buy this versimilitudinous stance where because background extras may wear masks we have to give up the symbolism of the mask itself in our main & supporting characters. The imperial forces always being made up of masked enforcers. The clone army hiding behind their protostorm trooper helmets. Boba Fett, Jango Fett, Vader, Leia's bounty hunter costume, Grievous, etc. It's not a madlib, nobody forced them into a "a creature [blank]" format. As for the rest, I'm glad we're in agreement that the dialog is about the importance of the mask largely independent from Rey's personal experience. Yes, the mask is symbolically important, but this isn't Deadpool, we don't need a character speaking metacommentary out loud. Well, I guess the capture and probing being impersonal is about Rey's own experience. Your suggestion is that Rey would prefer that being taken prisoner and mentally probed had a more personal touch?
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Feb 14, 2016 09:48
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Sir Kodiak posted:Your suggestion is that Rey would prefer that being taken prisoner and mentally probed had a more personal touch? Of course not, she would prefer to not be hunted & captured at all. It is simply one of the reasons why one might comment on a mask, because the person hunting her is hiding behind one. quote:The other point is that 'hunted' is an inapt word choice. Try "chased" instead. Rey is theoretically insulting Kylo, but positions herself as a frightened prey animal. Then the next line, she's doing the 'name, rank, and serial number' thing. Like what is even going on here. mmm chase is in the very definition of hunt, and you hunt something specifically to do something like capture or kill. She was definitely hunted. The scene is even shot like basically a scene from the predator, where a creature in a mask hunts people. She is insulting him, and in the very wide shot she says her line she is elevated above him. Its only when he takes off his mask that he rises above her. He IS pathetic as Kylo Ren. Jerkface fucked around with this message at 10:00 on Feb 14, 2016 |
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Feb 14, 2016 09:53
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I'm not disputing Lucas' ability to convey basic relationships through dialogue. He just writes these characters like he only has a vague idea what human beings sound like. Anakin and Padme don't sound like lovestruck teenagers. They sound like they grew up watching bad romance movies. It's fuckin' weird. It's a glaring and unforgivable flaw in the prequels. Look at this poo poo: Anakin: You're asking me to be rational. That is something that I know I cannot do. Believe me, I wish I could just wish away my feelings, but I can't. It's not hard to discern what Anakin is conveying here, the problem is it's stilted and awkward.
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Feb 14, 2016 09:57
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Jerkface posted:Of course not, she would prefer to not be hunted & captured at all. It is simply one of the reasons why one might comment on a mask, because the person hunting her is hiding behind one. So we're in agreement that, as far as her own beliefs are concerned, it's just some incidental detail of his outfit that she's decided to bring up as half her reason to want to kill him.
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Feb 14, 2016 10:06
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Rey is established previously as being prone to aggression towards people who do evil. She thinks he's inhuman, and the mask is - to her, to him, and to the audience - symbolic of that inhumanity. And the hunt he's on is certainly something she'd feel like killing someone for being involved in. Certainly she was going to town on Finn for (she thought based on the jacket) being involved in that same hunt.Yaws posted:They sound like they grew up watching bad romance movies. Well, he's just spent the last decade living in a monastery, and she has spent even longer dedicating herself to being a full-time politician. Fictitious experience is the only kind of experience they could have in love.
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Feb 14, 2016 10:19
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Yaws posted:I'm not disputing Lucas' ability to convey basic relationships through dialogue. He just writes these characters like he only has a vague idea what human beings sound like. Anakin and Padme don't sound like lovestruck teenagers. They sound like they grew up watching bad romance movies. It's fuckin' weird. It's a glaring and unforgivable flaw in the prequels. Look at this poo poo: Human beings are often stilted and awkward. Especially lovestruck teenagers.
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Feb 14, 2016 10:21
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Jerkface posted:Because a 'creature in a mask' sounds better than 'a creature that freezes people'. Because both our heroes give up their masks in the first act and don't put them on again. Because the mask is part of a horrific force vision our protagonist undergoes. Because it renders her capture & probing impersonal. Because the audience has just spent the entire first half of the movie watching this petulant masked creature stomp around. Masks are important in star wars. I again do not buy this versimilitudinous stance where because background extras may wear masks we have to give up the symbolism of the mask itself in our main & supporting characters. The imperial forces always being made up of masked enforcers. The clone army hiding behind their protostorm trooper helmets. Boba Fett, Jango Fett, Vader, Leia's bounty hunter costume, Grievous, etc. People tend to abuse the term 'reading into', using it to mean 'don't think to hard'. This is a good example of an actual case of 'reading into', as it involves discounting elements of the text (the costume designs of background extras, the actress' actual performance, the meaning of words, etc.) in order to prop up a feeling. The word 'creature' connotes inferiority, subordination, and generally being pitiful. Rey is simply calling Kyle a loser who acts tough - though she's putting her abduction in weirdly romantic, mythological terms. "Hunted" emphasizes his strength, which results in a 'snow white'/'beauty and the beast' subtext that, for my money, is not really appropriate (though it's a very good example of the sort of thing that's perfect for going viral on chibi blogs and prompting love triangle speculation for when the next films come out. #teamfinn). Kylo should have been like "I've been hunting you a long time." That's creepy. There's nothing in the film about Kylo being a robotic Terminator figure. Yaws posted:I'm not disputing Lucas' ability to convey basic relationships through dialogue. He just writes these characters like he only has a vague idea what human beings sound like. Anakin and Padme don't sound like lovestruck teenagers. They sound like they grew up watching bad romance movies. It's fuckin' weird. It's a glaring and unforgivable flaw in the prequels. Look at this poo poo: That line is actually quite well-written. It flows well, and the repetition is actually a pretty vital part of what's being expressed - as in this quote: “I was not in love as yet, but I was in love with love; and, from a hidden hunger, I hated myself for not feeling more intensely a sense of hunger. I was looking for something to love, for I was in love with loving, and I hated security and a smooth way, free from snares.” -The Confessions of St. Augustine, Book 3, Chapter 1. The repetition of 'wish' underlines Anakin's frustration and dissatisfaction; he can't just wish. He knows wishing is pointless, so his desire is ever-stronger. It also returns to the point that Anakin ultimately wants to be reduced to a passive tool to be utilized. His ultimate desire is to be without desire at all. So of course, in the end, he ends up as the 'purely rational' Vader. SuperMechagodzilla fucked around with this message at 10:30 on Feb 14, 2016 |
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Feb 14, 2016 10:23
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Bongo Bill posted:Well, he's just spent the last decade living in a monastery, and she has spent even longer dedicating herself to being a full-time politician. Fictitious experience is the only kind of experience they could have in love. Even if I agree with this (and I don't) it doesn't make the character interactions any easier to listen to. One really has to strain to justify these lines. Like this: SuperMechagodzilla posted:
It doesn't flow well at all. There's no real rhythm there. The audience doesn't get the impression that Anakin is longing for detachment because his actions say the opposite. He doesn't want to be a passive tool considering his chat with Obi-Wan at the end of RotS. It's difficult to discern what his ultimate goal is. Was he going to have a lifelong relationship with Padme behind the backs of the Jedi Order? Did he think that would work out? Especially when he knocked her up? Was he planning on raising kids while under the thumb of a Sith Lord? Did he honestly think Padme would go along with him slaughtering the Jedi and becoming a Sith? Does Anakin think Padme is as dumb as he is? Why are we wasting our time debating the merits of these movies? Again, I get what Lucas was going for with the Anakin. I personally found his characterization lacking. He's just so. loving. stupid. edit; maybe Anakin has a line about leaving the Jedi Order 
Yaws fucked around with this message at 11:19 on Feb 14, 2016 |
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Feb 14, 2016 11:13
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http://givenclarity.tumblr.com/post/138219021506/this-is-how-i-see-tfa-ending-every-time
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Feb 14, 2016 11:14
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If we read the line "That happens when you're being hunted by a creature in a mask" simply as is, what does it tell us about Rey? If there's anything reading SMG's posts in this thread has taught me, it's that we should always do this. Rey must have experience being hunted by creatures in masks, because she implies the normal course of action is that you need to kill them. Instead of it being bad writing, maybe it actually informs us about Rey's character. Even though the metacommentary can exist in the same line, it doesn't mean from Rey's perspective that it means the same thing to her. Maybe the reason someone might find the line unsatisfactory is because we haven't been shown any establishing moments of Rey being hunted by other creatures in masks (unless she considers stormtroopers to be creatures, but that's sort of the same hunt that Ren was involved in so I'm not sure it counts). But it still remains, that line must inform us of her character when interpreting it as simply a line she, as a character, has said.
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Feb 14, 2016 15:43
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