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Codependent Poster posted:Like just imagine a Doreen Green being an intern at Stark Industries, who is super hyper and keeps trying to talk to Tony. She begs him to let her be his sidekick, says what her powers are, and he blows her off. Then in a stinger you have her shown having beaten some supervillain or having talked them into doing something better with their lives. (SQ giving a motivational speech to stop villainy is all I want.) redbackground fucked around with this message at 21:41 on May 9, 2016 |
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May 9, 2016 21:38
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Squirrel Girl should be a TV show. Not a movie.
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May 9, 2016 21:39
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ImpAtom posted:The MCU is coming up on 10 years of length and more than a dozen films. It is one of the largest and most prolific film franchises ever. Saying they 'need to wait' is insane because they're going to be releasing their 14th film this year.. *14.* The only comparable franchise is like James Bond. They have one Cosmic Marvel film and zero Magic Marvel films. You're pretending like the Marvel Universe still isn't tiny in scope when it absolutely is, restricting the kinds of heroes they can introduce or stories they can tell. Currently, anyways.
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May 9, 2016 21:39
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Toxxupation posted:Marvel Studios has Hulk rights, just not distribution rights. That's why they haven't made a solo movie and likely won't. Also they seem to think Hulk is a risky property and not worth the trouble of dealing with it. So I'd imagine that as well goes for She-Hulk. Codependent Poster posted:I thought that was rumored to be the basis for a Netflix series. That would work fine as well, but it could work for a movie too.
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May 9, 2016 21:39
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How would you do She-Hulks origins in the MCU? Banners blood already killed a Stan Lee, why must we continue this senseless irradiated blood-based killing 
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May 9, 2016 21:41
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Also, not related to this conversation, but my current favorite rumor from the MCU offices is that they keep joking about wanting to make a Squadron Supreme movie.
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May 9, 2016 21:41
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Aphrodite posted:Nobody would see Squirrel Girl. You just don't Kimmy Schmidt to get cancelled since she'd be Squirrel Girl.
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May 9, 2016 21:41
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Codependent Poster posted:Also, not related to this conversation, but my current favorite rumor from the MCU offices is that they keep joking about wanting to make a Squadron Supreme movie. They should just skip that and make it The Great Society to make it even more thinly veiled.
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May 9, 2016 21:42
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Toxxupation posted:They have one Cosmic Marvel film and zero Magic Marvel films. You're pretending like the Marvel Universe still isn't tiny in scope when it absolutely is, restricting the kinds of heroes they can introduce or stories they can tell. Currently, anyways. The Marvel films involve a group of space heroes, a genius tech, an alien god who battles space elves, a World War II hero, and as of this year will involve a super-magician. calling it 'tiny in scope' is absurd. I literally can't think of a film franchise that is comparable in genre and setting.
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May 9, 2016 21:44
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ImpAtom posted:The Marvel films involve a group of space heroes, a genius tech, an alien god who battles space elves, a World War II hero, and as of this year will involve a super-magician. calling it 'tiny in scope' is absurd. And they all hang out in Manhattan.
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May 9, 2016 21:44
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redbackground posted:Nope, it's too much. The MCU can't possibly handle something like that. Shut it down. I'd rather SG be an actual character over what she almost always is outside of her solo books, which is someone who exists on the periphery of everything to make goofs. Even SG in New Avengers basically cordons her off from the rest of the team, where she's a generic guy-puncher who's possibly the least important member of the team. Again, it's why a TV show would work for SG so well, because in a half-hour format her goofier stories can work uninterrupted. Making her a film star saddles her with a bunch of changes to be an "MCU movie headliner" that would make her Not Squirrel Girl.
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May 9, 2016 21:45
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Dexo posted:Squirrel Girl should be a TV show. Not a movie. That She-Hulk is not already announced for a Netflix series is a profound failure on the part of everyone involved in the MCU/TV production office. Jessica should start as opposing counsel on Daredevil and spin off from there.
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May 9, 2016 21:45
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Aphrodite posted:And they all hang out in Manhattan. Yes, Thor and the Guardians of the Galaxy all spend most of their time in Manhattan. Edit: Actually none of them really do. Most of the Marvel films not named Avengers spend their time outside of Manhattan. ImpAtom fucked around with this message at 21:47 on May 9, 2016 |
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May 9, 2016 21:45
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ImpAtom posted:The Marvel films involve a group of space heroes, a genius tech, an alien god who battles space elves, a World War II hero, and as of this year will involve a super-magician. calling it 'tiny in scope' is absurd. I literally can't think of a film franchise that is comparable in genre and setting. Compared to 616, which is exactly where they'd be drawing female supers from? Yeah, the MCU is tiny in scope. And again, you're ignoring my point. I want more female MCU superheroes, just not ones that are literal jokes that only work because of how they invert expectations for Cosmic/Magic Marvel.
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May 9, 2016 21:48
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rantmo posted:That She-Hulk is not already announced for a Netflix series is a profound failure on the part of everyone involved in the MCU/TV production office. Jessica should start as opposing counsel on Daredevil and spin off from there. Given Jessica Jones and Daredevil both being sorta focused on at least three law firms, it's crazy she didn't get name dropped anywhere
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May 9, 2016 21:50
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You mean Jennifer, since that's She-Hulk's first name.
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May 9, 2016 21:52
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Toxxupation posted:Compared to 616, which is exactly where they'd be drawing female supers from? Yeah, the MCU is tiny in scope. You really need to stop treating the movies like they should give a poo poo about the comics at all. They're movies. They're not comic adaptations. Civil War just came out and has almost nothing to do with its comic counterpart beyond the mere basic concept of "Iron Man and Captain America fight over a law" and a version of an iconic villain who is so absurdly different (and yet still well done) that it doesn't matter. Treat them like films and compare them to other films, not like comics.
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May 9, 2016 21:53
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Toxxupation posted:Compared to 616, which is exactly where they'd be drawing female supers from? Yeah, the MCU is tiny in scope. Most of the movies ignore huge swaths of the comic book versions of characters to tell the stories they want to tell. Why would Squirrel Girl or any other female hero not do the same?
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May 9, 2016 21:55
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ImpAtom posted:You really need to stop treating the movies like they should give a poo poo about the comics at all. They're movies. They're not comic adaptations. Ah yes, comic book movies shouldn't take inspiration from comic books. How silly of me. Kevin Feige posted:We’ve always said if there’s any “secret” it’s respect the source material, understand the source material and then, any adaptation you make from the source material should be done only to enhance whatever the original pure spirit of the source material was. Deadpool hit on all cylinders with that.
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May 9, 2016 21:56
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The Wasp in the MCU is going to be a character who basically never existed before except as a completely different character with a completely different superhero identity in a "What if" future timeline.Toxxupation posted:Ah yes, comic book movies shouldn't take inspiration from comic books. How silly of me. I like how you can't tell the difference between "taking inspiration from' and "this is a literal exact copy" less than a week after Civil War came out. Civil War is an exact example of what we're talking about here. Its similarities are entirely superficial and its themes, concepts and basically everything about it are completely different. It omits every single iconic moment from the comic and its villain is completely different from the comic version of the character. ImpAtom fucked around with this message at 21:59 on May 9, 2016 |
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May 9, 2016 21:57
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Look, in season 3 of Unbreakable Kimmy Schmidt, Kimmy gets bitten by radioactive squirrel and gains powers and a cute tail in a way that is legally and irrevocably distinct from mutation. They can run with it from there.
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May 9, 2016 21:58
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The biggest hurdle to getting a lot of these female heroes is also the biggest hurdle for new male and female superheroes in comics. They're all either derivative of other heroes or are legacy characters. The original ones that don't fall into that category, or that are derivative of characters that don't matter like Tigra, Moondragon, Thundra, White Tiger, Songbird, Miss America, or Elsa Bloodstone is that these characters really couldn't really make it as solo characters in comics much less in movies. That's not to say there's not a way to make them work in movies, but there's no incentive to try from business point of view. You don't make movies out characters that barely make waves in the comics. That's why you're also never going to see a Nova, Red Wolf, Starbrand, Spider-Man 2099 movie or solo movies for characters like Hawkeye and Vision.
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May 9, 2016 22:00
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MacheteZombie posted:Most of the movies ignore huge swaths of the comic book versions of characters to tell the stories they want to tell. Why would Squirrel Girl or any other female hero not do the same? Because Squirrel Girl was invented as a joke. There's a difference between going "let's make her origin legally and distinctly different from being a mutant" to "let's make her Not a Joke".
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May 9, 2016 22:00
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ImpAtom posted:
You said, and I'm quoting you directly here, that the movies "shouldn't give a poo poo about the comics at all". The only one exaggerating here is you. As per usual.
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May 9, 2016 22:01
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X-O posted:The biggest hurdle to getting a lot of these female heroes is also the biggest hurdle for new male and female superheroes in comics. They're all either derivative of other heroes or are legacy characters. The original ones that don't fall into that category, or that are derivative of characters that don't matter like Tigra, Moondragon, Thundra, White Tiger, Songbird, Miss America, or Elsa Bloodstone is that these characters really couldn't really make it as solo characters in comics much less in movies. That's not to say there's not a way to make them work in movies, but there's no incentive to try from business point of view. You don't make movies out characters that barely make waves in the comics. That's why you're also never going to see a Nova, Red Wolf, Starbrand, Spider-Man 2099 movie or solo movies for characters like Hawkeye and Vision. This I agree with, unfortunately. I'm not sure how they can fix it short of trying for a super-hard push of a character Cyborg-style but that is really hard to do Toxxupation posted:Because Squirrel Girl was invented as a joke. There's a difference between going "let's make her origin legally and distinctly different from being a mutant" to "let's make her Not a Joke". As opposed to Deadpool? The character who literally began as a parody of Deathstroke: The Terminator? Toxxupation posted:You said, and I'm quoting you directly here, that the movies "shouldn't give a poo poo about the comics at all". The only one exaggerating here is you. As per usual. ... No? You don't actually grasp what I'm saying? If the comic does something and the film makers want to do something different then they shouldn't give a poo poo it contradicts the comic. Which they don't. They absolutely don't give a poo poo about the comic if it gets in the way of their story. If they really think it's better for a character to be different than the character will be different. It doesn't matter if it's the Nova Corps, Baron Zemo or The Mandarin.
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May 9, 2016 22:02
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Toxxupation posted:Because Squirrel Girl was invented as a joke. There's a difference between going "let's make her origin legally and distinctly different from being a mutant" to "let's make her Not a Joke". That's pretty piss poor reasoning.
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May 9, 2016 22:03
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X-O posted:You don't make movies out characters that barely make waves in the comics. That's why you're also never going to see a Nova, Red Wolf, Starbrand, Spider-Man 2099 movie or solo movies for characters like Hawkeye and Vision.
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May 9, 2016 22:03
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MacheteZombie posted:That's pretty piss poor reasoning. Wolverine was a pretty loving joke character when he first showed up, too.
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May 9, 2016 22:03
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redbackground posted:Has Ant-Man made more "waves in the comics" than Hawkeye? Yeah, he was the creator of Ultron just like in AoU...........
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May 9, 2016 22:04
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Toxxupation posted:Like She-Hulk should've, honestly, gotten her own movie by now and its kinda crazy that Captain Marvel ends up the first female supe to get her own movie. She-Hulk's rights are probably with Universal like the Hulk's solo movies.
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May 9, 2016 22:04
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redbackground posted:Has Ant-Man made more "waves in the comics" than Hawkeye? Ant-Man started as a nearly ten year passion project by one person before the MCU was ever an idea. The only reason it wasn't canned when he walked was because it was too late.
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May 9, 2016 22:05
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redbackground posted:Wolverine was a pretty loving joke character when he first showed up, too. He's still a joke 
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May 9, 2016 22:06
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The idea that people are equating Wolverine and Deadpool with Squirrel Girl as joke characters is ridiculous. That's just arguing in bad faith and you know it. Neither have ever been actual joke characters like what Squirrel Girl became.
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May 9, 2016 22:07
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There's a total complete difference between saying "this movie should ignore comic fiat at the filmmaker's discretion" (which I agree with) and "the DNA of this character, the fundamental building blocks that establish who they are and what their themes are, should be ignored" (which I absolutely don't). And origin has a hell of a lot to do with that essential definition of a character, which means that the current scope of the MCU eliminates a ton of female superheroes off the bat. Which, again, is why I'm saying that if you're looking to other female supes you should be looking at ones based in and around the US, earth-born, humans who have pre-existing relationships with current MCU superheroes. Because it means they can be introduced more easily with a bare minimum of change to what makes them work as characters.
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May 9, 2016 22:09
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X-O posted:The idea that people are equating Wolverine and Deadpool with Squirrel Girl as joke characters is ridiculous. That's just arguing in bad faith and you know it. Neither have ever been actual joke characters like what Squirrel Girl became.
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May 9, 2016 22:10
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Call me crazy, but I think Marvel and the MCU should probably try to make some original female characters that aren't just gender swapped versions of male characters and well defined. Those would would have a much better chance at actually being successful movies. Sure female Thor is fun, but why not make a similar character and push her the same way that isn't just a duplicate of someone else? That kind of thing works in comics, but can you imagine having Spider-Man, Spider-Woman, and Silk movies all out within a year or two of each other? Do you know how fast that would kill the brand?
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May 9, 2016 22:12
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Toxxupation posted:"the DNA of this character, the fundamental building blocks that establish who they are and what their themes are, should be ignored" (which I absolutely don't). Why? They do it all the time. Is Baron Zemo bad for being so completely and utterly different from his comic version? Is Drax a worse character because he isn't a human being whose family was killed by Thanos? Did it ruin Thor that the only service paid to Donald Blake was a brief injoke on his borrowed clothes? Is Scarlet Witch really ruined when she's now an orphan with a dead brother whose powers came from a magic gem? If they make a really good character who is completely divorced from the original character but is a good character, is that bad or wrong? X-O posted:Call me crazy, but I think Marvel and the MCU should probably try to make some original female characters that aren't just gender swapped versions of male characters and well defined. Those would would have a much better chance at actually being successful movies. Sure female Thor is fun, but why not make a similar character and push her the same way that isn't just a duplicate of someone else? I'd love to see the MCU actually take on original characters a bit more honestly, but I know it's more marketable to use existing ones.
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May 9, 2016 22:13
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Female Thor is really the only example of that, though. None of the Spider-Women (well, Gwen, but that's...a whole other shitstorm) or She-Hulk has that problem. Quasar and Nova are ideals so have no baggage of gender-swapping anyways.
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May 9, 2016 22:15
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X-O posted:Call me crazy, but I think Marvel and the MCU should probably try to make some original female characters that aren't just gender swapped versions of male characters and well defined. Those would would have a much better chance at actually being successful movies. Sure female Thor is fun, but why not make a similar character and push her the same way that isn't just a duplicate of someone else? Do you actually see Marvel creating original heroes to add to the MCU or just continue to go to the well of already owned IPs? X-O posted:The idea that people are equating Wolverine and Deadpool with Squirrel Girl as joke characters is ridiculous. That's just arguing in bad faith and you know it. Neither have ever been actual joke characters like what Squirrel Girl became. The fact you continue to push that Squirrel Girl live action is an impossibility is ridiculous. You even point out in a prior post its more about economics than about storytelling. So again I say, Marvel isn't trying to adapt them.
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May 9, 2016 22:16
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Toxxupation posted:Female Thor is really the only example of that, though. None of the Spider-Women (well, Gwen, but that's...a whole other shitstorm) or She-Hulk has that problem. Quasar and Nova are ideals so have no baggage of gender-swapping anyways. ... She-Hulk is literally named She-Hulk and got her powers from an infusion of Hulk's blood. Unless you change that entirely (and I'm not opposed to that) she is absolutely derivative of another hero.
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May 9, 2016 22:16
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