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Pandemonium posted:One story of one abused worker is anecdotal evidence, as well, you know? The idea that Taiwanese are particularly exploitative of these caretakers and nannies is something that has tons of traction in the foreign community for whatever reason, and it always boils down to three or so cases being trotted out as examples of abuse that are then made to represent the entirety of the industry. I've had many private students from well-off families who had these people living with them and working and whatnot, and let me tell you, those women were probably ecstatic. You know why? They get to live in sweet rear end-apartments and houses in Taiwan where back home they might very well have been sleeping on a cot in a house that was one or two rooms with their entire family. But these women--the vast, vast majority--are silenced in favor of the miniscule number who find themselves in lovely situations being abused and whatnot. My heart goes out to them, it does, but if you think the media covering them is at all different from the media covering this handful of dog-eating cases, well, lol you got played hard by the media, son.
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Apr 26, 2016 03:55
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Pandemonium posted:http://www.taipeitimes.com/News/taiwan/archives/2015/10/03/2003629170 It's the same article I linked above. It makes lots of accusations but it doesn't substantiate. I've seen tons of insane photos on facebook, but they don't mean anything. Digital manipulation, photos taken out of context, photos that are complete frauds, etc. There were 6 incidences in 5 years where people were prosecuted while this group alleged 50 in a single year. And if something never made the news or isn't advertised anywhere, how are we supposed to be held accountable for that knowledge?
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Apr 26, 2016 04:01
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I ate dog a whole bunch when I was working in rural Cambodia. It doesn't taste very good, like a really poor cut of pork. That's all I have to add.
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Apr 26, 2016 04:11
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TetsuoTW posted:Hey yo I was just playing before but you need to get hosed, son. Let me guess, you also think that the blame for their exploitation lies 100% with the Taiwanese and are unawares of the fact that these foreign laborers' countryfolk are also in on the scheme. It does indeed take two to tango. Also, I went swimming one Sunday awhile ago and witnessed a bunch of Indonesians (I think) antagonizing one of the workers at the pool who was trying to clean one of the lanes. They kept yanking and pulling on his vacuum cleaner thing and swimming around him. The lane was closed, of course. They were having a grand old time, too. They also jumped into the pool randomly and took up most of the lanes without swimming. Meanwhile, next to the lanes is a free swim area just as big as all of the lanes combined. So my anecdotal evidence is that foreign laborers go to places and act out of hand and antagonize locals, whether spitefully or not. Therefore, my conclusion based on my anecdotal evidence is such that I am able to conclude that... fart. I give as much weight to a story of one abused worker as that. Show me some statistics that make the abuse out to be rampant, please.
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Apr 26, 2016 04:15
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What was the name of the last domestic worker you spoke to, Anpanman?
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Apr 26, 2016 04:24
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Atlas Hugged posted:And if something never made the news or isn't advertised anywhere, how are we supposed to be held accountable for that knowledge? It's more about calling most of you out on passing the buck. Vietnamese and others need to be educated that eating dog is unacceptable here. Yet it seems like goons have taken this news story as an opportunity to bitch and moan about animal abuse and abandonment by locals, which is a separate issue entirely. Hence, my either/or hyperbole. I'm just following along with the wave of bad faith posts. Next topic: news about Taiwanese scammers. How will goons go about ignoring the issues brought up by this particular story in favor of some other tenuous yet much bigger more nefarious issue like, like, like, low wages and as a corollary how these low wages have forced young Taiwanese into joining illegal enterprises abroad? Or will you all deflect it by going into how much bigger Nigerian prince e-mail scammers are and how they need to be the primary target before we prosecute the Taiwanese scammers. I'm waiting with bated breath!
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Apr 26, 2016 04:25
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How do you stay on a high horse like that when your horse is entirely imaginary?
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Apr 26, 2016 04:37
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I'd love to get a cat (or two!) but I'm really worried that my apartment would be too small for them. What do you guys think: (That's the whole thing)
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Apr 26, 2016 04:39
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Moon Slayer posted:I'd love to get a cat (or two!) but I'm really worried that my apartment would be too small for them. What do you guys think: Cats need running space. So, either wait until you get a bigger apartment, or get used to having the cats wake you up in the middle of the night as they run from one end of your apartment to the other. If an apartment is big enough for one cat, it's big enough for two (always get two cats if you can, because they can keep each other company). e: Your apartment is too small.
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Apr 26, 2016 04:42
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Pandemonium posted:Vietnamese and others need to be educated that eating dog is unacceptable here. Do they? There's nothing substantial to say they do. Like, yeah, it happens. 6 times in 5 years. Does there need to be an awareness campaign about it?
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Apr 26, 2016 04:42
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Atlas Hugged posted:Do they? There's nothing substantial to say they do. Like, yeah, it happens. 6 times in 5 years. Does there need to be an awareness campaign about it? Dude, didn't we just implicitly agree that those were the cases that were prosecuted but that the number of times a dog or cat has been eaten by foreign laborers is much, much higher? And if it's something they are doing out of ignorance, then they absolutely do need to be educated.
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Apr 26, 2016 04:45
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Pandemonium posted:Dude, didn't we just implicitly agree that those were the cases that were prosecuted but that the number of times a dog or cat has been eaten by foreign laborers is much, much higher? And if it's something they are doing out of ignorance, then they absolutely do need to be educated. No we didn't agree because facebook posts are not evidence of anything as I outlined in my above post. There were 6 prosecuted incidents, accusations of 50 more in a year, accusations that police didn't bother because they had no incentive to, and supposedly 150 pictures in a facebook group (which wasn't linked in the article).
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Apr 26, 2016 04:47
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If only those benighted browns knew that dogs are cute! That burden must get real heavy sometimes, white man.
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Apr 26, 2016 04:47
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TetsuoTW posted:How do you stay on a high horse like that when your horse is entirely imaginary? By not posting that people eating dogs is probably better and more merciful than people abusing them, conflating two entirely disparate groups of people and situations in the name of apologizing for dog eaters like you have done.
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Apr 26, 2016 04:48
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YF19pilot posted:Cats need running space. So, either wait until you get a bigger apartment, or get used to having the cats wake you up in the middle of the night as they run from one end of your apartment to the other. If an apartment is big enough for one cat, it's big enough for two (always get two cats if you can, because they can keep each other company). Yeah, that's what I figured. Thanks!
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Apr 26, 2016 04:49
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TetsuoTW posted:If only those benighted browns knew that dogs are cute! Yep, I think eating dogs is wrong. You can gently caress off with your horseshit cultural relativism couched in an uninteresting and unfunny burn attempt (what post have you made that isn't), thank you very much. You're not making any point other than that you have no point to make and you oh-so-cutely think reducing the don't eat dogs argument to "dogs are cute" is something anyone who is against eating dogs would actually use as their argument. Edit: Your strawman game is strong. But you're still an idiot creating imagined arguments and people to snidely comment on. So have fun with that! Pandemonium fucked around with this message at 04:58 on Apr 26, 2016 |
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Apr 26, 2016 04:53
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You never did say who the last domestic worker you talked to was. Maybe instead of hastily dropping tepid burns on "cultural relativism" you could go ask one of the 46000 runaway domestic workers if abuse never happens in Glorious 中華民國 (that means ROC).
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Apr 26, 2016 05:09
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TetsuoTW posted:Hey yo I was just playing before but you need to get hosed, son. yeah - i started to list the fallacies in it, but i gave up after 5.
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Apr 26, 2016 05:11
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url posted:yeah - i started to list the fallacies in it, but i gave up after 5. Fortunately listing the phalluses is much easier.
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Apr 26, 2016 05:14
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37 posts? Oh cool! 安心上路
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Apr 26, 2016 05:16
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靠腰。
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Apr 26, 2016 05:23
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Speaking of anecdotes, I recently learned that a very popular character in a very popular children's anime is apparently a bad word in Taiwanese (at least the first two syllables of his name).
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Apr 26, 2016 05:26
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caberham posted:37 posts? Oh cool! 保重身體，廢文鬼
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Apr 26, 2016 05:30
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Pandemonium posted:Let me guess, you also think that the blame for their exploitation lies 100% with the Taiwanese and are unawares of the fact that these foreign laborers' countryfolk are also in on the scheme. It does indeed take two to tango. Holy poo poo is this bizarro stormfront? Of all the things I expected to see at SA today, a version of "black people sold black people into slavery" was not one of them.
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Apr 26, 2016 05:35
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Spanish Matlock posted:Holy poo poo is this bizarro stormfront? Of all the things I expected to see at SA today, a version of "black people sold black people into slavery" was not one of them. Or, alternatively, the very Libertarian idea that if you're being exploited it's just as much your own fault for entering into a contract *fart* human beings rational actors *wet fart* Von Mises *diarrhea filled pants making GBS threads fart*
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Apr 26, 2016 05:39
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On topic, I probably wouldn't eat stray cats and dogs because they're disease-ridden. I wouldn't eat stray pigs either.
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Apr 26, 2016 05:43
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Guys did you know Barry Soetoro, a brown, ate a dog and it was his fault
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Apr 26, 2016 05:44
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GoutPatrol posted:Guys did you know Barry Soetoro, a brown, ate a dog and it was his fault gently caress off with your cultural relativism
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Apr 26, 2016 05:46
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GoutPatrol posted:Guys did you know Barry Soetoro, a brown, ate a dog and it was his fault 
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Apr 26, 2016 05:51
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GoutPatrol posted:Guys did you know Barry Soetoro, a brown Fixed that for you.
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Apr 26, 2016 05:52
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MUSLIM
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Spanish Matlock posted:On topic, I probably wouldn't eat stray cats and dogs because they're disease-ridden. I wouldn't eat stray pigs either. is there something about wild boar I don't know? 5'd
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Apr 26, 2016 05:55
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In line with the mayor of London himself I would surmise that his part-Kenyan heritage left him with an ancestral disdain for dogs. (For those not acquainted with the mayor I would just like to take this opportunity to point out that he exists and it is literally impossible not to laugh at Google image search results for him:  )
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Apr 26, 2016 05:56
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Apr 26, 2016 05:57
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Spanish Matlock posted:Holy poo poo is this bizarro stormfront? Of all the things I expected to see at SA today, a version of "black people sold black people into slavery" was not one of them. No. This is what is required for Taiwanese companies to recruit in these countries. You think these companies all have Taiwanese over in Vietnam, Indonesia, Malaysia, etc., etc. speaking whatever language fluently conning and tricking locals left and right into signing up to be exploited? Lol. It's cooperative efforts. If you think otherwise, I don't know what to tell you. YF19pilot posted:Or, alternatively, the very Libertarian idea that if you're being exploited it's just as much your own fault for entering into a contract *fart* human beings rational actors *wet fart* Von Mises *diarrhea filled pants making GBS threads fart* It's not the people here working that are exploiting themselves. It's companies in their home country that are exploiting them. Again, it's a cooperative thing. Nice try, though. TetsuoTW posted:You never did say who the last domestic worker you talked to was. Maybe instead of hastily dropping tepid burns on "cultural relativism" you could go ask one of the 46000 runaway domestic workers if abuse never happens in Glorious 中華民國 (that means ROC). http://vietnamnews.vn/society/271844/taiwan-lifts-ban-on-vn-workers.html The single, solitary reason these people have run away is abuse, is it? You know that for a fact? Not to work under the table somewhere for more money? Not to continue working in Taiwan after their contract is up? You have a very myopic and negative view of this country you have lived for I'm guessing a big chunk of time, don't you? It's also not like these foreign laborers don't know what they are getting themselves into with respect to work hours and salary. Of course not the abuse, but they are all aware of the basic structure of their contracts and yet they still choose to come here. Hmm... makes you think, huh?
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Apr 26, 2016 05:58
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vietnamese_migrant_brides_in_Taiwan#Human_Trafficking.2FAbuse_Concerns How many of those marriage brokers in Vietnam are Taiwanese citizens, do you think?
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Apr 26, 2016 06:07
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Pandemonium posted:The single, solitary reason these people have run away is abuse, is it? You know that for a fact? Not to work under the table somewhere for more money? Not to continue working in Taiwan after their contract is up? You have a very myopic and negative view of this country you have lived for I'm guessing a big chunk of time, don't you? LoL its probably drapetomania.
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Apr 26, 2016 06:10
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Pandemonium posted:It's also not like these foreign laborers don't know what they are getting themselves into with respect to work hours and salary. Of course not the abuse, but they are all aware of the basic structure of their contracts and yet they still choose to come here. Hmm... makes you think, huh? It makes me think you're okay with people being treated poorly, yeah.
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Apr 26, 2016 06:13
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This thread: people who sign contracts to come over and work in Taiwan are all literal slaves, to a one. In addition, what was true about slavery in America is equally true and relevant to Taiwan and its relationship with its foreign laborers. All of them.
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Apr 26, 2016 06:15
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Pandemonium posted:This thread: people who sign contracts to come over and work in Taiwan are all literal slaves, to a one. In addition, what was true about slavery in America is equally true and relevant to Taiwan and its relationship with its foreign laborers. All of them. Pandemonium really takes it personally when people threaten stray animals because without the dogs that live down by the river he would have nobody to talk to.
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Apr 26, 2016 06:18
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Chantilly Say posted:It makes me think you're okay with people being treated poorly, yeah. Welcome to globalized capitalism. Lol if you think foreign laborers in Taiwan are a unique case of cheap, easily exploited/able labor. Also, I'm pretty sure they come over here because the salary and everything is actually better here than back home, but all I've got to support that is the words of a few Taiwanese businessmen who opened factories in Vietnam for this very reason--i.e., it's cheaper than having them come over and work in Taiwan. Taiwanese bunsinessmen are scum, don't get me wrong. Don't mistake me for being on team big business. I just understand the situation a bit better than most of you, I guess.
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Apr 26, 2016 06:19
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