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Phone posted:Police unions are good because Same except teacher unions.
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Apr 3, 2016 16:04
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Yes, I agree, let's jump aboard the union-busting train as long as we don't like the people who have the union. 
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Apr 3, 2016 16:10
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Quorum posted:Yes, I agree, let's jump aboard the union-busting train as long as we don't like the people who have the union. I don't see how that could backfire at all!
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Apr 3, 2016 16:11
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Shimrra Jamaane posted:I know this is primary chat but what the hell just happened in Nevada? Caucuses are overly complicated bullshit, and the thing that just happened is just as likely to get reversed again.
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Apr 3, 2016 16:12
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Nostalgia4Infinity posted:I don't see how that could backfire at all! end holy unions
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Apr 3, 2016 16:15
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Nostalgia4Infinity posted:I don't see how that could backfire at all! I was on the train, and I do recognize it was a low effort post; however, the police always seem to skate by the "all unions are bad" rhetoric when they're the ones that seem to have the most horrific abuses across all of the various unions. They're the least vulnerable by a landslide seeing how you can murder a child in a park on camera and come out smelling like a rose on the other end. I wish that labor unions were stronger in the states and that the police unions weren't the only real union left standing. Yeah, teacher and auto workers do have unions that technically exist, but neither of them have the teeth and tenacity (or history of straight up abuse/collusion) as the police.
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Apr 3, 2016 16:17
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Phone posted:Police unions are good because Every worker should be unionized and have an advocate working for them to ensure that they're protected from abuse, arbitrary firing, and can maintain and improve their quality of life.
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Apr 3, 2016 16:20
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Police Unions are a pretty good case study in how people can be shitheads even in an (economically) ideal environment. Also indicative of how conflicting interests can still pop up. Another example would be if a coal miner's union opposed getting off of coal power.
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Apr 3, 2016 16:26
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Phone posted:Police unions are good because Only the black cops would go to jail.
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Apr 3, 2016 16:26
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Police unions are pretty vulnerable to the old "we need to cut the state budget" and "whoops, there goes your pension." Or another fine product of that process was "we need to put our pension funds in a private security. This Bernie Madoff fellow seems to get real fine returns and is real trustworthy."
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Apr 3, 2016 17:10
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Rexicon1 posted:I would absolutely love for Al Jazeera or bbc to moderate an American debate. The simultaneous chaos and moral crisis it would create would be delightful to watch (unless it gets violent) I was thinking about this and the only way I could see it working is if there isn't an audience or if the moderators can keep the audience silent. I don't think I've ever heard of a debate without an audience and it would be interesting to see how it would change how the candidates talk if there are no applause lines. Has that ever happened before?
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Apr 3, 2016 17:48
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limp_cheese posted:I was thinking about this and the only way I could see it working is if there isn't an audience or if the moderators can keep the audience silent. I don't think I've ever heard of a debate without an audience and it would be interesting to see how it would change how the candidates talk if there are no applause lines. Has that ever happened before? Watch the channels then add their own applause track to candidates' statements like laugh tracks in bad sitcoms.
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Apr 3, 2016 17:51
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Phone posted:I was on the train, and I do recognize it was a low effort post; however, the police always seem to skate by the "all unions are bad" rhetoric when they're the ones that seem to have the most horrific abuses across all of the various unions. They're the least vulnerable by a landslide seeing how you can murder a child in a park on camera and come out smelling like a rose on the other end. Police unions should be like teachers unions, something everyone shits on because it turns out the members aren't bottomless pits of altruism who will keep working for nothing because their job is just so good and necessary.
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Apr 3, 2016 18:25
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Mystic_Shadow posted:Watch the channels then add their own applause track to candidates' statements like laugh tracks in bad sitcoms. You know they'd just mic up Frank Luntz's cavalcade of assholes.
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Apr 3, 2016 18:26
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We should get rid of all unions since they hamper free trade and then my paycheck will go up $10 a week maybe.
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Apr 3, 2016 18:40
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Trump really really has no idea how a government functions. His plan puts 'normal' calls for austerity to shame. Donald Trump's Unusual Plan to Lower the National Debt: Sell Off Government Assets
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Apr 3, 2016 18:41
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Shimrra Jamaane posted:Trump really really has no idea how a government functions. His plan puts 'normal' calls for austerity to shame. Well government should be run like a business, right? He just wants to run the government the way any
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Apr 3, 2016 18:47
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Shimrra Jamaane posted:Trump really really has no idea how a government functions. His plan puts 'normal' calls for austerity to shame. Sounds like a wet dream for business republicans. This is him extending a branch to the establishment.
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Apr 3, 2016 18:50
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Zeroisanumber posted:Every worker should be unionized and have an advocate working for them to ensure that they're protected from abuse, arbitrary firing, and can maintain and improve their quality of life. My friend have you tried reading Atlas Shrugged?
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Apr 3, 2016 18:52
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Shimrra Jamaane posted:Trump really really has no idea how a government functions. His plan puts 'normal' calls for austerity to shame. This is just cribbed from 1980s Reason magazine. He's courting the libertarian wing. This must be the pivot. 
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Apr 3, 2016 19:00
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Litany Unheard posted:Well government should be run like a business, right? He just wants to run the government the way any So government's should rent instead of just already paid and pay no rent. Great long term solution that.
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Apr 3, 2016 19:02
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Shimrra Jamaane posted:Trump really really has no idea how a government functions. His plan puts 'normal' calls for austerity to shame. The only assets the government really has is its first world infrastructure and open space, a national level of the "noooo the trees!" That people always pull when something they don't want built is proposed would be amusing. The real assets America has is its people, Mr. Trump 
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Apr 3, 2016 19:04
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computer parts posted:Police Unions are a pretty good case study in how people can be shitheads even in an (economically) ideal environment. The border patrol union endorsed donald trump.
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Apr 3, 2016 19:07
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RuanGacho posted:The real assets America has is its people, Mr. Trump Don't you worry, he'll privatize them too!
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Apr 3, 2016 19:09
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Maybe we could solve a lot of our problems by instituting a Citizen only system of government and we could have two types of people Citizens and Non-Citizens. Citizens could be people who volunteered for public works products and the military.
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Apr 3, 2016 19:11
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Hollismason posted:Maybe we could solve a lot of our problems by instituting a Citizen only system of government and we could have two types of people Citizens and Non-Citizens. Citizens could be people who volunteered for public works products and the military. I would like to know more
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Apr 3, 2016 19:20
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Shimrra Jamaane posted:Trump really really has no idea how a government functions. His plan puts 'normal' calls for austerity to shame. Because that's worked so well for Republican-run states that have done that already.
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Apr 3, 2016 19:20
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Shimrra Jamaane posted:Trump really really has no idea how a government functions. His plan puts 'normal' calls for austerity to shame. A few states already did this. And now they're paying for something that should be free and in a few cases sold off free/easy revenue makers
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Apr 3, 2016 19:23
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PhazonLink posted:A few states already did this. And now they're paying for something that should be free and in a few cases sold off free/easy revenue makers My favorite is Arizona selling their Capitol building, leasing it back at considerable cost, and then proposing to buy it back at a huge loss. FISCAL RESPONSIBILITY!
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Apr 3, 2016 19:29
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Branis posted:The border patrol union endorsed donald trump. The prospect of getting an injection of 20 kerbillion dollars, more power, more responsibility, higher wages would make most unions salivate.
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Apr 3, 2016 19:30
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Hollismason posted:My friend have you tried reading Atlas Shrugged? Yes. I wanted to crush John Galt's skull between my fingers afterwards, which is what I assume that the author was going for.
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Apr 3, 2016 19:30
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Good Citizen posted:My favorite is Arizona selling their Capitol building, leasing it back at considerable cost, and then proposing to buy it back at a huge loss. Where did the state congress meet, then? In the meeting hall at a Golden Corral, but sometimes go over their scheduled time when the Kiwanis club is supposed to use the room?
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Apr 3, 2016 19:31
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Hollismason posted:Maybe we could solve a lot of our problems by instituting a Citizen only system of government and we could have two types of people Citizens and Non-Citizens. Citizens could be people who volunteered for public works products and the military. This is an unfortunately seductive idea, the ultimate baseline problem with it being that citizenship as recognized by a government is binary while human society treats it as if it is not. I know you're probably joking but I feel it worth while to illustrate the idea because it's the basis of most trouble makers for the government at all levels. They're a citizen when they want to have a say in government policy, with an affect on themselves or others they feel need to be influenced. They are not citizens whenever that might entail taking responsibility for their actions, at that point the government is a nebulous other that they have nothing to do with, especially when it doesn't go the way they want because someone else with a more compelling argument or base of support has prevailed over them. This is a very rough cut but because most people don't think deeply about it, it boils down to give me power but not responsibility. It is a human condition and the reason why democracy is flawed, everyone naturally wants power but no culpability.
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Apr 3, 2016 20:05
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Star Man posted:Where did the state congress meet, then? In the meeting hall at a Golden Corral, but sometimes go over their scheduled time when the Kiwanis club is supposed to use the room? This sounds like some Jefferton of Tom Goes to the Mayor level of governance
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Apr 3, 2016 20:21
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N. Senada posted:This sounds like some Jefferton of Tom Goes to the Mayor level of governance You have no idea how accurate that show was.
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Apr 3, 2016 20:28
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Star Man posted:Where did the state congress meet, then? In the meeting hall at a Golden Corral, but sometimes go over their scheduled time when the Kiwanis club is supposed to use the room?
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Apr 3, 2016 20:29
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Gobbeldygook posted:They continued to meet in the Capitol building. Harper's has a good longread on it and the rest of the fiscal madness of Arizona under Tea Party management. What they did was raise some immediate money by selling the building (and a lot of other government property) to a private real estate company and then started paying them rent on a building they used to own. They eventually realized this was stupid as gently caress and are trying to buy it back. Are they sure it wasn't a pawn shop that they sold it to?
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Apr 3, 2016 20:39
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Gobbeldygook posted:They continued to meet in the Capitol building. Harper's has a good longread on it and the rest of the fiscal madness of Arizona under Tea Party management. What they did was raise some immediate money by selling the building (and a lot of other government property) to a private real estate company and then started paying them rent on a building they used to own. They eventually realized this was stupid as gently caress and are trying to buy it back. that is an amazing lack of foresight, like what did they even need the influx of money for that was so urgent you'd sell the Capitol?
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Apr 3, 2016 20:50
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Quorum posted:Yes, I agree, let's jump aboard the union-busting train as long as we don't like the people who have the union. Unions will be made obsolete in the future pocket computer economy - it will either be gross oligarchy or a fairly rational system of payscales. The real problem is such a system is a material fabrication of the Holy Spirit, a counterfeit that can enslave the planet.
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Apr 3, 2016 20:54
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mandatory lesbian posted:that is an amazing lack of foresight, like what did they even need the influx of money for that was so urgent you'd sell the Capitol? Getting reelected in 2010. The sale put a hundred million dollars in Arizona's budget for a short time, so that Brewer could point to a surplus in 2010, then bought it back at a loss because it was a dumb idea. It was basically a twenty million dollar transfer from the state to the major banks that bought the shares in the statehouse, that also tricked rubes into thinking austerity was working.
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Apr 3, 2016 20:59
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