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At no point in any of the gameplay videos I've seen does the player look like he's under any real pressure or threat. Also the enemies all warping in is kind of dumb, it entirely removes that 'oh poo poo' moment when you walk into a new area and everything notices you. The only enemies that seem to be already placed in the world are trash zombies who don't even appear to have weapons, as if they just decided "ok I guess we need to have something to shoot all time time so let's just throw these dudes everywhere". There's no real tactics required, you're only ever fighting one or maybe two enemies that matter, and once they're dead the next one or two show up. Classic Doom had a lot of threat management and poo poo that just looks totally absent here. I get that they're making a totally different game than the original Doom, but the game they ended up making seems worse in pretty much every non-graphical way (and even in some of the graphical ways, the whole world looks pretty same-y and uninteresting)
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May 1, 2016 21:44
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Brooks Cracktackle posted:At no point in any of the gameplay videos I've seen does the player look like he's under any real pressure or threat. Like they've said in the videos, these guys have played the game a million times and it's not a good representation of difficulty. And they often give themselves way more upgrades than they may have had at that point. I'd take stuff like difficulty level or pressure with a grain of salt based on those videos. And it's a pretty long campaign, the later areas shown had you fighting a lot of interesting classic enemies. I doubt every new area will just throw zombies at you, I can guarantee you'll be surprised by a random Imp or whatever.
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May 1, 2016 21:49
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Brooks Cracktackle posted:At no point in any of the gameplay videos I've seen does the player look like he's under any real pressure or threat. Yeah I watched another hour of gameplay of this game to be open minded and cool and good, and while I admit I will buy it when it's 15 dollars this Christmas sale, I was a little bummed out to see you can just double or triple jump is probably why they removed rocket jumps. No skill, no health lost, and you still get to be super mobile and dodge poo poo. Devs when you read our very famous gaming forum, take my advice: Just make it a regular 1 jump game, and add rocket jumps back again.
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May 1, 2016 21:51
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Heavy Metal posted:Like they've said in the videos, these guys have played the game a million times and it's not a good representation of difficulty. Sure, but watch that video of John Romero playing E1 of Doom with some nerd from IGN and it still looks like they're under way more pressure from enemies in that game than in anything we've seen here. If they're showing off their game in an unrealistic manner, it's absolutely to the detriment of the game (usually you want to stack the deck to make your game look better, not shittier)
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May 1, 2016 21:53
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Brooks Cracktackle posted:Sure, but watch that video of John Romero playing E1 of Doom with some nerd from IGN and it still looks like they're under way more pressure from enemies in that game than in anything we've seen here. If they're showing off their game in an unrealistic manner, it's absolutely to the detriment of the game (usually you want to stack the deck to make your game look better, not shittier) I just think you're taking the little snippets you've seen way too literally. You said you think the only pre-placed enemies in the game are zombies, just because a couple early areas of the game are like that. The gameplay in general doesn't look lovely to me, looks fun, but I'll review it when I play it in a couple weeks. As for comparing to the original, the zombiemen even with their rifle were never much of a threat. Also, the thing you said about only ever fighting one or two enemies that matter at once isn't true either. Have you watched any of the hell area gameplay? Some parts end up with a lot of bigger enemies. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zsoDh6TIKDo&t=49m52s Heavy Metal fucked around with this message at 22:03 on May 1, 2016 |
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May 1, 2016 21:55
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Heavy Metal posted:I just think you're taking the little snippets you've seen way too literally. You said you think the only pre-placed enemies in the game are zombies, just because a couple early areas of the game are like that. The gameplay in general doesn't look lovely to me, looks fun, but I'll review it when I play it in a couple weeks. cool ok, find me a point in this video where he's fighting more than one or maybe 2 things that is actually a threat to him at once https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i92rgRDT0lI He's got what looks like every weapon in the game, so this isn't early game content
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May 1, 2016 22:06
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Brooks Cracktackle posted:cool ok, find me a point in this video where he's fighting more than one or maybe 2 things that is actually a threat to him at once https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i92rgRDT0lI Sure, not every part of the game has lots of monsters at once. It's been a bit since I watched the streams, I'll try to find a moment for ya, but there were several of those big battle moments where there were plenty of enemies coming at you at once. Here's one of them, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zsoDh6TIKDo&t=30m11s And that's an early area, there will surely be some more hectic encounters. But as another poster pointed out, it's not all about number of enemies. A few enemies say Imps bouncing around the walls creatively is more dangerous than a crowd of dumb slow imps. And I love classic Doom, still play it, I just think the combat in this game in general does look pretty good. I've played slaughter maps where you can run right by a crowd of thirty Imps without getting hit, number of enemies isn't the be all end all. And as odd as it may seem, you don't want walls and walls of meat to shoot every single step in an FPS level. This has been discussed on level design when it comes to classic Doom as well, not everybody agrees that there needs to be lots of monsters in every hallway. There's more to level design than that, or can be, depending on what you're going for.
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May 1, 2016 22:14
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Unless they changed something between the alpha and the finished game, you can rocket jump with the gauss cannon in SP.
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May 1, 2016 23:12
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Rocket jumping was something out of Quake, anyway. It was never in the original Doom and would have been completely pointless in Doom 3, aside from multiplayer. Doom never had rocket jumping because you couldn't even look up or down, let alone jump. Why are people hung up on rocket jumping like it was ever some key mechanic in Doom?
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May 1, 2016 23:30
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Hellburger99 posted:Rocket jumping was something out of Quake, anyway. It was never in the original Doom and would have been completely pointless in Doom 3, aside from multiplayer. Doom never had rocket jumping because you couldn't even look up or down, let alone jump. Why are people hung up on rocket jumping like it was ever some key mechanic in Doom? Unless you count E3M6's secret exit, classic Doom really didn't have rocket jumps. That being said, it'd be a decent fit in DO4M.
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May 1, 2016 23:33
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GyverMac posted:Judging from the singleplayer stream and the leaked trailer, I guess the UAC has been changed from a regular cynical weapons research company to a full blown crazy pseudo scientology cult with billionaire backing. I kinda liked the backstory in Doom 3, where the UAC was unwittingly opening a portal to hell, however now they seem to be actively trying to do just that, along with arranging pilgrimages into hell, and asking for peoples souls over a workplace PA system? That and their CEO seems to be a laser sword wielding anime bad guy. The story seems to be really weird, and I look forward to see what exactly they are going for with all this. i'm getting the impression that you're supposed to be the same doomguy from doom 1 and 2 just further in the future, like he got frozen or some poo poo.
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May 1, 2016 23:56
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This is probably dumb and OCD as crap but I wish the game wouldn't encourage glory kills as much as it does, and I wish it did that by: -Not giving additional drops and rewards for glory kills -Not using ammo when you shoot monsters who are staggered, so you're not punished in the ammo department when compared to doing an ammo free glory kill I realize the 2nd point is a bit abstract but the idiot min maxer in me is going to be thinking about that a lot as I glory kill because it gives out better rewards. GreatGreen fucked around with this message at 00:05 on May 2, 2016 |
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May 2, 2016 00:02
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Brooks Cracktackle posted:At no point in any of the gameplay videos I've seen does the player look like he's under any real pressure or threat. I don't think there's much need to worry, if nothing else, they said even the devs haven't beat the game on Super Ultranightmarecore or whatever difficulty, so I don't think not enough pressure is going to be a problem. I mean difficulty doesn't necessarily equate to pressure but it's not like the demons are gonna headshot you with hitscan sniper rifles and perfect aim, so I'm gonna guess the difficulty comes from too many demons throwing too much poo poo at you and you not being able to keep up--I can't imagine what else it could be based on the gameplay shown so far. I don't think there's any way Doom 4 will be less intense than the originals; this relates to why I don't necessarily want Doom 1/2 gameplay in a new Doom, that would make the game too easy. The only reason the originals have any difficultly on modern controls is because the map maker is actively trying to gently caress you over, the enemies by themselves are hardly a threat, it's only when they're used by the map in a certain way that you start getting pressured, and once you realize this, most of the time it's only a matter of extricating yourself from that spot on the map with the turbo button to get out of that jam. A pinkie for example has basically zero chance of ever even scratching you unless the level you're on practically throws you down into a dark 1x1m pit with 20 of them inside. Compare this with the Doom 4 pinkie, yeah if it were by itself it's probably still not much of a threat, but it seems like it can charge fast enough and your own strafe speed is slow enough that if you're even a little off your game, you have a good chance of getting a chunk bitten out of you before you easily slaughter it. To me this has the potential to create way more interesting and intense scenarios than battling some closet trap or being pressured because the level spawn happens to be in the middle of a raised walkway with no cover and enemies surrounding you on all sides. Not to knock on the originals, I have fond memories of them and I still find fights with archviles in them or baphomet fights if I pretend I don't know how to kill the thing really fun and hectic, but almost every other encounter feels kind of tedious in a 'the outcome is obvious, I wish I had a quad damage so I can ffw' kind of way.
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May 2, 2016 00:10
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Hellburger99 posted:Rocket jumping was something out of Quake, anyway. It was never in the original Doom and would have been completely pointless in Doom 3, aside from multiplayer. Doom never had rocket jumping because you couldn't even look up or down, let alone jump. Why are people hung up on rocket jumping like it was ever some key mechanic in Doom? because damaging yourself in exchange for mobility is an iconic part of arena shooters, something they keep billing this thing as.
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May 2, 2016 00:26
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Pomp posted:because damaging yourself in exchange for mobility is an iconic part of arena shooters, something they keep billing this thing as. Yeah I really don't know a better way to explain rocket jumping to people who don't rocket jump but they added it in Doom 3 for a reason because they knew the engine was a bit sluggish and the gameplay was a bit slow, so they wanted to give it a little taste of Quake. This game is absolutely being marketed as the new extreme gore filled violent i dare u to try and 1v1 me, winner buys the next round of mtns!!!, if it truly is flashier and faster than Doom 3 was (it has to be or it'll have the same criticism the previous game in the series faced) why would it not have the more useful than ever rocket jumps instead of double jumps and boosters and poo poo? Double jumps and boosters are clearly a simpler, easier way to make the player avoid taking damage in singleplayer and in multi, just because I made a few new Doom jokes doesn't mean we have to start pretending to be retarded to lie about obvious changes in game mechanics. edit Also rocket jumping is harder on console than pc I'm sure, making it again a pandering to console kids to replace it with "press A a bunch of times while holding the joystick forward"
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May 2, 2016 00:41
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Rocket jumping is basically something you can't do on console, and one of many reasons why XBox TF2 had to be segregated from the PC player base.
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May 2, 2016 00:52
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Trying to imagine soldiers in TF2 without rocket jump makes my brain hurt.
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May 2, 2016 01:01
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One of the reasons why I played so much Soldier in TF2 is because it reminded me strongly of Q2 movement with the Q2 rocket launcher.
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May 2, 2016 01:07
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A.o.D. posted:One of the reasons why I played so much Soldier in TF2 is because it reminded me strongly of Q2 movement with the Q2 rocket launcher. At least Doomguy moves a lot faster in this than TF2 Soldier, he's got that going for him. At least for me playing TF2 Soldier didn't feel quite as good after playing a lot of the Doom beta.
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May 2, 2016 01:09
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I think it's the lack of a railgun.
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May 2, 2016 01:12
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Do the glory kills give anything except extra ammo?
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May 2, 2016 02:45
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wipeout posted:Do the glory kills give anything except extra ammo? They give you a severe sense of fuckawesome.
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May 2, 2016 02:47
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I bet this game won't even get a Cacoward.
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May 2, 2016 02:52
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wipeout posted:Do the glory kills give anything except extra ammo? Glory
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May 2, 2016 03:07
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If you do 500 glory kills you unlock a coupon to take 20 cents off of the season pass.
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May 2, 2016 03:09
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the Doomworld community is just flippin out over the lighting in the secret levels
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May 2, 2016 04:36
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Keith Stack posted:I bet this game won't even get a Cacoward.
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May 2, 2016 04:43
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A.o.D. posted:One of the reasons why I played so much Soldier in TF2 is because it reminded me strongly of Q2 movement with the Q2 rocket launcher. I love that they made a rocket launcher called "the original" in TF2 that comes out of the middle of the screen instead of the side, just like Quake 
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May 2, 2016 05:33
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Buca di Bepis posted:the Doomworld community is just flippin out over the lighting in the secret levels
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May 2, 2016 05:59
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Buca di Bepis posted:the Doomworld community is just flippin out over the lighting in the secret levels When I was a kid, I wanted a bagel but I didn't want any cream cheese on it. I told my babysitter this--I said I wanted a bagel, but hold the cream cheese--yet when he grabbed me a bagel, he stared straight into my eyes as he smeared a ridiculous amount of cream cheese on it. That's what Marty Stratton's doing with these Doom "easter eggs".
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May 2, 2016 06:10
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Granted, I've never done lighting anything more advanced than Quake 1, so maybe it's way more work than I'm imagining, but it seems weird to go to the trouble of doing everything else for an easter egg segment and then punt on the lighting. And on properly rotating STARTAN, I guess.
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May 2, 2016 06:25
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YUU7_BthBWM&t=641s
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May 2, 2016 07:18
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Pablo Gigante posted:You've been able to go backwards since SMB2 and butt slide since SMB3 Sure, but those were total rewrites of the engine, more comparable to Doom 3 and 4 than Doom 2 and Final Doom. Japanese SMB2, on the other hand, now that is Doom 2 comparable. Vikar Jerome posted:i'm getting the impression that you're supposed to be the same doomguy from doom 1 and 2 just further in the future, like he got frozen or some poo poo. Didn't humanity go all but extinct after 2? And he stayed in Hell after 64?
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May 2, 2016 08:33
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Zaphod42 posted:I love that they made a rocket launcher called "the original" in TF2 that comes out of the middle of the screen instead of the side, just like Quake It also has the Quake sound effects. It is my favoritest gun in TF2.
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May 2, 2016 11:19
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Keith Stack posted:I bet this game won't even get a Cacoward. Jesus, what a callback. 
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May 2, 2016 14:38
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Keiya posted:Sure, but those were total rewrites of the engine, more comparable to Doom 3 and 4 than Doom 2 and Final Doom. The official story of Doom 2 is that you enabled a significant portion of Earth's population to escape to another planet by like a third of the way through the game.
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May 2, 2016 16:13
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fishmech posted:The official story of Doom 2 is that you enabled a significant portion of Earth's population to escape to another planet by like a third of the way through the game. Yeah that's the blurb you see when you do the map Circle of Destruction. At the end of that map you pull a switch which enables humanity to escape the planet and you end up being the last human on Earth.
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May 2, 2016 16:16
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Keiya posted:Didn't humanity go all but extinct after 2? And he stayed in Hell after 64? There was a fleet of ships waiting to escape Earth that you need to bail out in MAP11.
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May 2, 2016 16:20
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Anyone mind posting their favorite controls for doom 1/2, or why my mouse won't work? I remember as a kid my mouse never worked so I just used arrow keys, but I am now spoiled, fat, and gay
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May 2, 2016 16:48
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extra stout posted:Anyone mind posting their favorite controls for doom 1/2, or why my mouse won't work? I remember as a kid my mouse never worked so I just used arrow keys, but I am now spoiled, fat, and gay Get a source port. Something like Zdoom where you can enable mouse aim but leave the other extra stuff like jumping off if you prefer.
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May 2, 2016 16:56
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