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Jordan7hm posted:I mean, if that's your attitude, sure. Success is literally just luck so why even bother. Im honestly surprised you are missing the point since youre normally more spot on. Maybe this is a soft spot for you because youve been born and raised in those connections but for the vat majority, growing up in poverty or working poor conditions stacks the deck extremely against you, no matter how good you are at what you do. I dont know how you think people can afford that ClubLink membership to fraternize with doctors to build inside connections. I certainly dont know any pharmacists that would hang out in any of the places I can afford to socialize at. You are vastly underestimating the financial barriers that have been going up in every work place across this country, the increasing prevalence of nepotism only makes it worse.
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Feb 26, 2016 05:26
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I posted a while ago about how so many people who grew up in relatively wealthy households just don't understand that their self made man schtick is so insufferable because they have no self awareness as to just how life easy is when you are born in to a position of strength. 'Weight the risks'? What do these people know about weighing the risks. Risk isn't 'I tried a career change and it didn't work out so I had to lower myself to accepting the job offer at my dads golf buddies firm' it's 'I bought a bus pass hoping that I could save 20 bucks this month over buying single ride tickets but work cut back on hours and now I can't afford to make rent because I spent too much on this bus pass'. THAT is why the less people have the more risk adverse they are.
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Feb 26, 2016 05:41
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Furnaceface posted:Im honestly surprised you are missing the point since youre normally more spot on. Maybe this is a soft spot for you because youve been born and raised in those connections but for the vat majority, growing up in poverty or working poor conditions stacks the deck extremely against you, no matter how good you are at what you do. It's decidedly the other way around. I don't have those family connections, so I work drat hard at making sure I forge them when I find the opportunity. I'm a single dad who does full time school and part time work, and I still make sure I go to networking events, get into leadership positions in industry related clubs, etc. Little stuff like this matters, as much because it reinforces an attitude in you as any tangible benefit you'll get from it. I've worked jobs where I did 90 hour weeks because that's what was expected. So what, suck it up, and find something else, but in the meantime pay your bills. There are a lot of people out there who have it a lot worse than me, but there are just as many who have it a lot better, and who I see failing to take advantage of what's right in front of them. It's very frustrating on the one hand trying and often failing to get classmates to go out and do the things that are more likely to make them employable (because getting high is fun, and  ), and in the next breath having to listen to them complain about how they just can't find jobs. I don't think there are many people who can look in the mirror and honestly pass off all their failings on their socioeconomic conditions and not on something they actually have control over.e: if when you graduate from a university your answer to "what did you do in those 4 years" is "i went to class and got good grades", then you weren't doing enough. That's just kind of how it is, it sucks but you're competing with people who are actually going to have a better answer than that.
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Feb 26, 2016 05:47
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Rime posted:We disagree on pretty much everything but I appreciate the concern. I'm not planning on killing myself tomorrow, however I'm quite fed up that at nearly 26 I'm working utterly garbage gigs below my CV, for starvation wages, and watching my friends do the same as they slowly lose the reasonably paid positions they acquired last decade. Join a trade or get a unionized job outside of BC. This is your only hope with no education or without a small loan of 1 million dollars. For ex, I know a bunch of people working at the LCBO for nearly $23-25 an hour, or city bus drivers cruising for $30 an hour. Basically any trade is in the 25-35 an hour unionized, but you can easily clear more. If you're trying to get a kush office gig without hard skills it's rough. Risky Bisquick fucked around with this message at 05:52 on Feb 26, 2016 |
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Feb 26, 2016 05:49
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By the way in case you think that's exaggerated made up bullshit, it isn't. She worked at loving foot locker that had to ride the bus all the way from Oakville to Hamilton and did it through city transit who had to do that exact thing. We often met when I was working the late shift and took the 11 bus from Burlington to Hamilton. She couldn't afford to take the GO because she couldn't budget single fares or even a 10 ride pass and if she bought a monthly pass and didn't get enough shifts to warrant the high cost of the monthly pass she and her kid would be out on the street. EDIT: p sure it was Oakville, not Missisauga. EvilJoven fucked around with this message at 05:54 on Feb 26, 2016 |
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Feb 26, 2016 05:52
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Jordan7hm posted:It's decidedly the other way around. I don't have those family connections, so I work drat hard at making sure I forge them when I find the opportunity. I'm a single dad who does full time school and part time work, and I still make sure I go to networking events, get into leadership positions in industry related clubs, etc. Little stuff like this matters, as much because it reinforces an attitude in you as any tangible benefit you'll get from it. I've worked jobs where I did 90 hour weeks because that's what was expected. So what, suck it up, and find something else, but in the meantime pay your bills. This is all very true. Sometimes it doesn't even have to be your industry. When I worked at a loving bakery I would chat with customers, ask about their lives, etc. Eventually I got headhunted to be a car salesperson by one of those customers (which I turned down). Especially in a small (relatively) city like Vancouver, people know people. You go to a random networking meeting, you meet a dude who works as the webmaster for a company in your field who offers to introduce you to his boss. That sort of thing happens. But you have to get your rear end out there. Which really sucks when you're doing it for a job. Because you're not getting paid for it, and yeah, sitting at home playing Xbox is more fun. But in the long run, a lot of the time, that networking poo poo pays off in spades. I'd be nowhere, probably still working at McDonalds, if I hadn't networked my rear end off in my field.
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Feb 26, 2016 05:55
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EvilJoven posted:By the way in case you think that's exaggerated made up bullshit, it isn't. Her fault for not getting enough university education and also picking the correct degrees and knowing the correct people. Also if she had invested the bus pass money in a mutual fund she'd be a billionaire by now. But really she's an idiot for choosing to live in Canada, if she had any brains she'd have moved out of Canada and gotten some sort of finance job in a major world city, everyone should do that.
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Feb 26, 2016 05:55
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Rime, work for BC ferries, cushy overpaid union job forever
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Feb 26, 2016 05:57
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CanPol: Millennial job prospect support thread
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Feb 26, 2016 05:58
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EvilJoven posted:By the way in case you think that's exaggerated made up bullshit, it isn't. Apart from the systemic issues you've identified, this is a great example of why transit needs to be extremely heavily subsidized by, essentially, punitive fees on car ownership and use. Transit is far too expensive, especially considering the loving poo poo service you receive in this country. Madrid's transit cost half the price for service that was 10 times better (it's not linear, of course, because a system where you have to wait a maximum of 20 minutes for a route is far more than twice as good as one where you have to wait 40 minutes for a route). Make everyone pay for their parking, like I have to, and redirect all the funds from that into improving transit. Increase property taxes too, if absolutely necessary. Transit is an area where I want to spend money, not an area where I want to save money. gently caress every rear end in a top hat who thinks free on-street parking is their god-given right, especially.
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Feb 26, 2016 05:59
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PT6A posted:Apart from the systemic issues you've identified, this is a great example of why transit needs to be extremely heavily subsidized by, essentially, punitive fees on car ownership and use. Transit is far too expensive, especially considering the loving poo poo service you receive in this country. Madrid's transit cost half the price for service that was 10 times better (it's not linear, of course, because a system where you have to wait a maximum of 20 minutes for a route is far more than twice as good as one where you have to wait 40 minutes for a route). Make everyone pay for their parking, like I have to, and redirect all the funds from that into improving transit. Increase property taxes too, if absolutely necessary. Transit is an area where I want to spend money, not an area where I want to save money. To be fair, the cost of transit in Toronto is like $120 or whatever a month. I pay $90 insurance for my daily driver, $200 gas, $7 vehicle reg, $200 amortized cost over 10 years, $13 oil, $125 maintenence per month, which works out to about $635 / month in true costs to have the privilege to sit in traffic in the GTA. That said we need to dump bucketloads of money into transportation and quash nimbys to expropriate land for transit use if needed. I wonder how many people actually calculate how much it costs them to own a car and drive.
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Feb 26, 2016 06:09
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Holy poo poo that last post of mine was word salad, thanks cell phone keyboard and your desire to sometimes put the cursor wherever the gently caress you want. Anyway, for every 'I put myself out there and everything worked out' story theres a ton of 'I tried and failed and now we're broke forever' and while I'm glad some of you who put in all that hard work managed to pull it off gently caress you, in the end some of it really was just luck and as the risks of failure steadily increase and the chances of success steadily decrease we need to gear society in a way where people have to rely less on their individual luck and more on our societies collective successes.
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Feb 26, 2016 06:10
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EvilJoven posted:and while I'm glad some of you who put in all that hard work managed to pull it off gently caress you No, gently caress you
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Feb 26, 2016 06:12
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I make 33 dollars an hour through pure dumb luck and concidence, I could just as easily still be living in someones basement making 11 dollars an hour working retail.
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Feb 26, 2016 06:14
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jm20 posted:To be fair, the cost of transit in Toronto is like $120 or whatever a month. I pay $90 insurance for my daily driver, $200 gas, $7 vehicle reg, $200 amortized cost over 10 years, $13 oil, $125 maintenence per month, which works out to about $635 / month in true costs to have the privilege to sit in traffic in the GTA. That said we need to dump bucketloads of money into transportation and quash nimbys to expropriate land for transit use if needed. An adult TTC Metropass is currently $141.50/mo or $129.75/mo. if you buy in advance for the whole year. It's still much cheaper than owning a car, but the time and reliability factors fudge that quite a bit if you're not traveling in the city core. Presto fares for Metrolinx (GO) and surrounding local transit vary considerably, but with even infrequent travel to Brampton and Mississauga it averages me over $50/mo.
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Feb 26, 2016 06:15
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EvilJoven posted:Holy poo poo that last post of mine was word salad, thanks cell phone keyboard and your desire to sometimes put the cursor wherever the gently caress you want. Yes, luck is always a factor; hell, I'm lucky by default for being born white, male, above average height, and smart in a way that's marketable. Recognizing that luck plays a massive role in any kind of success is why I'm a big believer in socialism. But that doesn't mean individual agency can be completely discounted either. (To be clear, I wasn't talking about people who are so poor that they are making the choice between a $100 bus pass and shelter, or bus fare and food. I am however talking about the very large swath of the university population that graduates every year believing they are owed a job or something by virtue of their ability to attend class most of the time.)
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Feb 26, 2016 06:18
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infernal machines posted:An adult TTC Metropass is currently $141.50/mo or $129.75/mo. if you buy in advance for the whole year. It's still much cheaper than owning a car, but the time and reliability factors fudge that quite a bit if you're not traveling in the city core. Presto fares for Metrolinx (GO) and surrounding local transit vary considerably, but with even infrequent travel to Brampton and Mississauga it averages me over $50/mo. I use Kijiji for this stuff, please don't pay retail price for things 
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Feb 26, 2016 06:18
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jm20 posted:I use Kijiji for this stuff, please don't pay retail price for things Um, okay. I have a business requirement to be able to travel within the GTA, and most frequently in Toronto, where I live. The 100% reliable way to ensure that I have a transit pass on time every month, is to buy one from the TTC. I'm not sure that hunting for one online and risking getting scammed or rolled for cash is really worth the potential cost savings. But if it works for you, then good on you.
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Feb 26, 2016 06:31
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Jordan7hm posted:Yes, luck is always a factor; hell, I'm lucky by default for being born white, male, above average height, and smart in a way that's marketable. Recognizing that luck plays a massive role in any kind of success is why I'm a big believer in socialism. But that doesn't mean individual agency can be completely discounted either. I'm glad you're at least self aware of this. So many people aren't, especially people who have even more advantages than you. It's loving infuriating, especially when those people go on and on about bootstraps. As for individual agency, it's kinda like steering a boat. Some people find themselves on calm seas and can go wherever they want with a little effort, others end up caught up in some storm and have to fight to keep it pointed into the wind, let alone on course. Except in life we can't wake up, look outside and go 'gently caress that, it's poo poo out there today'.
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Feb 26, 2016 06:40
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jm20 posted:To be fair, the cost of transit in Toronto is like $120 or whatever a month. I pay $90 insurance for my daily driver, $200 gas, $7 vehicle reg, $200 amortized cost over 10 years, $13 oil, $125 maintenence per month, which works out to about $635 / month in true costs to have the privilege to sit in traffic in the GTA. That said we need to dump bucketloads of money into transportation and quash nimbys to expropriate land for transit use if needed. Who gives a flying gently caress how much it costs to drive? Transit is as close to a pure public good as I can imagine, and having a great transit system improves everyone's life so much. Driving will always be, and should be, significantly more expensive, and regular transit use should be within the grasp of the least prosperous in our society. Make transit not suck rear end, and make it somewhat affordable, and suddenly people can go to their jobs and do shopping and live a normal life without a car. I've lived in places where transit is great, which is why the sorry loving state of Calgary Transit makes me so loving angry that I regularly call them all a bunch of cunts to their faces. Edit: before anyone asks: yes, I would pay more taxes to fund transit. Without a second thought. I get by mostly free, as I very rarely pay for transit, while many folks need to pay insane rates for terrible service. That's not right. Edit 2: Admittedly, I am lucky to have an opinion on the matter which is informed by experiences in a number of different cities all over the world. If my sole experience with transit systems were with Calgary Transit, I'd be strongly against it too. I know people who live within walking distance of a C-Train station (or downtown, if you don't mind a hike) who still pay $600/month for a parking spot downtown. PT6A fucked around with this message at 07:00 on Feb 26, 2016 |
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Feb 26, 2016 06:51
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EvilJoven posted:I'm glad you're at least self aware of this. So many people aren't, especially people who have even more advantages than you. It's loving infuriating, especially when those people go on and on about bootstraps. What purpose does it serve to dwell on past random events, positive or negative?
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Feb 26, 2016 06:58
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I really want to make it clear the distinction I have with agreeing with Jordanh7m's argument and my own bootstraps thing. This argument is solely a coping strategy to deal with the realities of socioeconomic conditions, it's a prescriptive thought on how one person can look at their situation. It is not, and I cannot emphasize this enough, not some deontological position that argues that this ought to be the prevailing philosophy of public policy. Every criticism here over the socioeconomic conditions and nepotism seen in the modern day workplace are valid and need to be tackled on a political level. However, when down to the individual level, to fall onto those realities as a means to drag yourself into a cynical and nihilistic worldview will only create a self fulfilling prophecy. Jordanh7m is correct, you absolutely have to build and exploit your networks available to you. As an immigrant myself who didnt have family networks to begin with I intentionally began creating them to open up opportunities. While you can't control the results of the dice being thrown, you can control how many times or when you throw them.
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Feb 26, 2016 07:04
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Ikantski posted:What purpose does it serve to dwell on past random events, positive or negative? Speaking as someone who placed really high in the vagina lottery, and who's got fairly lucky since, there ain't a drat thing wrong with being pissed off at people who don't appreciate the role that chance has played in their lives.
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Feb 26, 2016 07:04
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Melian Dialogue posted:While you can't control the results of the dice being thrown, you can control how many times or when you throw them. To a certain extent, yes. To continue your metaphor, some people get handed the dice far more often than others. Life is not a craps table where everyone gets to be the shooter in sequence.
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Feb 26, 2016 07:10
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Wow you guys are all never going to make good salesmen, public contract bidders or ethnic money
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Feb 26, 2016 07:18
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PT6A posted:Speaking as someone who placed really high in the vagina lottery, and who's got fairly lucky since, there ain't a drat thing wrong with being pissed off at people who don't appreciate the role that chance has played in their lives. Especially when those people fail to see the need for a much better safety net to catch those who fall when things don't work out their favor and begrudge the fact that some people fall and expect that net in the first place, acting like failure is always somehow triggered by the person suffering from it. And even when people see the need for and advocate for a safety net, they still sometimes turn around and get mad at people who dare get upset at the fact that they have to play at a table with a stacked deck. Yes, we all have to play this game but gently caress anyone who expects me to smile when I know the hand is rigged, even if it's rigged in a way where I might still win. Melian Dialogue posted:However, when down to the individual level, to fall onto those realities as a means to drag yourself into a cynical and nihilistic worldview will only create a self fulfilling prophecy. Holy gently caress I'm agreeing with you. Unfortunately, people can't be rational actors all the time. Never forget that as smart as people can be, we're animals. Kick a dog too many times and it takes more than a pat on the head and a biscuit for it to stop snapping at people and pissing on itself when it gets frightened. We're not so different.
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Feb 26, 2016 07:25
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I can't actually respond to the past few pages because I'm on mobile and my hands are shaking from watching a machine eat itself again. But yeah, we're all hosed. I posted elsewhere about the 1.5 hour personality test I had to do just to enter the lottery of maybe getting an interview at Telus. Alberta imploding has put nearly all the trades underwater for years to come with a journeyman glut. How do you even try and find a stable career path when every time you try and pivot, you find doors slamming shut and entire industries going under? 
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Feb 26, 2016 08:35
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Rime posted:How do you even try and find a stable career path when every time you try and pivot, you find doors slamming shut and entire industries going under? When you do land a job in your field or one that is livable, never stop planning your next move and setting up avenues to do so (licensing, training, networking). Sometimes you'll move ahead, sideways, or fall behind a bit, but it's better than falling off. I had to change careers four times in my 20s to avoid collapsing industries and companies, but there was always a common thread that let me find work. Right now I'm working so far outside of my education that it tends to raise eyebrows, but the pay and quality of life is right. And I'm still looking for another opportunity. Wasting fucked around with this message at 11:52 on Feb 26, 2016 |
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Feb 26, 2016 11:37
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Itt: a couple pages of untreated depressed people talking about how it's impossible to succeed ever for any reason unless it randomly happens to you, why bother doing anything, why don't I just go kill myself. Seek help jesus
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Feb 26, 2016 13:07
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terrorist ambulance posted:why bother doing anything, why don't I just go kill myself Eternal truth ITT.
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Feb 26, 2016 14:04
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Get a job at sea... Don't worry about room and board and food and you can stay as long as you like. Depending on the industry the money's not that great but not having any expenses will offset that.
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Feb 26, 2016 14:24
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And you'll get to dress up like a pirate
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Feb 26, 2016 14:28
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Ikantski posted:I haven't figured out how they got the deficit from 7.5 to 5.7b yet http://www.macleans.ca/economy/economicanalysis/ontario-shrank-its-deficit-but-how/ quote:– Government expenses were $400 million higher than forecast, including $300 million needed to set up the new cap-and-trade system. He left out $159 million extra from OLG. We lowered our deficit by drinking, gambling, buying houses, raiding the reserves and selling Hydro One. We can balance it if federal government balances it for us. http://www.thestar.com/news/queenspark/2016/02/25/wynne-banking-on-trudeaus-helping-hand-to-reach-a-balanced-budget.html quote:Federal funding is expected to increase by almost $2 billion in the coming year, from $22.9 billion in 2015 to $24.6 billion in 2016. The biggest source of cash comes in the form of infrastructure programs, which Prime Minister Justin Trudeau made a key part of his election campaign. Also helps explain why Ontario's budget is two months early instead of the usual April, they get to budget in federal transfers that don't actually exist yet.
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Feb 26, 2016 15:53
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What's the scoop on Ontario's mincome plans? They just as bad as what bunny posted?
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Feb 26, 2016 16:12
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Former Alberta Premier Don Getty, dead.
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Feb 26, 2016 16:25
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EvilJoven posted:What's the scoop on Ontario's mincome plans? They just as bad as what bunny posted? Come live in Ontario, we'll minimize your income?  http://www.fin.gov.on.ca/en/budget/ontariobudgets/2016/papers_all.pdfThis Coyne article isn't the worst, http://news.nationalpost.com/full-comment/andrew-coyne-wynne-liberals-succeed-in-making-the-terms-budget-and-deficit-near-incomprehensible quote:Money is money: if the government were not spending the carbon money on green technology, it would have to finance it from some other part of its budget. Or, indeed, its off-budget. Postess with the Mostest fucked around with this message at 16:31 on Feb 26, 2016 |
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Feb 26, 2016 16:26
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I wonder if he had CTE
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Feb 26, 2016 16:42
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EvilJoven posted:What's the scoop on Ontario's mincome plans? They just as bad as what bunny posted? Oh there actually is something. quote:As a result, this year, the government will continue to engage with delivery partners, clients and sector advocates to chart the path to comprehensive reform that effectively reduces poverty, supports people in their efforts to participate in the economy, and provides human services in a way that makes sense to the people who need them. This process will look across government and at the broader income security landscape to ensure that various existing and future programs work together to help Ontarians. The government will also engage with First Nation, Inuit and Metis communities to ensure that the path forward recognizes unique challenges on- and off-reserve and helps all Ontarians live a better life.
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Feb 26, 2016 17:20
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Oh my god that's like Ontario_Liberals.txt Theyre going to spend millions and go nowhere with this.
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Feb 26, 2016 17:26
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Military is always hiring, just ask CI, I'm sure he'll tell you everything about it  . But, serious, if you either go a technical route that has a clear civilian counterpart, or you go Officer with subsidized education in something non-combat arms, even the least gung-ho type can make a pretty decent career in the RCAF and RCN. Though honestly, avoid the Army side if you have no interest in playing pretend soldier because there's plenty of tactilol types there. Also, Trudeau indicated in the future (in the election though, wasnt actually tabled in this year's budget) that veterans would receive free university after service. But, if you're dumb and go NCM Infantry, unless you wanna be a CSOR/JTF2 sniper tactilol warrior (nothing wrong with that if its your thing or you wanna be a cop after) then I have no sympathy for your poor choices in life. Of course you have to be okay with being an imperialist-babykiller-Eichmann-banality-of-evil for the NATO death machine Melian Dialogue fucked around with this message at 17:35 on Feb 26, 2016 |
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Feb 26, 2016 17:31
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