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Yeah, that was one of the not so great DS2 ideas. Still Demon Souls cut your health in half straight away for dying.
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Apr 20, 2016 21:06
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FactsAreUseless posted:And part of your max health, in DS2. Yeah, that's part of why I wasn't a fan of this. It felt antithetical to the experimental nature of learning to play the game in ds1. A lot of things in ds2 seemed designed more as "gotchas!" than educational challenges, and I didn't really like that either. Mostly in sotfs though.
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Apr 20, 2016 21:07
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The health penalty is back in DS3.
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Apr 20, 2016 21:08
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In Training posted:The health penalty is back in DS3. Being embered giving you a large bonus to your health (and allowing summoning) at the cost of being able to be invaded is different from the game penalizing you with lower HP because you died.
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Apr 20, 2016 21:10
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In Training posted:The health penalty is back in DS3. It is not. You just get a like 25% bonus to your health when you are carrying the ember. When you die, you lose the ember. There is no penalty every time you die.
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Apr 20, 2016 21:10
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Yeah, but they successfully managed to convince my brain that Embered health was a bonus on top of your max health, rather than your max health being reduced.
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Apr 20, 2016 21:10
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booooooooo DS2 health penalty
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Apr 20, 2016 21:11
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Andrast posted:Being embers giving a large bonus to your health (and allowing summoning) at the cost of being able to be invaded is different from the game penalizing you because you died. Its the same but framed differently so people aren't mad about it lol.
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Apr 20, 2016 21:11
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Sakurazuka posted:Yeah, that was one of the not so great DS2 ideas. Still Demon Souls cut your health in half straight away for dying. You got a nice deal out of it though (10% more damage and the option to blue phantom).
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Apr 20, 2016 21:12
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Andrast posted:Being embered giving you a large bonus to your health (and allowing summoning) at the cost of being able to be invaded is different from the game penalizing you with lower HP because you died. Er that's exactly how it works in DS2 as well but the penalty in DS2 is less.
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Apr 20, 2016 21:13
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Iron Keep is still my least favorite area, just because they threw way too many of those Alonne Knights in there and they just sort of teleport to you so you can't run past them. That's still the only boss run in the entire series where I couldn't find a route to just run to the boss. That's the other thing that goes against the "these games are super hard" thing, when you know an area you can typically run past every enemy because you know where they are and how to avoid them.
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Apr 20, 2016 21:13
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Healbot posted:You got a nice deal out of it though (10% more damage and the option to blue phantom). I didn't play DeS much. 
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Apr 20, 2016 21:14
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Getting a holiday bonus in December is not the same as getting reduced pay in January.
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Apr 20, 2016 21:14
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FactsAreUseless posted:And part of your max health, in DS2. 2 hands out effigies like candy though so it's not too bad. Not to mention the ring that limits that.
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Apr 20, 2016 21:15
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Snak posted:Getting a holiday bonus in December is not the same as getting reduced pay in January. Insanely bad analogy.
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Apr 20, 2016 21:16
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Snak posted:Getting a holiday bonus in December is not the same as getting reduced pay in January. Yeah but that's not how the system works. The only difference at all between the two games is that DSII leave a little bit of empty health bar at the top of the screen but DSIII just gets rid of that.
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Apr 20, 2016 21:16
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They worded it differently in DS3. It's still a non-issue.
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Apr 20, 2016 21:17
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Golden Goat posted:They worded it differently in DS3. Yeah, as is usually the case stuff still feels designed around you playing in the downgraded form. Same as it was in Demons and Dark 2, really.
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Apr 20, 2016 21:18
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the reduced health thing is probably really more of a petty irritant in a game where many things can murder you like in 2 seconds but it's still annoying
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Apr 20, 2016 21:20
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In Dark souls 2, you start with a certain amount of max health. Every time you die, you lose some max health, until your health is halved. Playing the game with full health is balanced pretty normally, while the game is much more difficult with half health. In Dark Souls 3, you start with a certain amount of max health. Every time you die, this does not change. Playing the game with this amount of health is balanced pretty normally. When you use an ember, you get like 25% bonus health, which you will lose if you die. In Dark Souls 2, you face the first boss with full health, and each time you die, your health is reduced. In Dark Souls 3, you face the first boss with full health, and when you win, you get bonus health. That is not the same thing "framed differently".
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Apr 20, 2016 21:21
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In DS3 if you are in embered form and die you then have 30% less max health. In DS2 if you are in unhollowed form and die you then have 5% less max health.
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Apr 20, 2016 21:23
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Yes it is lol.
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Apr 20, 2016 21:23
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Apr 20, 2016 21:25
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Sakurazuka posted:This. There's plenty of games that let you keep level-up currency when you die. And those games usually don't give you health penalties or make you run back to your XP/Coins/Whatever. And dying twice definitely doesn't make that stuff completely vanish. Dark Souls isn't the hardest game ever but don't try and frame it like it's particularly merciful either.
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Apr 20, 2016 21:25
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Which part of DS2 punishes successive deaths, and Dark Souls 3 doesn't, don't you understand? It's mechanically different. One punishes you the first time you gently caress up. The other punishes you every time you gently caress up. That is loving different.
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Apr 20, 2016 21:30
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Ohhhhh, was that too hard? Try it again with less health you bitch fucker dumbshit heh heh heh DS2 you are a real rear end in a top hat sometimes
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Apr 20, 2016 21:33
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Snak posted:Which part of DS2 punishes successive deaths, and Dark Souls 3 doesn't, don't you understand? the clever thing is that since co-op makes you human, DS2 is actually making sure there's always a supply of white phantoms
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Apr 20, 2016 21:37
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The worst Elder Scrolls...
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Apr 20, 2016 21:38
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Lizard Wizard posted:the clever thing is that since co-op makes you human, DS2 is actually making sure there's always a supply of white phantoms This was originally a glitch, and then they decided "gently caress it, I guess that's okay" and made it work consistently.
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Apr 20, 2016 21:39
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in Dark Souls 1, there were enemies that could inflict a status aliment called "Curse." Status aliments are built up until a meter representing your resistance is filled, and then you suffer the status condition. When you are cursed in Dark Souls 1, your character immediately turns into a statue, you die, and you come back with your max health reduced by a fixed percentage. This max health reduction persists until you use a Purging Stone (I think?), which is an expensive item that a few vendors carry. Before it was patched, the health penalty would stack upon itself without a limit. So if you were having a hard time in the sewers and were cursed, you'd return with even less health. And if you were cursed again, even less health. This could - and did - happen to some people enough times that they were left with a sliver of their health bar and practically forced to roll a new character. Now, the sewers where you first run into this condition isn't terribly far into the game, but if you're just starting out you probably spent a couple hours working your way through the Undead Burg and getting appropriately frustrated at dying without having a penalty to your health. On the other hand, practice and experience enhance the player of Souls games almost more than they enhance the player character, so starting fresh would probably result in fewer deaths, a sense of dominance over the areas already navigated, and a more rewarding time with the game. Demon Souls, Dark Souls, Dark Souls 2, Bloodborne, and Dark Souls 3 are five of my favorite games from the last decade. I think everyone should try them, but I understand that tastes are subjective.
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Apr 20, 2016 21:46
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ckjyVOGM5_w
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Apr 20, 2016 21:46
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Snak posted:Which part of DS2 punishes successive deaths, and Dark Souls 3 doesn't, don't you understand? DS3 is the new game, expect people to defend it religiously. Better than the crap that was bloodborne but still not as good as ds2. Let the B team make the game good again imo. They prob shuffled them to the bloodborne sequel so they could make slightly better ds3.
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Apr 20, 2016 21:47
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I think Dark Souls 2 was the weakest in the series but it's still a good game, and a better game than many others. I don't know why someone would think that it's the best in the series, though. I would like to hear why someone would think that it was, however, because I have an open mind and am interested in differing viewpoints.
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Apr 20, 2016 21:59
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Snak posted:Which part of DS2 punishes successive deaths, and Dark Souls 3 doesn't, don't you understand? IMO its different implementations of the same mechanic, with DS2 being the more forgiving of the two, which seems to go against your point. One death in DS2 gives you a meager 5% hp penalty, and allows for quite a few more deaths before the penalty compares to that of DS3. Tenzarin posted:DS3 is the new game, expect people to defend it religiously. Better than the crap that was bloodborne but still not as good as ds2. Let the B team make the game good again imo. They prob shuffled them to the bloodborne sequel so they could make slightly better ds3. If anything I'm speaking in defense of DS2, I liked that system.
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Apr 20, 2016 22:09
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I think there's a big psychological different between being continuously penalized every time you die, and having a "bonus" that you lose if you die while having it. Because my original point was that there is a large element of learning by experimentation. You do not start out embered in DS3, so the whole time you are loving around in the tutorial area, your health does not decrease. This is different from DS2. When you are un-embered in DS3, you can die as many times as you want and there will be no penalty. This is a regular operating health. Once you have died 10 times in DS2, you have 50% of your normal health, and this is definitely a penalty as far as your survivability. At this point, you can continue dying with no penalty, but I think that 50% health is much more arguable a penalty state than your stat-determined max health in ds3.
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Apr 20, 2016 22:17
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Snak posted:Which part of DS2 punishes successive deaths, and Dark Souls 3 doesn't, don't you understand? Just eat one of the many human effigies it gives you.
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Apr 20, 2016 22:18
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Golden Goat posted:Just eat one of the many human effigies it gives you. That's not the point? I'm not talking about it making the game hard, I'm talking about how the game and the player interact.
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Apr 20, 2016 22:19
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itt people forget you get a ring that stops you losing most of your health in demons souls
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Apr 20, 2016 22:23
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I agree about the psychological difference, which is what I meant about it being framed differently.
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Apr 20, 2016 22:24
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| # ? Jun 1, 2024 01:21 |
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well guys, i got art academy: lessons for everyone. here's my cherry. it's a bit poo poo 
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Apr 20, 2016 22:25
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