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According to the autoblog article on driving the 3, the glass roof is a option. I preordered one based on my experiences with the model s, which I liked.
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Apr 1, 2016 15:24
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So 35k gets you the cheap version and there may or may not be any tax credits left by then. Good thing it is refundable. (Probably in Tesla T-Shirts)
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Apr 1, 2016 15:29
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Wait, the tax credit is limited to the first buyers? gently caress that, I am cancelling my reservation.
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Apr 1, 2016 15:54
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The $7500 tax credit applies to the first 200,000 cars Tesla sells in the US, international sales don't count. The same credit will continue for the rest of that quarter, as well as the following quarter. So if Tesla sells #200K on Jan 1st 2018, every car sold in the US for 6 more months will get the credit. Then the credit is cut in half for 6 months. Then cut in half again for another 6 months.
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Apr 1, 2016 16:00
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I wonder what # was my reservation at 9am today... if I find out its not within the 200k, I'll cancel.
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Apr 1, 2016 16:25
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Animal posted:I wonder what # was my reservation at 9am today... if I find out its not within the 200k, I'll cancel. Your reservation number probably isn't going to have a great deal to do with your actual build number, anyway.
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Apr 1, 2016 16:27
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The tax credit only becomes a problem if the S and X reach 200k before the 3 starts getting delivered. Or the Republicans kill the credit to buy more F35s or the Great Wall of Trump.
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Apr 1, 2016 16:35
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borkencode posted:The $7500 tax credit applies to the first 200,000 cars Tesla sells in the US, international sales don't count. The same credit will continue for the rest of that quarter, as well as the following quarter. So if Tesla sells #200K on Jan 1st 2018, every car sold in the US for 6 more months will get the credit. Then the credit is cut in half for 6 months. Then cut in half again for another 6 months. What's the process for doing this anyway? Do you submit the purchase to the IRS immediately, or does it get rolled into your taxes the following year?
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Apr 1, 2016 16:36
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A lot of the nitpicking just seems so obviously to be general contrariness. Oh God the glass roof is a disaster, imagine taking a rock to it, wtf Tesla? Completely ignoring that everything from Nissans to Porches and everything in between have had panoramic glass roofs for years and nobody bitches about it. There's no vents in the concept interior, wtf Tesla? Even if that interior is the final product, round/rectangular plastic vents scattered around the dash isn't the only way to ventilate a cabin. They only do the big screen because it's cheap! Because plastic gauges and knobs with maybe a couple of cents worth of cheap alloy covering = omg so luxurious, these guys really know how to spend my money. Like, I'm not bothered either way about the model 3 but I can't understand why everyone expects it to be so far beyond what everyone else builds for the same money, and gets all pissy when they aren't being shown the equivalent of a Spyker or Pagani.
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Apr 1, 2016 16:38
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io_burn posted:What's the process for doing this anyway? Do you submit the purchase to the IRS immediately, or does it get rolled into your taxes the following year? It applies to your tax filing for the fiscal year you title the car, IIRC.
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Apr 1, 2016 16:40
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io_burn posted:What's the process for doing this anyway? Do you submit the purchase to the IRS immediately, or does it get rolled into your taxes the following year? It is an income tax credit applied when you file. So you can only claim the full amount if you owed at least $7500 in federal income taxes (which was not a problem for most Model S and X buyers, but might be for some Model 3 buyers). Tesla still does not do a good job of advertising that fact up front, which is disappointing.
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Apr 1, 2016 16:40
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Tyro posted:Tesla still does not do a good job of advertising that fact up front, which is disappointing. I actually had this argument with a dude in line, who ended up being a loving tax attorney. He was telling his buddy that "Ya, the government basically gives you money" which I gently corrected, and he got bent out of shape. Spent the next couple minutes with his nose in his phone and I guess found a loophole where if you form an organization of some sort and title the car to that, you can carry the credit forwards to use the whole thing? For an individual, it is a non-refundable, non-transferable (meaning a single year of taxes only,) tax credit. Not a refundable credit, which means if you don't, or can't use the whole thing, the IRS is not going to write you a check.
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Apr 1, 2016 16:43
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MrYenko posted:Not a refundable credit, which means if you don't, or can't use the whole thing, the IRS is not going to write you a check. Yep. And I think Tesla still doesn't do a good job of communicating that to their customers. It was more excusable/understandable in the early Model S days, not so much now.
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Apr 1, 2016 16:51
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Did they actually say that supercharging is standard on the cheapest Model 3? Or is it one of those cases where the hardware to allow for supercharging is standard on every Model 3, but you still have to pay $2500 or whatever to activate it?
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Apr 1, 2016 16:52
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Linedance posted:A lot of the nitpicking just seems so obviously to be general contrariness. Oh God the glass roof is a disaster, imagine taking a rock to it, wtf Tesla? Completely ignoring that everything from Nissans to Porches and everything in between have had panoramic glass roofs for years and nobody bitches about it. There's no vents in the concept interior, wtf Tesla? Even if that interior is the final product, round/rectangular plastic vents scattered around the dash isn't the only way to ventilate a cabin. They only do the big screen because it's cheap! Because plastic gauges and knobs with maybe a couple of cents worth of cheap alloy covering = omg so luxurious, these guys really know how to spend my money. The interior looks like garbage, and the horses mouth said it was a production vehicle. Sorry not everyone dances to the same tune?
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Apr 1, 2016 16:53
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Tyro posted:Yep. And I think Tesla still doesn't do a good job of communicating that to their customers. It was more excusable/understandable in the early Model S days, not so much now. Absolutely, though to be fair, no one else does either. I understood the credit when I went to buy my Volt, but the salesman didn't, and it showed. Tesla being a company that builds no products that DON'T take advantage of the credit probably should do a little more to familiarize customers though, you're right. OldSenileGuy posted:Did they actually say that supercharging is standard on the cheapest Model 3? Or is it one of those cases where the hardware to allow for supercharging is standard on every Model 3, but you still have to pay $2500 or whatever to activate it? Standard on all Model 3s.
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Apr 1, 2016 16:56
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OldSenileGuy posted:Did they actually say that supercharging is standard on the cheapest Model 3? Or is it one of those cases where the hardware to allow for supercharging is standard on every Model 3, but you still have to pay $2500 or whatever to activate it? They said it's standard, as is "autopilot safety". You need to pay to enable full autopilot (adaptive cruise, lane/car following, auto park, summon).
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Apr 1, 2016 16:59
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Tyro posted:It is an income tax credit applied when you file. So you can only claim the full amount if you owed at least $7500 in federal income taxes (which was not a problem for most Model S and X buyers, but might be for some Model 3 buyers). What I'm not super clear on is how the 200,000 car limit works. It seems like you'd want to file as soon as possible to be under that, so you'd still need to wait for the begin of the 2017 tax filing period (provided they ship next year) and hope you submit your taxes and they're processed before everyone else?
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Apr 1, 2016 17:04
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io_burn posted:What I'm not super clear on is how the 200,000 car limit works. It seems like you'd want to file as soon as possible to be under that, so you'd still need to wait for the begin of the 2017 tax filing period (provided they ship next year) and hope you submit your taxes and they're processed before everyone else? Borkencode did a good job explaining it earlier on this page: quote:The $7500 tax credit applies to the first 200,000 cars Tesla sells in the US, international sales don't count. The same credit will continue for the rest of that quarter, as well as the following quarter. So if Tesla sells #200K on Jan 1st 2018, every car sold in the US for 6 more months will get the credit. Then the credit is cut in half for 6 months. Then cut in half again for another 6 months. The limit is not based on when you file taxes but when the car is actually sold / delivered (Tesla counts those in funky ways some times). So there will be a clear cutoff window and then a phase down window, and based on when you take delivery, the amount of the tax credit you can claim is pretty straightforward.
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Apr 1, 2016 17:08
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https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/715934657720639488 The revenue number makes him look as bad at accounting as I am, but very interesting about the average option price.
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Apr 1, 2016 17:15
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MrYenko posted:Your reservation number probably isn't going to have a great deal to do with your actual build number, anyway. Haven't the first batches of both the S and X been the "Signature" models that only come loaded? Hell, the X still doesn't have a configurator, are there any non-Signature models even out there yet? I'd expect the same here. First batch is all loaded models, then they start to phase in other configurations. Your reservation number could probably impact your order within a batch of similar cars, but I'd be willing to bet that those who want a more stripped down configuration are going to be waiting the longest.
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Apr 1, 2016 17:16
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Tyro posted:The limit is not based on when you file taxes but when the car is actually sold / delivered (Tesla counts those in funky ways some times). So there will be a clear cutoff window and then a phase down window, and based on when you take delivery, the amount of the tax credit you can claim is pretty straightforward. So you think there will be a pretty clear indication that I'll get the full $7,500 when I actually pick my options and stuff? My plan was to keep the net cost of the car around $40k, so if I'm totally in for the tax credit I'm just going to go HAM with options to keep that number around the same. ...But I don't want to be over-budget with a $50k car if all the sudden it's like "Oh poo poo no tax credit sorry bro."
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Apr 1, 2016 17:17
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Even with the model 3, I can't see anyone actually affording one who doesn't have at least $7500 in tax liability. That's about a $61k annual income and if you aren't making at least that, you probably shouldn't be buying $35k cars.
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Apr 1, 2016 17:21
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Perhaps you are not familiar with the level of financial discipline that guides American car purchases.
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Apr 1, 2016 17:22
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If average options are 7k, the 35k base model must be absolute poo poo in comparison. Can the tax credit be carried forward for a year if you don't use all of it? I have very swingy income, and I needed the carry forward for my solar panel tax credit.
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Apr 1, 2016 17:23
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Subjunctive posted:Perhaps you are not familiar with the level of financial discipline that guides American car purchases. If you like bad financial planning surrounding cars, you should really lurk r/teslamotors and watch 18 year olds living with their parents rationalizing leasing a $100,000 car because of all the money they'll save on gas.
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Apr 1, 2016 17:23
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OldSenileGuy posted:Did they actually say that supercharging is standard on the cheapest Model 3? Or is it one of those cases where the hardware to allow for supercharging is standard on every Model 3, but you still have to pay $2500 or whatever to activate it? So not 100% clear. Arkane posted:If average options are 7k, the 35k base model must be absolute poo poo in comparison. e:f;b.
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Apr 1, 2016 17:27
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Arkane posted:Can the tax credit be carried forward for a year if you don't use all of it? Nope.
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Apr 1, 2016 17:28
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Arkane posted:If average options are 7k, the 35k base model must be absolute poo poo in comparison. I'm guessing most are getting autopilot and the tech/GPS package at least, given early-adopter demographics, but at least on the S the options are things that are actually optional (heated seats, bigger wheels, fancy paint/upholstery, upgraded audio, spoiler, pano roof) and not basic things like backup cameras or keyless entry or AC.
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Apr 1, 2016 17:29
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io_burn posted:If you like bad financial planning surrounding cars, you should really lurk r/teslamotors and watch 18 year olds living with their parents rationalizing leasing a $100,000 car because of all the money they'll save on gas. I remember talking with a person at a Tesla store about the lease terms on a car (GA, so they aren't allowed to actually sell it). The lady dropped $725 a month for the stripped-down 70 kW/H model and I remember thinking "Holy gently caress, there's no way in hell I could spend $300+ a month in loving gas to make this even remotely worth it".  Reddit is hilariously awful so I never go there, but thank you for the mental image of the average Redactor. Edit: Supercharging being standard on the 3 is a really good idea. Early adopters on the S and Roadsters are more likely to be conscious about the range limitations and needs of an electric vehicle. People like ~my girlfriend~ (who adores the concept of the Model 3 and autopilot) that routinely forget to charge their phones will see the limitations of the electric car slam in their face when they're sitting on the side of the road without a charge, staring down the prospect of a tow and 3 hour recharge session. These folks will most likely bad-mouth electric vehicles as inconvenient at that point because they made a mistake, and now fixing it is causing them to have to change their entire day. However, let them tap into a supercharger and put enough miles to get home in about 15 minutes and it'll turn into more of an embarrassment of "yeah, I forgot to charge it, so I had to go get a coffee." Give someone a battery backup USB charger thing and it becomes less about "This phone sucks" and more "Yeah I forgot". It's a brilliant idea. funeral home DJ fucked around with this message at 17:37 on Apr 1, 2016 |
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Apr 1, 2016 17:29
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I've been trying to figure out which options have been confirmed, so far I have: 1. Larger battery (and probably a performance version on top of this) 2. Dual motors 3. The glass roof 4. Autopilot 5. Air suspension Seems pretty similar to the options available for the S, so I'm expecting it to be the same list, minus the rear facing seats.
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Apr 1, 2016 17:31
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I had this conversation with a coworker. He realized it was silly when i made him realize he spends about $20/week on gas. Now if you are already buying a $40k+ vehicle sure. But you cant justify buying one vs say, an altima or some poo poo.
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Apr 1, 2016 17:33
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Ripoff posted:I remember talking with a person at a Tesla store about the lease terms on a car (GA, so they aren't allowed to actually sell it). The lady dropped $725 a month for the stripped-down 70 kW/H model and I remember thinking "Holy gently caress, there's no way in hell I could spend $300+ a month in loving gas to make this even remotely worth it". I can't find it now as I really can't figure out what to search for to find it, but the best Reddit Model S post I ever saw was a dude living in some supremely lovely apartment working an hourly wage job who bought a Model S to save money on gas which he charged by keeping his front door cracked open and running a long-assed extension cord down to the parking lot. He had all these photos of the insane run the extension cord did, which included going down some stairs.
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Apr 1, 2016 17:36
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io_burn posted:I can't find it now as I really can't figure out what to search for to find it, but the best Reddit Model S post I ever saw was a dude living in some supremely lovely apartment working an hourly wage job who bought a Model S to save money on gas which he charged by keeping his front door cracked open and running a long-assed extension cord down to the parking lot. He had all these photos of the insane run the extension cord did, which included going down some stairs. Maybe its the altima lease guy moving up in the world.
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Apr 1, 2016 17:37
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I mean I can't really fault dumb gently caress decisions like that, when I was 18 I had a real stupid car I could barely afford. Seems like a rite of passage to realize how loving stupid it is to be car broke.
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Apr 1, 2016 17:40
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Don Lapre posted:I had this conversation with a coworker. He realized it was silly when i made him realize he spends about $20/week on gas. Assuming you qualify for 7500 and you get the average options, it'll cost you $35k after rebate versus like, what, $32k for a top end altima? I have a top end altima, and I like my car a lot. But there's no question I'll pay the extra few bucks for a 225 mile range vehicle that is more fun to drive and has very low maintenance/fuel costs. On a different issue, won't this car essentially render the Model S an inferior car without a big step up in the specs? Why bother buying a Model S when you can get let's say the top of the line model 3 for 50k? Seems like there might have to be huge improvements in the S in terms of range to justify the cost beyond just a roomier vehicle.
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Apr 1, 2016 17:49
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Arkane posted:Assuming you qualify for 7500 and you get the average options, it'll cost you $35k after rebate versus like, what, $32k for a top end altima?
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Apr 1, 2016 17:54
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Arkane posted:Assuming you qualify for 7500 and you get the average options, it'll cost you $35k after rebate versus like, what, $32k for a top end altima? The rebate could be gone or greatly diminished by the time it arrives. Im also talking about the person buying the $22k altima vs the $35-40k model 3 because of gas savings.
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Apr 1, 2016 17:56
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io_burn posted:I can't find it now as I really can't figure out what to search for to find it, but the best Reddit Model S post I ever saw was a dude living in some supremely lovely apartment working an hourly wage job who bought a Model S to save money on gas which he charged by keeping his front door cracked open and running a long-assed extension cord down to the parking lot. He had all these photos of the insane run the extension cord did, which included going down some stairs. I must find that this weekend, and when I do (unless someone beats me to it) I will post it up.
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Apr 1, 2016 17:58
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Ripoff posted:I remember talking with a person at a Tesla store about the lease terms on a car (GA, so they aren't allowed to actually sell it). The lady dropped $725 a month for the stripped-down 70 kW/H model and I remember thinking "Holy gently caress, there's no way in hell I could spend $300+ a month in loving gas to make this even remotely worth it". This is why I don't own one (well, that and I'm not in a position to drop that much on a car really). I commute 52 miles 1 way to work, and drive a Focus ST, so not the greatest mileage in the world, averages around 27. My annual cost for fuel last year was $2400. Given that you don't save 100% of that (have to pay for the electricity to fuel it), there is no way that the cost savings alone can even justify spending $42k on a 3, let alone the $$ for an S. This really is about wanting the car and wanting to go electric, not about saving money.
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Apr 1, 2016 18:05
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