The REAL USPol - February - The Something Awful Forums

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Meg From Family Guy: Feb 4, 2012

Electric Bugaloo posted:

Perpetual debt.

This is absolutely also the case in many, many parts of the East Coast and arguably the rest of the country. Anytime you see a Republican governor cut statewide education funding, you can bet that wealthier districts don't care because their schools are buoyed by local funds.

I grew up in Southwestern CT in a town that was, like, 90% families because everyone moved there specifically "for the schools." The public high school I attended was better than any of the prep schools and private schools in the area, aside from maybe one or two big names, and that remains the case for virtually all of the towns in Fairfield County, CT. The only families I know who sent their kids to what are mostly Catholic schools were the really vocally conservative ones- in hindsight, I appreciate how liberal my education was (because the faculty were well-educated and well-compensated) and I'm horrified by how grossly out-of-step with the national average it was in terms of quality and content, to say nothing of the travesties befalling underserved districts that my partner sees every day.

Granted, as I've come to learn in my tutoring work, the more big private schools you have around, the more comfortable families are about spending $100k/year on tuition ON TOP of the property taxes that fund the frankly top-tier local public schools in their areas. There is no shortage of parents in Boston-area suburbs who have no trouble paying me $75/hour to get their kid into Concord Academy despite often paying anywhere from $11k to $20k in property tax for an enviably good "free" high school not five minutes away. Because why settle for a 90% shot of getting your brood into a top-tier college if they work moderately hard, when you can spend the equivalent amount in tuition to functionally guarantee that they'll at least score a few solid NESCAC acceptances?

But while I'm not going to excuse the clearly out-of-touch spending habits of the NY couple from the article, fluctuating property values and their resulting taxes (which are generally going to be higher in wealthy, but still somewhat left-leaning New England towns) can vary widely, and it's unfortunately pretty common for people to have debt tied to those rising- and subsequently falling- assets.

To illustrate, my parents bought the house that I grew up in for probably ~$150k around 1990. They've put some modest upgrades into it over the years but it's otherwise your standard '60s/'70s-construction 3-bedroom, 2.5 bath suburban house. Nevertheless, that house became worth about $500k in the early 2000's and ballooned to $650k or more at the height of the housing bubble. Now it's probably worth about $350k in today's market, and would probably be worth at least $75k less anywhere else.

I think a plurality of legitimately middle-class New Englanders of my parents' generation moved into communities in the early '90s "for the schools," ended up taking out loans in the 2000's for any number of reasons against grossly inflated property values, and now have to deal with all of that debt. It's a big reason why you see so many people in their 40s-60s making $80k+ and still "barely getting by."

The guy you were responding to wasn't saying who a gamer is and who isn't, although that is a very popular strawman. He was saying that it's usually not gamers that end up criticising the industry (or rather make things up about it). It's people like sarkeesian, looking to get money from kickstarter and fame from the press championing her "moral cause".

(USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)

# ? Feb 18, 2016 06:57

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# ? Jun 7, 2024 00:16

CitizenKain: May 27, 2001; That was Gary Cooper, asshole.; Nap Ghost

bradburypancakes posted:

Does anyone have a link or copy of the henry article?

I'm pretty sure I have the link saved on computer at work, but I found this which is pretty close.
http://www.wsj.com/articles/six-figure-incomesand-facing-financial-ruin-1409936418

# ? Feb 18, 2016 06:57

FCKGW: May 21, 2006

Cliven Bundy was just indicted on federal charges.

# ? Feb 18, 2016 07:01

His Divine Shadow: Aug 7, 2000; I'm not a fascist. I'm a priest. Fascists dress up in black and tell people what to do.

shrike82 posted:

lol, the perennial 250K DnD debate.

Not sure why you guys are fussing over dry cleaning.
The biggest issue for families at that tier of income is often schooling. Not uncommon for private school to hit 30K a year per kid in a lot of the major cities.

outlaw private schools, problem solved.

# ? Feb 18, 2016 07:07

fosborb: Dec 15, 2006; Chronic Good Poster

Meg From Family Guy posted:

The guy you were responding to wasn't saying who a gamer is and who isn't, although that is a very popular strawman. He was saying that it's usually not gamers that end up criticising the industry (or rather make things up about it). It's people like sarkeesian, looking to get money from kickstarter and fame from the press championing her "moral cause".

What the gently caress is this poo poo

# ? Feb 18, 2016 07:10

His Divine Shadow: Aug 7, 2000; I'm not a fascist. I'm a priest. Fascists dress up in black and tell people what to do.

alpha_destroy posted:

Since we are speaking of HENRYs and poo poo like that, here is my anecdote. Two summers ago I was visiting my in-laws and we were having a good old time in their pool. For whatever reason my in-laws got to talking about wine and this particular bottle of wine that they were getting excited for because it was pretty exclusive and you could only buy a certain number of bottles and you had to wait for your number to come up or some poo poo I don't really understand. Anyway I was very confused so I asked about what was going on and my father-in-law explained this was all because this wine club he was a part of. The way he explained the benefits of the club was like this: "and it's a great club because it allows an average guy like me to get a bottle of wine for 60 or 70 dollars." (I want to break for a second and state that yes I realize expensive wine is much more expensive than that. And yes that is no doubt a very good deal for the bottle of wine he was getting. This is beside the point.) I just... I just didn't have the heart to him that the average American probably gets their wine in a loving box.

Point is, people have no concept of what average actually means with it comes to matters of income or spending.

You should call him and let him know.

# ? Feb 18, 2016 07:13

On Terra Firma: Feb 12, 2008

FCKGW posted:

Cliven Bundy was just indicted on federal charges.

never been a better time to use this

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hrMawW5J6NU

# ? Feb 18, 2016 07:32

computer parts: Nov 18, 2010; PLEASE CLAP

FCKGW posted:

Cliven Bundy was just indicted on federal charges.

But guys, they totally should've stormed that ranch way back when.

# ? Feb 18, 2016 07:44

Technogeek: Sep 9, 2002; by FactsAreUseless

bradburypancakes posted:

Does anyone have a link or copy of the henry article?

This is the only thing you need from the article.

# ? Feb 18, 2016 07:50

Roumba: Jun 29, 2005; Buglord

Does anyone remember the origin of that gif? Goon-created, Onion, immaculate imgurception?

# ? Feb 18, 2016 08:05

ComradeCosmobot: Dec 4, 2004; USPOL July

gradenko_2000 posted:

Do we have a thread for the encryption hullabaloo between Apple and the FBI? It seems to be gaining traction.

I assume the surveillance thread is still applicable.

# ? Feb 18, 2016 08:12

Quandary: Jan 29, 2008

Technogeek posted:

This is the only thing you need from the article.

This is a good gif.

# ? Feb 18, 2016 08:21

Harik: Sep 9, 2001; From the hard streets of Moscow
First dog to touch the stars; Plaster Town Cop

mastershakeman posted:

I actually worked as a foreclosure lawyer for over three years and this isn't close to true and even if it is you just file an affidavit saying you lost everything and move on

This does get funny though when things get found after swearing they're gone

Which part? Because it matches my experience with the system exactly. My favorite was the purported allonge (stamped by the county) that made no chronological sense at all. a->b months after b->c, invalid middlemen who were never transferred to, etc. We objected, they got a mulligan and came back with a less obviously fake copy, repeat as needed for years.

I like how perjury is just a joke now, too.

# ? Feb 18, 2016 08:21

trilobite terror: Oct 20, 2007; BUT MY LIVELIHOOD DEPENDS ON THE FORUMS!

fosborb posted:

What the gently caress is this poo poo

Fifth-dimensional trolling?

At face value, it's a stupid, stupid opinion.

# ? Feb 18, 2016 09:01

Sylink: Apr 17, 2004

My Imaginary GF posted:

What's the bullabaloo? It sounds like FBI are making an entirely reasonable request for a one-time situation.

If Apple doesn't unlock that phone, are they willing to accept the financial responsibility for any future terrorist attacks which may be connected to the San Bernadino jihadists?

Because its not Apple's job to help the FBI.

# ? Feb 18, 2016 12:40

Sylink: Apr 17, 2004

Also I don't think Apple can break the encryption anyway.

# ? Feb 18, 2016 12:44

Samurai Sanders: Nov 4, 2003; Pillbug

I was thinking about that this morning, but even if they could break it, is there a way to break the encryption on just a single phone, or by definition have you now effectively cracked every iphone?

# ? Feb 18, 2016 12:47

Mr. Nice!: Oct 13, 2005; bone shaking.
soul baking.

Sylink posted:

Also I don't think Apple can break the encryption anyway.

They want apple to create a new firmware for that phone that will allow the FBI to hook it up to a computer a brute force the PIN.

# ? Feb 18, 2016 12:47

DeusExMachinima: Sep 2, 2012; This poster loves police brutality, but only when its against minorities!

Put this loser on ignore immediately!

Properly implemented 256-bit AES is not going to be cracked by conventional computers before the Sun goes nova. A quantum computer can basically cheat and do it much faster but nobody has one of those yet or if the NSA does they're ahead of public scientific knowledge on the subject and they're not telling.

However IIRC the FBI just wants help with the phone's unlock screen, which has way fewer possible combinations. They're afraid the phone has a setting turned on that will erase the hard drive's contents if there's too many failed attempts and they want Apple to disable that. Of course Tim Cook is still completely in the right to tell them to gently caress off. Of course there's no guarantee that if the phone's unlocked the HD won't be AES encrypted anyway.

My Imaginary GF posted:

What's the bullabaloo? It sounds like FBI are making an entirely reasonable request for a one-time situation.

If Apple doesn't unlock that phone, are they willing to accept the financial responsibility for any future terrorist attacks which may be connected to the San Bernadino jihadists?

Any tool they gave the FBI to work just this once can be reverse-engineered to work all the time. That's unacceptable because the privacy of my cell phone unlock screen is more important than your dead kids.

# ? Feb 18, 2016 12:52

hallebarrysoetoro: Jun 14, 2003

Technogeek posted:

This is the only thing you need from the article.

I used to hate that gif back when I remembered the article more than the gif itself, but now that I barely remember that the article was trying to manipulate public opinion by a bloo bloo'ing people living on 3-10x the national average income having to pay a rounding error more in taxes per year it isn't so bad now

# ? Feb 18, 2016 13:17

MiddleOne: Feb 17, 2011

On Terra Firma posted:

A Guillotine would be too humane.

Does the cleaner live with them??? You could hire someone full-time for what they're paying to clean their poo poo house.

Also, 4000 for the kids activities??? Not even Hockey is that expensive.

# ? Feb 18, 2016 13:18

His Divine Shadow: Aug 7, 2000; I'm not a fascist. I'm a priest. Fascists dress up in black and tell people what to do.

Kids activities is burning 50 dollar bills in front of homeless people. It adds up.

# ? Feb 18, 2016 13:20

Mr. Nice!: Oct 13, 2005; bone shaking.
soul baking.

DeusExMachinima posted:

Properly implemented 256-bit AES is not going to be cracked by conventional computers before the Sun goes nova. A quantum computer can basically cheat and do it much faster but nobody has one of those yet or if the NSA does they're ahead of public scientific knowledge on the subject and they're not telling.

However IIRC the FBI just wants help with the phone's unlock screen, which has way fewer possible combinations. They're afraid the phone has a setting turned on that will erase the hard drive's contents if there's too many failed attempts and they want Apple to disable that. Of course Tim Cook is still completely in the right to tell them to gently caress off. Of course there's no guarantee that if the phone's unlocked the HD won't be AES encrypted anyway.

Any tool they gave the FBI to work just this once can be reverse-engineered to work all the time. That's unacceptable because the privacy of my cell phone unlock screen is more important than your dead kids.

Its not even about wiping the phone. Even if the 10 passcode wipe is not enabled, after each failed passcode there is a delay timer before you can put in another. You don't see it until you get 3 or 4 attempts deep but very quickly it locks you out of the phone for progressively longer with each failure. I've seen my step sister's phone get locked out for an hour because she couldn't remember the PIN she just made. The FBI specifically wants to bypass this delay with a custom firmware plus the ability to input PINs remotely so they can brute force the code by hooking it up to a computer.

# ? Feb 18, 2016 13:30

Yadoppsi: May 10, 2009

Xoidanor posted:

Does the cleaner live with them??? You could hire someone full-time for what they're paying to clean their poo poo house.

Dunno if it was that or another of the "poor rich folk" articles that were all the rage for awhile, but a HENRY was complaining about how raising kids was so expensive what with private schools and her kids' live in nanny, etc. There was a beautiful moment where the writer or illustrator rebelled against the editorial line: A caption of a photo of the nanny taking the kids to the dentist mentioned how this nanny was a mother of four who's job paid no health insurance.

# ? Feb 18, 2016 13:43

MiddleOne: Feb 17, 2011

Yadoppsi posted:

Dunno if it was that or another of the "poor rich folk" articles that were all the rage for awhile, but a HENRY was complaining about how raising kids was so expensive what with private schools and her kids' live in nanny, etc. There was a beautiful moment where the writer or illustrator rebelled against the editorial line: A caption of a photo of the nanny taking the kids to the dentist mentioned how this nanny was a mother of four who's job paid no health insurance.

Magical.

# ? Feb 18, 2016 13:47

haveblue: Aug 15, 2005; Toilet Rascal

DeusExMachinima posted:

Of course there's no guarantee that if the phone's unlocked the HD won't be AES encrypted anyway.

There are no third party whole-disk encryption programs on iOS, if Apple ends up being forced to assist the FBI, they'll be able to get the data. ~~This is only the case because the guy used an older iPhone; more recent ones have sealed encryption hardware that can't be bypassed at all.~~

e: Apple seems to have admitted that they could do this on current phones as well.

haveblue fucked around with this message at 14:24 on Feb 18, 2016

# ? Feb 18, 2016 14:08

Captain_Maclaine: Sep 30, 2001; Every moment that I'm alive, I pray for death!

computer parts posted:

Though US Citizens still can't go because of the embargo.

"That won't be a problem," Obama said, suppressing a smirk as he thought about the secret Kenyan passport he always carried on his person.

# ? Feb 18, 2016 14:33

Shifty Pony: Dec 28, 2004; Up ta somethin'

DeusExMachinima posted:

Any tool they gave the FBI to work just this once can be reverse-engineered to work all the time. That's unacceptable because the privacy of my cell phone unlock screen is more important than your dead kids.

That's actually not true - the software would never leave Apple's possession per the order, nor would the phone while it was running the software (which has to be in RAM only to prevent tainting the evidence on the flash memory).

Further iPhones won't accept OS software for install unless it has a cryptographically signed message saying that software is install-able for that phone's serial number. That's why you can't downgrade iOS versions even if you have the iOS installation image - Apple stops providing new "ok you can install this" messages for their old iOS versions for phones that can run the newer ones. I think that the protection is really deep in the iPhone, perhaps built-in to the chips' hardwired firmware, and this protection is the main reason that the FBI has to go to Apple in the first place.

What Apple is concerned about is that if they show the ability to make this software then every single law enforcement group in the US will getting court orders for them to do the same. Also other countries (particularly China) will start demanding the software, and they won't be as willing to let Apple keep sole possession of it.

Oddly enough the software wouldn't even work on the majority of iPhones in use. The iPhone 5c which the order is about doesn't have the same security measures as the 5s, 6, and 6s models. The 5c does the security work and lockout in software while the newer models have a physically separate "Secure Enclave" processor+memory bit on the CPU chip which the OS software cannot access or modify beyond inputting a passcode to see if the decryption key pop out the other end, making this sort of bypass potentially impossible. That isn't to say that a similar attack isn't possible. The secure enclave does have some sort of firmware which is upgradable but nobody outside of Apple knows what exactly is involved with that process - the phone may have to be unlocked for the firmware upgrade which would make it impossible to change the timeouts or reset the wipe option like the FBI is demanding.

Assuming that Apple loses what I really want to see is just how much they charge as a "reasonable cost" for the work. They can't just use a lightly tweaked version of iOS because it has to reside and execute in only in 1GB of RAM and include the ability to automate the passcode attempts. The FBI might be in for a bit of sticker shock at how much what they are asking for will cost when done by top tier programmers and Comp-E's like those at Apple.

Oh yeah - and Scalia ~~kicking the bucket~~ getting smothered with a pillow probably made it a lot more likely that Apple will lose when this hits the SCOTUS.

Shifty Pony fucked around with this message at 14:39 on Feb 18, 2016

# ? Feb 18, 2016 14:36

Good Citizen: Aug 12, 2008; trump trump trump trump trump trump trump trump trump trump

Technogeek posted:

This is the only thing you need from the article.

Seriously, gently caress HENRYs. Thinking they can foul up my country club just because they're killing themselves to squeeze out a couple hundred K

# ? Feb 18, 2016 14:38

Teriyaki Koinku: Nov 25, 2008; Bread! Bread! Bread!

Bread! BREAD! BREAD!

Country clubs are symbols of wealth inequality, social stratification, and racial segregation and should all burn.

# ? Feb 18, 2016 14:54

Alec Bald Snatch: Sep 12, 2012; by exmarx

Also golf is hella lame.

# ? Feb 18, 2016 14:58

Harik: Sep 9, 2001; From the hard streets of Moscow
First dog to touch the stars; Plaster Town Cop

DeusExMachinima posted:

Properly implemented 256-bit AES is not going to be cracked by conventional computers before the Sun goes nova. A quantum computer can basically cheat and do it much faster but nobody has one of those yet or if the NSA does they're ahead of public scientific knowledge on the subject and they're not telling.

It's worse than that. Exponents go up crazy fast - 2^257-1 is 2.3*10^77. Hard physical limit, the planck second, is 5.39*10^-44. Assuming you made a ridiculous supercomputer that test one key per planck second, it still takes 4.3 * 10^33 seconds ... which is something like 1.3 hundred million billion billion years. That's tens of million billions of times the lifetime of the universe.

Quantum isn't magic - brute force searches are limited to O(sqrt(N)). That theoretically breaks AES-256, if someone figures out how to make a 256 qbit quantum computer. AES-384 would still take a theoretical planck-speed quantum computer a million years to crack.

# ? Feb 18, 2016 15:03

mastershakeman: Oct 28, 2008; by vyelkin

Harik posted:

Which part? Because it matches my experience with the system exactly. My favorite was the purported allonge (stamped by the county) that made no chronological sense at all. a->b months after b->c, invalid middlemen who were never transferred to, etc. We objected, they got a mulligan and came back with a less obviously fake copy, repeat as needed for years.

I like how perjury is just a joke now, too.

I mean it's certainly possible the lawyers are totally incompetent but you don't even need a copy of the note/mortgage to proceed in the jurisdictions I'm aware of. And yes caring about perjury is non existent on both sides and it's pathetic.

The judges seem to compromise on letting the banks have poo poo records in exchange for homeowners denying they ever got a loan and somehow just magically moved into a house.

Edit: stuff about assignments and middlemen and whatnot actually has no legal significance at least in Illinois but it's faster to get them in order for stupid judges than it is to appeal them over and over.

mastershakeman fucked around with this message at 15:08 on Feb 18, 2016

# ? Feb 18, 2016 15:04

Samurai Sanders: Nov 4, 2003; Pillbug

Your Dunkle Sans posted:

Country clubs are symbols of wealth inequality, social stratification, and racial segregation and should all burn.

comes along bort posted:

Also golf is hella lame.

I have had a few people seriously argue to me that that was the past of golf and now it's a game for everyone. Yeah...no. It was one of my first disappointments with Obama when he stopped publicly playing basketball and switched to golf.

# ? Feb 18, 2016 15:13

zoux: Apr 28, 2006

Here's a video of Mitch McConnell in 2008 saying the Thurmond rule doesn't exist, is stupid, and decries the practice of running out the clock.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/vide...b231_video.html

# ? Feb 18, 2016 15:21

Eggplant Squire: Aug 14, 2003

Is there serious anyone actually saying that we need to respect the Thurmond rule?

# ? Feb 18, 2016 15:29

zoux: Apr 28, 2006

Radish posted:

Is there serious anyone actually saying that we need to respect the Thurmond rule?

Since the Thurmond rule is "don't do judicial confirmations in (the last six months) of an election year", yeah, the entire GOP is.

https://twitter.com/ZekeJMiller/status/700325875095617537
:stonk:

# ? Feb 18, 2016 15:30

Eggplant Squire: Aug 14, 2003

This is showing my ignorance but isn't the Thurmond rule just something he made up? Like how is that anymore legitimate a reason than if Reid made the Reid Rule which says you have to confirm in the last six months?

# ? Feb 18, 2016 15:40

Gin and Juche: Apr 3, 2008; The Highest Judge of Paradise
Shiki Eiki
YAMAXANADU

Radish posted:

This is showing my ignorance but isn't the Thurmond rule just something he made up? Like how is that anymore legitimate a reason than if Reid made the Reid Rule which says you have to confirm in the last six months?

A lot of American politics is based off of precedent. It should probably be viewed as about as relevant as the :heritage:

flag he hung on the statehouse as a gently caress you to the Civil Rights movement though.

# ? Feb 18, 2016 15:42

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# ? Jun 7, 2024 00:16

Sulphagnist: Oct 10, 2006; WARNING! INTRUDERS DETECTED

If the "Thurmond rule" didn't exist (there aren't enough quotation marks on the planet to appropriately describe it), the Republicans would invent it.

# ? Feb 18, 2016 15:43

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