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Carecat posted:I hate projectiles up damage down. It might be good with some combinations but the bad damage just pushes up your ammo usage and makes everything take longer to kill. It's not worse damage though? It's less per projectile but you're shooting 3x as many projectiles per ammo used, so you end up doing more damage.
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May 9, 2016 11:08
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RPATDO_LAMD posted:It's not worse damage though? It's less per projectile but you're shooting 3x as many projectiles per ammo used, so you end up doing more damage. That's assuming all of the projectiles hit, which is not possible very often if you're not running right up to enemies (which is a bad idea). If you only hit with half of the projectiles you more or less match what your damage would have been before the upgrade, and if you hit with a third or less you're at a loss. The accuracy penalty makes it not worth picking up. edit: Adjusted for multiple projectile weapons CJacobs fucked around with this message at 11:34 on May 9, 2016 |
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May 9, 2016 11:30
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I had Scatter Shot together with Muscle Relaxant, and also the M1. I then found Metronome and everything died. When my M1 was empty, i just switched to my crossbow and continued to 1-hit kill everything. It was a pretty easy run through bullet hell
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May 9, 2016 12:46
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A glitch chest on floor one. I'd like to see someone survive that.
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May 9, 2016 12:53
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I've actually never seen a glitch chest spawn past the first floor. Only at the start of the game. It's also always a red or a black chest that's glitched 
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May 9, 2016 12:59
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My first run with the new patch gave me three ammo refills on the first floor 
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May 9, 2016 13:39
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I just found a rainbow chest on the first floor which gave me: the AKEY-47, Railgun Prototype, Compressed Air Tank, a heart container, the Charm Horn (in case i wanna steal from the shop), the Riddle of Lead and the Super Hot Watch  This is the most broken loadout i've ever had within 3 minutes of starting a run, jfc edit: i also stole an Abyssal Tentacle from the 1st floor shop with the horn HenryEx fucked around with this message at 14:16 on May 9, 2016 |
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May 9, 2016 14:12
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I did it. i finished the longest game. 2 hours 34 minutes (though i had to leave twice during it), 992 shells collected and 1118 enemies killed. Thankfully i had the map, so i could skip more than half of bullet hell and went straight for the boss. I did the entirety of bullet hell with only the Alien Engine, to give myself a tiny challenge. It was fun. 31 guns (more collected, i munched some of them), 31 passives and 8 masteries. 
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May 9, 2016 17:02
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HenryEx posted:I've actually never seen a glitch chest spawn past the first floor. Only at the start of the game. Both times I've seen one it's floor 1, double glitchholder. With a piercing weapon, it's probably doable.
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May 9, 2016 17:12
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One of the devs commented on Reddit what they're currently doing about post-launch content.quote:There will be future updates for sure. We have a whole lot of item/gun/enemy/boss/floor ideas floating around in our heads, but we're not yet sure what the future updates are going to look like. We have a small list of things that we weren't able to get into the game for launch, which we'll be releasing in free updates in the future, then we'll sit down and figure out more long term goals. Also, I feel like the ammo fix does really freaking help with late game economy now. I just wish I was better at dodging enemies on the Hollow and the Forge.
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May 9, 2016 17:14
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This game + expansions on BoI level of expansions. 
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May 9, 2016 17:16
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I AM BRAWW posted:This game + expansions on BoI level of expansions. Yeah this. The basic gameplay is so loving good compared to isaac and once it has more content it's going to poo poo all over it.
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May 9, 2016 17:35
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Klaus Kinski posted:Yeah this. The basic gameplay is so loving good compared to isaac and once it has more content it's going to poo poo all over it. I've played a whoooole lotta Isaac and 100%ed every iteration of it, and I'm way more excited for Gungeon expansions than future Isaac ones.
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May 9, 2016 18:36
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I'm a fan of both Edmund McMillen's games (particularly Super Meat Boy) and Roguelikes and for the life of me I could never see the appeal of Isaac, its basically the nadir of his aesthetic and bloody, scatological obsessions while being repetitive in a boring sort of way and not particularly fun to boot. On a more related note I think I've started to understand why I'm having such trouble with the floor 4 and 5 transition, it's to do with the health economy as determined by the bosses. I really wish that you could get guaranteed health upgrades from some other way than forcing you to flawless bosses, I've fought so many bosses and been hit exactly once and thusly spent the entire rest of the run on the backfoot because of it. Its just way too harsh, if they reversed things so that a flawless fight would give you the gun or item instead and you got the health upgrade regardless I would find things a whole lot more manageable. In the meantime I've really come to hate the way Gatling Gull can lead his shots or the minions that the Beholster can summon.
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May 9, 2016 22:22
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For me, Isaac was either "i got this great item and now im going to steamroll the game" or "all I have gotten is poo poo and I am going to slowly die over the next 5-40 minutes"
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May 9, 2016 22:39
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khwarezm posted:I'm a fan of both Edmund McMillen's games (particularly Super Meat Boy) and Roguelikes and for the life of me I could never see the appeal of Isaac, its basically the nadir of his aesthetic and bloody, scatological obsessions while being repetitive in a boring sort of way and not particularly fun to boot. As much as I hate on isaac, SMB is still one of the greatest games ever.
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May 9, 2016 22:50
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The Duggler posted:For me, Isaac was either "i got this great item and now im going to steamroll the game" or "all I have gotten is poo poo and I am going to slowly die over the next 5-40 minutes" In addition to being incredibly unsatisfying to play (I'll dig up the vlambeer video on that again if anyone wants it) this makes isaac an utter trash game for me. People who defend it almost always seem to just bring up the broken overpowered runs it gives you, but what about all the times you're eve on the third floor with no damage increases and have no option but to slooooowly pour unresponsive shots into a blob of hit points for 5 minutes? Because guess what, the RNG decides whether you get a waste of time or the overpowered run, not you. I also hate almost everything about isaac's aesthetic, while gungeon has fantastic artwork and style, which has probably what has kept me playing it for so long even though there's a lot I don't like. Then in rebirth they made the graphics look bad and pixelated for no reason, and didn't have danny B's music anymore Owl Inspector fucked around with this message at 23:19 on May 9, 2016 |
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May 9, 2016 23:16
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I enjoyed Isaac for quite a bit of time when Rebirth came out, but now with this game and Nuclear Throne I find that I enjoy the faster-paced twin stick shooter roguelites (is this a thing?) much more. I do find it pretty impossible to switch between EtG and Nuclear Throne so I'll continue to focus on this one until I clear the content, but it's nice to know there are other similarly styled games available.
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May 9, 2016 23:26
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I got Scattershot + Shock Rounds + Bouncy Bullets the other day. Fun as hell, until a caped Bulletkin spawned and I couldn't possibly not hit him because of these passives.
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May 10, 2016 00:43
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Digirat posted:In addition to being incredibly unsatisfying to play (I'll dig up the vlambeer video on that again if anyone wants it) this makes isaac an utter trash game for me. People who defend it almost always seem to just bring up the broken overpowered runs it gives you, but what about all the times you're eve on the third floor with no damage increases and have no option but to slooooowly pour unresponsive shots into a blob of hit points for 5 minutes? Because guess what, the RNG decides whether you get a waste of time or the overpowered run, not you. I'd be interested in that video!
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May 10, 2016 00:48
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lazorexplosion posted:Yeah well there's no point leaving a boss fight with blanks left in your inventory. In fact, I'd say you should have the mindset that if you left a boss fight with leftover blanks, you hosed up. Work out the hardest patterns to dodge and just blank them if they're even close to you so you only have to deal with dodging the harder patterns zero or one times instead two or three times. Being stingy with blanks in the boss room and increasing the risk you'll lose a flawless bonus is so pointless and counterproductive. While I agree that any number of blanks is not worth losing the flawless bonus, there is the possibility of a secret room in the post-boss room so having a blank to check that if you haven't found the room yet is not terrible.
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May 10, 2016 01:19
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Speaking of secret rooms, is there some secret to figuring out where they might be?
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May 10, 2016 01:44
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Gamerofthegame posted:Speaking of secret rooms, is there some secret to figuring out where they might be? they can adjoin any room, but they seem to be most common next to treasure chests or special rooms like Cursula's shop etc. Not every ammo-consuming gun can reveal cracks. The Plague Pistol won't, for instance. I suggest checking the cardinal directions leading from chest rooms. I've never seen a secret room there that wasn't straight N/E/S/W, so it's quick and cheap to check. Once you kill a boss, if you have 2 or less blanks, you'll get exactly 2 on the next floor, so you might as well spend your leftover blanks checking for secrets. The down-elevator is a good place to blank; you're there anyway. You don't need to reveal a crack before blanking. The blank will check the whole room.
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May 10, 2016 02:15
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Klaus Kinski posted:Yeah this. The basic gameplay is so loving good compared to isaac and once it has more content it's going to poo poo all over it. I really dislike everything about Isaac. The box rooms make the dungeon feel like it doesn't have a real shape, the Edgy Poop Baby aesthetic is terrible, the movement is slippery, the basic attacks feel like you're flicking acorns. Nuclear Throne is a cool+good game. The 30 FPS lock is a shame though, it would be much better if it were more fluid. Also, Nuclear Throne isn't really a roguelike, just an action game that happens to have random level shapes.
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May 10, 2016 02:22
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ThisIsACoolGuy posted:I'd be interested in that video! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AJdEqssNZ-U You can skip 11-12 minutes in for it to get interesting. This is a huge list of reasons why nuclear throne feels so much more reactive and fun moment-to-moment than isaac.
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May 10, 2016 02:43
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Zorodius posted:
...and random weapons, upgrades, enemy placements/numbers/types. It even has permadeath and bizarrely obtuse secrets, like, what else do ya need?
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May 10, 2016 02:52
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khwarezm posted:...and random weapons, upgrades, enemy placements/numbers/types. Top-down turn-based grid-based gameplay where you drink potions, read magical scrolls, and hit kobolds with longswords?
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May 10, 2016 03:45
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khwarezm posted:...and random weapons, upgrades, enemy placements/numbers/types. If you want to be pedantic, people seem to refer to games as "roguelites" if their only roguelike elements are permadeath and random runs It doesn't matter much but they are a completely different genre from real roguelikes so it does make sense to call them something else.
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May 10, 2016 04:29
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khwarezm posted:...and random weapons, upgrades, enemy placements/numbers/types. Sure, it has those things, but the gameplay isn't really about calculated risk/reward and resource management. It doesn't emphasize random modifiers interacting to produce unique challenges in each run. It's 69 parts Smash TV to 1 part Crawl. Which is cool; it's just at the furthest borderline of being Rogue-like.
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May 10, 2016 06:20
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The art direction of Issac is the sole reason I've never played it. Seems fun, the aesthetic is terrible.
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May 10, 2016 08:05
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Really wish I could clear the Cultist's past without another person. I wonder if I can somehow double-bind p1 and p2 controls to the same controller somehow...
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May 10, 2016 08:14
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Digirat posted:If you want to be pedantic, people seem to refer to games as "roguelites" if their only roguelike elements are permadeath and random runs I thought the "lite" referred to stuff like Rogue Legacy where the permadeath is ameliorated by some kind of persistent progression.
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May 10, 2016 12:04
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Gungeon is really fun, and it's hitting the points for me that Nuclear Throne didn't after playing isaac. I'm not exactly sure what those points are, but I can get way more into this game. I have a feeling it's the wacky gun selection and synergies.Okonner posted:I thought the "lite" referred to stuff like Rogue Legacy where the permadeath is ameliorated by some kind of persistent progression. "Roguelite" at this point is pretty much what people call games of other genres that borrow roguelike elements. RNG, permadeath, procedural generation mostly. Though, to me, the progression always made Rogue Legacy feel more like one of those flash "launch the character" games where you hit things and get stronger and stronger until you just beat it.
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May 10, 2016 12:30
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Okonner posted:I thought the "lite" referred to stuff like Rogue Legacy where the permadeath is ameliorated by some kind of persistent progression. Lite is in reference to basically anything that doesn't closely follow the Berlin Interpretation: a turn-based, grid-based hack'n'slash with procedural terrain generation, permadeath, complex interactions, non-modal gameplay (no change in how the game works at any time, such as a shift between overworld travel and normal gameplay or a shop interface), identification/discovery, and resource management. Honestly, though, just call it a roguelike if you want to, who cares. Gungeon hits quite a lot of those points even if you are being pedantic.
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May 10, 2016 12:32
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Digirat posted:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AJdEqssNZ-U This video's pretty great even if the poor dude seemed ultra nervous (can't super blame him either.) Isaac was my first Rogue-lite or whatever the hell you feel like calling it and I burned myself out on it getting Platinum God way back when. Years later I tried out Afterbirth and played for all of 20 or so minutes before getting frustrated with it and trashing it, it just wasn't fun and the excessive gore/poop stuff that got added just made it really really unappealing to me. I honestly, like full honesty kinda want to know what's going on through Edmunds head because it all seems a bit more uh, troubled then artistically chosen and no one seems to really talk about it from what I've seen. I honestly wonder if people like Northernlion regret becoming "the isaac guy" because I can't imagine making GBS threads out so many videos of the same drat game and just not stopping. That too just astounds me nice guy or not. That being said though Gungeon's a much cleaner game with a better visual style and I can appreciate it for that, I love how the camera works and the general game mechanics and it really does feel satisfying to shoot most of the guns and just play it in general. Once it has more room variety and DLC stuff in it and maybe some slight damage tweaks I can't imagine a reason anyone would ever want to play Isaac instead.
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May 10, 2016 13:07
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 How about next time you don't spawn the chest in front of the death roller, game?
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May 10, 2016 16:06
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Zorodius posted:Sure, it has those things, but the gameplay isn't really about calculated risk/reward and resource management. It doesn't emphasize random modifiers interacting to produce unique challenges in each run. I don't think I agree, for one (unlike Gungeon) the two weapon limit can enforce some very tough decision making and Risk over reward is definitely encouraged from multiple directions with things like Crowns, cursed weapons or characters like Rogue and Melting. Additionally ammo can deceptively problematic as you get through the levels. You can't be sure about what you'll get weaponwise or what upgrades are available and that can create inherent risks in your build, for example you may take Long Arms and Trigger Fingers if they come up early with the intention of specializing in melee but if the game doesn't drop a high end melee weapon like an energy sword you'll be up poo poo creek as things wear on. Even if we're splitting hairs over whether its Roguelike or Roguelite or whatever as far as I can see it Nuclear throne is firmly within the category of games that Isaac and Gungeon also occupy. The main difference I think is that the game has a lot less total content and can be blasted through a lot quicker. ThisIsACoolGuy posted:
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May 10, 2016 16:40
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Today I found out you can blank the dragun daggers. This makes it so much easier.
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May 10, 2016 19:29
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Do you do that while they are in the air or after they are stuck in the walls because the number of times the dragun decides to do that attack pretty much decides whether I'm winning or losing.
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May 10, 2016 19:33
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Klaus Kinski posted:Today I found out you can blank the dragun daggers. This makes it so much easier. I'm guessing you have to blank while the knife projectiles are going toward the walls? I never would have thought of that.
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May 10, 2016 19:33
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