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First Round - Match 4: Paul.Power vs Anticheese Shockingly, Advance Wars By Web has been stable for over a week now, which I consider a miracle considering the way it has been acting lately. One out of the three active games has finished as a result, and therefore I can finally update this LP again! In our fourth round, Paul.Power and Anticheese will face off to see who makes it up to the top 8 in this wonderful little tournament. Considering Paul.Power's experience with the franchise, Anticheese has quite a bit of work cut out for her, but perhaps she can show off some unexpected tactics to put Paul.Power out of the tournament early. This will also be the first update where Paul.Power's game won't be deleted by contrived coincidence. That being said, let's go over the map and COs once more:   ...Well this is unexpected: rarely do I ever see Jake in competitive Advance Wars play. As well, it seems we have the main protagonist of Dual Strike off against its main antagonist. We've been over Von Bolt in Endorph and JunpeiHyde's game, so let's look at Jake's stats:
So Jake has a tiny bit of Grit and Jess built into him, but as well a bit of Andy, in that he's pretty well-rounded in all situations. The firepower bonus that he gets on plains applies to all units which can move over plains, so even air units get that slight buff to their power when they're hovering over plains. The worst that Jake can be is an average 100/100 CO, like Andy. His CO power can turn Jake temporarily into Grit for a turn, and his Super CO Power can help towards heavy pushes on ground-heavy maps. The reason I'm not a huge fan of playing as Jake in my own games is because for all that Jake can do, other COs can do it better: both Max and Jess handle direct and vehicular combat better than Jake can, as they are not hindered by being limited to certain terrain for their bonuses. As well, the two of them have CO powers which grant movement boosts and firepower boosts which are similar to Jake's, but on all terrain. As for indirect combat units, Grit passively boosts his units' range, while Jake has to use his CO power to get that kind of range. That being said, Jake does have his strengths, in that his lack of specialization make him extremely flexible: in more open maps with lots of plains, he does better than Max or Jess would in some situations due to not being hindered in either indirect combat units or air units respectively. As well, considering Grit is banned from this tournament due to his indirect combat specialization making him nearly impossible to defeat at chokepoints, Jake can be a surprisingly effective CO at both creating walls and breaking walls in the mid-to-late game thanks to his CO powers. Now that I'm done going over Jake (for an oddly extensive period of time considering previous updates), let's get right into the game! Red Fire - End of Day 2  So the capture phase begins, and it snows at the beginning of Paul.Power's turn. More or less, all this really does is slow down the capture phase to a point where we might be waiting a turn extra to see some infantry reach a building. Paul.Power immediately beelines towards the seaport near his southwest base, and the factory near his southeast base. I consider the decision to not go for the airport right away to be smart: there isn't much you can do with an airport this early into the game. Something I should mention about this map is that the two seaports which are available to each player are boxed in by shores. That means that any unit build on top of it except for landers and black boats can't move off of it; they'll be boxed in with no way to move. Considering that all of the shores on this map are either next to cities or mountains, it's assumed that the map designer wanted players to use black boats to get their infantry to the comm. tower and nearby cities. The alternative to reaching those cities is via transport copter, or by having infantry built on the northwest and southeast bases to cross the mountains. The former of these methods wouldn't be the worst, but black boats can transport two infantry/mech units at a time, meaning it will be faster and more resourceful to use a black boat to get there. The latter of these methods isn't optimal, for it will take quite some time for those infantry to cross those mountains to get to those cities (especially in alternate weather conditions). Another use for black boats on this map is to repair any air units which have been damaged in the course of combat by retreating those air units to the black boat's location. Using the airport is another option, but I think it'd be better to build new air units off of them instead. Building a battleship to protect the bases is another option as well, if the spare funds are available! Blue Moon - End of Day 2  Seems that in the northwest, due to the incoming snow, Anticheese decided to use her infantry to capture the city to the north of her northeast base, rather than rush the port. A good move on her part; the funding is more important than waiting the extra turn at this point in the game. She also is beginning the capture of the leftmost factory on the north, meaning she will be able to build some extra units within the next turn. Blue Moon - End of Day 3  ...Until the unforgiving interface comes around and Anticheese makes a fatal mistake due to it: thinking that she had captured the factory already, she moved her infantry off of the factory she was capturing. It's not too much of a problem considering how early it is in the game, but the funding difference might become a problem later on down the line. She does make up for her mistake by building a recon. This might be a good disruption for Paul's capturing infantry. once it gets moving. Red Fire - End of Day 4  It rains. Paul also retaliates with his own recon. He also uses this turn to secure a funding advantage over Anticheese (6000 to 4000). Well, let's see what happens once these units start rolling in: Blue Moon - End of Day 5  Anticheese's unit deployment is kind of strange at this point in the game: I don't really understand building the APC at this point, as no units truly need any greater transportation. Maybe she's planning a stealth-HQ capture, but I can't see it happening with Paul's HQ being fortified with infantry units. Moving the recon up behind the infantry just one space out of Paul's firing range was smart; perhaps that will keep him from moving upwards. Red Fire - End of Day 6  The combat finally rolls in, with Paul.Power spilling first blood. Using his infantry, he brings down Anticheese's infantry on the road down to 4 HP, as well as (minimally) roughs up Anticheese's infantry on the city that she just captured. It seems as if Paul.Power isn't too concerned with the health of his recon, and his defenses on the west side of the map might be compromised thanks to it. He seems to be more concerned on issues in the east as of the moment. Perhaps it's because he knows he can deal with the small amount of units in the west later on without losing too much ground. A tank and a transport copter are built this turn; I assume Paul's going for that comm. tower on the southeast corner of the map. Red Fire - End of Day 7  After Anticheese attacked Paul's recon in retaliation on her last turn, Paul retreats it and proceeds to build another tank on the left side. It seems as if I was right in predicting that he wouldn't just let the west side of the map go. The push on the right side is going good as well: with the tank pressuring Anticheese's units, her entire right side is boxed in as of the moment, with her key units being in attack range of Paul's tank. Blue Moon - End of Day 7  Anticheese decides to not be daunted on either front: she unloads her infantry onto a neutral city on the far east of the map near Paul's tank, and moves her recon right next to Paul's infantry...but doesn't fire for some reason. I'm going to chalk that one up to AWBW's interface. She also builds a battle copter, which will probably push her out of that corner later into the match. On the western front, it seems as if Paul's recon is about to fall to Anticheese's. Paul is probably going to punish that move next turn with his tank. Red Fire - End of Day 8  Yep. It seems whatever Anticheese builds to try and get her back into the game, Paul has a direct answer to it: Recons? Tanks. Battle copters? Anti-air. Infantry? More infantry. At this point in the game, Paul has 14000 funds to Anticheese's 9000, meaning that Anticheese is now fighting a war of attrition to see if she can stay alive long enough to regain that property advantage. Red Fire - End of Day 10  With the way that Paul has positioned his units, he's essentially pushed Anticheese back into a wall. His anti-air sunk the first battle copter Anticheese built, while his tank did quite a number on Anticheese's recon. What I don't understand from Anticheese is why she built a second battle copter in the northeastern front rather than try and push back with a tank or two. Perhaps she had more fear of the tanks than the anti-air at this point and wanted to have something to attack those tanks without retaliation. Regardless, things aren't looking good for Anticheese. Paul's infantry on the west side is getting dangerously close to that HQ of hers as well. Blue Moon - End of Day 10  Anticheese builds two mech on all 3 of her bases. This is actually a pretty smart move considering the positon she's in: by using that smaller amount of funding, anticheese can fight back against the anti-air and tanks coming in on the northeastern side, while preventing an HQ capture on the northwest side as well as having something extra to back up her b-copter coming in to save her. Paul will have probably one more turn of pushing in before Anticheese can retaliate seriously. Red Fire - End of Day 11  Paul's going in for the kill with an HQ capture. Knowing that Anticheese only has the one mech to protect her HQ, he backs it up his infantry with his tank. The other infantry which is just to the south of the one capturing Anticheese's HQ can also join with Paul's infantry if it gets too damaged to complete the capture. Red Fire - End of Day 12  Anticheese opts to attack the tank instead of the capturing infantry. Paul.Power wins the game by HQ capture. We didn't really get to see very much out of the COs and their abilities this time around, due to the map being laid out the way it was, and the COs being pretty average for the most part, so it was simple unit-versus-unit tactics. This match teaches quite a bit about unit deployment and unit placement, and how it's important in order to select your units carefully and placing them in decent positions as to ensure that you can create a decent defense as well as a good offense. That being said, four more matches are left in the first round, and two are currently ongoing. Who will face off against Paul.Power and Doctor Reynolds in the semifinals? Stay tuned for the next update! Slur fucked around with this message at 23:37 on Apr 4, 2016 |
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Apr 4, 2016 20:58
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Oh neat, the last AWBW game I played was on that map, but in FoW. Unsurprisingly it played out very differently. I imagine that given how close the factories are to the opposing HQs that short games are a given.
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Apr 5, 2016 19:04
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So, considering Trasson has been away for a total of 20 days due to being busy, Cake Attack will be taking Trasson's place in the tournament. The map that Cake Attack and TheMcD will be playing on is this one (as to not give TheMcD the same map a third time). I should also mention there's chat going on about the tournament at irc.synirc.net #awgoons. Enjoy.
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Apr 6, 2016 21:25
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Game's up. Pass is "goons". Third time's the charm?
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Apr 6, 2016 21:42
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I joined. Let's see if you can face up to the pro strat that got me through every Advance Wars I played - Build bombers, attack with bombers
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Apr 6, 2016 23:53
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Oh man, Andy vs. Olaf, it's an Operation Dunderhead throwdown.
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Apr 6, 2016 23:57
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My game will be over as soon as my opponent takes a turn.
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Apr 7, 2016 03:26
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Yeah, sorry, I should have checked more often. It looks like we averaged one day per day though, so that's not too terrible. I've played in worse.
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Apr 7, 2016 05:55
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Slur posted:
 . Other COs I thought about playing as include Max and Lash: Max because I still probably haven't come down off the high that is AW1 Max yet, and the fairly open terrain suits his style. Meanwhile Lash (AW2 and AWBW Lash, at least) is one of the stronger not-officially-broken COs, whose only real weaknesses are an average air game and a lackluster regular COP (and as the demo game showed, with most COs the SCOP is where it's really at) I went with Jake over Lash because his air units also get the plains bonus (not that my B copter ended up seeing any action). Either way, Jake vs. Von Bolt certainly led to a fun AWDS-themed matchup.e: Snow and rain played a fairly big part in the battle - a few times I found myself cursing infantry's complete inability to move through mountains in snow. At the same time though, I tried to use the weather to my advantage if I got it first and knew that Anticheese would have to sit through a turn of it after me - e.g. her recons struggling to get away from her bases on snow and rain days. One extra bit of advice I'd give Anticheese is that sometimes Flak has good ideas: tanks are powerful, and they do move far. They can't win a battle on their own, but they play an important role in almost any army, and because Anticheese had no tanks of her own, I had the run of the field with mine. Paul.Power fucked around with this message at 13:13 on Apr 7, 2016 |
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Apr 7, 2016 12:16
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Paul.Power posted:Hey, he was your suggestion I honestly thought you were going to go with Max or Jess. That being said, I'll update the LP sometime today or tomorrow with Keiya and Gnoman's game.
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Apr 7, 2016 14:06
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First Round - Match 5: Keiya vs Gnoman Well, we're finally done the first half of the first round after all this time, and I have to say that when I think about it, things have been going along faster than I expected them to, even though it feels longer in my head: 5 out of the 8 games in the first round are completed, we're only 3 months into the LP, and we've had some pretty interesting matches so far which have had a range of playstyles. This time, we're going to be seeing who faces off against Paul.Power in the semifinals: Keiya or Gnoman. As per tradition, let's take a look at the map and the COs:   I actually wish to talk about the map first this time and say that this map has a lot going on: there's quite a few properties for each player to capture in the center of the map, all of them haphazardly spread apart from one another as to not focus the attention of either player towards any one particular section of the map. Despite the map looking open, however, there are quite a few sets of woods here and there, which makes it ideal to create chokepoints from due to the terrain penalties woods tend to have. The HQs are a bit closer to the center of the map, and with each player's bases starting on the east and west side corners, they're going to have quite a trek getting to either HQ. The CO diversity continues to surprise me in this tournament: Lash is a common choice among people I tend to play Advance Wars with, but Adder comes as a surprising choice for Gnoman. Let's go over his stats quickly to understand how Adder works:
...Pretty basic, isn't he? However, if you take a look at the image above, you can see that his CO bar is extremely short: 2 bars for a CO power, and 3 more for a Super CO Power. This means that despite Adder's basic stats, he has quite a bit of utility which can be brought forth at nearly every other turn in the mid-to-late game due to the speed at which he can unleash his CO powers. Though a movement bonus may not seem like much (especially since certain other COs get that and more from their CO powers), Adder's CO power can help him break through annoying stalemate situations in where units are defending important positions from just one space outside of Adder's attack range by constantly threatening those units with the potential of a sideslip/sidewinder being activated. Furthermore, sideslip/sidewinder can be used in order to bring a unit into which was just attacked in the previous turn, thus granting it safety without the need of another unit to wall for it. These are only some of the utilities that Adder can grant, but are probably two of the more viable tactics I've found when playing as him. The biggest flaws Adder has is that he doesn't have any offense behind his CO power to back up any heavy assaults that he may make. As well, his day-to-day being 100/100 in all situations may hurt him against more specialized COs like Max. If a player is well-fortified within a defensive position, Adder might have a tough time cutting through that defense and making a push into enemy territory: a movement bonus won't exactly help cut through a wall of tanks and rockets knocking at Adder's doorstep. Thus, Adder is better on smaller maps with less deployment, as cornering enemies is much easier to do on those kinds of maps. That being said, let's move on into the game! Pink Cosmos - End of Day 1  Gnoman makes a strange move by deciding to march his infantry upwards, away from all of the cities that are within the potential range of his infantry. As well, he refuses to build another infantry from his initial base. I wonder what was going on there: is he trying to go for something in the central areas first? Is there anything that the extra 1000G he just saved will give him? Hmm... Pink Cosmos - End of Day 2  Ah, it was an error it seems. Perhaps Gnoman thought he could cross the river over to the city with his infantry and positioned his infantry incorrectly as a result. Regardless, both players seem to be concentrated towards the central properties on their respective sides of the map. Pink Cosmos - End of Day 3  Gnoman already decides to bring out a recon to start some infantry harrassment. An interesting move so early into the game, but perhaps this can disrupt Keiya and make her start looking towards other units. It will delay Keiya's capture, if nothing else. Purple Lightning - End of Day 5  That is, until Keiya decides to build a tank on her turn. If Gnoman tries to roll in with the one recon he built any further, Keiya's tank will probably greet Gnoman's recon with a nice welcoming gift of gunpowder and shrapnel. This is half the reason I really don't like utilizing recon harrassment tactics, with the sole exception of Fog of War situations: recons lack diversity in their choice of targets, and a simple 3000G is the difference between a unit which only has one purpose and one which drives the very force of ground-based combat. Furthermore, for as many infantry as a player may be able to damage, the point of recon harrassment is to ensure that you can maintain a property advantage on your front, and continue to maintain that property advantage until you can overwhelm your opponent by sheer resources. By the time that recon would have been able to get up there, Keiya could have focused her attention to other properties which are on the map that are more important or readily available, without sacrificing the advantage to Gnoman. That being said, Gnoman did build another recon on the right side of the map on his previous turn, and if he plays defensively, he might be able to hold off any incoming infantry on that side for the time being. Pink Cosmos - End of Day 7  Moving forward two turns, we have our first bit of combat in the game, where Gnoman decides to push forward with his recon on the west side and use it to harass Keiya's infantry. It's going to be the sacrifice of his recon within the next turn, sadly, but I assume that Gnoman wished to accomplish something here, at the least. As well, Gnoman has brought out a battle copter in the last turn and is sending it northbound to take care of the tank that Keiya built. Gnoman is a bit behind in properties since he insisted on the assault to begin with, but with the unit advantage he has currently, he might be able to push forward and get himself back on even footing with a few more properties captured. Keiya has built an APC on the last turn, while her infantry are just finishing on painting the entire northern cities purple. At this point, Keiya has a significant 3 property advantage, and can start building more offensive units without detriment. Purple Lightning - End of Day 8  At this point, Keiya has nearly double the property advantage that Gnoman has, with 16 properties to Gnoman's 9. The next offensive unit Keiya decides to build is a b-copter on the newly captured airport that she grabbed on the east side of the map, which will impede any advance that Gnoman's recon will have on the right side of the map. On the west side of the map, it seems as if the APC is going after the properties which Keiya's infantry can't quite reach as of yet. I predict that she's going to probably move her APC over to the Comm. Tower on the west side, and try and gain an attack advantage through that. She doesn't seem that concerned with the b-copter coming in from the middle from Gnoman's side, though. Purple Lightning - End of Day 9  Keiya's defense and offenses become more fortified on this turn. As expected, the Comm. towers now become priority as combat becomes a bit more prominent within the game state. An anti-air is also built on Keiya's western base to combat Gnoman's b-copter in the center of the stage, and it might even mow down a few infantry which get in its way. With superior numbers and superior offenses, Gnoman might have to reconsider his strategy. Pink Cosmos - End of Day 9  ...Something's confusing me here: if you observe the last screenshot and compare it to this one, I don't understand why Gnoman didn't immediately move his infantry on his westmost city to try and capture the airport above him. The southernmost tank that Keiya controls could have attacked Gnoman's infantry regardless of whether he captured the airport or the city, and that airport might be needed to fortify his defenses for Keiya's oncoming assault. Regardless, Keiya's eastmost battle copter is being threatened by Gnoman's anti-air. Using his b-copter and recon, he takes out Keiya's capturing infantry on the neutral city which is adjacent to them. Sadly, this is a bit of an error: Keiya's newly built b-copter on the northmost airport is in range of attacking either of them now. Gnoman ends the turn with building rockets on his westmost base, which I can only think he uses to threaten that tank which might prevent a future airport capture. Purple Lightning - End of Day 10  Keiya uses her b-copter and infantry to take down Gnoman's b-copter which overextended, leaving only Gnoman's recon left on the frontlines. Keiya also backed up her b-copter on the eastern side of the map away from Gnoman's anti-air unit, but not by enough spaces; Gnoman could easily opt to throw his anti-air northbound and destroy Keiya's b-copter next turn. More captures take place this turn as well. Keiya controls a total of 20 properties to Gnoman's 13, meaning Gnoman will have to find some way to regain the advantage and fast. Thankfully there are a group of neutral properties near his base. Pink Cosmos - End of Day 10  Gnoman proceeds to capture a whopping total of 4 properties this turn, leaving him 3 behind Keiya. However, what bugs me about this turn is that Gnoman ignored south-central base that his infantry was in range of capturing. As well, Gnoman opts to destroy an infantry instead of the b-copter within his range as well. With an army of b-copters and tanks closing in, as well as Keiya building stronger units, Gnoman is going to have a difficult time making a comeback at this point. Purple Lightning - End of Day 12  ...Quite a bit of change happened this turn, but Gnoman gave up his capture of the airport, and his rockets were slightly damaged by the incoming tank. Gnoman damaged it with his own tank, which caused Keiya to retreat it and stop her assault on Gnoman's rockets. However, there's a more pressing issue at hand which Gnoman can't stop: his HQ is under siege, and is about to be captured within the next 2 turns, and there is little to nothing that Gnoman can do about it. Gnoman's assault consists of an artillery, a rocket, and 2 tanks, as well as a few infantry, while Keiya has a significantly more offensive units than that. This spells the end for Gnoman. Purple Lightning - End of Day 14  It is now day 14. Keiya captures Gnoman's HQ, ending the game. I think Gnoman could have held off his assault a little longer to capture some more properties on his side of the map, as well as prioritize his attack a little better on Keiya's front. For whatever reason, Gnoman decided that his central base and his westernmost airport weren't of any importance, as well as some nearby neutral cities. With the funding advantage as well as the lack of unit deployment in those areas, this match was made significantly easier for Keiya as a result. Keiya moves onto the quarterfinals as a result. Considering that the only game left active now is TheMcD versus Slur fucked around with this message at 22:13 on Apr 7, 2016 |
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Apr 7, 2016 20:41
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There's a very simple reason I like playing Lash.
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Apr 7, 2016 22:07
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it will be a thousand years before you can beat me goons edit: oh no, sensei didn't get nixed. Well, don't pick him.
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Apr 7, 2016 22:40
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Let's see if SuccessfulStudent can become SuccessfulGeneral. detemmienation
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Apr 8, 2016 01:11
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This map might literally be 50% roads and yet neither of us picked Koal.
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Apr 8, 2016 02:00
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This is the crazed ramblings of someone who should be asleep, but oh my goodness, capture all your bases as soon as possible, you're missing out on an extra infantry every turn.
Paul.Power fucked around with this message at 02:47 on Apr 8, 2016 |
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Apr 8, 2016 02:40
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Basically, I thought it would be worthwhile to sacrifice a few captures early by giving up initial control of some of the easy to reach properties (which I could snap up at leisure) in an attempt to deny control of the center properties. Problem is that, by the time I did so my opponent had enough cash to counter, and I doubled down on it instead of giving up. I never captured the extra factory or airport because I didn't think they'd be useful, as I didn't have the cash to use them.
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Apr 9, 2016 09:00
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It's hard to beat an extra infantry when you want value for your money.
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Apr 9, 2016 11:47
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Apr 9, 2016 13:24
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In under 24 hours, you two managed to complete your game, and I can't thank you guys enough for the speed in which you two took your turns. I was watching it partially in real-time when I had the opportunity or wasn't doing anything between my work schedule. I think that game was my fave of the first round. Commentary will be done within the week. Slur fucked around with this message at 19:30 on Apr 9, 2016 |
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Apr 9, 2016 19:26
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I pick my COs for very similar reasons. There was a long time back when I played AWBW more often of me trying to make Jake happen.
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Apr 13, 2016 04:40
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The weather game is strong in my current game. Here I was laughing at Cake Attack getting hit with snow twice during the early phase, but now I've gotten my plans completely hosed over by some surprise rain.
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Apr 13, 2016 16:15
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As soon as I got every last little chore out of the way for the week, I check the site and it's ridden with SQL errors again. I'm kind of not the best for luck when it comes to this LP.
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Apr 16, 2016 02:30
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So, just came to post about the state of the website: apparently the servers are going to be moved in 2 days over to the new hosting. The new hosting where replays don't work. So, this LP might be done for if Amarriner doesn't fix those up on the new site before the migration happens.
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Apr 18, 2016 18:02
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Slur posted:So, just came to post about the state of the website: apparently the servers are going to be moved in 2 days over to the new hosting. I'll never get to finish a game. 
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Apr 18, 2016 19:47
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man this free site is hot garbage, smh
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Apr 18, 2016 19:58
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Well, the good news is that I contacted Amarriner: he's got the replays working again. Let's just hope it all works post-migration
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Apr 19, 2016 19:13
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First Round - Match 6: GameroftheGame vs Monk E - Part 1 I have to give credit to both these players and say that they finished their game in under 48 hours, with moves going back and forth like lightning between the players. It was also one of the games I was consistently pressing F5 on because the match was as entertaining as it was: most of the time I didn't know who was going to win. That being said, Map and CO analysis time!   So this map is full of roads, roads, and more roads. That means there's probably not going to be a lot of indirect combat fights, and weather isn't going to affect either player all that much. There's four airports in total, but I want to focus on two on the northeast and southwest corners respectively: it seems like there is no way that those airports can be reached, but upon closer inspection...  The areas where I highlighted red aren't ocean tiles at all, but rather rivers which can be walked across by infantry over to the airports on the corners of the map. Of course, in the actual Advance Wars games, you could not build rivers like this because the game wouldn't let you. Such is the beauty of Advance Wars By Web. The CO choices this time are different from what we've seen thus far: GameroftheGame chose Kindle, while Monk E chose Sasha. Let's do a quick analysis of them both. Kindle:
Sasha:
So there's quite a bit going on here. Let's begin with Sasha. I don't like Sasha. I don't like Sasha because most of the matches that I end out facing against her end out becoming about how bland the match can become when Sasha is in the early-to-mid game. Market Crash essentially turns the battles with Sasha into matches which only rely on day-to-day abilities, with absolutely no push happening between either player due to the lack of CO powers breaking any form of stalemate. This is especially noticable in free-for-all games with more than 2 players, but where Sasha is most deadly is in her home game of Dual Strike, as well as 2v2 matches: while Sasha can consistently spam market crash, her partnering CO can continue to build his/her power until the second player can make a significant push. In matches where the grounds are even between the players, Sasha also has the benefit of having greater funding than her opponent. This puts Sasha in a position where she can use her superior funding to nudge in with the extra tank or medium tank she can build over her opponent in a given turn. The small little advantages that Sasha can gain over her opponent can end out turning the tide in her favor, and especially so against CO-power reliant COs like Olaf, Andy, Von Bolt and Eagle. Where Sasha's biggest weakness lies is against COs which grant heavy day-to-day bonuses, like Max, Grimm, or Sami: their superior firepower will eventually match out against, or even topple over Sasha's slight funding advantage. Sami is especially a good counter against Sasha in the early-game, as Sami's property advantage can get her back on par with Sasha rather quickly. Sasha's other big weakness is during the late-game. CO powers cost more to use every time that you use them, and after a few Market Crashes are activated, eventually she evens out with the other COs in terms of how fast her meter charges. If a good Olaf or Andy player holds out long enough, they'll be able to use their CO powers freely again, and use them to break any stalemates that Sasha may be causing. That all being said, Sasha is definitely a threat in the early to mid game, and if her player manages to keep the match even or to her advantage during this time, she can become a rather huge threat in the late game with her superior numbers. Kindle is a bit easier to talk about : properties are important. Kindle is good on properties. Kindle is a good CO as a result. She gains a whopping bonus of 40% extra attack power passively on properties, meaning that she can contend with most COs in the early game for important properties rather easily. Urban Blight is one of the best vanilla CO powers in the game, doing 3 damage to any enemy units that are standing on any property. If your opponent just built something big, you can blight them and cost them a ton of funds in the next turn. If your opponent is trying to capture an important property, you can blight them and prevent the capture for another turn. If your opponent is trying to heal a damaged unit, you can blight them and watch their unit become vulnerable enough for the kill. High Society can also be used to push during the late-game against walls of enemy units, or just to tell units to get the hell away from your infantry/mechs on your properties (though this rarely ever happens). Kindle has few weaknesses in competitive play. The worst that she can become is a vanilla 100/100 CO. In smaller maps or maps with fewer properties, Kindle will flounder. As well, she isn't the greatest comeback CO either: if your opponent has seized a majority of the properties on the map, and Kindle is being overwhelmed, then Kindle will most definitely lose due to a lack of way to push through heavier walls on normal terrain. Beyond that, if Kindle can keep in control of the map, then she's extremely difficult to come back from. That being said, it's game time. Cobalt Ice - End of Day 4  The capture phase is probably going to take longer for this game than the others, because I deliberately set up the two contestants on a slightly larger map than the ones that have been seen before it. It's also has a few more properties than the other few maps. That being said, the first units which were built that weren't infantry on both player's sides were APCs. I assume they wish to use them to beeline towards the airports on their respective sides of the map, as to gain an aerial advantage when it becomes possible to do so. That, or they can use them to get to the more centralized properties a little bit quicker. Each player is handling the capture phase differently: GameroftheGame seems to be doing a direct beeline towards the bases, while Monk E is taking his time and capturing a few properties along the way. At this point in the game, Monk E has a 7-6 property advantage over GameroftheGame, but considering that Monk E is playing Sasha, that means he gets 700G more during each turn. This might give him a bit of an edge going forward. Cobalt Ice - End of Day 5  The extra funding allows Monk E to push forward with a tank when his turn begins, as well as a few more infantry. Holding 11 properties, a tank is easily affordable without it being considered overextending for this point in the game for Monk E. It will also allow him to secure the properties in the middle without having to worry about GameroftheGame's APC crossing into territory that is important. If Monk E plays this right, he could secure himself via superior numbers. Cobalt Ice - End of Day 6  Despite two tanks rolling right into his territory, it doesn't seem as if GameroftheGame is too daunted at this point. He continues to build infantry and tread slowly along his own area so that he can secure a few extra properties, not really preapring for Monk E's oncoming assault. GameroftheGame might get disrupted rather soon. Jade Sun - End of Day 7  It seems as if he won't make it that easy. GameroftheGame retaliates strong on this turn: spending 14000 of his funds, he builds a total of two tanks at the end of his turn, showing that he's not just going to let up to Monk E as easily as he let on a turn ago. Considering that one of the tanks that Monk E deployed is as close as it is to the center line, the position won't go completely unopposed after all. Cobalt Ice - End of Day 7  Monk E proceeds to care less as he walks in with his tank and proceeds to strike down GameroftheGame's capturing infantry. I wouldn't exactly consider this a smart move: GameroftheGame can march up with his tank next turn and retaliate with full force, giving Monk E a rather grievous smackdown with his tank. Of course, Monk E has another tank to back up that tank, but generally the tradeoff won't be worth it in the long run, as GameroftheGame can can reinforce the line rather easily considering his base is as close as it is. An anti-air was built on Monk E's southwestern base as well. I assume he wishes to use it as an infantry-bulldozer later, or he's pre-empting an air assault soon enough. Jade Sun - End of Day 8  GameroftheGame makes his intentions perfectly clear at this point: his APC as well as his capturing infantry move south, beelining right for the HQ. As well, just as expected, GameroftheGame retaliates in the best ways that he could this turn: -Moving the capturing infantry off of the city was a viable move at this point in the game. Considering that Kindle gains a 40% passive attack boost upon cities, it was the ideal place to retaliate against Monk E's tank from. -Moving the infantry south of the tank ensures that when Monk E attacks with his full HP tank to the 9 HP tank that GameroftheGame has deployed on the city, it will gain no terrain defensive bonuses, meaning that counterattack damage will be maximized, as the full HP tank that Monk E controls will only be able to attack that tank from the road. -Monk E's focus will be switched from the offensive to the defensive, as the HQ is now clearly under siege. Cobalt Ice - End of Day 8  Monk E reacted probably as GameroftheGame wanted to, but his moves weren't exactly unintelligent either: he focuses his assault not on the tank which was ruining his tank, but rather to the APC and the infantry which were closing in on his HQ. I'm not sure if this is exactly the move I would have performed, for a multitude of reasons. The first of those reasons is because the anti-air is moving up and providing enough of a defense for the HQ anyways. The second reason is because the biggest offensive threat to the HQ right now is that 9 HP tank, as it can pave the way for the HQ capture at hand. The third reason is because there's more than enough time to prevent an HQ capture in full, especially with the amount of surrounding assault-based units around the HQ. Monk E might pay for it in a bit of his defensive wall being chopped down. There's a battle copter deployed on Monk E's airport. Not a bad move; GameroftheGame doesn't have any anti-air deployed yet, but at this point in the game, GameroftheGame could deploy one with little repercussion. If the airport were a little closer, maybe I would have liked that move more. Jade Sun - End of Day 9  GameroftheGame proceeds to be one of the most amusing players in this thread so far, for how little of a drat he actually gives and his extreme lack of subtlety in his playstyle. On the western front, GameroftheGame throws his full HP tank in front of an infantry and hits it down to 2 HP, not caring that a battle copter can just waste his tank within the next turn. As well, he drops his infantry loaded onto his APC on top of Monk E's HQ, surrounding it with other units for defensive cover. This assault can be stopped, but Monk E will have to devote resources to it. The tank on the west front is an interesting move: if Monk E attacks it, it means that it will take less time for his battle copter to come in and save Monk E around his HQ. This is what I assume GameroftheGame wanted (unless he just felt like being a jerk to that penguin-like infantry). As well, he has Monk E thinking about his HQ, rather than GameroftheGame's capturing units in the northern front. Despite the funding advantage Monk E has, GameroftheGame has the advantage on the board right now in terms of unit deployment and tactical positions. Cobalt Ice - End of Day 9  Strange. Monk E moves his anti-air to the east instead of upwards to take care of those infantry. He's probably aiming to get towards GameroftheGame's b-copter and take it out before it can move in with the main force. Plus, with the amount of tanks that are surrounding Monk E's HQ, he still has a good turn to prevent the capture. Those units which are defending the capturing infantry are about to die anyways. If that HQ capture does fail, then GameroftheGame will be forced to deal with a 7100G (!!!) advantage and a multitude of units at his front doorstep. Monk E also finished seizing the southeastern comm. tower. With 110/100 units, Monk E could roll in with ease and settle in with superior power and number. Also he built a T-copter and an artillery. I wonder what those are going to be used for... With so much being said in this update, I believe that this match is going to be the first two-parter in our tournament! Will Monk E stop the HQ capture? Will GameroftheGame succeed with his aggressive tactics? Will the funding advantage matter at the end of the day? Find out, in the next part of this LP! Slur fucked around with this message at 05:16 on Apr 20, 2016 |
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Apr 20, 2016 05:13
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The answer to re:b-copter is probably because I didn't notice it. I tended to not notice one there a fair bit on that far side of the map, though I recall a lot of unmoved choppers on Monk's end so it was probably mutual.
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Apr 20, 2016 05:26
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First Round - Match 6: GameroftheGame vs Monk E - Part 2 We're back! In the last part, Monk E was dealing with GameroftheGame's HQ assault and playing rather defensively, but he's been turning it around and taking a good portion of the west side of the map. As well, we were left with Monk E's 7100G funding advantage dominating over GameroftheGame. However, GameroftheGame has quite an aggressive strategy which pushed Monk E on the ropes and even did away with most of Monk E's defensive line. What will happen this time? Let's continue from where we left off! Cobalt Ice - End of Day 10  Well, I skipped ahead of GameroftheGame's turn as he was mainly consolidating his troops towards the center of the map. However, Monk E has made quite the comeback here: he brought down GameroftheGame's HQ capturing infantry down to 1 HP, and has made quite a bit of progress securing the western side of the map. The tank that GameroftheGame was using as a distraction is down, and Monk E is beginning his capture on GameroftheGame's properties. Monk E is fortifying his defenses in the south. I'd comment on the snow, but considering that half the map is roads, it doesn't matter all that much. Jade Sun - End of Day 11  It took me some time to consider if this was a misplay or not, but at the end of the day, it was a viable option: if you take a look at the end of Monk E's turn last turn, GameroftheGame could have used his tank which was in range to punish Monk E's anti-air, paving the way forward for GameroftheGame's b-copter. I figure that pushing it to the center was probably the better choice in the long run. That being said as well, GameroftheGame is continuing to brutally push for that HQ there, showing no signs of pulling back his units or trying to form any defense whatsoever on any front. Tanks continue to be pushed from the central-north factory, and Monk E's other units don't seem to bother him at this point. He's finally getting around to capturing the northwest comm. tower as well. This might give him just the offensive push he needs to get back at Monk E. I have to give GameroftheGame credit here: if I were him, I'd be turtling like mad in the northwest corner here and probably losing my central front to Monk E. Jade Sun - End of Day 12  Wait, how did that battle copter in the west get down to---  Oh yeah. I forgot that this was a thing. So it seems as if the first CO power was activated this round, and it just so happened to be Kindle's Urban Blight. Perhaps Monk E didn't really see that as much of a threat as to Market Crash against, but it did a fair amount of damage, anyways. In the previous turn, you can see that Monk E has created a huge wall of infantry right around his HQ, and is backing it up with his artillery. GameroftheGame seems adamant on pushing through it. Without a lot of forces to replace the broken pieces of that wall, I don't think that Monk E is going to be able to hold out much longer in the southern front, especially with no offensive units backing up the defense except the artillery. That being said, GameroftheGame left his westmost B-copter exposed to A-air fire. That might hurt him next turn. Cobalt Ice - End of Day 12  And it does. Monk E pushes his leftmost forces towards the center. In the process, GameroftheGame loses a b-copter, and (despite it never being able to succeed) one of his infantry is now within range of GameroftheGame's HQ. More b-copters are coming in from the west, and it seems as if GameroftheGame is being choked in. Cobalt Ice - End of Day 13  One SCOP later and here's the results. War Bonds isn't that great offensively, really. War Bonds isn't that great at all, really. It sure as heck pushed GameroftheGame out of HQ territory though, and Monk E now has the advantage on both unit deployment and funding. Jade Sun - End of Day 14  Urban Blight does wonders, really: GameroftheGame is pushing back and doing quite a bit of damage to Monk E's units without engaging in any actual real combat with them, taking away from Monk E's funds whenever he does build something. As well, it puts GameroftheGame in a position to severely weaken or destroy units he wouldn't have been able to otherwise, leading back to this situation where he's pushing back against Monk E's forces. Also, a medium tank was built in the north-central base that GameroftheGame controls. Seems as if bigger guns are being brought out for the endgame. Jade Sun - End of Day 15  Cobalt Ice - End of Day 15  It seems whenever GameroftheGame breaks through some of Monk E's forces, Monk E just keeps replacing them and walling GameroftheGame right off from his objective. Every tank is replaced with another. Every infantry is replaced with another. However, Monk E did just lose a b-copter this turn, and considering that Monk E was relying on that b-copter to do a lot of the forward assault, this might end out causing some hurt in the long run for Monk E's forces. going forward. Especially since that medium tank is rolling around. Jade Sun - End of Day 17  So I skipped a bit further ahead here, and the back and forth is beginning to slow down a lot. Monk E's forces in the center are nearly eradicated by sheer attrition on GameroftheGame's part. With only an anti-air and a nearly-dead tank covering the center, GameroftheGame can proceed to do what he initially sent out to do and capture the HQ. Also a third Urban Blight was activated this turn. C'mon Monk E, use that Market Crash already! Jade Sun - Day 19  Well, the HQ capture begins again on this turn, and it's also snowing something fierce. Monk E's forces in the north are being eradicated one by one, and a fourth Urban Blight was activated. Monk E has lost a lot of his forces by splitting them up and sending them off to different areas on the map, leading to GameroftheGame picking them off one by one. Notably, a few b-copters were shot down from the sky by some newly built anti-air, and Monk E didn't account for them. Jade Sun - End of Day 21  Eventually the push got to this point. In the last 2 turns that occurred, GameroftheGame moved his forces forward and made an impenetrable wall around the infantry capturing Monk E's HQ. Well, not exactly "impenetrable" as much as "impenetrable with Monk E's current setup". You know where this is going to lead to... Jade Sun - End of Day 22  Bang. A lot of this game can come down to understanding unit placement once more, but the biggest mistake that Monk E made was not utilizing Market Crash. Getting hit by a consistent number of Urban Blights weakened the potential for Monk E to put out some heavier units in the frontline. As well, Monk E placed all of his units so haphazardly towards the end leading to GameroftheGame being able to easily pick off stray units which just so happened to stand in the way of his forward (and extremely aggressive) march on the HQ. Despite having the funding advantage for the entire game, Monk E eventually lost the unit advantage, leading to GameroftheGame's win. Whew! This has been the longest update of the LP yet! The first round is almost over, and the Amarriner is changing the hosting to the new site quite soon. Hopefully this LP will be allowed to continue after that, and I won't run into any more technical difficulties with the site. In the next part, let's see how things play out between our last four contestants of the first round! See you then! Slur fucked around with this message at 00:32 on Apr 21, 2016 |
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Apr 21, 2016 00:30
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Cool map.
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Apr 21, 2016 01:34
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Looking back I feel like I really underestimated Kindle I never actually considered devoting meter to block her CO powers and I didn't quite grasp just how disadvantageous trying to attack a property boosted unit with huge damage buffs was until really late in the game.
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Apr 21, 2016 02:43
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Looks like the site has moved successfully, and now e-mail notifications work for me! Hooray!
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Apr 22, 2016 15:36
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me right now:
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Apr 22, 2016 15:39
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there's no way im winning but you'll need to pry victory from cold dead hands
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Apr 22, 2016 17:47
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Victory status: Pried from cold dead hands. Also, I'm pretty sure the replay didn't save for all the moves we made since the server move, which was like half the game. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_-GaXa8tSBE
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Apr 22, 2016 18:28
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Make a crude MS paint representation.
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Apr 22, 2016 18:53
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Well you two, your replay only goes up to day 11. Time to e-mail Amarriner! In the meantime, if you guys wanna hang out, we still have a chat channel at irc.synirc.net #awgoons EDIT: Amarriner claims he won't be able to fix anything for the next few days. So, guess I'm waiting. Slur fucked around with this message at 06:03 on Apr 23, 2016 |
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Apr 22, 2016 18:53
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First Round - Match 7: Zemyla vs SuccessfulStudent Since the last update, Amarriner finally switched the servers for Advance Wars By Web, going to some cheaper hosting. Ever since switching to the new hosting, there hasn't been a single SQL error show up on the site. This means that it's time for another update! This time, Zemyla and SuccessfulStudent will face each other to see who gets sent over to the next round. Let's take a look at the map and their CO choices once more:   ...Oh boy. So the map is kind of neat in its own little way: there's a lot of defensive cover between the roads, making it ideal for indirect combat units to position themselves behind the mountains and various other terrain to get into some various defensive positions and guard off portions of the road leading right through the middle of the map. A variety of properties allows for bigger units to be built at a later part of the game, so we might be seeing some bombers or medium tanks if we're lucky. There are two black boats guarding off two ports on either side, meaning that the opposing player is going to have to get rid of that before gaining any form of naval transport or battleships on the playing field. As far as COs go, we have a mirror match of Hawke vs. Hawke. Might as well go over his stats real quickly:
In my time playing Advance Wars By Web with other goons, Hawke has been one of Something Awful's favourite COs, due to how universally good he is on mid-to-large size maps. He's also one of Something Awful's least favourite COs, with some calling him the most boring character in the game (they're wrong; it's Sasha). The universal 10% attack boost allows Hawke in order to chip off a small bit of extra damage that other COs wouldn't be able to do upon normal attacks, generally giving him an advantage in situations where he is able to strike first. However, another advantage to Hawke is that he tends to hold chokepoints rather well due to the small bits of extra counterattack damage he'll get off on some units. Hawke's CO powers take advantage of this bonus as well: damaged units lose defense as well as offense, and a well-timed black wave or black storm can set up Hawke to break through important chokepoints or bigger enemy units in an instant. Also, like most damage-based CO powers, Hawke can use them to prevent enemies from capturing important properties for another turn. Hawke is by no means invincible though, or generally "better" than any other CO due to his universal bonuses: having the third-largest CO meter in the game, his CO powers take a much longer time to charge than most other COs are able to. Because of this, it takes a lot of time for Hawke to really be able to push against tighter chokepoints and more defensive COs. The most notable hard-counter to Hawke is Andy, who can shrug off any damage that his CO powers do with Hyper Repair. The Hawke mirror match will be pretty vanilla in this regard as well, as one black wave can be countered by another. So, let's see how this game plays out: Brown Desert - End of Day 3  We're still in the capture phase here, but I thought I might as well bring up two interesting points in regards to these opening moves: the first being that SuccessfulStudent moved his black boat off of the port that it was initially docked on. If Zemyla decides to rush that port, he may be able to capture it, but wisely he chooses not to: instead capturing the properties around him first. Ports generally don't become very useful until the mid-to-late game due to how expensive naval units tend to be, and considering how little there is to defend with naval units, there isn't much point anyways. However, a well-placed battleship can easily defend the upper points of the map at those times. SuccessfulStudent built a recon too. With the road right down the middle of the map, it doesn't seem like the worst idea: he can start harrassing some infantry, and he can retreat it if a tank comes around to ruin his day. Teal Galaxy - End of day 4  Speak of the devil, there's a tank right there. Zemyla is pretty smart here to build one, but I also noticed that he skipped out on capturing a city to go for the port to the north. Considering it is one day lost, and Zemyla already has a 2000G funding advantage, I guess there's not too much worry in regards to that. It's also a good move just in case that black boat that SuccessfulSTudent has decides to beeline around and stop the capture for whatever reason. Brown Desert - End of Day 6  The ground war has pretty much turned into tank mobilization and continued captures from either side. It seems as if the northwest port isn't going completely uncontested though: SuccessfulStudent has decided to drop his infantry right upon the mountains, and he might just take back that port that Zemyla is attempting to capture up there. Zemyla could stop the capture and retaliate, or finish the capture and watch his infantry get boxed in and destroyed. Teal Galaxy - End of Day 7  The first bit of ground combat has begun, and the only bits of SuccessfulStudent's current assault take some rather heavy damage. As well, that northwestern port is being reinforced by some more infantry now. Zemyla has quite the funding advantage as of the moment right now as well, due to a stronger dedication to capturing properties and securing a defensive line before going forward. Within a few turns, Zemyla can roll right over SuccessfulStudent's front line if SuccessfulStudent doesn't back it up. One of the interesting choices that Zemyla made on this turn is building an anti-air. Considering that SuccessfulStudent is as close as he is to capturing the airport right underneath his southmost infantry, and considering the units that SuccessfulStudent currently has deployed, this is not a bad move at all. Brown Desert - End of Day 8  SuccessfulStudent is just not giving up that northwest port for the life of his infantry. He drops the second one he loaded onto his black boat right onto the port, and with his current infantry he begins to take on Zemyla's reinforcements. On the lower front, SuccessfulStudent doesn't seem to want to back up his tanks either, instead opting to do a bit of damage to some infantry coming for his properties. With a recon and a tank built this turn, I think he's planning to clean out some of the infantry which are swarming in around his areas before doing any heavier damage to the assault units on his side. The mobility that the recon does bring might be useful going forward. Teal Galaxy - End of Day 9  The artillery that Zemyla built on the top base will certainly end SuccessfulStudent's capture on the northwest port: a few pelts on whatever he spawns from it won't hurt either. Zemyla also seems to have the funds to build a medium tank in his last turn! ...But the game ends here. Yeah. I asked Zemyla about this, and he didn't take his turn for a full 20 real-time days. This was due to a combination of his ISP failing him, as well as the site being down for a multitude of days. Zemyla said he didn't mind that this happened, as his internet services were kind of acting up on him frequently. He's a good sport about it all, to be quite honest. It makes SuccessfulStudent the winner by default, but I wonder what would have happened if the game were to continue. With an overwhelming property advantage, Zemyla might have had this, but SuccessfulStudent's adamant insistence on important properties on the map might have had him turn it around with an airforce that Zemyla wouldn't have been able to deal with. Games of Advance Wars can go either way, even when a player is disadvantaged. The best players are the ones, who even left in less-than-ideal situations can turn things around. That's what the campaigns of the games are there to show you, and which is why I recommend them wholeheartedly. That being said, SuccessfulStudent moves onto the next round! There's only one more match to work with in the first round, and that is the one between Cake Attack and TheMcD. Considering the replay for their game only works up to a certain point in time, I had to contact Amarriner to get him to fix it. He's currently away from his computer for a few days, so it might be some time before the next update is shown. Nonetheless, stay tuned to see the exciting conclusion to the first round of this AWBW tournament! Slur fucked around with this message at 21:09 on Apr 27, 2016 |
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Apr 27, 2016 20:40
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That's a pretty cool map. I like that it has all the property types.
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Apr 27, 2016 21:41
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