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Mans posted:Natonalist idiots are attacking Portuguese people in Poland because they think we're Arabs. did they privatize sun rays during the 90's and everyone in Poland is a pale ghoul or something? stop being so brown
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May 11, 2016 08:29
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I CANNOT EJACULATE WITHOUT SEEING NATIVE AMERICANS BRUTALISED!
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| # ? May 10, 2024 03:02 |
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Mans posted:Natonalist idiots are attacking Portuguese people in Poland because they think we're Arabs. did they privatize sun rays during the 90's and everyone in Poland is a pale ghoul or something? They're attacking everyone who's not Polish right now, including Spaniards, Italians, Romanians even Ukrainians. The government encourages it through its silence in the face of the rapidly growing number of these incidents and through things like its official spokesman for equality saying, when asked, that a hotel owner has the right to deny service based on things like sexual orientation, religious faith and even color of skin if it clashes with his deeply held beliefs and convictions. Duckman needs the nationalists and hooligans who perpetrate these attacks as his military arm if poo poo goes down because PiS electorate is church grandmas and villagers.
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May 11, 2016 08:54
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Polish nationalists:
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May 11, 2016 09:16
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Don't worry, my Spanish friends were regularly attacked in the streets for their looks way before PO/PiS was a thing. Poland has always been intolerant. Of course now that this is getting silent support from the government and the average middle-class Joe got openly racist it's doubled down.
Palpek fucked around with this message at 09:39 on May 11, 2016 |
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May 11, 2016 09:36
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alex314 posted:Polish nationalists: I admire this rare moment of introspection when faced with the glorification of child soldiers
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May 11, 2016 09:38
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Pierogi posted:I admire this rare moment of introspection when faced with the glorification of child soldiers I don't know if you're being silly or you missed it but he's pissing on that child soldier's monument. edit: for non-Poles his shirt say "Death to Enemies of the Fatherland"
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May 11, 2016 09:46
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I'm pretty sure he understood the picture right.
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May 11, 2016 09:52
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Mans posted:Natonalist idiots are attacking Portuguese people in Poland because they think we're Arabs. did they privatize sun rays during the 90's and everyone in Poland is a pale ghoul or something? That's not really Poland-specific. Here in US a plane got held up because "Middle-Eastern looking" man was scribbling something strange and not explaining it to the lady sitting next to him. Turned out he was an Italian-born economics professor working for a prestigious university working out some math in preparation for a talk he was going to give.
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May 11, 2016 12:53
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alex314 posted:Polish nationalists: Maybe he thought this was the Manneken Pis.
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May 11, 2016 13:25
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A Pale Horse posted:I don't know if you're being silly or you missed it but he's pissing on that child soldier's monument. Yes I get it. If a right wing numbnut figures out we should not be celebrating child soldiers* I am all for it even if his method of expression stems from the urethra. *note that this is my headcanon only
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May 11, 2016 13:36
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Pierogi posted:Yes I get it. If a right wing numbnut figures out we should not be celebrating child soldiers* I am all for it even if his method of expression stems from the urethra. Yeah, gently caress that kid, that little smug rear end in a top hat is just trying to be the center of attention.
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May 11, 2016 16:20
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oh god. gently caress us! gently caress us for putting a literal child soldier on a pedestal for other children to admire.
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May 11, 2016 16:26
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You are right, it's not a poignant and tragic memorial to the victims of the genocide, which forced even children to suffer the horrors of war, it's a monument to the glory of child soldiery.
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May 11, 2016 16:31
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steinrokkan posted:You are right, it's not a poignant and tragic memorial to the victims of the genocide, which forced even children to suffer the horrors of war, it's a monument to the glory of child soldiery. that is precisely what is - a memorial glorifying the sacrifice of the child soldiers of Warsaw Uprising. I can imagine a more fitting monument to the obvious suffering of children, yes, even those who weren't forced to bear arms.
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May 11, 2016 16:46
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Maybe if you look at that statue and think "This is definitely meant to be awesome as hell" the problem isn't in the statue.
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May 11, 2016 17:11
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Pierogi posted:oh god. Are you forgetting that the Nazis were liquidating Warsaw building by building, killing everyone indiscriminately? Is it somehow more noble or less horrifying for children to die by an executioner's bullet than fighting back for their survival? Its not like child soldiers were a planned thing from the beginning of the uprising, they're a thing that happened because the Nazis went full Genghis Khan on Warsaw. That memorial makes me very sad, and I hope that's its intended purpose, and also makes others feel that way. I don't think it was placed for children to aspire to or admire, but rather for their parents to remember the absolute degradation of the human spirit and the annihilation of innocence that war causes.
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May 11, 2016 17:55
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I rest my case before we delve into tactilol territory of strategic value of child soldiers on the battlefield.
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May 11, 2016 18:24
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Ffs, I've posted that picture so we'd make fun of shitheads who call themselves patriots. There's something wrong with you if you think that statue glorifies child soldiers.
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May 11, 2016 18:29
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alex314 posted:Ffs, I've posted that picture so we'd make fun of shitheads who call themselves patriots. There's something wrong with you if you think that statue glorifies child soldiers. What's their angle, anyway? Why would a Polish nationalist have an issue with a memorial for a Polish fighter?
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May 11, 2016 18:38
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It's pretty clearly not saying "child soldiers are good and cool," and instead saying "look how bad it was, even children fought and died." It's not encouraging kids to become child soldiers any more than it is encouraging adults to destroy Warsaw with artillery.
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May 11, 2016 18:39
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OddObserver posted:What's their angle, anyway? Why would a Polish nationalist have an issue with a memorial for a Polish fighter? My guess is "The Nazis were after the Jews of the Warsaw ghetto" -> "The memorial is to the Jews" -> "I hate Jews" (No need to lecture me on why this is ridiculous)
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May 11, 2016 18:44
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OddObserver posted:What's their angle, anyway? Why would a Polish nationalist have an issue with a memorial for a Polish fighter? It's a homoliberonazist monument meant to oppress the Polish fighting spirit.
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May 11, 2016 18:45
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Probably just an idiot boor.
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May 11, 2016 18:48
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alex314 posted:There's something wrong with you if you think that statue glorifies child soldiers. There's something wrong with me but at least I'm not alone, here's a little retrospective: http://histmag.org/Maly-Powstaniec-duza-hanba-8501
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May 11, 2016 18:49
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I am actually curious what a monument designed to unambiguously glorify and promote child soldiering would look like. For a friend, I mean.
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May 11, 2016 18:51
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I'll just leave this awesome youtube channel here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=channel?UCS5tt2z_DFvG7-39J3aE-bQ With gems such as: How to squat like a slav https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2-8gsWZqDBM
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May 11, 2016 18:57
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Well this took a nice turn. Ideally you don't want a war. If you have a war on your hands, ideally children shouldn't fight in it. But, as this person posted: A Pale Horse posted:Nazis went full Genghis Khan on Warsaw. These people were war heroes. Yes, they were also children, and that's all sorts of hosed up. But does that mean they don't deserve a monument for their sacrifice? I don't think so. And it conveys the message of "poo poo's hosed" quite well if you ask me. You could argue the motif isn't appropriate all day, but the shock value is very well there, as evidenced by this discussion. It did exactly its job. If it was a boring plaque on some street corner, we wouldn't be having a discussion about child soldiers right now.
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May 11, 2016 19:26
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If the choices is dying with a gun in your hands or not, and you'll die all the same... Don't take a real bright kid to put it together and pick up that gun. It's one of the real problems with trying to eradicate a population rather than subjugate it. Subjugating them mostly requires taking out all the fighting age males. Eradicating them is going to involve fighting everyone, women and children included. Modern firearms' democratization of violence is probably one of the only reasons the 19th-20th centuries weren't bloodier still.
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May 11, 2016 19:42
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There's a growing (I think?) sentiment that the Warsaw uprising was a reckless mistake. It was not heroic because the outcome was predictably destructive. That it should be treated as a cautionary tale against unhealthy patriotism (which was feverish coming out of a century of boiling under bondage) rather than a noble act of defiance. Some go so far as to call it selfish martyrdom. I don't agree, but I can't say the few first hand accounts from my family left me impartial (it's not something they talked about often). Warsaw could definitely tone down the annual remembrance (celebrations?), though. Rinkles fucked around with this message at 19:53 on May 11, 2016 |
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May 11, 2016 19:50
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Imo the nuance of the statue having the helmet be too big and the weapon just hanging from the neck looking too heavy for the child to lift sway it into a victim memorial and not an idolization. The child could have been easily shown in an aggressive pose running at the enemy considering how the subject is seen in Poland. Which is an entire different matter in itself... I don't have a problem with the monument but what I'm critical of is the self-explainatory sentiment in Poland that those child soldiers were necessary sacrifices. When child soldiers in current-day conflicts are shown on the news you'll hear people being disgusted by it but somehow doing the same during WW2 in Poland (not only during the Warsaw Uprising) is glorified with no place allowed for asking questions. You will hear many reasons why it was a different situation as if those modern armies don't also have a reasoning of their own. Those Polish children were given weapons in a conflict entirely outside of their understanding to fight for a cause that the adults decided to sacrifice themselves for. You can argue that the alternative for those children was death but that's not that clearly cut just as the necessity of the Warsaw Uprising isn't. Children were consciously used as soldiers way before the Uprising started and when I read on the official websites that it's the poor underground recruiters who were "pressured" by those children into sending them to battle it really rubs me the wrong way. But before I'm eaten alive here I'll say that I don't consider either side as clearly right here but it's something I'd like to see critically considered more often because during the next conflict that Poland finds itself in I expect children to be used as soldiers way more eagerly specifically because of the glorified nature of the WW2 symbol.
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May 11, 2016 21:43
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Palpek posted:But before I'm eaten alive here I'll say that I don't consider either side as clearly right here but it's something I'd like to see critically considered more often because during the next conflict that Poland finds itself in I expect children to be used as soldiers way more eagerly specifically because of the glorified nature of the WW2 symbol. That's preposterous.
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May 11, 2016 21:50
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Ok, I went a step too far with that but if you google children soldiers in Polish you'll see how the subject is usually presented. I remember a website aimed at children saying that those soldiers "loved their country so much that they left their toys and went to help the adults free the city" and this kind of perspective makes me angry.
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May 11, 2016 22:17
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A Pale Horse posted:They're attacking everyone who's not Polish right now, including Spaniards, Italians, Romanians even Ukrainians. The government encourages it through its silence in the face of the rapidly growing number of these incidents and through things like its official spokesman for equality saying, when asked, that a hotel owner has the right to deny service based on things like sexual orientation, religious faith and even color of skin if it clashes with his deeply held beliefs and convictions. Duckman needs the nationalists and hooligans who perpetrate these attacks as his military arm if poo poo goes down because PiS electorate is church grandmas and villagers. so when did poland hate russia so much they started out-russianing the russians?
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May 12, 2016 00:15
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Rinkles posted:There's a growing (I think?) sentiment that the Warsaw uprising was a reckless mistake. It was not heroic because the outcome was predictably destructive. That it should be treated as a cautionary tale against unhealthy patriotism (which was feverish coming out of a century of boiling under bondage) rather than a noble act of defiance. Some go so far as to call it selfish martyrdom. Well the Reds din't save them. Almost as though Stalin wanted the non red poles to die needlessly.
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May 12, 2016 01:13
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Discendo Vox posted:I am actually curious what a monument designed to unambiguously glorify and promote child soldiering would look like. For a friend, I mean. 
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May 12, 2016 01:53
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OddObserver posted:What's their angle, anyway? Why would a Polish nationalist have an issue with a memorial for a Polish fighter? It's some drunk rear end in a top hat that thinks wearing partiotic t- shirt makes him better and give an opportunity to act like an rabid monkey. His brain can hold only one excuse at a time, and now it's all about "cursed soldiers". Warsaw Uprising was used about 3 years ago. Reminds me of a movie some right wing shithead made about polish hooligans, where statements of hools could be summer as "sure, we destroy stuff and steal, but should Russians attack we'll be the first to fight them".
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May 12, 2016 06:31
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May 12, 2016 08:08
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Crowsbeak posted:Well the Reds din't save them. Almost as though Stalin wanted the non red poles to die needlessly. Or maybe the Red Army had extended to the furthest point thier supplies could manage and it was just a case of poor timing by the uprising?
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May 12, 2016 08:50
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Right sector dropped propaganda pamphlets on the victory day parade in Donetsk. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hx1bPZeRwnc there is also some nice shots of the airport ruins in there.
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May 12, 2016 09:08
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Xerxes17 posted:Or maybe the Red Army had extended to the furthest point thier supplies could manage and it was just a case of poor timing by the uprising? Initially, perhaps, but it lasted for two whole months. That's plenty of time. The Soviets had also: - broadcast calls for the Poles to stage an uprising, including specifically in Warsaw, for months before they actually reached the city, - refused to provide air or artillery support, - publicly wondered whether or not the participants of the uprising are cooperating with the Germans, - refused to let Western Allied planes on supply runs use Soviet airfields, even those not in the direct vicinity of the front line, - prioritised the Balkans for supplies in full knowledge that the uprising was going on, - allowed the 1st Polish Army to cross the river and try to support the Home Army, proving they had the capacity to commit to that fight, then severely restricted any support for their beachhead until it collapsed. Compare to the Western Allied reaction to the uprising in Paris: despite being similarly unaware of the exact plans for it, they immediately dispatched two divisions to help the uprising, in spite of being similarly - if not more - hamstrung by logistics. The enemy resistance was smaller, no doubt, but it remains obvious that the Soviets, including Stalin personally, had no political will to aid the Warsaw Uprising. Claiming that they intended it to bleed out the resistance is mere speculation, of course, but saying that they totally would help you guys!!! why didn't you cooperate!!! is simply unfounded.
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May 12, 2016 13:09
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