Doctor Who: "I've finally run out of corridor...there's a life summed up."

The Something Awful Forums > The Finer Arts > TV IV > Doctor Who: "I've finally run out of corridor...there's a life summed up."

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Which non-Power of the Daleks story would you like to see an episode found from? This poll is closed.
Marco Polo	36	20.69%
The Myth Makers	10	5.75%
The Massacre of St. Bartholomew's Eve	45	25.86%
The Savages	2	1.15%
The Smugglers	2	1.15%
The Highlanders	45	25.86%
The Macra Terror	21	12.07%
Fury from the Deep	13	7.47%
Total:	174 votes

[Edit Poll (moderators only)]

MrL_JaKiri: Sep 23, 2003; A bracing glass of carrot juice!

Burkion posted:

We can have you replaced man.

Unlike them.

Pfft, where are you going to find a cantankerous Doctor Who fan who much prefers the classic series, comments on anti-immigration allegories in the revival, has initials "L" and "M" in some order, one of which is "Lawrence"?

It's impossible I tells ya

# ? Apr 22, 2016 13:46

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# ? Jun 3, 2024 11:27

Fil5000: Jun 23, 2003; HOLD ON GUYS I'M POSTING ABOUT INTERNET ROBOTS

MrL_JaKiri posted:

Pfft, where are you going to find a cantankerous Doctor Who fan who much prefers the classic series, comments on anti-immigration allegories in the revival, has initials "L" and "M" in some order, one of which is "Lawrence"?

It's impossible I tells ya

This only works if you've written your own fanfic about totally cool rogue timelords who are totally badass and cool.

# ? Apr 22, 2016 13:54

The_Doctor: Mar 29, 2007; "The entire history of this incarnation is one of temporal orbits, retcons, paradoxes, parallel time lines, reiterations, and divergences. How anyone can make head or tail of all this chaos, I don't know."

Fil5000 posted:

This only works if you've written your own fanfic about totally cool rogue timelords who are totally badass and cool.

Which reminds me, the AVClub recently reviewed the surprisingly good Faction Paradox book 'The Book of the War'. A book that is long out of print. �\_(ツ)_/�

# ? Apr 22, 2016 14:32

Timby: Dec 23, 2006; Your mother!

Rhyno posted:

Tom Waits is next.

I'm actually more worried about Leonard Cohen. He's reportedly been in poor health for a couple of months and the dude's 81.

# ? Apr 22, 2016 15:02

Picklepuss: Jul 12, 2002

https://twitter.com/bbcdoctorwho/status/723122358597332992

I think the real question is where did he get that empty cup. I don't see any tea.

# ? Apr 22, 2016 15:26

CobiWann: Oct 21, 2009; Have fun!

MrL_JaKiri posted:

Pfft, where are you going to find a cantankerous Doctor Who fan who much prefers the classic series, comments on anti-immigration allegories in the revival, has initials "L" and "M" in some order, one of which is "Lawrence"?

It's impossible I tells ya

Look, I'm not saying we can force your regeneration, but...

# ? Apr 22, 2016 16:12

Issaries: Sep 15, 2008; "At the end of the day
We are all human beings
My father once told me that
The world has no borders"

CobiWann posted:

Look, I'm not saying we can force your regeneration, but...

Sure we can:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W_t32ANxnI4

(Start @ 1.45)

# ? Apr 22, 2016 17:24

2house2fly: Nov 14, 2012; You did a super job wrapping things up! And I'm not just saying that because I have to!

Picklepuss posted:

https://twitter.com/bbcdoctorwho/status/723122358597332992

I think the real question is where did he get that empty cup. I don't see any tea.

He drank the tea

# ? Apr 23, 2016 03:26

Box of Bunnies: Apr 3, 2012; by Pragmatica

Got a handful of Target novelisations from a garage sale this morning to throw on my random mishmash "collection" of Target books and a couple of covers in particular I want to comment on (pictures nicked from wiki because why take my own)

The Drahvins look kinda fabulous here in an old scifi way, but how do you do a Galaxy Four cover and not put a Chumbley on it!?

Also just this Tom Baker face on Revenge of the Cybermen. It's amazing and almost entirely makes up for the story being a stinker.

# ? Apr 23, 2016 11:18

Fil5000: Jun 23, 2003; HOLD ON GUYS I'M POSTING ABOUT INTERNET ROBOTS

God I loved the target books as a kid. I'm glad I didn't know about the New Adventures and just read Peter, Baker and Davison stories while I waited for season 27.

# ? Apr 23, 2016 11:31

MrL_JaKiri: Sep 23, 2003; A bracing glass of carrot juice!

The new companion is called Bill, and is played by Pearl Mackie

# ? Apr 23, 2016 18:18

The_Doctor: Mar 29, 2007; "The entire history of this incarnation is one of temporal orbits, retcons, paradoxes, parallel time lines, reiterations, and divergences. How anyone can make head or tail of all this chaos, I don't know."

Astro?

# ? Apr 23, 2016 18:21

Fair Bear Maiden: Jun 17, 2013

They introduced her with a short video, for anyone who cares: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YaLficIRInM

# ? Apr 23, 2016 18:27

Yvonmukluk: Oct 10, 2012; Everything is Sinister

Fair Bear Maiden posted:

They introduced her with a short video, for anyone who cares: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YaLficIRInM

She's no Shona, but she'll do nicely.

# ? Apr 23, 2016 18:41

Comrade Fakename: Feb 13, 2012

I didn't see the reveal so I first saw her on the BBC website, which has this picture:

Which looks like some teenage fangirl photoshopped herself into the photo. Is that a good or bad thing? I don't know.

# ? Apr 23, 2016 18:53

Issaries: Sep 15, 2008; "At the end of the day
We are all human beings
My father once told me that
The world has no borders"

Fair Bear Maiden posted:

They introduced her with a short video, for anyone who cares: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YaLficIRInM

a New companion? I don't like her.

# ? Apr 23, 2016 18:54

CobiWann: Oct 21, 2009; Have fun!

A black female companion? It'll never work!

(I like what I see so far)

And remember, the first pic of Matt Smith made him look very emo...

# ? Apr 23, 2016 19:22

Big Mean Jerk: Jan 27, 2009; Well, of course I know him.
He's me.

Oh man, I like her a lot already. Reminds me of Donna.

# ? Apr 23, 2016 19:46

Maxwell Lord: Dec 12, 2008; I am drowning.
There is no sign of land.
You are coming down with me, hand in unlovable hand.

And I hope you die.

I hope we both die.; Grimey Drawer

I'm getting just a hint of Lucie Miller.

Also like her look already.

# ? Apr 23, 2016 19:48

jivjov: Sep 13, 2007; But how does it taste? Yummy!; Dinosaur Gum

CobiWann posted:

And remember, the first pic of Matt Smith made him look very emo...

This is why I never judge anything from promo pics. I remember the absurd kvetching from the fan base, and then just how different 11's look was from that promo.

# ? Apr 23, 2016 20:08

NieR Occomata: Jan 18, 2009; Glory to Mankind.

After many years away, it's nice to see Steven Moffat returning to the Companion that matters- "Rose Tyler, but black".

# ? Apr 23, 2016 20:20

howe_sam: Mar 7, 2013; Creepy little garbage eaters

Maxwell Lord posted:

Also like her look already.

It's so Eighties I love it, and that Prince shirt is a nice, I'm assuming coincidental, homage.

# ? Apr 23, 2016 20:34

Cerv: Sep 14, 2004; This is a silly post with little news value.

CobiWann posted:

And remember, the first pic of Matt Smith made him look very emo...

it really didn't

# ? Apr 23, 2016 20:38

jivjov: Sep 13, 2007; But how does it taste? Yummy!; Dinosaur Gum

Cerv posted:

it really didn't

Dim light, dark clothes, the hair....

A kneejerk reaction of "emo" was super common

# ? Apr 23, 2016 20:44

AndyElusive: Jan 7, 2007

Fair Bear Maiden posted:

They introduced her with a short video, for anyone who cares: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YaLficIRInM

I like her and her questions already.

# ? Apr 23, 2016 20:50

Teek: Aug 7, 2006; Whatever.

Ehhh... I'll wait until I can see her in a full episode, because that short scene really didn't do her character any favors for me.

# ? Apr 23, 2016 20:53

Well Manicured Man: Aug 21, 2010; Well Manicured Mort

jivjov posted:

Dim light, dark clothes, the hair....

A kneejerk reaction of "emo" was super common

Back when the first promo picture came out I saw a lot of Doctor Who fans online saying, "He looks too emo" or "Oh, gently caress, they're trying to capture the Twilight demographic" or "Why is his neck so long?" (Matt Smith's pose in the photo did kinda show off his neck a bit).

When the next promo picture showing Smith in a tweed jacket and bowtie came out, all those fans were pretty quickly placated.

# ? Apr 23, 2016 20:58

DoctorWhat: Nov 18, 2011; A little privacy, please?

Shades of Lucie Miller and Flip Jackson in this, which I quite enjoy.

# ? Apr 23, 2016 21:07

Box of Bunnies: Apr 3, 2012; by Pragmatica

Fair Bear Maiden posted:

They introduced her with a short video, for anyone who cares: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YaLficIRInM

"That's not explainin', that's just saying a word."

I love her already.

# ? Apr 23, 2016 21:32

Jerusalem: May 20, 2004; Would you be my new best friends?

Fair Bear Maiden posted:

They introduced her with a short video, for anyone who cares: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YaLficIRInM

Welp I already like her.

Farewell, sweet Shona :unsmith:

# ? Apr 24, 2016 00:04

Timby: Dec 23, 2006; Your mother!

Toxxupation posted:

After many years away, it's nice to see Steven Moffat returning to the Companion that matters- "Rose Tyler, but black".

Jesus Christ, shut up.

# ? Apr 24, 2016 00:59

NieR Occomata: Jan 18, 2009; Glory to Mankind.

Timby posted:

Jesus Christ, shut up.

I, too, get angry about obvious and clear jokes.

# ? Apr 24, 2016 01:11

Jet Jaguar: Feb 12, 2006; Don't touch my bags if you please, Mr Customs Man.

I was kinda hoping for Evelyn Smythe.

# ? Apr 24, 2016 01:20

Big Mean Jerk: Jan 27, 2009; Well, of course I know him.
He's me.

What if she's actually from the 80's :allears:

# ? Apr 24, 2016 01:33

Skull Servant: Oct 25, 2009

I just hope that we finally get another companion that is more friendly with the Doctor and doesn't have a weird obsession like Clara or wants to bang him like... nearly every other companion.

I'm speaking about the revival series, of course.

# ? Apr 24, 2016 01:36

Cleretic: Feb 3, 2010; Ignore my posts!
I'm aggressively wrong about everything!

Big Mean Jerk posted:

What if she's actually from the 80's

Well, they did describe 2017 as the future...

I'm pretty on board with this girl, she seems fun.

# ? Apr 24, 2016 02:04

The_Doctor: Mar 29, 2007; "The entire history of this incarnation is one of temporal orbits, retcons, paradoxes, parallel time lines, reiterations, and divergences. How anyone can make head or tail of all this chaos, I don't know."

Randomly flipping channels in my Chicago hotel room, I've just come across Revenge of the Cybermen starting. I'm a little ashamed that I recognised it from the incidental music.

# ? Apr 24, 2016 04:09

Rhyno: Mar 22, 2003; Can't post for 10 years!

Big Mean Jerk posted:

What if she's actually from the 80's

Oh god I hope so!

# ? Apr 24, 2016 05:18

Jerusalem: May 20, 2004; Would you be my new best friends?

Short Synopsis: The Doctor goes to the Po' House.

Long Synopsis: An impossible "random" encounter with a housecat see the TARDIS to land on a desolate planet whose sole living inhabitant is locked away in an Edgar Allan Poe inspired prison-mansion. Misunderstandings lead to Poe-inspired tortures, and the Doctor's only hope of rescuing Tamsin and escaping is in telling a Poe story of his own.

What's Good:

The Doctor's reasoning. On multiple occasions in this story, the Doctor finds himself presented with his usual life or death scenario, and as usual figures out a way to talk himself out of it. There's nothing unusual about this in Doctor Who, but the execution of the concept varies in quality from story to story. Here it works very well, there's very much a sense of a Doctor who takes the situation he finds himself in, adapts to the scenario and calmly works out how to extricate himself from it. When suddenly confronted by squawking humanoid raven robots who demand he provide his credentials to prove he is who they think he is, the Doctor calmly considers his surroundings, the raven's odd appearance and dialogue, and smoothly transitions into delivering the "proof". That the system makes no sense is secondary to the Doctor's smooth handling of the situation. McGann's performance avoids what could have been an Adam West-esque bit of sleuthing because he gives the material a gravitas that it perhaps doesn't quite merit. But it's really later in the story, when the Doctor is being tortured and slowly figures out what is going on, and when he comes up with a method of assuaging/bribing his jailer into not only giving him up but rescuing Tamsin where he really shines. The story the Doctor tells again benefits from McGann's performance, as he narrates a story of his own in a Poe style that is specifically constructed to enthrall his captor. The "punchline" to this story is hilarious and somehow completely in keeping with the tragedy that was Poe's bizarre life.
Balancing the season arc. After a couple of seasons of making the overarching season arc sit painfully with the individual stories, this one gets things absolutely right. The intrusion of the cat at the start of the story makes no sense but the Doctor immediately picks up on what is going on, and just completely refuses to have any part of it. Gone is the obtuse Doctor who somehow misses the obvious in spite of his genius - here there is just enough peppered in amongst the actual meat of the story to make the listener realize there is just a little more going on beneath the surface. Best of all, the Doctor has already figured it all out and.... just doesn't care. Instead of being intrigued by the mystery, he just rightly scolds the Time Lords (via the cat) to sort out their own mess for once. He's not their agent, he's not at their beck and call, and though I'm sure the season arc will eventually catch up to him, it's nice that it will do so without catching him by surprise. The Doctor is smart, so the viewer shouldn't be figuring out the obvious multiple stories ahead of him.
Nothing makes any sense. This story makes no bones at all about being inspired by Edgar Allan Poe, it's completely blatant. And in keeping with Poe, the whole thing is meant to evoke a sense of desperation verging on madness, on a dreadful romantic obsession that can only lead to despair. The prisoner is a monster, but her jailer is obviously insane and plagued by guilt that he redirects into a violent terror of cats (the Doctor straight up calls him out on this), and the settings are designed purely for the sense of terror or dread they invoke regardless on if they make any sense or serve any purpose beyond the macabre. It's pure theater, everything is for show and serves no function, even the robots that guard the prisoner and secure the planet from intruders are simply another excuse for the jailer to indulge in his passion for Poe. The man is beyond obsessed, and though that all ends up having a reason, it stretches believably that he would be put into such a position of authority as he is. But believably isn't necessarily all that important in this case, because the story is more about evoking a feeling. It does a fairly good job of this, the entire planet gets across a sense of being a nightmare, a place that doesn't make sense and leaves the prisoner (and unlucky visitors) scrambling to maintain their sanity.

What's Not:

Nothing makes any sense. Except while the story does a good job of evoking that sense of nightmarish dread.... it's still a story and you need to be a pretty drat good writer to make that work. For all his faults, many of Poe's works are excellent because of the emotional reaction they illicit in the reader, and the fact that their settings are at best sketchy is irrelevant - one of my all time favorites is The Masque of the Red Death, and that's about as loose as things get - a Prince and 1000 nobles hole up in his palace to wait out a plague in conspicuous luxury, refusing to acknowledge or care for the devastation outside their walls.... and that's basically all the back story you get (or need!). But while Alan Barnes is a fine writer, he's no Edgar Allan Poe, and it sits ill in the Doctor Who context because attempts ARE made to explain why things are as they are, why things have been allowed to happen, how things were created, what the explanation for the deaths are etc. So you get a creepy setting and explicit attempts to recreate the feeling of being in an Edgar Allan Poe story, but then undercut all that with explanations that do little more than dilute what was effective in the first place with no real narrative payoff.
The forced dilemma. The Doctor and Tamsin are brought to the planet by "accident", and it's already contrived with the sudden arrival of a cat that just so happens to set coordinates for the TARDIS to follow. The Doctor of course is fully aware of what is going on, and he wants to just clear the gently caress out of there. He is forced to remain because of Tamsin, who refuses to accept the cat is anything other than what it appears to be on face value. That's excusable at first, but several times it is Tamsin's credulous nature that forces the Doctor to stick around when he clearly knows it is time to get the hell out of there. Tamsin, sadly, comes across as more than a little dim and it doesn't help that thanks to the way she was "recruited" the viewer still has very little idea who she actually is as a person. Based on this story, it would appear that she's a nice but dim lady who gets in easily over her head - not helped by other characters being dismissive of her or openly questioning her intelligence. I don't know how much longer this will last, but it may be awhile considering in the interviews Big Finish notes that scripts were written at the same time as Situation Vacant so nobody apparently had any real idea just who Tamsin is or what her character is like. Even after this story, I STILL don't know!
The Ravens. Great idea, terrible execution. The Ravens are obviously intended to evoke their namesake from Poe's most famous work as well as mirror the nonsensical obsession their creator has with the author. But the way they're written makes them seem like idiotic comedy relief instead of dangerous, and the voice effects/modulation used for them robs them of any gravitas or indeed any sense that they actually sound like ravens. On the interviews you briefly hear an unmodulated performance and it actually sounds much better, or at least more ravenlike.
The "monster" resolution. When the Doctor figures out who is responsible for the murders of the prisoner's accomplices, and how and why that has happened, he comes to a conclusion over what should be done. That involves giving her a spaceship and her freedom and while that may be for the greater good of the universe, it effective rewards a monster. The prisoner not only admits to the crimes she was accused of committing, but shows zero remorse and insists what she did was utterly justifiable (here's a hint: it wasn't) but everybody seems so concerned with the immediate threat that they don't consider or even pay lipservice to the fact that there is a complete lack of rehabilitation. It's a nasty little oversight that just left me with a bad taste in my mouth.

Final Thoughts:

Nevermore is all about evoking a feeling, and on the surface level it succeeds at doing that. It consciously and openly apes many themes and even settings from Poe's works, and the strongest character work comes from the jailer obsessed with Poe and his interactions with the Doctor who adapts to this obsession in order to achieve his own ends. But the combination of Who and Poe does not, in this case, sit well together. After spending all that time trying to play off the sense of desperate madness, it negates most of its good works with an attempt to quantify and explain everything. In doing so, it forgets or deliberately overlooks the moral issues with how the war criminal prisoner is ultimately dealt with. Throw in some clunky sounding robots, Tamsin acting like a credulous idiot, and a secondary character so irrelevant that I completely forgot to mention her in the entire write-up despite a pretty massive end of story reveal about them.... well, this is probably a story I shall listen to.... never more.

# ? Apr 24, 2016 11:54

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# ? Jun 3, 2024 11:27

Murderion: Oct 4, 2009; 2019. New York is in ruins. The global economy is spiralling. Cyborgs rule over poisoned wastes.

The only time that's left is
FUN TIME

Toxxupation posted:

After many years away, it's nice to see Steven Moffat returning to the Companion that matters- "Rose Tyler, but black".

- From London

- Does not have the same encyclopedic knowledge of monsters from time and space as The Doctor

dunno why you guys are so mad, this checks out

I will wait to see her character's power in the Dr Who gem match mobile game before passing judgement :reject:

# ? Apr 24, 2016 13:07

The Something Awful Forums > The Finer Arts > TV IV > Doctor Who: "I've finally run out of corridor...there's a life summed up."

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