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Barry Shitpeas posted:Flashback isn't in this set That's true. Rats. Ayli, Sorin, and that new demon land seem like they're missing a couple key pieces to be a tier 1 deck in the new standard and I really hope they get it.
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Mar 17, 2016 17:43
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Elyv posted:well the prerelease is in april so It's right after Easter. The Halloween candy last time wasn't given out exactly on Halloween either.
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Mar 17, 2016 17:44
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TheKingofSprings posted:How the gently caress does this work
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Mar 17, 2016 17:44
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Panderfringe posted:I may have pulled it out of my rear end and convinced myself it's true. But given how terrible mana dorks are lately they're definitely making it simpler. They are making mana dorks worse because they want to make 3-drops and 4-drops better. Also worsen early game ramp in general. Rampant Growth is notably absent even. It's kind of all a reaction to INN-RTR standard. And probably Wolf Run Ramp too. Zoness fucked around with this message at 17:50 on Mar 17, 2016 |
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Mar 17, 2016 17:47
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Sharzak posted:Man I hope we get a lingering souls reprint. I'd really love to run Ayli and Sorin in an Orzhov Tokens deck with that new vindicate Not unless they bring back Flashback as a mechanic in Eldritch Moon.
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Mar 17, 2016 17:50
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How quickly we forget THS/KTK's turn two Anafenzas and turn 3 Rhinos.
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Mar 17, 2016 17:51
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It's fitting to release an Innistrad set now because we all know that Easter is a holiday celebrating the world's most famous zombie, Jesus.
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Mar 17, 2016 17:54
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You know KTK/BFZ standard is literally the first standard without 1-cost mana dorks in some capacity? They may be wanting to try more than just one block without them.
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Mar 17, 2016 17:59
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Angry Grimace posted:Sorin doesn't seem like he gets there. I mean, he's technically harder to cast than Elspeth or Chandra and worse than either one because he doesn't really bring you back when you are losing. I don't know. I'm reminded a lot of Garruk, Apex Predator. I just think he's too expensive for what he does. I just feel like the situation he is good in is the same situation that Linvala is good in and Linvala doesn't do anything in constructed. I agree with this. Usually to see constructed play 4-5 mana walkers need to protect themselves from one threat at a time (Ob Nixilis, ROE Gideon, Ajani Vengeant), or have minus abilities that are so good you run 4 and don't care if one dies (new Nissa, new Gideon, Jace Architect of Thought). 6+ mana walkers need to clear the board (Chandra, Elspeth, Ugin). The land that comes back from the graveyard is really good, I don't know what you guys are smoking. That fact that it taps for only colorless kind of sucks but it's card advantage. It's especially good in Limited, where any time you discard it or mill it you get to still hit a later land drop. I wouldn't be surprised to see at least one other card besides the card draw spell that lets you sack a land to do something good. The new green creature tutor is also very good, I wish I knew how easy it is to turn on Delirium. I think it's on par with Oath of NIssa including the fact that it should be a common or uncommon. It always gets you a land early, and mid to late game it gets you whatever you want. I'm on board. The land that turns into a giant Demon is cool although this standard seems to be all about Reflector Mage, and this guy sucks against it. It's also real bad vs. Ugin/Ulamog. It's still a land that makes dudes and is a giant win condition, and requires instant speed removal to avoid taking 9 to the face and there is only one playable land destruction spell in standard so I think it will see play.
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Mar 17, 2016 18:04
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Zoness posted:They are making mana dorks worse because they want to make 3-drops and 4-drops better. Figures they'd take corrective action against the most enjoyable standard environment in years.
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Mar 17, 2016 18:06
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Sperling continuing his Magic Ethicist column on CFB, including a scenario on knowingly exploiting MTGO bugs and what a players' responsibility is in those situations. He takes up David Sirlin's "Playing to Win" mantle:quote:“Players often fault other players for 'cheating' or playing 'dishonestly' when they use tactics that should not be allowed in a tournament, often because they are exploits of bugs. The player is never at fault. The player is merely trying to win with all tools available to him and should not be expected to pull his punches. Complaints should be taken up with the governing body of the tournament (or the community of players) as to what should be allowed in a tournament. This is a dead simple issue that confuses too many players.” This is one of those typical autistic internet nerd approaches that may be on one extreme end of the spectrum, but it's interesting to consider nonetheless I think. Thought it was also interesting given the situation LSV faced the other day with a player intentionally activating that Waxmane Baku bug against him -- and suicidesteve mentioning that that's a bannable offense. Sperling actually addresses that point in his article, noting that as far as he could tell, intentionally exploiting a bug in Magic Online appears nowhere in Wizards' MTGO code of conduct. Not really going anywhere with this, just a topic off of spoilerchat that might spur discussion.
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Mar 17, 2016 18:07
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Well it's good to confirm that Sperling has no business positioning himself as an ethicist. I shouldn't really be surprised by that though, since he's a lawyer.
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Mar 17, 2016 18:11
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What's there to really discuss? It's ok if a wizard professional does it. It is not if it's a random nobody.
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Mar 17, 2016 18:13
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sarmhan posted:Well it's good to confirm that Sperling has no business positioning himself as an ethicist. I shouldn't really be surprised by that though, since he's a lawyer.
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Mar 17, 2016 18:17
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The problem with using Sirlin's stance on bugs is that Sirlins examples for what constitute bugs is based on inductively assuming what behavior should be with no clear counterexample while magic online's mission statement is to imitate paper magic so interactions that don't work in paper should fall into a category that shouldn't be allowed online. I agree with sperling that wizards should probably be more proactive about it (Riot and the guys who do ptcgo are very proactive about disabling bugged game units, for example), but at the same time, there's the view that publically talking about the bug somehow makes it worse and is bad PR (which I think is ridiculous because the problem is in and of itself derived from information asymmetry). Bugs on MTGO also do fall into some weird categories because they can show up on cards that you would play anyway or on cards that you'd never touch ever: 1. Pillar of Flame not working during a PTQ. This made zombies the dominant deck. This is weird because a lot more people played zombies than people did in same format tournaments in paper, but this isn't really harshly punishable because there are definitely players who would play zombies anyway. Still, it should really invalidate the tournament, which sucks for people spending the time, but it's technically a different format than standard sooooo. Hallowed Moonlight kind of falls into this, you can conceivably accidentally run into the hallowed moonlight / flipwalker interaction without trying to and it's lovely. 2. Myr Superion - This is clearly a case of a card that you play because you know it works a particular way that defies paper expectations and this is stupid and wotc should just say that this isn't working properly and warn about / take account actions casting myr superion with noncreature produced mana. 3. Spirespine bug - anyone who does this more than once should be banned outright with no warning. Also Fatespinner is probably this category. There was a precedent for WotC taking account action with no warning on people who did the Fatespinner bug, but at the same time LSV did mention there was a drawing bug with Fireball that they let slide, so it's kind of bad that they are rather inconsistent on this. Zoness fucked around with this message at 18:23 on Mar 17, 2016 |
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Mar 17, 2016 18:20
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When have they ever printed a creature tutor below rare? This isn't like Kozilek's Return, you aren't playing this card for the lovely front half, you're playing it because it becomes Green Sun's Zenith under delirium.Orange Fluffy Sheep posted:How quickly we forget THS/KTK's turn two Anafenzas and turn 3 Rhinos. Irony Be My Shield fucked around with this message at 18:25 on Mar 17, 2016 |
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Mar 17, 2016 18:22
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MiddleEastBeast posted:Sperling continuing his Magic Ethicist column on CFB, including a scenario on knowingly exploiting MTGO bugs and what a players' responsibility is in those situations. He takes up David Sirlin's "Playing to Win" mantle: poker players raus all of this is acceptable if magic is actually gambling, and thus i imagine he would be fine with it being properly regulated as gambling and mtgo being illegal in america  if it is supposed to be some kind of esport like wizards likes to market it then sportsmanship needs to be a thing
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Mar 17, 2016 18:24
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 code:
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Mar 17, 2016 18:24
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more like David Spergin and Matt Sperging it's really easy to avoid going out of your way to exploit clear mistakes.
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Mar 17, 2016 18:25
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sarmhan posted:Well it's good to confirm that Sperling has no business positioning himself as an ethicist. I shouldn't really be surprised by that though, since he's a lawyer. I don't know if its ironic or what that Ross Merriam just posted an article about how basically all pros cheat by colluding and accepting bribes but don't feel bad about it, even though they should (specifically putting Efro on blast): http://www.starcitygames.com/article/32592_You-Play-To-Win-The-Game.html Lets Pickle posted:I agree with this. Usually to see constructed play 4-5 mana walkers need to protect themselves from one threat at a time (Ob Nixilis, ROE Gideon, Ajani Vengeant), or have minus abilities that are so good you run 4 and don't care if one dies (new Nissa, new Gideon, Jace Architect of Thought). 6+ mana walkers need to clear the board (Chandra, Elspeth, Ugin). Yeah, I mean, the only example of a 6 or more CMC PW that sees play and doesn't have the capability of 2-for-1s is Karn and Karn wasn't that busted in Standard. Karn's mostly busted if you can dump him early; not to mention he has a relatively ridiculous amount of loyalty if you use his worst ability and the ability to answer basically any problematic permanent. Angry Grimace fucked around with this message at 18:31 on Mar 17, 2016 |
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Mar 17, 2016 18:26
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Elyv posted:
it's too bad this isn't legendary
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Mar 17, 2016 18:26
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Irony Be My Shield posted:When have they ever printed a creature tutor below rare? This isn't like Kozilek's Return, you aren't playing this card for the lovely front half, you're playing it because it becomes Green Sun's Zenith under delirium.  edit: tbf, this doesn't draw you the card, while the new one does (which i forgot when i complained about it being a sorcery earlier, which i now take back). MiddleEastBeast fucked around with this message at 18:30 on Mar 17, 2016 |
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Mar 17, 2016 18:27
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Elyv posted:
dies to silkwrap, therefore it is unplayable
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Mar 17, 2016 18:29
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Zoness posted:3. Spirespine bug - anyone who does this more than once should be banned outright with no warning. Also Fatespinner is probably this category. I don't know what spirespine is and google isn't working for me cuz i guess my internet feels like being retarded today
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Mar 17, 2016 18:31
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Skyl3lazer posted:Yo the art on deathcap is disgusting, but why is that card a rare? Was talking about this with my friends hours ago: T1 land, whatever T2 land, vessel T3 land, pop vessel, cast reality smasher. I think you can probably take a turn off in standard if you're casting T3 smasher. Depends on what you can do with your t1 play I guess.
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Mar 17, 2016 18:34
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mandatory lesbian posted:I don't know what spirespine is and google isn't working for me cuz i guess my internet feels like being retarded today  There was a bug where IIRC if you bestowed this on an opponent's tapped guy and attacked, they would time out A sample decklist: http://mtgtop8.com/event?e=8186&d=247168&f=ST
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Mar 17, 2016 18:36
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Zoness posted:dies to silkwrap, therefore it is unplayable Silkwrap is rotating out. That new Land/Demon also dies to Silkwrap. I think whether it's playable will depend on whether or not there's good exile-based removal in the environment. That new 1WB exile spell is bad news for the Land/Demon. mandatory lesbian posted:I don't know what spirespine is and google isn't working for me cuz i guess my internet feels like being retarded today There was a bug on MTGO where if you cast Spirespine targeting an opponent's tapped creature and then attacked, your opponent would lose the entire match. The dominant deck in the MTGO metagame became a deck that was all Spirespine, tutors, and tapper, and people even started building decks for the mirror with no non-Hexproof creatures.
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Mar 17, 2016 18:36
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Chamale posted:Silkwrap is rotating out. That new Land/Demon also dies to Silkwrap. I think whether it's playable will depend on whether or not there's good exile-based removal in the environment. That new 1WB exile spell is bad news for the Land/Demon. Silkwrap is in Dragons of Tarkir. Also the card is obviously great.
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Mar 17, 2016 18:38
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Was this posted?
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Mar 17, 2016 18:40
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Elyv posted:
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Mar 17, 2016 18:41
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Chamale posted:Silkwrap is rotating out. That new Land/Demon also dies to Silkwrap. I think whether it's playable will depend on whether or not there's good exile-based removal in the environment. That new 1WB exile spell is bad news for the Land/Demon. you can just use the land as a vitu-ghazi, the city-tree against anyone who might be able to kill your giant idiot
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Mar 17, 2016 18:41
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Elyv posted:
My modern Aristocrats brews are being thrown some serious bones by this set. This guy and Gravecrawler could be best buds.
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Mar 17, 2016 18:44
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Zoness posted:Silkwrap is in Dragons of Tarkir. What the gently caress, I thought I understood the new block rotation. I looked it up, you're right.
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Mar 17, 2016 18:45
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Zoness posted:dies to firey impulse, therefore it is unplayable fixed for accuracy
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Mar 17, 2016 18:48
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80s James Hetfield posted:fixed for accuracy rude, I wouldn't misspell Guy Fieri Impulse.
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Mar 17, 2016 18:48
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Sirlin's stance on bugs makes sense for fighting games on arcade cabinets and older consoles where updates were difficult and costly and hard to make uniform. It was only with the mid-2000s consoles X360/Wii/PS3 that patching became a thing. Whatever bugs exist in Street Fighter 3 Alpha aren't going to get removed a few days later. This isn't the case for MTGO, obviously because it's online. It changes constantly, and embracing bugs isn't a thing to do because they go away quickly, and because they're not actually Magic. Zoness posted:1. Pillar of Flame not working during a PTQ. This made zombies the dominant deck. This is weird because a lot more people played zombies than people did in same format tournaments in paper, but this isn't really harshly punishable because there are definitely players who would play zombies anyway. Still, it should really invalidate the tournament, which sucks for people spending the time, but it's technically a different format than standard sooooo. Hallowed Moonlight kind of falls into this, you can conceivably accidentally run into the hallowed moonlight / flipwalker interaction without trying to and it's lovely. This is why I think that Sperling is wrong by being so reductionist, because it creates situations like these where tournaments aren't playing Magic because they're doing things contrary to what the cards say, like Myr Superion's rules text being ignored. You cannot do that in paper, and MTGO is not a different game, just a different avenue of the same game. It can turn individual tournaments into contests of who exploits the bug the best, which will never happen again because they'll be fixed by the next one (hopefully). If you know anything about competitive Pokemon, you know a lot of the action is not on the games on Nintendo handhelds but on simulator programs that recreate the mechanics of battles. They streamline the process of getting a team together so that the focus is on the battles themselves. Accuracy is paramount here because they're simulating the process of battling on the actual games. A while back, the Pokemon Azumarril could learn the move Belly Drum (quadruples attack at the cost of half of its HP) or Aqua Jet (which always hits first regardless of speed) but not both at the same time. But a the simulator at the time did not account for this exclusivity and one could use a Belly Drum/Aqua Jet Azumarril and wreck faces. By what Sperling said I should've exploited the hell out of this and Aqua Jetted to the top ranks, but the act of doing so is contrary to the simulator's goal of recreating the games. And if the tournament switches over to physical copies then suddenly my team changes. What was I doing before, then? So using Belly Drum/Aqua Jet Azumarril, or casting Myr Superion off of Forests, or whatever, we've accidentally stopped playing the game, only a flawed reproduction of it. So For 362 days of the year we're playing Magic but the other 3 we're playing Mogic where everything is the same but there's a 5/6 for 2.
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Mar 17, 2016 18:50
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Demonland seems like it could be pretty solid with an early-game hangarback. Maybe toss in some Sifter of Skulls and do the aristocrats thing with a 9/7 as a backup wincon in case you can't push a fat Husk through?
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Mar 17, 2016 18:50
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Chamale posted:What the gently caress, I thought I understood the new block rotation. I looked it up, you're right. It'll be easy to understand once BfZ is the oldest block, but imagine KTK and FRF are a block, and that DTK and ORI are a block. (for rotation purposes)
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Mar 17, 2016 18:51
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Zoness posted:
nasty
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Mar 17, 2016 18:53
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i absolutely think if you're abusing a bug like that you should be banned for a while like maybe the first time it's an accident but if you're doing it over multiple games like a deck like that would do you need to go for a bit
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Mar 17, 2016 18:55
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