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Darth Walrus posted:Despite that being why the director said he included that scene of Supes killing someone? Man of Steel doesn't argue that killing someone is the only way to learn that killing is bad. Neither does Snyder, going by the excerpt included in the video. He chose to explain Superman's aversion to taking life as moral agency won through bitter experience, and not as an expression of natural, divine innocence. e: The video in general is unintentionally hilarious, because the punchline ("We have killed the Superman") boils down to nostalgia. And nostalgia is nothing but deceitful. "Wasn't it so much better when Superman was good and real, and we could believe in him? Too bad we killed this ideal." If "cynicism" is enough to kill Superman, then Superman was nothing. BravestOfTheLamps fucked around with this message at 22:54 on Mar 31, 2016 |
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Mar 31, 2016 22:49
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Tracula posted:That's super good of him to do that. Now if only the other Noah Who Doesn't Make Content™ would actually be that upfront with his backers To be fair, it looks like he's going through a pretty rough patch at the moment.
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Mar 31, 2016 22:50
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Ensign_Ricky posted:To be fair, it looks like he's going through a pretty rough patch at the moment. At the moment?
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Mar 31, 2016 22:50
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Augus posted:This is what we call "trying way too hard to look smart" This is genuinely the way I interpreted the scene on first viewing. Man of Steel is still a bad movie for a medley of other reasons. Don't be a dick.
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Mar 31, 2016 22:51
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BravestOfTheLamps posted:Man of Steel doesn't argue that killing someone is the only way to learn that killing is bad. Snyder complains that Superman's 'aversion to killing is unexplained, it's just... in his DNA', and calls it a gimmick like his Clark Kent disguise or his work as a reporter. He then decided that the best way to explain it was to have him kill someone and not like it. That does rather imply that not wanting to kill people is an unusual state of being that requires explanation via shocking, learned experience. Which is a bit weird for most people who have empathy, and can put themselves in other people's heads enough to decide that killing is bad without trying it themselves. Darth Walrus fucked around with this message at 23:00 on Mar 31, 2016 |
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Mar 31, 2016 22:57
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poparena posted:The Noah Who Posts Things just put up a pretty nifty retrospective on Wolfenstein. Man, want I want now is a Thief retrospective. The last entry in the series was pretty forgettable, bit the first games really hold up.
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Mar 31, 2016 22:58
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Beefstew posted:This is genuinely the way I interpreted the scene on first viewing. Man of Steel is still a bad movie for a medley of other reasons. Don't be a dick. Nah that's not a bad guess at what Snyder had in mind, but it's just that he tries way too hard to look smart.
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Mar 31, 2016 23:00
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Augus posted:Nah that's not a bad guess at what Snyder had in mind, but it's just that he tries way too hard to look smart. Not sure if you're backpedaling or not, but whatever. Yeah, you're right about Snyder. Especially considering that he worried BvS would be "too smart" for people. Did Snyder write Man of Steel though? I genuinely don't know. Because I see elements of the type of story I mentioned, but there's also plenty of stuff that undermines that. I get the feeling with a lot of movies that there's someone with a pretty powerful creative treatment of the story, but it ends up getting muddled in the midst of a bunch of other crap that doesn't fit together. And that's pretty much the director's fault regardless, since they're responsible for making everything work together.
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Mar 31, 2016 23:09
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BravestOfTheLamps fucked around with this message at 18:51 on Aug 18, 2016 |
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Mar 31, 2016 23:31
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BravestOfTheLamps posted:Actually, it makes perfect sense for Superman, and especially for Man of Steel. His aversion to killing is exceptional, something to be noted. Snyder explains Superman's exceptional aversion to killing as coming from an equally exceptional source: killing someone. In what hell is not wanting to kill exceptional.
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Apr 1, 2016 00:21
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dbzfandiego posted:In what hell is not wanting to kill exceptional. America.
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Apr 1, 2016 00:55
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Superman doesn't kill people because he has super hearing and vision and speed and all other sorts of powers that allow him to see pretty much the entire world and all the people in it and this makes him into a walking conduit of empathy and you don't want to kill people when you empathize with them.
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Apr 1, 2016 01:05
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Superman is also basically a demigod and what makes him interesting in proper portrayals is that he doesn't want to be treated like a deity and that his good ol' southern farmer upbringing gave him a moral compass to want to help people and be compassionate when he more or less could rule the world if he wanted to.
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Apr 1, 2016 01:15
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Tracula posted:Superman is also basically a demigod and what makes him interesting in proper portrayals is that he doesn't want to be treated like a deity and that his good ol' southern farmer upbringing gave him a moral compass to want to help people and be compassionate when he more or less could rule the world if he wanted to. My favorite meta casting thing is the fact that Clancy Brown originally auditioned for Superman, but didn't get it and instead became Lex, kind of how like Lex's whole character is that he wants to be the Superman of this earth.
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Apr 1, 2016 01:20
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Tracula posted:Superman is also basically a demigod and what makes him interesting in proper portrayals is that he doesn't want to be treated like a deity and that his good ol' southern farmer upbringing gave him a moral compass to want to help people and be compassionate when he more or less could rule the world if he wanted to. Uptight Midwestern upbringing.
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Apr 1, 2016 01:35
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dbzfandiego posted:In what hell is not wanting to kill exceptional. I figured it was a natural outgrowth of the Dark Age of comics, when the stories were all pretty explicitly, "No, really, why don't these guys kill people?" to the point that actually refusing to kill someone WAS considered exceptional.
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Apr 1, 2016 01:35
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At that point the crappy writing that allows mass murderers out on a daily basis shat on the moral compass more than any dark age comic.
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Apr 1, 2016 01:37
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Beefstew posted:Not sure if you're backpedaling or not, but whatever. It is David S. Goyer. It is always David S. Goyer. Even those DC films you might have liked were David S. Goyer.
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Apr 1, 2016 03:21
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The Vosgian Beast posted:It is David S. Goyer. It is always David S. Goyer. Even those DC films you might have liked were David S. Goyer. Didn't he start ragging on other superheroes calling them "dumb"?
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Apr 1, 2016 03:26
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Arcsquad12 posted:Didn't he start ragging on other superheroes calling them "dumb"? Probably. He certainly went off about the Hulk's penis.
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Apr 1, 2016 03:30
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Jack Gladney posted:Uptight Midwestern upbringing. Actually, his parents probably voted for Eugene V Debbs.
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Apr 1, 2016 04:19
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Beefstew posted:This is genuinely the way I interpreted the scene on first viewing. Man of Steel is still a bad movie for a medley of other reasons. Don't be a dick. I think you're right in what you're saying and I saw the movie the same way. There was this underlying thread throughout the movie of his identity crisis that had potential but the execution wasn't all there. The ending really brought that plotline to a head that really stood above the rest of the blah-ness.
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Apr 1, 2016 04:57
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This poster loves police brutality, but only when its against minorities!
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The Vosgian Beast posted:It is David S. Goyer. It is always David S. Goyer. Even those DC films you might have liked were David S. Goyer. It'll be really interesting to see what Terrio does with Justice League. He's solo with that one.
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Apr 1, 2016 04:59
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dbzfandiego posted:In what hell is not wanting to kill exceptional. Aversion, not just "not wanting to kill". Killing is actually fairly common for mythological heroes.
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Apr 1, 2016 05:50
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BravestOfTheLamps posted:Aversion, not just "not wanting to kill". Killing is actually fairly common for mythological heroes. heroes reflect the values of their age
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Apr 1, 2016 06:07
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Great video about thunderfoot, hbomberdude
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Apr 1, 2016 06:08
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8-Bit Scholar posted:heroes reflect the values of their age Yes, and the overwhelming majority of action movies , comics, games, anime, and other dumb stuff end with the villain getting killed. Redemptive violence is still very much a thing.
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Apr 1, 2016 06:12
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Beefstew posted:Actually, Superman killing Zod was the best moment of Man of Steel. In a film where he was constantly oscillating between his Kryptonian and Earthly father-figures, ideologies, and identities, he finally has to make a choice. But it doesn't come without cost; not only is Superman traumatized by the fact that he had to kill, but he also eliminated the last connection to his homeworld, the last person who could understand the burden of his heightened senses and consequent super-anxiety. By killing Zod, Superman guarantees that he'll be alone. After seeing Man of Steel, I was shocked that so many people hated that scene when it's easily the best part of an otherwise dreary movie. And I was very interested to see the kind of isolation Superman would go through after MoS, possibly withdrawing from emotional connections entirely to become a mechanism of justice for a people he has difficulty relating to. I was looking forward to seeing how the god turned into a tool - a tragic inversion on the "boy scout" stereotype that we have of Superman. And I was excited to see the kind of pressure Superman would face in this role, and the inevitable frustrations resulting from his inability to save everyone all the time. I agree with all of the first paragraph on a yes that's what they were going for level but they failed utterly at attaining because the second paragraph (sentence) is what ended up happening. It's odd that it took Batman v Superman for people to recognize that's what MoS was the whole time. BravestOfTheLamps posted:Aversion, not just "not wanting to kill". Killing is actually fairly common for mythological heroes. Troll spotted y'all c'mon
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Apr 1, 2016 06:50
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Beefstew posted:Yes, and the overwhelming majority of action movies , comics, games, anime, and other dumb stuff end with the villain getting killed. Redemptive violence is still very much a thing. Thus fueling an entire generation that doesn't get that a problem doesn't go away by killing 'em all.
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Apr 1, 2016 06:53
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Pirate Jenny posted:Troll spotted y'all c'mon Noted pacifists Apollo, Thor, etc. Annointed posted:Thus fueling an entire generation that doesn't get that a problem doesn't go away by killing 'em all. As opposed to beating them up and leaving them for the police to find, I suppose? BravestOfTheLamps fucked around with this message at 18:51 on Aug 18, 2016 |
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Apr 1, 2016 07:01
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Chromatic posted:Great video about thunderfoot, hbomberdude Seeing as how the new Ghostbusters has like 80% of the team behind Bridesmaids behind it, I have faith in it actually being a good movie. At least I hope it will be good, not for the least of reasons than to spite MRAs. Also, while "f00tsoldiers" was great, I still prefer Kevin Logan's term to describe Thunderf00t's throng of rabid followers, the "Thundermentalists".
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Apr 1, 2016 07:25
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When I heard Phelous did a review of an Hunchback of Notre Dame cartoon, I thought it was gonna be the Dingo Pictures one.
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Apr 1, 2016 07:32
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BravestOfTheLamps posted:As opposed to beating them up and leaving them for the police to find, I suppose? Killing them as opposed to the victims having a chance of living, thus having a chance of being able to tell their story and able to get past this one event. The better alternative is not going on vigilantism and not doing these things. Your point being?
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Apr 1, 2016 07:42
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Maybe I'm under-thinking this (is under-thinking a word?), but I thought the point of the Zod death scene is that Superman is trying as hard as he can to keep Zod from zapping the civilians without trying to kill him. Ultimately, though, he isn't able to do that, and he's upset that he had to take a life in order to save others.Jack Gladney posted:Uptight Midwestern upbringing. quote:David S. Goyer The other day I was thinking, "You know what would be really cool? A Martian Manhunter film." Then I see this tweet from Nash https://twitter.com/Nash076/status/714704479589937152
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Apr 1, 2016 07:45
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After all, incarceration worked wonders for Batman's whole rogue gallery.
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Apr 1, 2016 07:46
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PiedPiper posted:After all, incarceration worked wonders for Batman's whole rogue gallery. It's not like killing them has worked either.
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Apr 1, 2016 07:46
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Andrast posted:It's not like killing them has worked either. Somewhat agree, but that's par for the course. Between these two options, I find letting Joker live less defensible.
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Apr 1, 2016 07:51
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drat, Owen is looking pretty rough these days. I wonder who he is talking about suing? Hbomberguy? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vh_AFUzsxwA Edit: Wait, it's Serena Nelson, who roasted him on another one of his planned documentaries that fell through. Chromatic fucked around with this message at 09:00 on Apr 1, 2016 |
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Apr 1, 2016 08:55
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Annointed posted:Killing them as opposed to the victims having a chance of living, thus having a chance of being able to tell their story and able to get past this one event. The better alternative is not going on vigilantism and not doing these things. Your point being? Superman should've let humanity die. That's the moral thing to do. e: Also Schwarzenegger should've just laid down and died in all of his heroic roles BravestOfTheLamps fucked around with this message at 09:16 on Apr 1, 2016 |
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Apr 1, 2016 09:12
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BravestOfTheLamps posted:Superman should've let humanity die. That's the moral thing to do. And Batman should just siphon off the city with his companies. Green Lantern should've stayed evil and collected all the rings without the need of a space bug crawled up his rear end. Spiderman should've joined up with the Green Goblin.
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Apr 1, 2016 09:27
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