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Mr. Nice! posted:A right to a speedy trial does not prevent an extension for a few months. They really have no ground to object and I'm glad the judge is making GBS threads all over them. I like the way it was phrased to specifically note that this delay is because of the bullshit they like to pull. A nice way of noting that they can delay all they want, but they're going to be remain incarcerated regardless.
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Apr 27, 2016 14:10
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Comments are fun on that one. A few nut bars and a few people who sound like reasonable people. I did like that someone pointed out that speedy trials aren't really a thing any more. Also that bumping people already waiting for their trials out of the way would be violating their rights to a  speedy trial
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Apr 27, 2016 14:19
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the bundy ranch Facebook page is deliciously outraged by the trial being pushed to next February suck it down sovcit idiots
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Apr 27, 2016 15:10
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Shakenbaker posted:Comments are fun on that one. A few nut bars and a few people who sound like reasonable people. I did like that someone pointed out that speedy trials aren't really a thing any more. Also that bumping people already waiting for their trials out of the way would be violating their rights to a Yeah but those people are criminals and we're just good ol' boys!
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Apr 27, 2016 15:34
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Constant Hamprince posted:One of histories best ironies IMO is that Franz Ferdinand was an advocate for concessions to Austria-Hungary's ethnic minorities and would likely have been favourable to them had he not been assassinated by a Serbian nationalist. As a connoisseur of irony, this is very pleasing to me.
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Apr 27, 2016 15:45
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rudatron posted:That's not an irony - the people who assassinated him chose to kill him for that exact reason, because they felt those concessions would lead to a loss of push for serb independence. So, in all seriousness, WWI was started because of a form of accelerationism?
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Apr 27, 2016 18:03
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Discendo Vox posted:So, in all seriousness, WWI was started because of a form of accelerationism? That's a ted-cruz-face-level gross oversimplification, but you make that case, yes.
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Apr 27, 2016 18:07
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Mad Doctor Cthulhu posted:From the article: quote:Leen on Tuesday also ordered defense lawyers and prosecutors to meet to see if they can agree on a protective order to keep key government evidence in the case secret. Why do I get the feeling that as soon as one of them gets their hands on the government's evidence, it's going on facebook to be debunked by the world's first crowdsourced legal defense? Protective Orders don't have Jurisdiction on Federal Land, after all :sovcit:
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Apr 27, 2016 18:17
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OAquinas posted:That's a ted-cruz-face-level gross oversimplification, but you make that case, yes. yeah but at that level of simplification it's just as likely he was killed because of youthful naivety and chance, too
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Apr 27, 2016 18:38
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OK, lemme rephrase, because I'm genuinely not particularly knowledgeable about the time period. Is this:Constant Hamprince posted:One of histories best ironies IMO is that Franz Ferdinand was an advocate for concessions to Austria-Hungary's ethnic minorities and would likely have been favourable to them had he not been assassinated by a Serbian nationalist. As a connoisseur of irony, this is very pleasing to me. rudatron posted:That's not an irony - the people who assassinated him chose to kill him for that exact reason, because they felt those concessions would lead to a loss of push for serb independence. the accepted history of the event- that Ferdinand was killed because his politics were too conciliatory, and would blunt the impetus for nationalist rebellion? Discendo Vox has issued a correction as of 20:03 on Apr 27, 2016 |
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Apr 27, 2016 19:53
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Constant Hamprince posted:As someone who grew up during the Bush years I still have a lingering suspicion that random chance is a better selector of head of state than the average American voter. Well coming from the country where crown appointee Michaelle Jean saw her shadow and cast 7 more years of Harper on the land like a nightmare groundhog by proroguing this is pretty rich The canadian system as a whole is pretty hilariously absurd in its reliance on the 'good governance' x-factor and the weird representative apportionment and tbh that it hasn't imploded spectacularly is proof positive that canadian politeness is absolutely not a stereotype (large rodent analogy because  )
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Apr 27, 2016 21:08
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Discendo Vox posted:OK, lemme rephrase, because I'm genuinely not particularly knowledgeable about the time period. Is this: In short: Ferdinand's conciliatory liberalism toward the empire's non-Austro-Hungarian subjects was a contributory factor, but not the main reason why the Black Hand was jonsing to bump him off. Further discussion of the causes of WWI should probably go in a more specific thread, as tempting as it is to go into much greater depth here.
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Apr 28, 2016 02:43
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Discendo Vox posted:OK, lemme rephrase, because I'm genuinely not particularly knowledgeable about the time period. Is this: It's not totally clear - the black hand society that performed the assassination had very close links to the Serbian government and links to the Russian government. It seems likely that the intent was to provoke a war between Austria-Hungary and Serbia, the Russians would join in and their would be a short, easy victory leading to the creation of Greater Serbia. The fact that Ferdinand would diffuse tensions was just a side bonus rather than the main thrust (provoke a war). Edit: There are entire books about this topic, Captain MacFarlane is right that it's another thread.
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Apr 28, 2016 02:49
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Thanks folks, sorry for the derail. Kings Mountain ‘medicine man’ charged over guns, liquor still Discendo Vox has issued a correction as of 03:23 on Apr 28, 2016 |
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Apr 28, 2016 02:56
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New post for new content: Ammon Bundy offered to plead guilty to federal conspiracy after arrest, lawyer says quote:Three days after his arrest, Ammon Bundy offered to plead guilty to a federal conspiracy charge in the takeover of the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge if the government dismissed charges against others in custody and let people still at the refuge leave peacefully without arrest, his lawyer says. The 24 page motion is available through the quoted, linked story, and is also very worth reading.
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Apr 28, 2016 03:23
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Discendo Vox posted:New post for new content: "The government has too much evidence on my client (much of it created and put out there by my client), and it's bullshit that I have to defend this and read it all. Try him now or I'll write a stronger worded memo!"
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Apr 28, 2016 03:51
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Marijuana Nihilist posted:the bundy ranch Facebook page is deliciously outraged by the trial being pushed to next February Anyone know if the court trying this case is one of the courts with a vacancy owing to the GOP blocking most of Obama's nominations to the federal bench? If so it would be deliciously ironic, because you know these idiots support blocking O'bummer's socialist communist judges  to the bench.
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Apr 28, 2016 04:19
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Discendo Vox posted:New post for new content: Of course Ammon is still trying to play the hero to his followers by claiming he would be a martyr if only the tyrannical government had listened to is totally reasonable request. Anything to keep up his SovCit sainthood. OAquinas posted:"The government has too much evidence on my client (much of it created and put out there by my client), and it's bullshit that I have to defend this and read it all. Try him now or I'll write a stronger worded memo!" At some point even the most dedicated or delusional lawyers start to realize when a case has no prayer. This guy sound like he reached that point a while ago and is just trying the least stupid thing his client asks.
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Apr 28, 2016 04:45
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VikingSkull posted:yeah but at that level of simplification it's just as likely he was killed because of youthful naivety and chance, too that sounds like a lot like accelerationism tbh
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Apr 28, 2016 04:57
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Might not be a great idea for Ammon to grandstand in ways that piss off his co-defendants. It's not like they need all that much incentive to roll on him, they're sitting in jail too.
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Apr 28, 2016 05:24
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Flavahbeast posted:that sounds like a lot like accelerationism tbh it was more a reference to the Archduke's choice of transport and the route taken, but yeah you can apply it to the Black Hand, too
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Apr 28, 2016 05:35
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Kazak_Hstan posted:Might not be a great idea for Ammon to grandstand in ways that piss off his co-defendants. It's not like they need all that much incentive to roll on him, they're sitting in jail too. What's there to roll over on? They recorded everything proudly. His plea deal was refused because they have no difficulties in prosecution. That and let 50 people go just for lil ol' me is thinking highly of yourself.
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Apr 28, 2016 05:44
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How about instead of 24 backboard shattering slam dunks you only do one? Please?
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Apr 28, 2016 06:17
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Constant Hamprince posted:Lol don't fool yourself dog, the American Revolution was a tax revolt dressed up in Enlightenment era costume. If the founding fathers were for all for real about freedom you guys wouldn't have had to fought a civil war over treating black people like cattle. This is a common belief, especially for those just coming to terms with the idea that maybe the founding fathers weren't living gods, but like most such Recently Woke history it's overbroad in its sweeping generalizations. In fact, the founding fathers were (generally) quite earnest in their ideals; they viewed the united states as a grand experiment in government, and truly believed they were correcting the problems they'd identified in British government, previously itself viewed as an excellent model of Enlightenment-era thinking. (They did, but they also created several new problems, too.) And meanwhile they were all massive hypocrites about the slaves, which several of them acknowledged but didn't do anything about.
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Apr 28, 2016 06:29
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Quorum posted:This is a common belief, especially for those just coming to terms with the idea that maybe the founding fathers weren't living gods, but like most such Recently Woke history it's overbroad in its sweeping generalizations. In fact, the founding fathers were (generally) quite earnest in their ideals; they viewed the united states as a grand experiment in government, and truly believed they were correcting the problems they'd identified in British government, previously itself viewed as an excellent model of Enlightenment-era thinking. (They did, but they also created several new problems, too.) And meanwhile they were all massive hypocrites about the slaves, which several of them acknowledged but didn't do anything about. Actually, I think you'll find that God himself wrote the Constitution, and you can tell by the use of CAPITALIZATION if you actually know how to read it. 
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Apr 28, 2016 06:40
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Quorum posted:This is a common belief, especially for those just coming to terms with the idea that maybe the founding fathers weren't living gods, but like most such Recently Woke history it's overbroad in its sweeping generalizations. In fact, the founding fathers were (generally) quite earnest in their ideals; they viewed the united states as a grand experiment in government, and truly believed they were correcting the problems they'd identified in British government, previously itself viewed as an excellent model of Enlightenment-era thinking. (They did, but they also created several new problems, too.) And meanwhile they were all massive hypocrites about the slaves, which several of them acknowledged but didn't do anything about. I do love how many were like 'boy it sure is hard to reconcile my ideas and rhetoric with the 50+ people I keep chained in servitude to me, but eh, I really really don't want to pay them.' And wasn't Jefferson predicting it would end up being a war eventually? 'One day this is gonna be a whole loving thing, but hopefully I'll be dead and someone else can deal' exact words of the founders obv.
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Apr 28, 2016 11:37
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Ron Paul Atreides posted:I do love how many were like 'boy it sure is hard to reconcile my ideas and rhetoric with the 50+ people I keep chained in servitude to me, but eh, I really really don't want to pay them.' yep; "our contempt for the black man, combined with his understandable desire for revenge for everything we've inflicted on him, will lead to race war which will exterminate everyone" he also said something like "we're holding onto a wolf; we can never let go!" vis a vis slavery near the end of his life (after he'd sold off his bastard kids with sally heming)
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Apr 28, 2016 13:37
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Ron Paul Atreides posted:I do love how many were like 'boy it sure is hard to reconcile my ideas and rhetoric with the 50+ people I keep chained in servitude to me, but eh, I really really don't want to pay them.' quote:And wasn't Jefferson predicting it would end up being a war eventually? 'One day this is gonna be a whole loving thing, but hopefully I'll be dead and someone else can deal'
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Apr 28, 2016 13:37
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theflyingorc posted:Whereas all of us would have behaved differently than they in the same circumstances, what with our inherently superior moral fiber. Well, a bunch of the founding fathers freed their slaves after the revolution, and a bunch more never owned slaves in the first place because they thought it was evil. It's not like this particular institution of slavery didn't face significant opposition since its beginning. I mean, sure, it would be more likely that any given one of us would have done the same then than now, but moral relativism isn't quite as much in play as you might think. The Larch has issued a correction as of 13:45 on Apr 28, 2016 |
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Apr 28, 2016 13:43
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Ron Paul Atreides posted:I do love how many were like 'boy it sure is hard to reconcile my ideas and rhetoric with the 50+ people I keep chained in servitude to me, but eh, I really really don't want to pay them.' Oh yeah, and Patrick Henry explicitly said that slavery was incompatible with his ideas of liberty and Christian dignity, but also, he was poo poo at manual labor and would be completely sunk without all that free labor. Like a lot of his fellows he assuaged his conscience by resolving to educate the next generation to do without, something that for a number of reasons did not happen at all.
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Apr 28, 2016 13:45
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The Larch posted:Well, a bunch of the founding fathers freed their slaves after the revolution, and a bunch more never owned slaves in the first place because they thought it was evil. It's not like this particular institution of slavery didn't face significant opposition since its beginning. My point is that the human condition is horrifying and our ideas about ourselves as moral are largely shaped by our circumstances, not much more.
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Apr 28, 2016 13:45
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theflyingorc posted:My point is that the human condition is horrifying and our ideas about ourselves as moral are largely shaped by our circumstances, not much more. We are all meat, consciousness was a mistake, and only death is certain.
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Apr 28, 2016 13:49
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theflyingorc posted:My point is that the human condition is horrifying and our ideas about ourselves as moral are largely shaped by our circumstances, not much more. If anything, it's testament to the human ability to become accustomed to even the most heinous of evils. While most people with a decent education and moral upbringing were on some level aware of the evil of holding a human being in bondage, they also were exposed on a regular basis to the practice from a young age, so that awareness stayed on a very intellectual, not visceral, level. So you get all those self-justifications-- oh well it would be too hard, oh well it would cause race riots, oh we'll get rid of it with the next generation. I would suggest that global poverty is a similar situation for us today.
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Apr 28, 2016 13:55
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theflyingorc posted:My point is that the human condition is horrifying and our ideas about ourselves as moral are largely shaped by our circumstances, not much more. We shape the circumstances for the next generation though, so this is an abdication of responsibility. We inherited things from our forebears, as they did from theirs, back and back unto the first generation. That things are better now (significantly fewer people in involuntary bondage if nothing else) is a debt we pay by trying to leave the world better than we found it. The human condition is amazing and if we were properly grateful we'd all practice ancestor worship.
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Apr 28, 2016 13:58
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cumshitter posted:How about instead of 24 backboard shattering slam dunks you only do one? You can only break that backboard so many times before you just have to call it done.
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Apr 28, 2016 14:47
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theflyingorc posted:My point is that the human condition is horrifying and our ideas about ourselves as moral are largely shaped by our circumstances, not much more. I was being funny not judgemental
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Apr 28, 2016 15:25
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Marijuana Nihilist posted:suck it down sovcit idiots I hope this is what the judge says before the final gavel bang.
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Apr 28, 2016 18:41
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I typed up almost two pages today without citations as a brief summary of the lead up and occupation of Malheur. The next section is gonna be a synopsis of the various loony filings they've made. I'm having as much fun as I can in footnotes, though. quote:Finicum's tale shows the sharp line between fact and fiction. In real life, the lone wolf gunman fumbled his draw and was quickly incapacitated. Thanks thread for posting lots of links you've helped me out a lot. Something I genuinely learned today - Terry Nichols was full on toot toot I'm not a citizen you have no jurisdiction over me years before he and McVeigh blew up the Murrah building. He also had a mail order filipino bride and killed the baby she was delivered with.
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Apr 29, 2016 04:39
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I don't believe it's accurate to say Finicum fumbled in his draw. If you watch some of his earlier videos he talks frequently about being willing to die. If anything I think he was fake drawing to get the cops to shoot an unarmed man head on in cold blood. If that was his goal then he hosed up by doing it a third time after turning away from the two gun holding OSP officers to face the officer holding the tazer (not that anyone who is pro-Freedom would make the distinction)j. It's consistent with what he said in his first interview hiding under the tarp. He wanted to make it easy for the FBI to find him by being under a blue tarp in a white snowy field and he said he wasn't going to fire until fired upon. He knew the entire time that he was walking it up to the line and doing the political protest equivalent of waving your finger in someone's face while shouting, "I'm not touching you! I'm not touching you!" but I guess somehow making the government pull the trigger on him was some kind of moral victory. Which in retrospect it was, because his funeral became a rallying cry for other disaffected fringe weirdos. I recently laid a red, white, and blue "Excavator" horsecock modeled dildo at the shrine where his tarp cross was erected.
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Apr 29, 2016 07:29
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quote:United States of America vs Ammon Bundy The Bundy ranch facebook page is a goldmine of craziness, while also asking for money every day.
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Apr 29, 2016 10:31
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