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Typically you're using your rank and file troops (chaff) as blockers for your mages anyway, so if the chaff eats some poo poo from tstrikes or shadow bolts, who cares, did you win the battle? you'll recruit/summon more chaff and keep steam rolling.
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Mar 31, 2016 21:57
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MF_James posted:Typically you're using your rank and file troops (chaff) as blockers for your mages anyway, so if the chaff eats some poo poo from tstrikes or shadow bolts, who cares, did you win the battle? you'll recruit/summon more chaff and keep steam rolling. My problem was that I've been sending my flying sacreds to attack rear while my hordes of slingers and archers rain fire down on closest. But closest and rear turn out to be the same thing a lot of the time, and I'm losing expensive sacreds that I can only recruit five of per turn due to the Holy points limit to friendly fire. I'll need to re-think my recruiting and battle strategy to compensate. It's not insurmountable but it's an issue.
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Mar 31, 2016 23:05
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Yep that's a Thing. Also as a piece of advice, a domscore below 6 or really 7 is pretty dangerous to your nation's health, because there are a lot of nations who will take a) more or b) have the ability to blood sacrifice from their temples, which is like a super temple check, and if your dominions get extinguished by black enemy candles you are out of the game.
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Mar 31, 2016 23:10
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Leperflesh posted:My problem was that I've been sending my flying sacreds to attack rear while my hordes of slingers and archers rain fire down on closest. But closest and rear turn out to be the same thing a lot of the time, and I'm losing expensive sacreds that I can only recruit five of per turn due to the Holy points limit to friendly fire. when you attempt to fly over groups of enemies that causes a morale check, if you fail the check, you don't fly over and you stop to fight them, if morale check is successful you fly past that group ad infinitum until you drop or hit the back pack.
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Mar 31, 2016 23:13
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jBrereton posted:Yep that's a Thing. Yeah, I know about domkill. There's a few posts of advice on the first page, and I've been slowly working through the (ridiculous 300 page) manual, as well. MF_James posted:when you attempt to fly over groups of enemies that causes a morale check, if you fail the check, you don't fly over and you stop to fight them, if morale check is successful you fly past that group ad infinitum until you drop or hit the back pack. Yeah in this case my enemy on that map is just big hot giants, so they tend to have not that many combatants. Generally a couple dozen barbarians with swords and right behind them a big pile of giants. So my fliers were flying to the "rear" which was maybe six to ten squares behind the guys in front. Not far enough back to avoid getting shot. I also didn't optimize paths for a good bless, I'll need to do that next game. I'm still just trying poo poo out, not expecting to actually win, just figuring out the interface, mashing the buttons, seeing what fails spectacularly and what merely fails by a little, etc. Like in my most recent battle I had a mage summon some undeads. They got summoned way at the back next to the mage and never made it into combat before my army routed (due to my sacreds getting wiped out almost to a man while my peltasts pelted them with rocks). Welp. I also figured out very belatedly that hey, maybe I need to research this "construction" deal, so I could forge some items for my duders? Huh. Yeah.
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Mar 31, 2016 23:23
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Throw the manual in the trash, open up the mod inspector and play around. Like the devs didn't even write it, Some Guy did.
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Mar 31, 2016 23:24
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The manual is useful for numbers about spell effects and specific mechanical questions that you generally won't have/need to worry about until they arise in MP.
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Apr 1, 2016 00:03
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jBrereton posted:Throw the manual in the trash, open up the mod inspector and play around. a Guy who is on record as saying he doesnt like it when game mechanics are explained iirc
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Apr 1, 2016 02:48
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willus posted:a Guy who is on record as saying he doesnt like it when game mechanics are explained iirc so your typical game documentation guy
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Apr 1, 2016 07:22
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Etalommi posted:The manual is useful for numbers about spell effects and specific mechanical questions that you generally won't have/need to worry about until they arise in MP. The manual can even be wrong about specific mechanics, like it says in cooperative games the disciples awaken at 1 level lower than the pretender (eg pretender: imprisoned, disciple: dormant) but in fact the disciples awaken after half the time of the pretender (eg pretender: imprisoned (~36 months), disciple: ~36/2 months)
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Apr 1, 2016 08:10
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Enjoy posted:The manual can even be wrong about specific mechanics, like it says in cooperative games the disciples awaken at 1 level lower than the pretender (eg pretender: imprisoned, disciple: dormant) but in fact the disciples awaken after half the time of the pretender (eg pretender: imprisoned (~36 months), disciple: ~36/2 months) Sure, but it's also the only place to find out how domspread or trample damage works. It's more reliable than desura or z7 or random goons, that's for sure. Though the real answer is when in doubt ask monkee.
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Apr 1, 2016 08:15
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Enjoy posted:The manual can even be wrong about specific mechanics, like it says in cooperative games the disciples awaken at 1 level lower than the pretender (eg pretender: imprisoned, disciple: dormant) but in fact the disciples awaken after half the time of the pretender (eg pretender: imprisoned (~36 months), disciple: ~36/2 months) thats because they changed that in a patch and the manual is giant and nobody cares to update it
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Apr 1, 2016 08:52
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Tiler Kiwi posted:so your typical game documentation guy Like we had an argument on Desura about what should be included in spell descriptions and he was basically against even telling people which units were getting summoned by spells to ~enhance the mystery~ or something. I mean that's just retarded.
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Apr 1, 2016 10:00
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jBrereton posted:Yeah but even moreso. Yeah it's really mysterious how you can look at a spell description going "Kills everything undead really good", get excited, build a huge communion to cast the spell in battle and then the spell turns out to have giant massive drawbacks not mentioned in the description. But one of the drawbacks actually mentioned in the description turns out to be far too slow working to influence most battles, because apparently it was opposite day when that description was written! That's mystery for you. Pure, undiluted mystery. Oh wait, instead of mystery I wanted to type bullshit, don't know what happened there
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Apr 1, 2016 10:53
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ask me about Ultimate Generals Gettysburg documentation is for pussies just use """common sense""", the game although dominions 4 is worse about that at least it has a real manual
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Apr 1, 2016 11:14
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Adding "mystery" to a game that isn't about mystery (such as, say, a strategy game) is just going to result in people asking other people what things do or looking it up while being really frustrated. There are games that sort of thing works in, but Dominions is not one of them.
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Apr 1, 2016 11:25
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Libluini posted:Yeah it's really mysterious how you can look at a spell description going "Kills everything undead really good", get excited, build a huge communion to cast the spell in battle and then the spell turns out to have giant massive drawbacks not mentioned in the description. But one of the drawbacks actually mentioned in the description turns out to be far too slow working to influence most battles, because apparently it was opposite day when that description was written!
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Apr 1, 2016 11:35
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I almost feel that they hider Geryk to do the manual just so they could get the free press out of him and Three Moves Ahead. I'd never heard of Dominions 3 until I heard about it on that podcast, and who knows how many other players came in the same way?
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Apr 1, 2016 20:04
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 Oh right I need to do that thing first before I can do this thing first I'm good at this game 
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Apr 2, 2016 14:51
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A lot of the time when you have multiple different mod nations they will conflict and not work because both nations will have used the name unit id or some poo poo. This makes it hard to do modnation games, because some poor rear end in a top hat has to go through each .dm file and merge them, making sure that there are no conflicts. I figured that, surely, it must be pretty easy to automate this process. All you need is a program which: 1.) take a bunch of .dm files as input, 2.) merges them into a single .dm file, and 3.) goes through the newly merged file incrementally overwriting those commands which might cause conflicts. LordWindy on IRC then agreed to produce such a piece of software, and so I said I would make a list of those commands which may cause conflicts, and find out what their allowable ranges are. Turns out this poo poo is more complicated than I thought it would be. http://hastebin.com/raw/wijakuriwi <-- if any fucker retard who mods this lovely game wants to look over this and see if it covers everything, please do so.
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Apr 2, 2016 15:17
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Leperflesh posted:My problem was that I've been sending my flying sacreds to attack rear while my hordes of slingers and archers rain fire down on closest. But closest and rear turn out to be the same thing a lot of the time, and I'm losing expensive sacreds that I can only recruit five of per turn due to the Holy points limit to friendly fire. If you want to win just plays as bats or undead Rome.
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Apr 2, 2016 20:35
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amuayse posted:If you want to win Worst way to play dominions imo.
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Apr 2, 2016 20:39
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amuayse posted:If you want to win just plays as bats or undead Rome. If you want to be cool as heck play regular Rome.
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Apr 2, 2016 21:14
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Decrepus posted:If you want to be cool as heck play Not Gaul. Ftfy, imperialist sympathizer 
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Apr 2, 2016 21:52
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just make lots of mans and throw them into the grinder
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Apr 2, 2016 22:18
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Mu. posted:A lot of the time when you have multiple different mod nations they will conflict and not work because both nations will have used the name unit id or some poo poo. This makes it hard to do modnation games, because some poor rear end in a top hat has to go through each .dm file and merge them, making sure that there are no conflicts. That is an awesome list!
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Apr 3, 2016 00:20
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Didn't one of the other forums folk produce a list of syntax highlighting for text editors? That might be handy to have as well.
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Apr 3, 2016 00:59
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Barono posted:Didn't one of the other forums folk produce a list of syntax highlighting for text editors? That might be handy to have as well.
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Apr 3, 2016 01:22
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DOWN JACKET FETISH posted:thugs were apparently much more of a dominions 3 thing. the dom4 experience involves buffing your troops and casting battlemagic, which is nice Just a note; thugs are totally a thing for the nations that have mounted glamour commanders, if only because the price of two of their commanders with 0/5-10 gems of items is about the same as the gold you'd spend for number of troops you'd need to make a similarly reliable raiding party. And in the meantime the commanders can research (poorly), and can be used to cast spells in battle. And golems are still pretty popular as summoned raiders/"thugs" since they can be made really mobile and are a pretty cheap way to snipe provinces for nations that often lack access to good raiding units. Nuclearmonkee posted:Such is the suffering of the priest magi. 3 path sacred for 195g isn't completely hateful though. True, but that's after a cost reduction. I feel it is inflated because of the fact that you are paying for the stealthiness and leadership they have. They only get a small amount of utility out of getting N3, and out of their stealth, and out of their leadership, and out of their H1 status; they shouldn't really be priced as if all those things were valuable. It's MA Man, a stealthy H1 doesn't mean anything when you have them at 35 gold in any province with a 200 gold temple. The leadership with stealth lets them lead foresters, but they don't provide that much more utility than a generic stealthy leader for that stack for much of the game. Raiding counter counters aren't something that N has great access to for a long time, and an N mage doesn't do much on their own. Using them as leaders tends to have the major negatives of increasing the cost of a raiding party, and making the loss of one more painful, in exchange for the benefit of being more efficient with your fort turns. And the autocalc making you pay the 3 in a path fee on the moms when for much of the game N3 is barely different from N2 in battle; at least without a pretty hefty investment in boosters and gear that you don't have great access to. Further, MA Man has plenty of N for rituals. Overall I'm just not a fan of the autocalc, since it asks you to pay for everything a unit has when some units combinations of traits add up to something greater then the sum of their parts and others just provide flexibility that you may or may not be able to take advantage of. If it were up to me, the cost of moms would not take into account their alright leadership or their ability to get 3 in a path because those things are often not parts of the unit's strength. In a similar manner I would refund a bit of the cost incurred because of them having holy and stealth in combination. The autocalc just universally prices everything. But in the context of a nation like Man, there are mechanical and flavor incentives to weight the costs differently. It's an issue that effects MA Man quite heavily, since in my opinion Man's strengths are built ultimately on numerical superiority in fielded mages. All of that isn't to say that these kind of things have to be changed, but if I decided Man was an underpowered nation in need of some help the first thing I'd do is tweak the costs. Personally I think Man's one of the better bad nations. Nature mages are better than they look in dom 4, and they have a pretty reliable expansion no matter what they do. Their ability to disrupt an early opponent with a couple of decent ways to raid, combined with spies and massed nature's surprising potency with little research, can give them the tools to cement a decent position in the early game if they can get a second fort up well ahead of a neighbor. They also have really good scouting combined with enough research supplements that they can afford to pull mages early, so it's not unreasonable for them to identify and hit their window. They're basically an MA Ulm patterned nation, but not as good at Ulming in exchange for being trickier and more diverse. Which is a bad trade, but not an impossible one to work with.
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Apr 3, 2016 01:55
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None of that matters. They sing and monks/logrians own. Soothing song is incredibly powerful.
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Apr 3, 2016 02:31
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Update on PMS (Project Mod Smasher) I'm in the process of compiling mods into their parts. Life has been made easy by requiring a #end and an opening statement like #newmonster. The only problem I see in the future is what happens when two mods modify the same thing. Eg, the same vanilla weapon. Similar mod mashing tools pick the one closest to vanilla but I don't want to do that. I may either throw an exception telling the user to fix it or just using the first one and telling them of the conflict.
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Apr 3, 2016 02:49
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Lord Windy posted:The only problem I see in the future is what happens when two mods modify the same thing. Eg, the same vanilla weapon. Similar mod mashing tools pick the one closest to vanilla but I don't want to do that. I may either throw an exception telling the user to fix it or just using the first one and telling them of the conflict. change it to some thing different from both imo
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Apr 3, 2016 05:34
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Nuclearmonkee posted:None of that matters. They sing and monks/logrians own. Like everyone sings though. Two N2 daughters are better for singing than the N3 mom they might take the place of if you aren't bringing a massive number of mages. The issue with moms is that daughters do a lot of what moms do just as well from an N magic perspective for quite a while, which devalues the non A2 moms. It always seemed to me that more casters singing is better than a higher leveled song, but I might have missed something.
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Apr 3, 2016 06:42
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If you're not taking out many mages for some reason, I'd take an N3 out any day over 2 N2s. You've got Howl, which is great for trading mages at least until people wise up, a lot of good buffs, much bigger + so stronger Panic and so on. With W1 you have Foul Vapors too, which DoAs just don't get, E1 and you have Strength of Gaia; there's not a lot an effective base N4 mage can't cast in battle. You've got Relief, Serpent's Blessing and Growing Fury, all castable theoretically at least off the same mage with one N3E1. That's a lot of good stuff!
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Apr 3, 2016 08:12
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Like Man's main problem is just Having Late as we would say in dota terminology. Weak against undead and demons, no H3s for quick throne capping, and since quite a lot of people run N9 gods they have a bit of a hard time keeping their own globals up, especially since Nature is their only natural global path. Pretty solid early and unquestionably good midgame though.
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Apr 3, 2016 09:04
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 #FeelTheBern
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Apr 3, 2016 11:48
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Enjoy posted:
What mod does that come from?
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Apr 3, 2016 13:21
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Lord Windy posted:What mod does that come from? http://z7.invisionfree.com/Dom3mods/index.php?showtopic=2517
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Apr 3, 2016 13:29
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I was not expecting that 'facelift' one bit.
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Apr 3, 2016 13:49
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akulanization posted:Like everyone sings though. Two N2 daughters are better for singing than the N3 mom they might take the place of if you aren't bringing a massive number of mages. The issue with moms is that daughters do a lot of what moms do just as well from an N magic perspective for quite a while, which devalues the non A2 moms. It always seemed to me that more casters singing is better than a higher leveled song, but I might have missed something. You don't use your real mages to sing. You use idiot tribe n1s. That's the whole thing. You have RP going from monks and logrians, singers from some random n1 indie and then real mages from your forts. Done properly you get a lot of research and each one of your combat mages is worth more than it first appears since you can go a full 5 rounds and still be at near 0 fatigue at the end. With the randoms you pull, they will mostly be N spammers but you can easily build a very nasty tstrike stack that can load a full 5 tstrikes per mage. I didn't save screenshots but I subbed in as man and basically obliterated a guy with very few losses just by exploiting songs to their maximum potential. The high RP means you are able also means you get RoS pretty fast and every e1a1 logrian can do it out of the box. The key trap people have to avoid is building all longbows and then going obsolete the second someone can arrow fend or drop a battlefield wiper on you. You have to be more creative than that. edit: You have stealthy mages with 40 leadership and stealthy troops and summons. use those. I have never seen anyone but me do this. Should be pulling pan style shenanigans with them when possible. Nuclearmonkee fucked around with this message at 15:54 on Apr 3, 2016 |
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Apr 3, 2016 15:44
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