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Kamikaze Raider posted:except what happens is that people recognize the grind for what it is and just go and play something else that isn't a slog. now you have a dead game. grats. Didn't say it was a good thing but I bet it's probably their rationale for having such harsh penalties. In SSD talk, I just got my new SSD in the mail. Does anyone have any experience moving games over so that uplay still recognizes them or do I need to reinstall?
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Mar 15, 2016 17:45
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Knifegrab posted:So is the DZ really as inflated with OP players due to the currency glitch as I keep hearing about? Not really, you'll definitely know if you come across one though. In my experience, they're always Eastern European and take four players focus firing to down one. E: Seriously, every drat time. dogstile fucked around with this message at 17:52 on Mar 15, 2016 |
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Mar 15, 2016 17:46
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A lot of these Dark Zone changes you want will just make it so people camp Entrances. Though the blue-prints on Bosses is a better idea than just buying them.
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Mar 15, 2016 17:54
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They need to just add another way in the DZ to go hostile against other players besides going rogue. Like, randomly grouping parties into 2 opposing teams, or having FFA DZs where every party is hostile to everyone else, or maybe a DZ where picking up enough items or calling an evac makes you a free target. The rogue system (with some tweaks) is ok, there just need to be other options.
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Mar 15, 2016 17:57
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Vatek posted:The lower brackets have the same issue since the best source of reliable loot is still the safehouse vendors and the numerous checkpoint vendors. The only difference is that the best gear at lower brackets is blue or purple instead of orange. true, that part is a universal problem. it's just at the lower level brackets the death penalty is significantly less so the risk associated with going rogue is drastically different.
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Mar 15, 2016 17:57
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Honestly all they really need to do is lessen the penalty. The penalty for dying as a rogue is pretty goddamn outrageous. What I would do is make it so that if you die as a non-rogue you don't lose any XP, but you still drop DZ bucks, keys and loot for someone to happen upon and be like 'hey cool, hit the jackpot' and walk away with. The game tells you who picked up your poo poo so it would create a bit of incentive, especially if you dropped something you wanted to keep to hunt that guy down. If you die as a rogue you lose the same as above except you also lose what a non-rogue would lose as XP now, still multiplied by rogue level to some extent. This would make it not such a ridiculous risk compared to the possible payout. I'm so used to extractions being tense as gently caress from the beta, but lately everyone has been real loving chummy at extractions. I haven't had anyone make a move on me at an extraction since the day after launch when I first went back to the DZ. It's made it so much more boring.
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Mar 15, 2016 17:58
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Goons are experts at analyzing a game concept that isn't quite working and discussing elaborate ways of making it less fun, while also more complicated. For their efforts they are all rewarded with jobs in the video game industry.
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Mar 15, 2016 17:58
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exquisite tea posted:Goons are experts at analyzing a game concept that isn't quite working and discussing elaborate ways of making it less fun, while also more complicated. For their efforts they are all rewarded with jobs in the video game industry. poo poo man sorry for talking about a thing we're enjoying in the games forum of all places.
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Mar 15, 2016 18:01
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Knifegrab posted:So is the DZ really as inflated with OP players due to the currency glitch as I keep hearing about? Its a crapshoot, there's enough players and the number of players in an instance is small enough I haven't run into many, but they are out there for sure.
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Mar 15, 2016 18:01
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Rabble posted:Didn't say it was a good thing but I bet it's probably their rationale for having such harsh penalties. It's always better to reinstall. Migrating from an HDD to an SSD can cause issues sometimes.
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Mar 15, 2016 18:02
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After running around in the dark zone yesterday I happened upon some randoms, overheard them talking to each other "Oh hey, its SpacePrez, I saw him earlier, he goes rogue like we do sometimes, he's fun"  I am the proud papa.Rabble posted:In SSD talk, I just got my new SSD in the mail. Does anyone have any experience moving games over so that uplay still recognizes them or do I need to reinstall? Move the files over, uPlay will think the game is gone, tell it to re-install to the new location and bingo bango should recognize the files. uPlay is the worst of the game managers for doing this (steam, origin, etc. are a little smarter) but it should still work. Akion posted:It's always better to reinstall. Migrating from an HDD to an SSD can cause issues sometimes. I've never had a single issue ever. And I even move things back and forth sometimes. Zaphod42 fucked around with this message at 18:05 on Mar 15, 2016 |
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Mar 15, 2016 18:02
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i for one agree that a person who decides to try to kill me to take my loot should receive more benefits for doing so. perhaps also give them one of my equipped guns. if you go rogue and die you gambled and lost. the incentive to going rogue is taking people's poo poo. in exchange for taking people's poo poo, you lose a lot of xp when you die. there's no reason to be so protective of your DZ rank.
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Mar 15, 2016 18:04
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What about if rogues didn't show up on the radar and you couldn't see their name through cover? The only way you could tell is when you hover over them and it pops up 'non-hostile/hostile agent' Would certainly create a little more tension around other players.
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Mar 15, 2016 18:05
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I like the idea of a dz-exp gain penalty if you die as rogue. At most it would discourage players from repeatedly going rogue if their payouts start tapering off. Unless they just want loot, glorious lovely dz loot.
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Mar 15, 2016 18:06
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Sultan Tarquin posted:What about if rogues didn't show up on the radar and you couldn't see their name through cover? The only way you could tell is when you hover over them and it pops up 'non-hostile/hostile agent' Would certainly create a little more tension around other players. I think they should be on the radar but you shouldn't be able to see them through cover. Chasing people around but being a little too far to see exactly where they are is a pretty tense game of cat and mouse, and being rogue and having to give people the slip is super fun. But the full wallhacks when you're close are a bit much. Also I think the whole "non-hostile" thing needs to be more obvious, although it does seem easier to tell than in beta.
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Mar 15, 2016 18:06
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Zaphod42 posted:I've never had a single issue ever. And I even move things back and forth sometimes. Cool? Hence why I said sometimes.
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Mar 15, 2016 18:07
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I agree that the current penalties are too harsh. I kind of like to see a system where never you never LOSE progress, but instead PvE is the "slow and steady" path to gains while PvP provides a risky way to speed the process up. I kind of liked the way the PVP "tokens" worked in Blade and Soul, and I think something like that could work in The Division. In Blade and Soul you collected tokens for fighting AI enemies in a PVP area, and players could see the number of tokens you had next to your name bar. If a player killed you they got your tokens. You could hand the tokens in at any point, but there were increasing rewards if you handed in large batches at once. Have the Division equivalent tokens be like... Division Watches or whatever. AI enemies drop them at about the same frequency as DZ keys. Maybe have carrying them around provide a DZ exp/scavenging bonus the more you have, to encourage PvE players to participate in the risk/reward aspect. You can carry a big pile of tokens that you collected entirely through PvE and get big bonuses to progress, but also makes you a big target. If you go rogue and steal someone's watches you have to wait out the rogue timer like usual, and can't get into checkpoints to turn them in until your timer is gone, and players can attack you penalty free to try and get your watches. No more experience or gear drop penalties. If you die as a non-rogue you just lose whatever tokens you've collected, if you die as a rogue your personal watch gets "deactivated" and you suffer an exp gain penalty and can't collect more watches for some not-too-harsh period of time. Or maybe keep the gear drop in to keep the extractions tense, I don't know. I'm just bored at work and spitballing PVP systems I know they won't ever implement(and are probably terrible and ill-conceived).
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Mar 15, 2016 18:09
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Rabble posted:Didn't say it was a good thing but I bet it's probably their rationale for having such harsh penalties. So there may be a different way, but what I did with another game... I went into the original install directory into games and picked the game I wanted to move. Copied the entire folder. Then on my HDD I created a new directory called uplay and pasted the copied game files in there. So it ended up being D:\Uplay\Gamefolder Then in uplay you click the game, go to properties and change the install directory for the game. Then I would just verify game files from the same properties menu to make sure everything is correct. Akion posted:It's always better to reinstall. Migrating from an HDD to an SSD can cause issues sometimes. Migrated from HDD to SSD is only an issue if you migrate an OS install, not files on the drives. thebushcommander fucked around with this message at 18:11 on Mar 15, 2016 |
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Mar 15, 2016 18:09
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Yeah the penalties for going rogue are pretty loving awful at the higher levels if you ask me. I get that you need to discourage it slightly, but its a PVP area for christ's sake.
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Mar 15, 2016 18:10
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I've only used police M4 so far, and with mods/rolls I can get at level 13 it's fine but I'd like something that I can unload without the bigger recoil issues. Are SMGs competitive with ARs in most ways? I'm guessing I would just have to be a bit closer? I'm not really a distance/headshot kinda guy, especially on a PS4 controller.
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Mar 15, 2016 18:10
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So I got enough PCs for the yellow .45 acp. The perks on it aren't that good...should I just keep crafting it til I get a good one? Also any ideas on what gear to buy next after a week of farming dailies?
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Mar 15, 2016 18:11
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ShaneB posted:I've only used police M4 so far, and with mods/rolls I can get at level 13 it's fine but I'd like something that I can unload without the bigger recoil issues. Are SMGs competitive with ARs in most ways? I'm guessing I would just have to be a bit closer? I'm not really a distance/headshot kinda guy, especially on a PS4 controller. SMG tends to have a bit less range than an AR, but they are easier to keep on target for sustained fire. They also have a crazy bonus to crit chance. If you aren't going for range, just use a good SMG and you should be bueno. I've found SMG + M1A covers me pretty well for whatever engagement ranges I've had by level 24.
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Mar 15, 2016 18:11
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El Cid posted:I agree that the current penalties are too harsh. I kind of like to see a system where never you never LOSE progress, but instead PvE is the "slow and steady" path to gains while PvP provides a risky way to speed the process up. I kind of liked the way the PVP "tokens" worked in Blade and Soul, and I think something like that could work in The Division. This is a much better system IMO. Don't actually take away my rank, but slow down my gain.
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Mar 15, 2016 18:11
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exquisite tea posted:Goons are experts at analyzing a game concept that isn't quite working and discussing elaborate ways of making it less fun, while also more complicated. For their efforts they are all rewarded with jobs in the video game industry. You dare question the mistaken genius of SA armchair game designers?????
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Mar 15, 2016 18:12
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How do you get all four of the cosmetic sets? My rewards vendor only had the fireman costume.
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Mar 15, 2016 18:12
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ShaneB posted:I've only used police M4 so far, and with mods/rolls I can get at level 13 it's fine but I'd like something that I can unload without the bigger recoil issues. Are SMGs competitive with ARs in most ways? I'm guessing I would just have to be a bit closer? I'm not really a distance/headshot kinda guy, especially on a PS4 controller. Yeah you'll find some great SMGs. Just pair it with a marksman rifle. Honestly until you hit 30 you're best off using whatever the highest damaging AR, SMG, or LMG the game happened to drop for you (plus a marksman rifle). They're all viable - shotguns are the only weapon that is too situational to always recommend.
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Mar 15, 2016 18:12
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Sultan Tarquin posted:What about if rogues didn't show up on the radar and you couldn't see their name through cover? The only way you could tell is when you hover over them and it pops up 'non-hostile/hostile agent' Would certainly create a little more tension around other players. The minimap indicator should definitely go. It was pretty clear even in beta that makes it extremely difficult to survive since you're very rarely going to be able to hide long enough for your timer to tick down without it being paused constantly or reset/extended when you're forced to return fire. Another thing I noticed last night is that DZ bosses at 30 give small amounts of phoenix credits but you don't have to extract them, which is yet another baffling design decision related to high end gear.
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Mar 15, 2016 18:12
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I measure my status (ie dick) by the literal length of my primary weapon. SMG's are terrible 100% of the time.
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Mar 15, 2016 18:13
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ShaneB posted:I've only used police M4 so far, and with mods/rolls I can get at level 13 it's fine but I'd like something that I can unload without the bigger recoil issues. Are SMGs competitive with ARs in most ways? I'm guessing I would just have to be a bit closer? I'm not really a distance/headshot kinda guy, especially on a PS4 controller. A big part of it is just level, at higher level you'll have more bonus traits and much much better attachments which massively help with recoil. SMGs, ARs, even LMGs can all be kit out to have very low recoil once you have the right attachments available. At low level you just don't have many options. Both of my current guns have a trait that gives +20% accuracy, that plus good stabilization mods is a laser cannon.
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Mar 15, 2016 18:16
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Vatek posted:The minimap indicator should definitely go. It was pretty clear even in beta that makes it extremely difficult to survive since you're very rarely going to be able to hide long enough for your timer to tick down without it being paused constantly or reset/extended when you're forced to return fire. Maybe make it all based on sight? If someone sees you while rogue, then it gets announced to the server where you are just like it automatically does now. Then they don't show up until someone sets eyes on them again. Once they hit manhunt though, all bets are off and it works the same way it does now.
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Mar 15, 2016 18:18
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Isn't the experience loss from death as a rogue the same as experience loss from getting killed in PvE?
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Mar 15, 2016 18:19
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El Cid posted:I agree that the current penalties are too harsh. I kind of like to see a system where never you never LOSE progress, but instead PvE is the "slow and steady" path to gains while PvP provides a risky way to speed the process up. I kind of liked the way the PVP "tokens" worked in Blade and Soul, and I think something like that could work in The Division. Yeah this actually works really well. Its pretty similar to what I was saying earlier about having "dark zone credits" or something. You say you should never lose progress, but you need to be able to lose something to have a dis-incentive to going rogue 24/7. But then you do set up an alternative thing to lose, the tokens, and that works even better IMO. Make it so that you have to save up a ton of tokens to get really good guns, but then that's risky because you start to become a bounty for other players the more tokens you have. The only thing there is how easy would it be to track a player with lots of tokens? (If they're not going rogue already) Do you have to extract the tokens? That'd work I guess, although kinda silly.
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Mar 15, 2016 18:20
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Rabble posted:Isn't the experience loss from death as a rogue the same as experience loss from getting killed in PvE? No.
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Mar 15, 2016 18:20
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That's loving stupid. It should just be a flat death penalty.
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Mar 15, 2016 18:22
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Rabble posted:Isn't the experience loss from death as a rogue the same as experience loss from getting killed in PvE? Definitely not. Getting killed outside the DZ PvE has zero penalties, and getting killed in the DZ PvE while non-rogue costs you like, a single kill's worth of XP. Dying while rogue though... will remove a substantial chunk of DZXP, for sure. It takes a good bit of time to recover all that. If you survive the rogue status and then die you only get the normal penalty. Rabble posted:That's loving stupid. It should just be a flat death penalty. Ugh, try reading the page before you post. There does need to be a dis-incentive for going rogue. But its too much which we all agree on.
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Mar 15, 2016 18:23
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Is your regular grenade damaged increased by firearms stat or electronics stat?
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Mar 15, 2016 18:23
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Zaphod42 posted:Yeah this actually works really well. Its pretty similar to what I was saying earlier about having "dark zone credits" or something. You say you should never lose progress, but you need to be able to lose something to have a dis-incentive to going rogue 24/7. But then you do set up an alternative thing to lose, the tokens, and that works even better IMO. The system I imagined in my head is that the tokens are just a per-session thing that are always visible to other players. They're not a currency, just a fluctuating/stealable experience/drop rate multiplier. If you leave the dark zone or log out for more than a few minutes (to try and be forgiving of disconnects) they get turned in and you receive a reward based on however many you had on hand. Edit: I see what you're saying now about extracting. I was thinking you'd just hand them in at checkpoints or safehouses, since you have to completely survive your rogue timer/manhunt to be able to access those areas. El Cid fucked around with this message at 18:27 on Mar 15, 2016 |
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Mar 15, 2016 18:24
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They should take a leaf from, out of everything, GTA:Online's and Destiny's book with their public events (Even if GTAO took them two years to get around to them). Game gives you some kind of prompt if you want to participate or clearly obvious marker that poo poo is going to happen at a location. Doing so clearly marks you in some way that you're playing. Anyone participating is free game to other participants, otherwise if someone shoots at a non-participant, or a non-participant shoots a Player, they get Rogue and the penalties from it. Even just participating gets you some kind of reward. -Game drops in a special loot but there's only x amount loot in it. You need to extract it within a time-limit. If you extract it you get rewarded. -Or a capture-and-hold type of thing. Stand in the circle (I dunno, hacking a laptop or something) to fill a progress bar up. To keep with the theme just chalk it up as trying to be a better Agent than the others.
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Mar 15, 2016 18:25
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El Cid posted:The system I imagined in my head is that the tokens are just a per-session thing that are always visible to other players. They're not a currency, just a fluctuating/stealable experience/drop rate multiplier. If you leave the dark zone or log out for more than a few minutes (to try and be forgiving of disconnects) they get turned in and you receive a reward based on however many you had on hand. Sure, but other players need some way to know that there's a guy named JoeBob who has 400 tokens or else it'll just be a random thing like loot stealing is now. "Oh hey, that guy we killed had a bunch of tokens? Cool I guess." Like you'd need a bounty board that showed all the players in your DZ session and their current token counts. That or make people extract the tokens to cash out, which I think would work even better, although it seems really goofy to have to "launder" your credits  Croccers posted:They should take a leaf from, out of everything, GTA:Online's and Destiny's book with their public events (Even if GTAO took them two years to get around to them). Yeah I was suggesting they should do destiny/guildwars style public events earlier. I didn't think about PVP events though, that's an interesting idea. Have it be like Reboot where a giant game cube drops on the DZ somewhere. If you want to PVP, head there, if you don't, leave. When it triggers everybody inside is allowed to fight each other with no penalties. That'd be a fun way to spice up the pvp while letting people opt-out that wouldn't just be an "arena mode" and would work in with the existing DZ system better.
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Mar 15, 2016 18:27
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Croccers posted:Game gives you some kind of prompt if you want to participate or clearly obvious marker that poo poo is going to happen at a location. It does. It's called "going into the Dark Zone."
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Mar 15, 2016 18:28
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