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Captain Invictus posted:Doflamingo just not knowing when to quit Yeah, it's kind of bullshit overpoweredness. Usually One Piece power scales feel fairer than that.
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Feb 21, 2016 23:44
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I do kinda wish it'd been more like the Lucci fight where Luffy only collapses after he's won. Having that happen part way through the fight to have the villain come back like it ain't no thing kills it. However the arc would still have had lovely pacing even without that. There were far too many mini-arcs being bounced between with recaps whenever they switched back to one of them. Probably could've halved the length if they'd just focussed on one plot point at a time instead of constantly jumping around.
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Feb 21, 2016 23:54
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No, I think doflamingo getting dropped soon after 5th gear would have been great. Or even a combo of Law and Luffy dominating him with clever tricks that don't go to waste.
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Feb 22, 2016 01:20
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Zark the Damned posted:I do kinda wish it'd been more like the Lucci fight where Luffy only collapses after he's won. Having that happen part way through the fight to have the villain come back like it ain't no thing kills it. The interesting thing about the Lucci fight is that Luffy was set-back for a good chunk of it. Like Gear 3rd was introduced during that fight only for it not to be as effective as Luffy would have liked so there was a brief bit where he was getting beat up in chibi form too. Oda had a lot of interesting things happening in parallel to that fight though so you never really felt like the fight was getting drawn out, and Luffy's desperation at keeping up with Lucci really sold it. Enough that him collapsing and almost losing till Usopp gave his motivational speech which basically gave Luffy his last wind to do his final attack, which is a lot more emotionally compelling compared to Dressrosa's time-limit collapse.
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Feb 22, 2016 01:50
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Allarion posted:The interesting thing about the Lucci fight is that Luffy was set-back for a good chunk of it. Like Gear 3rd was introduced during that fight only for it not to be as effective as Luffy would have liked so there was a brief bit where he was getting beat up in chibi form too. Oda had a lot of interesting things happening in parallel to that fight though so you never really felt like the fight was getting drawn out, and Luffy's desperation at keeping up with Lucci really sold it. Enough that him collapsing and almost losing till Usopp gave his motivational speech which basically gave Luffy his last wind to do his final attack, which is a lot more emotionally compelling compared to Dressrosa's time-limit collapse. Luffy vs Lucci is one of my favorite fights. And I vaguely recall my friend tried showing it to me many many years ago to convince me to watch the show. So it's my first memory of the show. Gear 3rd was effective. It damaged Lucci's leg, giving Luffy an extra second to recover from chibi mode. Though I suppose you could argue he wouldn't have been in that position to begin with if he hadn't used it.
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Feb 22, 2016 12:48
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Shadow0 posted:Luffy vs Lucci is one of my favorite fights. And I vaguely recall my friend tried showing it to me many many years ago to convince me to watch the show. So it's my first memory of the show. It was just odd and fun and amazing.
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Feb 22, 2016 20:33
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Gimmick question, but should we maybe close the thread? People just don't really care about the anime anymore, it's gotten to be really garbage and we can't really get excited about it anymore. 
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Mar 2, 2016 04:21
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Your Dunkle Sans posted:Yeah, it's kind of bullshit overpoweredness. Usually One Piece power scales feel fairer than that. I watched this with my fiancé. She's mad that doflomingo has limitless power. Unlimited use of strings that are unbreakable, can control a crap ton of people at once, can heal destroyed organs, make clones, make a multiple miles large birdcage, and keep it all going for a day straight and show no signs of weakening. Luffy goes gear 4th for 2 minutes and can't move for 10 minutes.
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Mar 2, 2016 04:41
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RC Cola posted:I watched this with my fiancé. She's mad that doflomingo has limitless power. Unlimited use of strings that are unbreakable, can control a crap ton of people at once, can heal destroyed organs, make clones, make a multiple miles large birdcage, and keep it all going for a day straight and show no signs of weakening. Luffy goes gear 4th for 2 minutes and can't move for 10 minutes. Don't worry all of that's in the Manga too.
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Mar 2, 2016 04:55
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With all he hype Warlords get its honestly kind of bizarre that the ones besides Doflamingo can't keep trucking to such an absurd extent. Like, it's legit horrifying how strong the dude is and considering Mihawk it makes sense.
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Mar 2, 2016 05:01
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Kild posted:Don't worry all of that's in the Manga too. I know. I'm just still annoyed at how ridiculous his power is.
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Mar 2, 2016 05:49
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Its especially disappointing because nothing about Doflamingo looks like he should be this tough in a fight. His backstory is that he's a spoiled brat who lucked into a good power and has a strong crew, there's no reasoning behind his arbitrary near-invincibility. He just is. And it's so dumb. Any one of his given powers he shows off is fine and cool and could work, but he can somehow use all of them simultaneously while also surviving being punched literally across town and through buildings multiple times and it just gets to a point where it feels like nothing does anything to him. Everyone was expecting him to be a tough fight because he has a strong power set and seems like the kind of clever guy who could use his powers to avoid being hit in the first place, and that's true right up until Law and Luffy get there, where suddenly he's taking blows better than Rob Lucci or Garp ever did and those two are infamous for their toughness and strength. It's just so dumb and out of nowhere and I think that's why nobody likes this dang fight, even if Gear 4 is incredibly cool and some specific moments are neat.
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Mar 2, 2016 12:44
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I honestly think bird cage is the real problem, not just with Doffy's powers but with the end of the arc. Without birdcage, Doflamingo's strings aren't explicitly unbreakable, just sharp, tough and difficult to see. And the other things he does are in the realm of acceptable One Piece power stunts. Sewing himself up is cool and hardcore, akin to Eneru defibrillating his own heart. Birdcage also really I think waters down the setting. To compare with Arabasta, that was a whole nation, with different countries and regions and such, where birdcage makes dressrosa feel tiny, a small island with a single location. It's also cheap "tension" by creating a bullshit time limit. Birdcage wouldn't be as bad if it took a toll or effort on Doflamingo to do it,but no he just casts one of his level 9 spells then forgets about it while it just works automatically.
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Mar 2, 2016 13:02
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Your Dunkle Sans posted:Gimmick question, but should we maybe close the thread? People just don't really care about the anime anymore, it's gotten to be really garbage and we can't really get excited about it anymore. With regards to Doflamingo, completely agree. The amount of crap this guy pulls is frustrating. Everyone forgot to mention he was controlling a talking clone! while in birdcage, manipulating people and decides to loving heal himself. Many times. Law totally eviscerated his internal organs yet STRINGS heals all.... The healing is the bullshit factor for me. Suspicious Lump fucked around with this message at 13:34 on Mar 2, 2016 |
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Mar 2, 2016 13:27
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I still don't get the controlling bodies. He is controlling dozens of people at the same time while fighting Luffy. Once his string attaches to you does he have a psychic control over you? Because he's swinging both arms wildly against Luffy to attack, while also flying, while also closing the bird cage, while doing precise surgery on himself, while occasionally making a clone of himself out of string so he can fight Luffy and Law at the same time. Why doesn't he get tired? If he were a good guy his power would have so many limitations
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Mar 2, 2016 15:15
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RC Cola posted:Why doesn't he get tired? If he were a good guy his power would have so many limitations And we finally get to the heart of the matter. Bad guys are allowed to be overpowered as hell. If the good guy is too strong it's boring.
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Mar 2, 2016 15:38
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One Piece seems to be full of things that make no sense, though. Turning off your brain while watching is probably a requirement. Some things that bothered me this arc: Why didn't Usopp just shoot a sleep bullet at Sugar? It knocked out raging giant kids, after all. Why didn't Robin try to catch Trebol's lighter that literally blows up her little friends? People always stand staring at horrifying things. Why didn't they just have a little person deliver Law's key? It could have flown straight to him instead of taking the scenic bouncy route. Why didn't Viola just snail-call up Rebecca and ask her to tell Luffy-Law about Sugar instead of trying an impossible sniper shot? Why didn't Robin just throw people up the mountain with her giant arms instead of making weird arm nets? Or pull them up with snakey arms. Why didn't Bartolomeo just use his barrier like an elevator to shove people up the mountain, instead of make slow stairs? Why didn't Bartolomeo just shove enemies off the mountain side, completely taking them out of the fight for a while? Why did Leo have to beat up goons on the way to the princess when even Sugar and Trebol couldn't see him running? But then, asking one question probably opens up for a dozen better I never thought of. Usually I wouldn't really mind when the hero makes the slowest possible choice, but it's harder to overlook when Mingo is forcing fathers to kill their own children while everyone is goofing around.
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Mar 2, 2016 16:06
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darkgray posted:One Piece seems to be full of things that make no sense, though. Turning off your brain while watching is probably a requirement.
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Mar 2, 2016 19:15
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darkgray posted:One Piece seems to be full of things that make no sense, though. Turning off your brain while watching is probably a requirement. A lot of things like this are bigger issues in the anime than in the manga. The anime's terrible pacing often gives the impression that characters are just standing there and watching, when I think Oda's intent is more that they don't have a chance to act.
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Mar 2, 2016 19:31
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Bart's barriers can move. He has shown that on several occasions such as when he defeated Elizabethio in the colosseum.
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Mar 2, 2016 19:40
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AkumaHokoru posted:a normal shot wouldnt have reached he did it from a much longer distance to the point he had to use a multi-stage bullet just to scare her. No, I mean earlier, during the "swap out her grape" plan. AkumaHokoru posted:Time was of the essense. in the time it would have taken to call they would have been attacked. Er, Usopp has time to draw his face and roll it up in a nice triple stage rocket or whatever, so that's not a very good explanation. And Viola realizes Sugar is awake while Luffy is fighting the big dolls, so she should have had plenty of time to call Rebecca before she handed over the key to Law. AkumaHokoru posted:The arms arent super strong just super big. She totally slaps the poo poo out of people with those enormous arms, though. Surely she can throw someone as well. She even has gigantic legs to stomp with; could probably put someone on her shoe and launch them miles high. AkumaHokoru posted:The barrier cannot move. he can move inside of it and around it but the barriers themselves are stationary In episode 638, Bart pushes the punchy king with his barrier using the move "Barrier Crash", so this seems to be incorrect, unless it's anime original. AkumaHokoru posted:Revenge? you try being a toy soldier trying to free your people from these very goons Leo isn't the toy soldier, though. Probably still applies, mind. Reminds me of how nutty it felt that Chopper absolutely refused to let the kids have one more "candy", after they'd been eating them daily for years. Seems safer to keep them from being giant raging addicts in the middle of a deadly poison cloud catastrophe than avoiding a single dose.
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Mar 2, 2016 19:41
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Why doesn't Bart make a barrier around someone and service them or air? Or crush them in a shrinking sphere?
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Mar 2, 2016 19:45
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Doffy is too much at least when someone is super strong in One Piece they look it but not only does he have his DF power he is stronger then faster then Luffy and can take infinite punishment. That and the birdcage being a seemingly easy to use power that is completely unbeatable, uncuttable by Zoro, hell even blocks snail phones, like if he was outside would that mean he can destroy any country without the slightest issue.
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Mar 3, 2016 01:58
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RC Cola posted:I still don't get the controlling bodies. He is controlling dozens of people at the same time while fighting Luffy. Once his string attaches to you does he have a psychic control over you? Because he's swinging both arms wildly against Luffy to attack, while also flying, while also closing the bird cage, while doing precise surgery on himself, while occasionally making a clone of himself out of string so he can fight Luffy and Law at the same time. Why doesn't he get tired? If he were a good guy his power would have so many limitations socialsecurity posted:Doffy is too much at least when someone is super strong in One Piece they look it but not only does he have his DF power he is stronger then faster then Luffy and can take infinite punishment. That and the birdcage being a seemingly easy to use power that is completely unbeatable, uncuttable by Zoro, hell even blocks snail phones, like if he was outside would that mean he can destroy any country without the slightest issue.
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Mar 3, 2016 02:16
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darkgray posted:No, I mean earlier, during the "swap out her grape" plan. AkumaHokoru fucked around with this message at 03:05 on Mar 3, 2016 |
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Mar 3, 2016 03:03
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darkgray posted:Why didn't Usopp just shoot a sleep bullet at Sugar? It knocked out raging giant kids, after all. I'm pretty sure falling asleep =/= being knocked unconscious. Otherwise, she would have had to have been awake for 10 years.
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Mar 3, 2016 03:35
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Have you watched the anime at all? Are you speaking from a manga reader's POV here? We seem to be talking past each other.AkumaHokoru posted:The bullet was made well before they got to dressrosa (he made the face bullet when he was on the plant island) This is false. Usopp's face bullet is produced on the spot on the hill, because it uses Kanjuurou's tragic brush art for the 3D face effect, and Usopp's seen wrapping it all up in ep 697. Viola notices Sugar's awake in ep 694, but Rebecca doesn't give Law the key until ep 696, so it's easy to believe Rebecca could have told them about Sugar during the exchange, if Viola had called her about it. AkumaHokoru posted:she couldnt even use them to make an opening when they need to break something open. they are literally just bigger versions of her limbs. most of her attacks are joint locks because you dont need strength to do them just a good grip. when she wants to stop a big attack she uses a rather large amount of hands instead of one big one so i think the strength is equal to her normal arm x number of arms. Yeah, powers never make any sense in One Piece, which has already been discussed. Either way, in ep 695 Robin summons up her giant arms, and the massive dolls are sent sprawling. Then in ep 698 she uses giant legs to "stomp" away dozens of goons, again showing they're very powerful -- certainly enough to launch human bodies into the air. AkumaHokoru posted:barrier crash is pushing directly in one direction at a high rate of speed with the intent to crush. he hasnt shown any other ability to move a barrier in that way. An elevator would only have to push in one direction as well, but uh. It would still seem useful to shove enemies off a cliff, surely? Julias posted:I'm pretty sure falling asleep =/= being knocked unconscious. Otherwise, she would have had to have been awake for 10 years. Agreed, but it would at least spare any more people from getting dollified, and give them more opportunity to deal with her. Oh well. In many other battle manga, we see character thoughts along the lines of "drat, I can't use move X to do Y, because Z!" and it puts the reader's mind at ease, because they're such obvious questions to have. OP just lets the reader imagine their own explanations, I suppose. Sorry to bother you with my stupid doubts.
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Mar 3, 2016 03:53
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I also want to jump in on the Doffy-is-way-overpowered-and-his-powers-are-stupid and the A-lot-about-this-arc-doesn't-make-sense train. I agree with all of what darkgray was saying, and then on top of it, I found that Ussop's initial victory over Sugar was stupid. After everyone claiming how Ussop will absolutely save the day like 40000 times, he only wins because of a technicality and literally anyone could have done it. Furthermore, his original plan obviously didn't work since he woke up shortly after. Realistically, she's not even actually a child - they state she is 20, but with the body of a child due to her fruit and also due to Japan always doing this "child, but it's actually an adult, but still acts like a child" thing, and also she is evil and going to cause everyone to die, and also Ussop, you are a lawless pirate - just shoot her. Distract Trebol (who has no right to be able to shoot down bullets in the first place) and shoot her. Also, the whole Zoro thing is stupid. If he can't cut the strings because his haki isn't good enough, that seems really broken, but fine, I guess. But when no one even tries? Or is surprised that Zoro would try anything at all? That's stupid. Now like an entire city is pressing up against these strings, and they don't even slow down? And meanwhile Doffy isn't even exerting effort? Doffy has no right to be this strong. And a lot of Doffy's powers don't even make sense. Especially the string clone. How does he see out of it? Or make it talk? Or make it colored in? And now his new attacks have even less to do with strings. Also, as I said before - Sugar's powers are also way overpowered. And are they immune to haki? Maybe if she touches someone before they are aware she is the enemy. In which case, she should be more secretive about her identity like Vergo. I love Gear Fourth, but this is easily the worst Luffy fight in the anime. Also, no, don't close this thread - this thread is like 95% of why I come to this forum. Anyone else think that before the end, Robin will make a giant version of herself? Edit: one last last thing I've been thinking about recently: Aokiji left the Marines because presumably he didn't like the direction Akainu was taking it, but then Fujitora got promoted to his position, and he seems even more actively pursuing Aokiji's sense of justice. And in the Z movie, we see Akainu disproving of and working against Z's plan, even though it seems more like something he'd agree with more than the people that did actually join Z in on his plan. I just don't really see much of a change in how the military operates despite this supposedly being a significant change in management. Shadow0 fucked around with this message at 08:13 on Mar 3, 2016 |
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Mar 3, 2016 07:52
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we were talking past each other i primarily read the manga with some trips to anime land to see how things got put together.
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Mar 3, 2016 14:06
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Shadow0 posted:Edit: one last last thing I've been thinking about recently: Aokiji left the Marines because presumably he didn't like the direction Akainu was taking it, but then Fujitora got promoted to his position, and he seems even more actively pursuing Aokiji's sense of justice. And in the Z movie, we see Akainu disproving of and working against Z's plan, even though it seems more like something he'd agree with more than the people that did actually join Z in on his plan. I just don't really see much of a change in how the military operates despite this supposedly being a significant change in management. I can't really speak about Film Z much, not having watched it, but Fujitora's appointment makes sense to me - the two new admirals were basically drafted out of desperation, because the World Government really needed more hardcore badasses after Aokiji left and Akainu got promoted out of the field. Fujitora may have been given his position against the wishes of Akainu, or maybe Akainu - monstrous as he is - is a little more flexible than we've been led to believe.
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Mar 3, 2016 15:38
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Oh Doflamingo, you always find time to torture people in the best ways.
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Mar 6, 2016 14:30
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Does Sugar have the most sinister fruit power we've seen so far, or have I just forgotten some really nasty ones? I mean a power that can't seem to be used in a positive way. It's hard to see how turning people into forgotten dolls would have a good effect on the world. For instance, Pica's stone powers seem useful if you want to excavate large quantities of diamond or whatever.
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Mar 6, 2016 23:03
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darkgray posted:Does Sugar have the most sinister fruit power we've seen so far, or have I just forgotten some really nasty ones? I mean a power that can't seem to be used in a positive way. It's hard to see how turning people into forgotten dolls would have a good effect on the world. I dunno, she could probably touch a rock and turn that into a doll or something.
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Mar 7, 2016 01:05
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She'd be a pretty great Impel Down warden. Generally those are all horrible people who the world wouldn't be worse off forgetting.
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Mar 7, 2016 01:27
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darkgray posted:Does Sugar have the most sinister fruit power we've seen so far, or have I just forgotten some really nasty ones? I mean a power that can't seem to be used in a positive way. It's hard to see how turning people into forgotten dolls would have a good effect on the world. She could have turned Dofy into a doll to get him safely out of the country. She could be the world's best smuggler (but for good things).
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Mar 7, 2016 03:32
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http://onepiecepodcast.com/2016/03/06/one-piece-episode-733-delayed/ One Piece Episode 733 delayed until March 20 because of 2016 Nagoya Women's Marathon. 
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Mar 7, 2016 19:42
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Well, the pacing will certainly be much better in the marathon.
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Mar 7, 2016 22:19
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Gyges posted:Well, the pacing will certainly be much better in the marathon. 
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Mar 7, 2016 22:36
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Gyges posted:Well, the pacing will certainly be much better in the marathon. 
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Mar 7, 2016 22:56
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Gyges posted:Well, the pacing will certainly be much better in the marathon. Darth Walrus posted:You're getting upset about the One Piece anime being replaced by something with good pacing? 
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Mar 7, 2016 23:42
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