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camoseven posted:You can do it, buddy!!! Thanks! It's always nice to get some positive reinforcement.
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Mar 14, 2016 04:23
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For me I think a lot of it is where in the career they are. I expect 4-5 jobs in the first 5 years. I'd fine 4-5 jobs in years 15-20 a warning sign.
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Mar 14, 2016 04:40
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Feels good to finally create a working app. Now to pray that the guys I'm interviewing with this week look at it lol.
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Mar 14, 2016 08:21
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Rurutia posted:He's counting stock price increases, which isn't really total compensation so to speak. It's not really reliable and won't hold much leverage in negotiations. Why doesn't this hold much leverage? It determines whether their offer is competitive or not. If it didn't count then no big company would ever be able to hire someone from another, right?
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Mar 14, 2016 08:34
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Safe and Secure! posted:Why doesn't this hold much leverage? It determines whether their offer is competitive or not. If it didn't count then no big company would ever be able to hire someone from another, right? Unless you think the stock price is going to keep skyrocketing up forever (in which case you're an idiot), it's misleading to count a price increase as part of your "total compensation" because it's something that you're no longer going to be benefiting from once your current round of stock grants have finished vesting. It'd be like including your signing bonus.
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Mar 14, 2016 14:47
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Jabor posted:Unless you think the stock price is going to keep skyrocketing up forever (in which case you're an idiot), it's misleading to count a price increase as part of your "total compensation" because it's something that you're no longer going to be benefiting from once your current round of stock grants have finished vesting. It'd be like including your signing bonus. I don't know what internal math he is doing, but assuming you're at a large company with real HR you should ask your manager about target compensation.
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Mar 14, 2016 18:42
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Jabor posted:Unless you think the stock price is going to keep skyrocketing up forever (in which case you're an idiot), it's misleading to count a price increase as part of your "total compensation" because it's something that you're no longer going to be benefiting from once your current round of stock grants have finished vesting. It'd be like including your signing bonus. How is that misleading? My current round of stock grants won't finish vesting until more than three years from now. That puts a probable floor on my current comp, since even if there's fall in stock price (which is just as likely to happen to the company I've been contacted by), I'll be getting extra grants over time that will mitigate it. Is it really misleading to say "Hey, thanks for reaching out, I'll likely make $X this year and there's no reason to think I won't next year, so can you beat that?"? How would companies like Facebook, LinkedIn, Netflix, Uber, Google, Microsoft, etc. ever hire from each other if they were like "hey, I know you're making a lot right now because your employer's stock price has improved, but that doesn't really count, so how about we offer you 3/4 of that?" FamDav posted:I don't know what internal math he is doing, but assuming you're at a large company with real HR you should ask your manager about target compensation. Actually, I suspect that I'll see a raise if I don't get promoted by next year because I already suspect my salary is under target for my level at the company I'm at. Safe and Secure! fucked around with this message at 22:50 on Mar 14, 2016 |
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Mar 14, 2016 22:47
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I just had my very first phone interview! I was nervous as hell, but managed to solve the questions given very quickly without any errors. I also explained my thought process along the way but it seemed like the interviewer didn't really care about that much? I hope I get a shot at doing some on site interviews. I have another phone interview with Microsoft this Wednesday; I hope I don't feel like I'm having a heart attack throughout that one as well. One quick question: Should I apply for internships as a recent grad? I'd like to keep the option of doing an internship if I cannot get any normal jobs, so that I can get some out of school experience to put on my resume. At the very least it would be some interviewing experience, and I need a lot of those to overcome my anxiety of being put on the spot.
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Mar 14, 2016 23:03
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just finished the google coding challenge. First problem was fairly easy, banged out a O(n) time solution in about 20 minutes. Second problem was difficult and I wasn't able to finish it, though I did include some comments on my planned strategy so hopefully that carries some weight, along with the code I did finish.
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Mar 15, 2016 00:10
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edit: nm
Analytic Engine fucked around with this message at 18:39 on Mar 15, 2016 |
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Mar 15, 2016 02:16
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If I want to work in a small team, what field should I be trying to get into? Am I right in thinking that medical equipment would be low level languages?
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Mar 19, 2016 16:38
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People are doing salary shares (along with their year-to-year progression) on HN which I thought some people might be interested in since pay gets brought up a lot here. All different experience levels but people are giving context: Amazon (+ random others) https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11312984 Google (+ random others) https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11314449 I think the year-to-year progressions are some the most interesting data points because I haven't really seen those around before. edit: Amazon one has a lot of talk in it, Google one has more actual numbers. edit 2: Facebook people made a spreadsheet: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1E1Jz00naFjdfP5RVC3AYDeDXHdkw8PfWZNhYV0e59oM M / Caucasian, M / Caucasian, M / Caucasian... let i hug fucked around with this message at 19:43 on Mar 19, 2016 |
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Mar 19, 2016 19:33
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So my luck changed with getting responses back in the past few weeks. I had an on-site that went alright on Tuesday, but they went with another applicant who I know who was much more personable during his interview than I was haha. I have two on-sites next week and a phone screen. And there's one company i'm waiting to hear back from about a potential on-site. It's been kind of luck that I got responses. One of my on-sites next week is with a company that has hired several App Academy grads in the past, so I knew they would take me seriously before applying. I've also been getting responses from AngelList actually. My profile on there isn't amazing but it is complete with projects, my resume, a portfolio site, etc. And whenever I find a company on AngelList I'll also apply through their website as well if they have a company job page.
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Mar 19, 2016 20:36
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n4 posted:they went with another applicant who I know who was much more personable during his interview than I was haha. Remember, your interviewers are people. As much as they are looking for someone that can get stuff done, they are also looking for someone they think they won't hate working with.
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Mar 19, 2016 20:57
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let i hug posted:People are doing salary shares (along with their year-to-year progression) on HN which I thought some people might be interested in since pay gets brought up a lot here. All different experience levels but people are giving context: Is it just me or are these kind of on the higher end? I mean I don't know I think I'm paid fairly well but I'm not making half a million dollars in a year.
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Mar 20, 2016 17:52
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RICHUNCLEPENNYBAGS posted:Is it just me or are these kind of on the higher end? I mean I don't know I think I'm paid fairly well but I'm not making half a million dollars in a year. Yeah, plus you have to consider the unverifiable internet effect on the numbers. They're not crazy numbers though, but getting $500k a year in overall effective compensation is not a typical kind of thing. When you are one of a handful of people with key knowledge of the code and use cases of primary profit centers worth billions and billions of dollars? You might just be underpaid at $500k.
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Mar 20, 2016 22:03
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 guess the required job skill here:quote:Software Developer
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Mar 21, 2016 00:36
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MrMoo posted:
Brainfuck
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Mar 21, 2016 01:00
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MrMoo posted:
Sounds like something straight outta the 90s. Maybe the pay is in Air Jordans?
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Mar 21, 2016 03:50
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baquerd posted:Yeah, plus you have to consider the unverifiable internet effect on the numbers. They're not crazy numbers though, but getting $500k a year in overall effective compensation is not a typical kind of thing. When you are one of a handful of people with key knowledge of the code and use cases of primary profit centers worth billions and billions of dollars? You might just be underpaid at $500k. There's literally thousands of people at google with that level of compensation.
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Mar 21, 2016 07:33
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b0lt posted:There's literally thousands of people at google with that level of compensation. 3.6 million software developers in the US though.
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Mar 21, 2016 12:01
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Elements of Coding Interviews has some great and hard questions, but my god the explanations and the actual code itself can be tough to follow. It's like a machine wrote the book. Several times I thought I had the problem completely wrong when I realized the solution is doing the exact same thing in a weirdly obscure way that would never occur to me in an actual interview.
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Mar 21, 2016 15:51
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b0lt posted:There's literally thousands of people at google with that level of compensation. Yeah but I mean, according to the Bureau of Labor Statistics, the median pay is like $97k for developers (http://www.bls.gov/ooh/computer-and-information-technology/software-developers.htm#tab-5), which means, you know, more than half of developers are not even pulling down six figures. Yet there is hardly anyone in those links who falls into that category. Maybe it's geography? Just self-selecting? HN readers tend to be better paid? I don't know.
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Mar 21, 2016 16:59
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Would it be safe to say those companies aren't hiring median employees?
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Mar 21, 2016 17:12
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Gounads posted:Would it be safe to say those companies aren't hiring median employees? Would it? They certainly would claim they aren't, but who knows how much we should trust that judgement? I've never heard anyone say they're looking for average programmers. And I can't think of any totally objective standard; someone who excels in one environment may do poorly in another.
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Mar 21, 2016 17:13
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RICHUNCLEPENNYBAGS posted:Yeah but I mean, according to the Bureau of Labor Statistics, the median pay is like $97k for developers (http://www.bls.gov/ooh/computer-and-information-technology/software-developers.htm#tab-5), which means, you know, more than half of developers are not even pulling down six figures. Yet there is hardly anyone in those links who falls into that category. Maybe it's geography? Just self-selecting? HN readers tend to be better paid? I don't know. It's like big law lawyer salaries. If you have the right skillset from the right school and get in at the right company and perform well, you can make an absolute gently caress-ton as a software engineer. If you barely make it through a mediocre college and can only just barely code your way out of a paper bag, you're going to be making maybe $40k a year fresh out of school. Also like lawyers, if you can go into business for yourself and land clients, the profit potential is basically limitless.
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Mar 21, 2016 17:13
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baquerd posted:It's like big law lawyer salaries. If you have the right skillset from the right school and get in at the right company and perform well, you can make an absolute gently caress-ton as a software engineer. If you barely make it through a mediocre college and can only just barely code your way out of a paper bag, you're going to be making maybe $40k a year fresh out of school. That seems like a questionable comparison. I have a degree in Japanese literature; I would not even be allowed to practice law but I can work as a software developer with no issue.
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Mar 21, 2016 17:16
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RICHUNCLEPENNYBAGS posted:Would it? They certainly would claim they aren't, but who knows how much we should trust that judgement? I've never heard anyone say they're looking for average programmers. Two phrases come to mind - "actions speak louder than words" and "put your money where your mouth is".
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Mar 21, 2016 17:17
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RICHUNCLEPENNYBAGS posted:That seems like a questionable comparison. I have a degree in Japanese literature; I would not even be allowed to practice law but I can work as a software developer with no issue. It's not about the qualifications that I'm comparing software to law, but regarding the distribution of salaries.
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Mar 21, 2016 17:19
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baquerd posted:Two phrases come to mind - "actions speak louder than words" and "put your money where your mouth is". What does that mean? That I should apply? I mean clearly they are very selective; the question is whether their process selects the people who are, objectively, "the best" programmers. I don't know that this question is even possible to answer.
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Mar 21, 2016 17:22
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RICHUNCLEPENNYBAGS posted:What does that mean? That I should apply? I mean clearly they are very selective; the question is whether their process selects the people who are, objectively, "the best" programmers. I don't know that this question is even possible to answer. Answer doesn't matter. They think it is and they base compensation on that belief.
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Mar 21, 2016 17:29
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Gounads posted:Answer doesn't matter. Yeah, fine, but then just saying "those guys are above-average programmers" isn't really accurate; more accurate to say that they work for companies with generous compensation. e: To take this away from the realm of the philosophical, one of those spreadsheets isn't limited by company and includes industry and stuff but there is almost no one who doesn't live in SF or NYC and almost no one who makes less than six figures (and very many north of $200k) so either NYC and SF have considerably higher salaries than other cities (which I'm sure is true, but to this extent?) or else there is some other reason these people are not representative. RICHUNCLEPENNYBAGS fucked around with this message at 18:22 on Mar 21, 2016 |
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Mar 21, 2016 17:48
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It's also a self-selected group of people willing to share. I wouldn't be surprised if higher earners were more willing to share or something. These numbers don't look insane to me, a former Boston area engineering manager.
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Mar 21, 2016 18:41
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RICHUNCLEPENNYBAGS posted:Yeah but I mean, according to the Bureau of Labor Statistics, the median pay is like $97k for developers (http://www.bls.gov/ooh/computer-and-information-technology/software-developers.htm#tab-5), which means, you know, more than half of developers are not even pulling down six figures. Yet there is hardly anyone in those links who falls into that category. Maybe it's geography? Just self-selecting? HN readers tend to be better paid? I don't know. This is nation-wide. They also provide stats for metropolitan areas which you should use instead.
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Mar 21, 2016 18:53
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RICHUNCLEPENNYBAGS posted:Yeah, fine, but then just saying "those guys are above-average programmers" isn't really accurate; more accurate to say that they work for companies with generous compensation.
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Mar 21, 2016 19:00
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Cicero posted:Yes, perhaps programmers at Facebook and MS are totally average and got their high compensation through sheer dumb luck, but that sounds a lot less plausible than the alternative of "those companies pay more so that they can successfully attract better-than-average programmers". I think it would be fair to say that high quality corporate culture/development principles can bring even a median developer to very productive output and when companies can take advantage of that they have more money to spend on making sure their programmers stay with them. I think the question of whether top tech companies' programmers are truly "better" or not could go either way, but the difference in company cultures is a huge factor in what they ultimately produce. What top tech companies can do that other companies can't is target the very top of the top engineers who have proven themselves elsewhere and pay them incredible sums of money because they recognize that keystone engineers have a huge role in bringing everyone else up to snuff. But that's less than 5% of the developer population and a small part of even those large companies.
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Mar 21, 2016 19:16
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I would also say that in companies that aren't any kind of "tech company" - big or small - software developers are almost inherently undervalued and underused, which then leads to lower developer salaries outside of the proper "tech industry".
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Mar 21, 2016 19:20
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The BLS statistics also claim that the median "computer programmer" makes $20k less than the median "software developer," so I guess there are issues with that data too. e: Web developer is even lower so I guess I'll make sure not to describe my job that way RICHUNCLEPENNYBAGS fucked around with this message at 19:52 on Mar 21, 2016 |
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Mar 21, 2016 19:39
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Some space opened up in my resume recently; I'm listing 3 projects I hope can wow HR and managers alike. http://i.imgur.com/SyuecG1.png Just looking for general impressions. Good / No Good? Too much detail / Not enough?
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Mar 21, 2016 20:45
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let i hug posted:I think it would be fair to say that high quality corporate culture/development principles can bring even a median developer to very productive output and when companies can take advantage of that they have more money to spend on making sure their programmers stay with them. quote:What top tech companies can do that other companies can't is target the very top of the top engineers who have proven themselves elsewhere and pay them incredible sums of money because they recognize that keystone engineers have a huge role in bringing everyone else up to snuff. But that's less than 5% of the developer population and a small part of even those large companies.
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Mar 21, 2016 20:51
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