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Sarmhan
Nov 1, 2011

Moist Mardu, come on people.

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Sickening
Jul 16, 2007

Black summer was the best summer.

TheKingofSprings posted:

Do you actually need a playset of both? I thought it was more a 3/3 split card

Actually no clue, I didn't play in the small stretch that card was being played. All I know is that they were 3 bucks, old, and if I didn't buy some they would be a lot more expensive. If that is the case I will simply trade the extra away while its still expensive and be happy.

rinski
Sep 12, 2007

Thisuck posted:

It's loving Marblue


sarmhan posted:

Moist Mardu, come on people.

you guys are making the baby grumpy

suicidesteve
Jan 4, 2006

"Life is a maze. This is one of its dead ends.


rinski posted:

you guys are making the baby grumpy



This is correct.

Irony Be My Shield
Jul 29, 2012

I've heard you're meant to run one less sword than foundry, since you can combo with sword in your graveyard.

Fuzzy Mammal
Aug 15, 2001

Lipstick Apathy

JerryLee posted:

Didn't they have specific draft rules in place for Innistrad 1.0 to deal with exactly this situation? Looking to see whether a dude's drafted a DFC isn't a new problem, and as I recall you were explicitly permitted to see if someone had taken a DFC.

Yeah it was a total BS DQ. Lots of salt on that one.

GimmickMan
Dec 27, 2011

rinski posted:

you guys are making the baby grumpy



Let's be honest, nobody remembers which of the Nephilim is which. Might as well just call the deck "Not Green."

Mae
Aug 1, 2010

Supesudandi wa, kukan-nai no dandidesu

African american is always the best deck name

TheKingofSprings
Oct 9, 2012

Irony Be My Shield posted:

I've heard you're meant to run one less sword than foundry, since you can combo with sword in your graveyard.

http://www.channelfireball.com/videos/channel-pmayne-modern-thoptersword/ Pascal Maynard has a version of the deck he's testing out.

Looks good but I seriously dunno why no River of Tears

E: I do like the idea of looping EE a lot, seems good against Affinity. Three Hurkyl's Recall does not, though :laffo:

TheKingofSprings fucked around with this message at 01:35 on Apr 8, 2016

rinski
Sep 12, 2007

GimmickMan posted:

Let's be honest, nobody remembers which of the Nephilim is which. Might as well just call the deck "Not Green."

That is why I am performing this public service announcement.

Know Your Nephilim!

White has Glint Hawk, not Glint-Eye!
Dune-Brood blue? Nope! Not true!
It's Ink-*Treader* Nephilim, not "Submerged In Ink, Specifically Black Ink" Nephilim.
Witch-Maw kind of rhymes with rickshaw, which begins with R, but it is not a rickshaw and therefore has no R.
The only other Tiller is Spike Tiller, a green card, so obviously Yore-Tiller costs WUBR.

Skyl3lazer
Aug 27, 2007

[Dooting Stealthily]



TheKingofSprings posted:

http://www.channelfireball.com/videos/channel-pmayne-modern-thoptersword/ Pascal Maynard has a version of the deck he's testing out.

Looks good but I seriously dunno why no River of Tears

E: I do like the idea of looping EE a lot, seems good against Affinity. Three Hurkyl's Recall does not, though :laffo:

Why is Hurkyl's bad against affinity? It's a fantastic card?

Gridlocked
Aug 2, 2014

MR. STUPID MORON
WITH AN UGLY FACE
AND A BIG BUTT
AND HIS BUTT SMELLS
AND HE LIKES TO KISS
HIS OWN BUTT
by Roger Hargreaves

Bugsy posted:

SOI drafts are going to work like ISD drafts right? Got to show the which DFC cards are in the pack when opening.

On LR Marshall said when drafting paper you show which DFC cards you open to the table but you don't need to announce when you take them; however they need to go to the top of the pile in front of you regardless of pick order.

suicidesteve
Jan 4, 2006

"Life is a maze. This is one of its dead ends.


Skyl3lazer posted:

Why is Hurkyl's bad against affinity? It's a fantastic card?

Are you killing them next turn? If you're not Hurkyl's is pretty medium. Sure you get your "bounce a manland, 2 Darksteel Citadels, make them discard 4 cards and kill their Glimmervoid EOT" Hurkyl's but you get more "oh well I'm dead if I don't blow this mid-combat. Also he's going to vomit all these cards back out this turn so I'm still dead next turn so I guess I just cast a 1U Fog" Hurkyl's. You really need multiples for it to be guaranteed to be good. Snapcaster Hurkyl's or Hurkyl's, wait a turn or 2 Hurkyl's again is usually good enough. It's also much better if you have Chalice of the Void. EOT Hurkyl's, Chalice on 0/1 is a giant beating.

LifeLynx
Feb 27, 2001

Dang so this is like looking over his shoulder in real-time
Grimey Drawer
Really looking forward to the clusterfuck that is people trying to hide their DFCs again.

mfcrocker
Jan 31, 2004



Hot Rope Guy

Gridlocked posted:

On LR Marshall said when drafting paper you show which DFC cards you open to the table but you don't need to announce when you take them; however they need to go to the top of the pile in front of you regardless of pick order.

Well, Marshall's wrong. The requirements are as written in the MTR, quoted last page

TheKingofSprings
Oct 9, 2012

Skyl3lazer posted:

Why is Hurkyl's bad against affinity? It's a fantastic card?

suicidesteve posted:

Are you killing them next turn? If you're not Hurkyl's is pretty medium. Sure you get your "bounce a manland, 2 Darksteel Citadels, make them discard 4 cards and kill their Glimmervoid EOT" Hurkyl's but you get more "oh well I'm dead if I don't blow this mid-combat. Also he's going to vomit all these cards back out this turn so I'm still dead next turn so I guess I just cast a 1U Fog" Hurkyl's. You really need multiples for it to be guaranteed to be good. Snapcaster Hurkyl's or Hurkyl's, wait a turn or 2 Hurkyl's again is usually good enough. It's also much better if you have Chalice of the Void. EOT Hurkyl's, Chalice on 0/1 is a giant beating.



There's also the issue of about a third of the deck running it being artifacts

TheKingofSprings fucked around with this message at 02:36 on Apr 8, 2016

Sickening
Jul 16, 2007

Black summer was the best summer.

BJPaskoff posted:

Really looking forward to the clusterfuck that is people trying to hide their DFCs again.

What is this about?

TheTofuShop
Aug 28, 2009

mfcrocker posted:

Well, Marshall's wrong. The requirements are as written in the MTR, quoted last page

I kinda miss having Joe Bono on, as it was nice to have a Judge to make intricate rulings on the show.

I know the three local stores I play at all revealed DFCs during ISD, so I assume they will do the same. It wouldn't surprise me if someone shows up trying to challenge it and referencing the MTR though.

suicidesteve
Jan 4, 2006

"Life is a maze. This is one of its dead ends.


TheKingofSprings posted:

There's also the issue of about a third of the deck running it being artifacts

That's uh, not an issue at all? It's not Rebuild.

Unless you're Hurkyl'sing yourself in response to Shatterstorm or something I guess.

Elyv
Jun 14, 2013



suicidesteve posted:

That's uh, not an issue at all? It's not Rebuild.

Unless you're Hurkyl'sing yourself in response to Shatterstorm or something I guess.

Maybe TKoS plays against a lot of Swerves

suicidesteve
Jan 4, 2006

"Life is a maze. This is one of its dead ends.


Elyv posted:

Maybe TKoS plays against a lot of Swerves

Commandeer your Hurkyl's. :getin:

E4C85D38
Feb 7, 2010

Doesn't that thing only
hold six rounds...?

TheTofuShop posted:

I kinda miss having Joe Bono on, as it was nice to have a Judge to make intricate rulings on the show.

I know the three local stores I play at all revealed DFCs during ISD, so I assume they will do the same. It wouldn't surprise me if someone shows up trying to challenge it and referencing the MTR though.

The TO could make a rule that says that after each pick each player is required to pat their bellies and rub their heads simultaneously and it'd be fine—as long as it's done ahead of time, TOs have pretty wide discretion in filling in whatever the MTR doesn't address. (Any such things should technically be on a tournament fact sheet, but at a Regular REL event I don't expect that to happen and nobody's really going to care about it.)

E4C85D38 fucked around with this message at 03:13 on Apr 8, 2016

TheDemon
Dec 11, 2006

...on the plus side I'm feeling much more angry now than I expected so this totally helps me get in character.
The MTR says only this:

quote:

Players may not reveal the front face of their card selections or the contents of their current packs to other
participants in the draft and must make a reasonable effort to keep that information from the sight of other
players. Players are not permitted to reveal hidden information of any kind to other participants in the draft
regarding their own picks or what they want others to pick. (Exception: This does not apply to double-faced cards,
both faces of which may be revealed at any time during a draft.)

LifeLynx
Feb 27, 2001

Dang so this is like looking over his shoulder in real-time
Grimey Drawer

Sickening posted:

What is this about?

In draft, I'll watch people grab a DFC real quick and slide it under their previous picks or all their picks all sly-like so the people next to them won't know what colors they're in.

Sickening
Jul 16, 2007

Black summer was the best summer.

BJPaskoff posted:

In draft, I'll watch people grab a DFC real quick and slide it under their previous picks or all their picks all sly-like so the people next to them won't know what colors they're in.

Is that not allowed?

Rinkles
Oct 24, 2010

What I'm getting at is...
Do you feel the same way?

BJPaskoff posted:

In draft, I'll watch people grab a DFC real quick and slide it under their previous picks or all their picks all sly-like so the people next to them won't know what colors they're in.

That's not unintuitive.

Entropic
Feb 21, 2007

patriarchy sucks
There's really not much advantage to be gained by hiding your colors anyway, and probably some disadvantage.

ShadeofBlue
Mar 17, 2011

BJPaskoff posted:

In draft, I'll watch people grab a DFC real quick and slide it under their previous picks or all their picks all sly-like so the people next to them won't know what colors they're in.

What? I would rather announce loudly what colors I'm in than hide it. Unless you know the person next to you is a troll or something.

suicidesteve
Jan 4, 2006

"Life is a maze. This is one of its dead ends.


Well if you're passing to the person who pack 1 pick 1s Arlinn it kinda makes sense to cut them off of RG.

TheDemon
Dec 11, 2006

...on the plus side I'm feeling much more angry now than I expected so this totally helps me get in character.

Sickening posted:

Is that not allowed?

The draft procedures say this:

quote:

Players choose one card from their current booster pack and then pass the remaining cards
face down to the player on their left until all cards are drafted. Once a player has removed a card from the pack
and put it on top of his or her single, front face-down drafted pile, it is considered selected and may not be
returned to the pack.

Players may not reveal the front face of their card selections or the contents of their current packs to other
participants in the draft and must make a reasonable effort to keep that information from the sight of other
players. Players are not permitted to reveal hidden information of any kind to other participants in the draft
regarding their own picks or what they want others to pick. (Exception: This does not apply to double-faced cards,
both faces of which may be revealed at any time during a draft.)

It seems mandatory to place the card on top of the pile, even if it's not mandatory to reveal the DFC. But at regular REL, doubt anyone would care.

Emerson Cod
Apr 14, 2004

by Pragmatica
Was there a change to the MTR since Origins? Because in Origins revealing DFCs was required and you weren't allowed to hide them. Which was kind of annoying - I asked on Judge Apps what the implications of this would be at a competitive level event and they just kind of brushed it off and said that those would be really rare and not to worry about it. Meanwhile I was slated to judge at a GPT that thankfully at the last minute switched from limited to Standard.

E4C85D38
Feb 7, 2010

Doesn't that thing only
hold six rounds...?

Emerson Cod posted:

Was there a change to the MTR since Origins? Because in Origins revealing DFCs was required and you weren't allowed to hide them. Which was kind of annoying - I asked on Judge Apps what the implications of this would be at a competitive level event and they just kind of brushed it off and said that those would be really rare and not to worry about it. Meanwhile I was slated to judge at a GPT that thankfully at the last minute switched from limited to Standard.

This is the version of the MTR that was effective with Origins, but I don't see any notable changes. http://wpn.wizards.com/sites/wpn/files/attachements/mtg_mtr_17jul15_en.pdf

You weren't allowed to hide them then, you aren't allowed to hide them now (just plop them on top of your pile of picks), but nothing in policy either then or now requires affirmatively revealing them/announcing them to the table.

ShadeofBlue
Mar 17, 2011

suicidesteve posted:

Well if you're passing to the person who pack 1 pick 1s Arlinn it kinda makes sense to cut them off of RG.

Only if you are confident you can cut them so hard that they just abandon RG entirely. Otherwise you just wrecked your second pack on purpose, that's not how you win a draft.

Rinkles
Oct 24, 2010

What I'm getting at is...
Do you feel the same way?
Was it Zvi during Torment that almost got in trouble for publicly announcing he was forcing White (a weak color) before drafts, so he had a tshirt made or something for the PT?

Angry Grimace
Jul 29, 2010

ACTUALLY IT IS VERY GOOD THAT THE SHOW IS BAD AND ANYONE WHO DOESN'T REALIZE WHY THAT'S GOOD IS AN IDIOT. JUST ENJOY THE BAD SHOW INSTEAD OF THINKING.

ShadeofBlue posted:

Only if you are confident you can cut them so hard that they just abandon RG entirely. Otherwise you just wrecked your second pack on purpose, that's not how you win a draft.

Trying to jam a dude you might not even play seems like a bad draft strategy in general

JerryLee
Feb 4, 2005

THE RESERVED LIST! THE RESERVED LIST! I CANNOT SHUT UP ABOUT THE RESERVED LIST!

Rinkles posted:

Was it Zvi during Torment that almost got in trouble for publicly announcing he was forcing White (a weak color) before drafts, so he had a tshirt made or something for the PT?

I remember the T-shirt story. It was him and at least one teammate. The shirts had the art of Teroh's Faithful, and the caption "And all the drafters say I'm pretty fly for a White guy."

I didn't recall him actually getting in any trouble for it.

Shovelmint
Apr 22, 2004
Lipstick Apathy
The Zvi story:
http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=sideboard/ptnice02/dr1

TheKingofSprings
Oct 9, 2012

suicidesteve posted:

That's uh, not an issue at all? It's not Rebuild.

Unless you're Hurkyl'sing yourself in response to Shatterstorm or something I guess.

Whoops I thought it was symmetrical.

In that case it's a lot better but I don't know that Affinity's that bad of a matchup that they need it.

JerryLee
Feb 4, 2005

THE RESERVED LIST! THE RESERVED LIST! I CANNOT SHUT UP ABOUT THE RESERVED LIST!

I hadn't remembered that Zvi got griefed by PTR in the process. That's magical. :allears:

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clamiam45
Sep 10, 2005

HIGH FIVE! I'M GAY TOO!!!!!!
What's the point of not letting players show their picks?

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