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I recently bought this set from the same site. The reviews are all very positive about the stones. The "board" is just fabric, but that's fine and can be replaced with a wooden board down the road and you can still use the fabric one for travelling.
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Mar 16, 2016 00:56
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Yeah, I looked at that one...but I've been playing 9x9 on a paper grid, and I desperately want to have a solid goban under my stones. It just feels SO much nicer. The mini-me set comes with those same Bento Stones (and I think that 19x19 floppy board too) EDIT: Yeah, the mini-me set is just the Bento set + a wood 9x9/13x13 board jivjov fucked around with this message at 01:04 on Mar 16, 2016 |
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Mar 16, 2016 01:01
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Added Dancer, pmrowla, and huzenhagen to ITGO.
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Mar 16, 2016 01:53
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Xom posted:Added Dancer, pmrowla, and huzenhagen to ITGO. Thank you
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Mar 16, 2016 01:58
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Forgetting preference for stone thickness or anything like that, they are good peeps at gogameguru. I got a 9x9/13x13 board from them and I like it. Not one hundred percent flawless but it looks nice and the flaws are things you really have to look for. Very good for the price.
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Mar 16, 2016 02:08
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I really love this portable roll up set but it seems like it's no longer for sale?
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Mar 16, 2016 02:16
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looks like its not available anymore but i got this one and love it http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0054LX1HY?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_detailpage_o09_s00 with these stones: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001FHSAGI?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_detailpage_o09_s01 just wish i had someone to play on it -_-
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Mar 16, 2016 03:07
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I too had a goban, but no one to play. Feels like a common lament.
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Mar 16, 2016 04:53
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Overwined posted:Moreover it already has all of Lee Sedol's games up to the point he played AlphaGo. The real "learning" it will do will be at the hands of the developers as they analyze mistakes and fix the algorithms. Hassim was pretty adamant, during the post game conference, about how Alphago didn't have Lee Sedol's games at all, but rather it had a few amateur games from the start and just played millions of times against itself to reach that point.
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Mar 16, 2016 07:52
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Overwined posted:Welp, just won a game against a sandbagger by 0.5 points because he forgot to take a dead group of mine off the board. I did as well, but he was the first to hit done and I didn't bother to look it over. Serves him right. There's really no way someone who has once attained the rank of 2k is suddenly now a 17k player. Can anyone comment on how long it takes to get back to your rank if you lose your KGS account to inactivity? Doesn't matter for me personally yet, I'm just curious.
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Mar 16, 2016 16:54
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kgs seems to adjust the rank pretty quickly for new accounts. id guess 10 games or so and you should have a pretty accurate rank
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Mar 16, 2016 17:00
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Could someone invite me into the group? Tigern
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Mar 16, 2016 18:26
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uXs posted:As far as I know, it has 2 neural nets and a MCTS thing. Maybe something else as well but I forgot. I suppose they might be able to optimize some poo poo in the connections between everything, or maybe improve the MCTS a bit, but I think I read that they primarily still have a ways to go in improving the neural nets. They haven't reached the limit there. That's what it does though. In the last game Lee was able to pull off a tesuji, but then he let up a little, so AlphaGo was able to do what it does best and ever so gradually put itself back in a position to win.
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Mar 16, 2016 19:43
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Could I be added to ITGO as well? User name b00yah
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Mar 16, 2016 19:51
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Could I get an ITGO invite please, kgs name is "jjvibrams". Thanks.
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Mar 16, 2016 20:56
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How's the Android KGS client? Looks like it hasn't been updated in ages...but if it still works, I might want to drop the $10 to have it on my tablet.
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Mar 16, 2016 21:58
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found this from sensei's library which is pretty cool quote:Suppose every particle in the universe (eg: sub atomic. electrons, quarks, etc. etc. Overestimate and let's say 10^90) was evaluating one board position every planck time (the smallest unit of time. Approximately 5x10^44 planck time per second)) for the entire life of the universe (~14 billion years, or 4x10^17 seconds). is this accurate, all you computer maths people? or is there some hypothetical way to compute things more efficiently than that (already seemingly extremely ridiculously efficient) way?
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Mar 16, 2016 22:55
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Some nonsense with hypothetical quantum computing might speed things up a bit..but that math looks about right
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Mar 16, 2016 22:57
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It is incorrect for a variety of reasons including but not limited to stones in a state of capture being counted weirdly and identical boards due to rotation being counted multiple times. I'm not sure how far it's off, but it's probably not enough to change the conclusion significantly. It also doesn't account for the state of which player is the active player, which could theoretically be deduced from the board but whatever Also that's only for trying to completely solve the game which is dumb. Aggressive pruning of the search space is pretty key to be able to do anything gwrtheyrn fucked around with this message at 23:22 on Mar 16, 2016 |
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Mar 16, 2016 23:17
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Computational complexity is a terrible way to measure game complexity. Warcraft 1 has infinite complexity if you measure possible game states but is a really simple game for humans. That's why you should stop wanking about how many game states there are in go, because it doesn't matter at all unless you're a computer trying to brute force it.
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Mar 16, 2016 23:21
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Because of the capturing rule, there are more like 2.1*10^170 legal board positions, not 1.7*10^172 (see https://tromp.github.io/go/legal.html). Captured stones don't make a difference at all under Chinese rules, so I think it would be silly to worry about that in the "go positions" question. Since the vast majority of positions look different at all 4 rotations (or 8 with reflections) you can divide by 4 (resp. 8) and be pretty darn close to the answer if you count rotated positions the same. In any case, it's still about right. But also, everything the two posts above me said.
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Mar 16, 2016 23:28
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Added Tigern and b00yah. Somebody else already added jjvibrams.
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Mar 17, 2016 04:17
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Thanks!
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Mar 17, 2016 09:06
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In the aftermath of the Lee Sedol/AlphaGo games, it's been really fascinating to me to see the reactions from the peanut gallery that is the Internet. While I'm sure the vast majority of comments along the lines of "well here comes Skynet!" are facetious, there have been a handful of ones that seem to at least have some thought behind them, and raise actual concerns about AIs being used for things like education or law enforcement. I think people have a really unrealistic idea of what exactly AIs can do, based on Hollywood depictions though...what's AlphaGo gonna do to us if it "goes rogue"? Play more Go at us? It's a program designed to do one task; it can't exactly take over the military or something. One of the other big categories of discussion I've seen seems to center around the argument "well you could just unplug AlphaGo's computers from the wall socket and win!" This seems like a really odd avenue to pursue...if you shut off AlphaGo, you haven't beaten it at Go, you've prevented it from playing at all. And you can "shut off" a human too, by drugging, knocking unconscious, or just straight up killing. And unlike a computer, which can be plugged back in and rebooted, a human doesn't come back from that last one.
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Mar 17, 2016 13:53
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I think the concern is that alphaGO primarily became so good at it by playing games against itself rather then imitating the best human players. There's lots and lots of jobs that can be replaced by robots and computers (including my own field of anaesthesia) given how so much gets reduced down to flow charts in the name of standardisation and efficiency. In theory we should be welcoming an age where computers do our jobs and we can all go away and do three degrees for the sake of learning and be full time parents whereas in reality we're headed for a new wave of feudalism.
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Mar 17, 2016 13:58
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In a world where alphago's strength and stronger is widely and easily accessible, what motivation can there be to improve at the game when you or anyone else could just use a computer instead?
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Mar 17, 2016 21:15
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AdorableStar posted:In a world where alphago's strength and stronger is widely and easily accessible, what motivation can there be to improve at the game when you or anyone else could just use a computer instead? there are already plenty of bots stronger than you. do you use those bots? you had a teacher for a while, didnt you? did you go to him for every single move in every game? i think you already know the answer to this question.
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Mar 17, 2016 21:29
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i think people still play chess, too
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Mar 17, 2016 21:35
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I love reductive arguments too!
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Mar 17, 2016 21:41
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khels plz
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Mar 17, 2016 21:45
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kgs keeps deleting my account can I get invited back into kgs? this time, I swear, I'm going to play games zestym
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Mar 17, 2016 21:59
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ive found a new source of motivation, instead of caring about my rank or wins, im just trying to get my number of games played higher. its still a 'number next to my name' that my stupid brain can get gratification from, but it actually encourages me to play instead of making me hesitant. yay for tricking your brain
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Mar 17, 2016 22:02
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totino boy posted:there are already plenty of bots stronger than you. do you use those bots? The point is that the bots are now stronger than professionals who have dedicated their entire lives to the game with talent. " you had a teacher for a while, didnt you? did you go to him for every single move in every game? " Unlike a professional strength bot, that teacher would not be available on command. Testiclops posted:i think people still play chess, too Besides being boring, it's one of the reasons I don't play chess.
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Mar 17, 2016 22:47
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AdorableStar posted:The point is that the bots are now stronger than professionals who have dedicated their entire lives to the game with talent. We could put a machine on the pitcher mound that could throw a baseball faster than a person could hit with a bat. Does that make baseball obsolete? Just because computers can complete activities faster or better than people doesn't make those activities obsolete unless you have a poisonous attitude towards leisure hobbies.
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Mar 17, 2016 23:06
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Pander posted:Playing against bots is optional. Playing against humans is more fun, so it's what people will do. Until those people use the computers to play for them in their own games to sandbag. Pander posted:
I think it pretty much does. Because computers can do things better than people, those activities are obsolete and should be replaced by computers.
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Mar 17, 2016 23:08
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Speaking of "playing against humans", does anyone want to play a couple 9x9s with me, and point out all my flaws? The 27k bot on KGS just kicked my teeth in, and the only other human I found playing on a small board wasn't particularly communicative.
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Mar 17, 2016 23:09
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AdorableStar posted:I think it pretty much does. Apologies for the double post...but...what?? Are you...are you being serious right now?
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Mar 17, 2016 23:10
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If you want people playing 9x9, Online Go is rife with them.
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Mar 17, 2016 23:10
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jivjov posted:Apologies for the double post...but...what?? Are you...are you being serious right now? Yes
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Mar 17, 2016 23:10
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jivjov posted:Apologies for the double post...but...what?? Are you...are you being serious right now? Based on his past history of RANK > EVERYTHING type posts, he's probably hyper-competitive to the point of having absolutely no sense of fun playing except when he wins and ranks up. Or a troll. Either way, he's not going to be convinced by arguments here.
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Mar 17, 2016 23:12
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