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goddamnedtwisto posted:60% of the electorate would vote for a pile of pig offal if it had the right-coloured rosette on it. I thought he only got about 25% of the vote in the last GE?
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May 6, 2016 11:48
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StoicFnord posted:ignoring the huge amount of Labour members who voted for Corbyn, as if we are all idiots or something. I'm too polite to comment. StoicFnord posted:Tory Austerity is killing people. More austerity wont do poo poo. That's what the membership voted for. Why don't you try getting on board as opposed to just saying the 5 words every 10 minutes? I'm not a Labour party member.
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May 6, 2016 11:48
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Undead Hippo posted:Seeing an election result that is basically a damp squib kills that dream dead. Which means Corbyn is a failure, under the terms on which I voted for him. And I think that's the terms a lot of you voted for him under too. I don't think so. Sure, a Great Socialist Awakening would be lovely, but realistically those don't happen without people putting in years of work promoting socialism. What I want from Corbyn was 1) democratization of the party, to give members control over policy, and 2) left wing policies, to shift the Overton window to the left. Both of those things take time. I didn't expect Labour to achieve great electoral victories for the simple reason that FPTP doesn't work like that. The left is divided, so ousting the Tories requires tactical voting. If there is one obvious alternative party to vote for, people will vote for that - unless it massively fucks up. The LibDems did so in 2010, and lost SW England back to the Tories. Labour did that over many years and have lost Scotland to the SNP. It won't get Scotland back until the SNP makes mistakes of similar magnitude. Oh dear clone fucked around with this message at 11:58 on May 6, 2016 |
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May 6, 2016 11:50
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Pissflaps posted:I'm not a Labour party member. If you want a voice in the selection of the Labour Leader, or the direction of the party, then why don't you get involved? Instead you parrot the 5 words. Because its easy to say them, rather than do something. It doesn't make you sound smart, it makes you sound like a one note soundbite.
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May 6, 2016 11:52
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goddamnedtwisto posted:60% of the electorate would vote for a pile of pig offal if it had the right-coloured rosette on it. Maybe that's not practical in a GE, where even though you're voting for the individual they'll still be under the party whip (although maybe that's a separate argument about how strong the whip should be), but for roles like the PCC if we must have them elected and not appointed then party politics should be kept out of it as much as possible. Being as we probably can't stop people from knowing that, for example, Labour Shadow Attorney General Willy Bach is a member of the Labour Party, we can at least take it off of the ballot.
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May 6, 2016 11:54
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StoicFnord posted:If you want a voice in the selection of the Labour Leader, or the direction of the party, then why don't you get involved? I don't want to get involved in the Labour Party. I'm not a politician or an activist, just another voter with an opinion.
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May 6, 2016 11:55
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Pissflaps posted:I don't have the inclination to get involved in the Labour Party. I'm not a politician or an activist, just another voter with an opinion. When you have a good opinion, let us know, eh? Usually starts with not calling the person your taking with an idiot.
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May 6, 2016 11:55
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Pissflaps posted:I'm glad you can be so sanguine about another nine years of a Tory government that is literally killing people. For some, the sky is most definitely falling. I know you don't think Corbyn is a good leader of the Labour party, but do you genuinely think that any of the proposed alternative candidates would have a) been more popular with the overall Labour voting population b) been able to GAIN votes from previously undecided/other party voting people (while simultaneously not losing current or previous voters) and c) been able to effectively challenge or break through Tory rhetoric? I'm sure some would have dealt better with the media but I genuinely can't see any of them making inroads against this government anyway. I had hoped Corbyn would be able to do all of the above much better than he currently is, so that's certainly disappointing. Given how resoundingly Labour were beaten in the GE though I'm not sure any leader would be able to bounce back and create major gains at this stage. The Tory government is killing people but it's the public who keep voting them in who are to blame, not Jeremy Corbyn. He has provided a valid alternative (albeit not as well promoted as it could have been) but apparently most people don't want it.
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May 6, 2016 11:55
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Gonzo McFee posted:Mummy's good boy Toby Young has quit running his free school after shock of all shocks running a school is hard and should be left to the professionals rather than spoilt rich twats. I bought one of his books, I now feel somewhat better.
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May 6, 2016 11:56
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StoicFnord posted:Usually starts with not calling the person your taking with an idiot. Again, I'm too polite to comment.
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May 6, 2016 11:56
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Pissflaps posted:Again, I'm too polite to comment. Look, Tony Blair wasn't your fault. We just have to bear that shame.
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May 6, 2016 11:57
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Robot Mil posted:I know you don't think Corbyn is a good leader of the Labour party, but do you genuinely think that any of the proposed alternative candidates would have a) been more popular with the overall Labour voting population b) been able to GAIN votes from previously undecided/other party voting people (while simultaneously not losing current or previous voters) and c) been able to effectively challenge or break through Tory rhetoric? I'm sure some would have dealt better with the media but I genuinely can't see any of them making inroads against this government anyway. I had hoped Corbyn would be able to do all of the above much better than he currently is, so that's certainly disappointing. Given how resoundingly Labour were beaten in the GE though I'm not sure any leader would be able to bounce back and create major gains at this stage. I don't believe that Corbyn's leadership is the best Labour can do. Politicians are supposed to serve the public, not the other way round. If he fails to engage with and persuade the electorate than the blame is his, not theirs.
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May 6, 2016 11:58
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Gonzo McFee posted:Mummy's good boy Toby Young has quit running his free school after shock of all shocks running a school is hard and should be left to the professionals rather than spoilt rich twats. It's nice he admitted his failure, it's a loving disgrace he had the opportunity in the first place.
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May 6, 2016 12:02
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Pissflaps posted:I'm glad you can be so sanguine about another nine years of a Tory government that is literally killing people. For some, the sky is most definitely falling. Ooh, I get to unironically use the term 'virtue signalling' at someone. That someone is you. Pissflaps posted:So being as he is now, but for another year? Got it. Somewhat, effectively if he stagnates then it's worrying. As it is now he is a backbencher thrust into the leadership role. While I'd love him to instantly become King Leader of Führer Mountain I'm willing to accept that taking over a leadership role requires time and effort to do right. If he continues not doing it I'll be concerned, but so far he's staved off a by-election with an increased majority, stopped Labour from tanking in the revised polling results and has seen off what was expected to be decimation today that precipitated his resignation with us going "oh, net of -8, big whoop."
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May 6, 2016 12:03
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Pissflaps posted:I don't believe that Corbyn's leadership is the best Labour can do. He persuaded enough of the public to come from obscurity to the leadership.
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May 6, 2016 12:03
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Trickjaw posted:He persuaded enough of the public to come from obscurity to the leadership. So what?
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May 6, 2016 12:04
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StoicFnord posted:Tory Austerity is killing people. More austerity wont do poo poo. That's what the membership voted for. Why don't you try getting on board as opposed to just saying the 5 words every 10 minutes? Yo, I'm one of those people and was basically forced out of the country so I didn't die on the streets. Corbyn is the only one in Labour that would ever convince me to vote for them. If he's outsted then it's the Greens for me. Tory and Tory-Lite can gently caress right off because they'll be the literal death of me either way.
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May 6, 2016 12:04
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Mods please change my name to Cannabis is safer than alcohol.
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May 6, 2016 12:04
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Speaking of which, the Home Office has set a totally for reals this time start date for the Psychoactive Substances Act, May 26th.
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May 6, 2016 12:07
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Pissflaps posted:So what? You sound like my mum. And I don't mean that in a bad way - do you seriously believe politics is honest? If Yes, I want to be your new campaign manager. Proviso, not *that* honest.
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May 6, 2016 12:09
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Theresa May 26th
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May 6, 2016 12:09
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speaking of which I saw a woman with a tattoo earlier this week, it was VII.V.MMIXVI 
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May 6, 2016 12:10
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sweek0 posted:"It's every property developer's dream to become mayor of London", he said. "You can grant your own planning permission." Wow 
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May 6, 2016 12:16
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just a note of the London mayoral election: unless UKIP make a big surge Sadiq Khan should win easily if is leading on first preferences; the Greens are third and should favour Khan, the Lib Dems seem to be fourth and they'll probably scatter a bit; the UKIP preferences will probably go all to Goldsmith. Below that you've got the Women's Equality Party, Galloway and CISTA collectively ahead of the fascists and Zylinski: and the former will probably favour Khan quite significantly, while the latter will probably go to Goldsmith (bar the anti-semitic fash votes, they'll probably exhaust). I'm pretty confident that he'll win unless these numbers are all from inner London or something odd. On the London Assembly List it looks like Labour will still hold their lead; the Greens are third and the Women's Equality Party has managed to beat Respect, all are good things.
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May 6, 2016 12:19
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Hexyflexy posted:If yes I don't know what you're trying to say about me or your mum or politics.
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May 6, 2016 12:20
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"further democratization" of the party is dead in the water; the Blairites outmaneuvered it by keeping the bare organizational hierarchy holding the party together as an entity and instead OMOVing the election system it's literally already one member one vote, how much more democratic are you going to make it the trick is that the hammering out of party policy requires that one-member-one-voting your way through the policy committees, which is a long and tedious slog. This disempowers entryist insurgencies and favours party careerists. Who are not necessarily non-left-wing (cough Corbyn cough) but are bound by the party's long-term commitments
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May 6, 2016 12:22
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Tesseraction posted:speaking of which I saw a woman with a tattoo earlier this week, it was No wait, that would be MMXCVI. Two thousand, nine, six?
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May 6, 2016 12:24
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Trickjaw posted:He persuaded enough of the public to come from obscurity to the leadership. The reports of terrible turnout make me think this is yet another fad culture moment and some of the people who paid 3 quid to vote him in have gotten bored.
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May 6, 2016 12:24
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serious gaylord posted:The reports of terrible turnout make me think this is yet another fad culture moment and some of the people who paid 3 quid to vote him in have gotten bored. Nah, it's just that the whole Labour Party electorate is maybe 1% of all voters.
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May 6, 2016 12:26
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OvineYeast posted:Nah, it's just that the whole Labour Party electorate is maybe 1% of all voters. Hence Trickjaw posted:He persuaded enough of the public to come from obscurity to the leadership. Pissflaps posted:So what?
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May 6, 2016 12:27
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Tesseraction posted:
Technically all submarines are classed as boats, whereas the research vessel named RRS David Attenborough is actually a ship!  In other news, Manchester now has an Opposition again, after former Lib Dem MP John Leech wins in Didsbury West.
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May 6, 2016 12:28
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It's just not the same. It's not even a boat!
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Pissflaps posted:Hence I am in complete agreement.
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May 6, 2016 12:28
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Paul.Power posted:7th May... 2096? yep. I haven't a loving clue what she was trying to honour, but it certainly wasn't within our concept of space-time
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May 6, 2016 12:35
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Final Welsh Assembly makeup: Labour 29 seats (-1) (27 constituency + 2 regional) Plaid Cymru 12 (+1) (6 constituency + 6 regional) Tories 11 (-3) (6 constituency + 5 regional) UKIP 7 (+7) (0 constituency + 7 regional) Lib Dems 1 (-4) (1 constituency + 0 regional) Time to offer an olive branch to the Lib Dems maybe? If nothing else, in future we could use someone taking those regional seats back from UKIP.
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May 6, 2016 12:37
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Carwyn Jones has said he's speaking to the Libs and Plaid. Would be nice of them to work together if the Welsh Libs aren't like their fuckhead English/Scottish counterparts.
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May 6, 2016 12:38
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Tesseraction posted:Carwyn Jones has said he's speaking to the Libs and Plaid. Would be nice of them to work together if the Welsh Libs aren't like their fuckhead English/Scottish counterparts. *the Welsh Lib.
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May 6, 2016 12:40
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TinTower posted:Technically all submarines are classed as boats, whereas the research vessel named RRS David Attenborough is actually a ship!
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May 6, 2016 12:41
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Paul.Power posted:Time to offer an olive branch to the Lib Dems maybe? Why? They blew any credibility they had by spending five years fagging for the Tories. I'd honestly be surprised if they still exist after the next GE.
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May 6, 2016 12:43
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Oh loving hell Livingstone is on Sky News talking about Hitler. 
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May 6, 2016 12:43
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at least he didn't do it on polling day!
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May 6, 2016 12:44
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