CanPol Megathread: Big Changus

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namaste friends: Sep 18, 2004; by Smythe

It's pretty awesome that most adults can't comprehend grade school math let alone the implications of treating national income/debt like your household's.

My greatest failure in life this far is that i haven't figured out how to exploit these dumb assholes

# ? May 15, 2016 21:23

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# ? May 31, 2024 15:16

namaste friends: Sep 18, 2004; by Smythe

How much do you want to bet these people who can't do math are also the ones complaining that they're kids get too much homework

# ? May 15, 2016 21:24

JawKnee: Mar 24, 2007; You'll take the ride to leave this town along that yellow line

Cultural Imperial posted:

My greatest failure in life this far is that i haven't figured out how to exploit these dumb assholes

have you considered becoming a Realtor?

# ? May 15, 2016 21:25

EvilJoven: Mar 18, 2005; NOBODY,IN THE HISTORY OF EVER, HAS ASKED OR CARED WHAT CANADA THINKS. YOU ARE NOT A COUNTRY. YOUR MONEY HAS THE QUEEN OF ENGLAND ON IT. IF YOU DIG AROUND IN YOUR BACKYARD, NATIVE SKELETONS WOULD EXPLODE OUT OF YOUR LAWN LIKE THE END OF POLTERGEIST. CANADA IS SO POLITE, EH?; Fun Shoe

Cultural Imperial posted:

How much do you want to bet these people who can't do math are also the ones complaining that they're kids get too much homework

Kids do get too much homework, though. Elementary school is usually over a half a dozen classes a day and high school is at least 4. Every one of these teachers ends up assigning what on its own would be a paltry amount of homework but when it all comes together it leads to sometimes 2-3 hours a night.

Some school boards across the nation and overseas (discounting Asian schools because those guys are insane) are actually drastically scaling back or eliminating homework all together because they're finding it to be a detriment to a child's education.

# ? May 15, 2016 21:31

Evis: Feb 28, 2007; Flying Spaghetti Monster

Cultural Imperial posted:

How much do you want to bet these people who can't do math are also the ones complaining that they're kids get too much homework

Speaking of grade school...

Also re:Bernier, I wonder what would happen if a PM was elected that was ineligible to access classified documents because they had leaked them in the past.

Edit: I've heard that homework in some places is being replaced with video lectures to watch at home, and exercises are done at school. Seems like a better way to do things to me.

Evis fucked around with this message at 21:35 on May 15, 2016

# ? May 15, 2016 21:33

Brandon Proust: Jun 22, 2006; "Like many intellectuals, he was incapable of scoring a simple goal in a simple way"

Cultural Imperial posted:

It's pretty awesome that most adults can't comprehend grade school math let alone the implications of treating national income/debt like your household's.

My greatest failure in life this far is that i haven't figured out how to exploit these dumb assholes

# ? May 15, 2016 21:39

Jordan7hm: Feb 17, 2011; Lipstick Apathy

EvilJoven posted:

Kids do get too much homework, though. Elementary school is usually over a half a dozen classes a day and high school is at least 4. Every one of these teachers ends up assigning what on its own would be a paltry amount of homework but when it all comes together it leads to sometimes 2-3 hours a night.

Elementary school kids have 2 teachers who would conceivably assign homework. Their normal teacher for 80% of the time, and their second language teacher.

Also every elementary school I've seen has pretty solid guidelines on the amounts of homework kids get, and it's not 2-3 hours.

# ? May 15, 2016 21:43

namaste friends: Sep 18, 2004; by Smythe

look you dumb rear end psychology degree holders, math, up to about calculus 300 can be done well by pretty much anyone if they put enough loving effort into practicing it. There's only a couple heuristics you need to memorize to recognize what techniques you need to apply to a problem and then the solution become mechanical. so shut up about too much homework i swear you loving white people are the worst

# ? May 15, 2016 21:50

namaste friends: Sep 18, 2004; by Smythe

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/inquiry-exposes-holes-in-canadian-forces-mental-health-caresystem/article30021281/

quote:

Gary Collins�s voice trembled, his face reddened, and tears pooled in his eyes as he began to talk about his only son inside a silent Edmonton courtroom. He had sat at a small wooden desk for four days, poring over thick binders of exhibits and listening to 11 Canadian Forces members and mental-health specialists testify at an unprecedented Alberta death inquiry. Now, it was his turn to speak. He took a deep breath and pressed on.

His son, Shaun, was a teenager when he joined the reserves, not long before the terrorist attacks of Sept. 11, 2001, sparked the Afghanistan war. Deploying twice to the battlefield � first as a reservist and then with the regular force � Corporal Collins returned from his second tour haunted by nightmares and flashbacks.

�Shaun seen and did things over there that were against everything we taught our kids to respect,� Mr. Collins told a group of mostly government lawyers gathered for the inquiry.

His son had been a caring young man. Mr. Collins recalled how he once bought a bus ticket to Fort McMurray for a panhandler trying to get to the oil-sands mecca. If only, he lamented, Edmonton military police had shown similar compassion on March 9, 2011, the night they arrested his son for allegedly driving drunk in a black SUV.

Within two and a half hours of that arrest, the 27-year-old corporal with the Princess Patricia�s Canadian Light Infantry was found unconscious in a dark military cell, hanging from the metal-barred door. Cpl. Collins, who was being treated for post-traumatic stress disorder and clinical depression, died in a hospital two days later.

The inquiry, the first ever in Alberta to zero in on a military death, has exposed disturbing cracks in military police practices, equipment and facilities and in the Forces� mental-health-care system. The province�s police watchdog � the Alberta Serious Incident Response Team � and the military completed separate investigations into Cpl. Collins�s death, but their reports have not been publicly released. No criminal or military charges were laid in the case, a Canadian Forces spokesperson said in an e-mail.

Key breakdowns that came to light over four days of inquiry testimony included a lack of medical follow-up after Cpl. Collins asked for mental-health services after his second Afghanistan tour. Also, the military police team failed to adequately search the Forces� security information database and so were not aware of the corporal�s previous suicide threats.

I could tell you 100 stories about Shaun. He was so much more than that day.

Meanwhile, video cameras installed to watch over soldiers in the Edmonton military police cells were not working and hadn�t for years. And a defibrillator belonging to the military didn�t work when officers and a friend of Cpl. Collins frantically tried to revive the soldier.

Cpl. Collins is one of at least 62 military members and veterans who have taken their lives after deploying on the Afghanistan operation, a continuing Globe and Mail investigation has found, an alarming number that had been hidden from Canadians until recently. Another 158 soldiers died in theatre, including six who killed themselves. About 40,000 soldiers served on the 13-year mission.

Provincial court Judge Jody Moher, who presided over the inquiry, cannot assign blame, but she can make recommendations to help prevent a similar death. Although the inquiry concluded last week, her report will likely take months to complete.

National Defence lawyers urged Judge Moher to limit the scope of her recommendations, arguing the province does not have jurisdiction over a federal entity such as the military. Mr. Collins, however, pleaded for the judge to weigh in: �Why allow an inquiry if you are not going to allow recommendations?� he asked.

It was a gruelling week for Mr. Collins, and more lie ahead for the Edmonton grandfather. On Monday, he returned to another courtroom for the first-degree murder trial in the death of his eldest daughter, Shannon. Her remains were found on an acreage just outside the city in 2008. Her boyfriend, Shawn Lee Wruck, wasn�t charged until 2013. The trial is expected to last a month.

Signs of concern

Shaun Collins was a kind-hearted teenager when he joined the reserves shortly before the Sept. 11, 2001 terror attacks. The inquiry looking into his 2011 suicide, the first of its kind in Alberta, has exposed flaws in military jail safeguards and mental-health-care system.
Photo by: Courtesy Collins family
Torn apart by his sister�s slaying, Cpl. Collins began seeing military social worker Shaun Ali in 2008. He told Mr. Ali that he believed he knew who killed her and was frustrated that police hadn�t made an arrest. He also felt he was being harassed by members in his own unit because he had reported drug use by other soldiers.

Mr. Ali saw Cpl. Collins about five times over 11 months. The social worker said Cpl. Collins appeared to be doing well before he went to Afghanistan for his second tour in November, 2009, with the 1st Battalion of the Princess Patricia�s Canadian Light Infantry.

During the tumultuous deployment, Cpl. Collins erupted in the field at a master corporal. He reportedly turned in his rifle to a fellow soldier and said: �Take this from me before I kill him.� But some also heard, �Take this from me before I kill myself.� Cpl. Collins was flown out of the battlefront to see mental-health workers at Kandahar airfield base. They determined that he was not a threat to himself, Major J.M. Watson testified.

Alberta's police watchdog and the Canadian Forces completed separate investigations into Cpl. Collins�s death, but their reports have not been publicly released. Courtesy Collins family
Photo by: Courtesy Collins family
The battle group spent a few days in Cyprus decompressing before returning to Canada in May, 2010. While there, soldiers filled out a form that asked whether they wanted to speak with a mental-health worker. Cpl. Collins answered yes, but the inquiry heard that no one from the military�s medical system followed up until he called a help line in distress on Aug. 23, 2010.

Frustrated with the information he was getting, Cpl. Collins abruptly hung up the phone. Before he did, he said: �I�m done,� and �I�ve had enough.� Worried that he might be thinking about killing himself, a mental-health worker called for help and Edmonton police were dispatched to his home. Cpl. Collins told the officers it was a misunderstanding and assured them that he didn�t want to take his life.

The incident led to a session with Mr. Ali. The social worker noticed significant changes in Cpl. Collins. He was showing signs of depression and anxiety. He wasn�t sleeping well and was drinking more.

Cpl. Collins was referred for psychological and psychiatric assessments and anger-management counselling, but balked at addictions treatment. As his mental health continued to deteriorate, he threatened to take his own life twice in the fall of 2010.

The military prohibited him from handling weapons and transferred him to a woodworking shop with other ill and injured soldiers. The move was a positive change for Cpl. Collins. One of the soldiers he met was Everett Dalton, now a retired corporal.

�I tried to take care of him. Watch over him like a big brother would,� Mr. Dalton said. �I recognized what he was going through.�

Cpl. Collins wanted to get better. In early December, 2010, he turned to a psychologist outside of the military system because he worried seeking further help within would harm his career. Trauma specialist Keli Furman testified that �he was one of the most severe cases of PTSD� she had seen in her career. �There was clear evidence that he had been exposed to horrific events,� she said.

Dr. Furman worked with him to control his temper and ground him to reality. A military psychiatrist monitored his medication. He was taking an anti-depressant, sleeping pills and an anti-psychotic to stabilize his mood.

Dr. Furman met with Cpl. Collins the day before he hanged himself. She said she saw no signs then that he was a suicide risk. He was excited about his future and about getting married. He recently got a cat and was enjoying his woodworking job. He hoped he could eventually rebuild his career in the Forces.

�He knew he had a long way to go, but he was highly motivated to recover,� Dr. Furman said.

Lack of support

Cpl. Shaun Collins stands with his father, Gary, in this undated family photo.
Photo by: Courtesy Collins family
The next day, on the morning of March 9, 2011, Cpl. Collins reported to the Joint Personnel Support Unit (JPSU) at the Edmonton base. The resource was created during the Afghanistan war to help seriously ill and wounded soldiers return to their military careers or train them for new civilian jobs and smooth their transition out of the Forces. He was nervous about being transferred to the JPSU, but also trying to remain optimistic.

But inadequate resources and a large number of war casualties have strained the JPSU. Over the years, internal reviews and the military ombudsman have pointed to chronic under-staffing and insufficient training at the support unit. The Forces is currently reviewing the JPSU and has pegged it for an overhaul.

On Cpl. Collins�s first day in the JPSU, the platoon warrant officer and service co-ordinator were not there to meet with him. He left the support unit frustrated and went drinking at a bar on base for junior-rank soldiers. A bartender tried to stop him from driving off in his SUV, but the corporal didn�t listen. As he drove away, the bartender called military police.

Cpl. Jason Pettem was a rookie military police officer in 2011. He pulled Cpl. Collins�s SUV over on a busy street just outside the base shortly after 6 p.m. The soft-spoken officer told the inquiry that the soldier�s eyes were bloodshot and that he admitted to drinking. Fellow military police officer, Sergeant Matthew Parkin, a corporal at the time, soon arrived at the scene.

�� he was one of the most severe cases of PTSD [I have seen]. There was clear evidence that he had been exposed to horrific events.

�Cpl. Collins questioned their authority to stop him. When he was advised he would be detained, he got more angry and agitated, Sgt. Parkin testified.

The corporal was placed in handcuffs and taken to the military police guardhouse just before 7 p.m. He was searched and put in the solicitor-client room to call a lawyer. A dispatcher at the guardhouse was supposed to check the military security information database and the Canadian Police Information Centre (CPIC) for information about Cpl. Collins, but he misspelled the soldier�s name, the inquiry was told.

As a result of the mistake, the officers were not aware of his suicidal history, which was recorded in the Forces database, but not in CPIC. No follow-up checks were done until after his hanging.

While Cpl. Collins was in the solicitor-client room, he was asked to perform a breathalyzer test, but he refused. Warrant Officer Dean Boyd, then a sergeant and the officer in charge that night, testified that the intoxicated soldier got aggressive and attempted to strike Cpl. Pettem with a phone.

Worried about the safety of the officers, WO Boyd decided to place Cpl. Collins in cell No. 1. He warned the soldier he would remain locked up for the night unless he started co-operating. Cpl. Collins refused two more breathalyzer demands. WO Boyd dimmed the lights in the cell and walked out. It was about 8 p.m. No one else was in custody that night.

A veteran of the Afghanistan war, WO Boyd planned to charge Cpl. Collins with refusing to provide a breath sample and release him to Cpl. Dalton, who was on his way to the guardhouse. Military police officers have the same powers of search, seizure and arrest as civilian police. They can lay both criminal charges and charges under the Forces� code of service discipline, which is part of the National Defence Act.

Cpl. Collins could be heard screaming from the darkened cell. At some point, the yelling stopped.

Around 8:30 p.m., WO Boyd and Cpl. Dalton walked into the cell block to free Cpl. Collins. They found him slumped, hanging from the cell door�s bars by a noose fashioned from his combat shirt. The pair rushed to him. WO Boyd cut the noose off and started chest compressions. Cpl. Dalton breathed into his friend�s mouth. A defibrillator was brought in from a military police vehicle, but it didn�t work. The batteries were dead. A second defibrillator was retrieved. Firefighters and paramedics soon arrived and took over, but they couldn�t save him.

Sgt. Parkin was choked with emotion as he recalled Cpl. Collins� hanging. Testifying by phone from Egypt, he said he and the other military police officers would not have left the soldier unsupervised in the cell had they known about his suicidal history.

Changes to the Edmonton military police guardhouse and practices were made in the wake of Cpl. Collins� suicide. In an e-mail, Captain Joanna Labonte noted that wire mesh was installed to cover hanging points and Plexiglas was used to shield the metal-barred doors. A functioning camera system was also installed, providing observation of the cells and surrounding areas. As well, all members in pretrial-service custody are now under constant physical observation and a defibrillator has been moved into the guardhouse.

Despite these changes, the guardhouse still doesn�t meet current correctional standards, Capt. Labonte noted. Limits have been placed on how long members can be kept in the cells.

After Mr. Collins finished testifying at the inquiry, the judge adjourned for a break. Instead of burying his head back into the exhibit documents, he walked over to WO Boyd, who had been taking notes at the back of the courtroom.

The pair talked calmly for some time, each explaining their side, each wishing they could change what happened on March 9, 2011. The suicide of Cpl. Collins ripped a hole in many lives.

�I could tell you 100 stories about Shaun,� Mr. Collins had told the inquiry. Afterward, he said: �He was so much more than that day.�

stop deploying the cf anywhere imo. our good old boys need to be PROTECTED from mental anguish and trauma

# ? May 15, 2016 22:06

EvilJoven: Mar 18, 2005; NOBODY,IN THE HISTORY OF EVER, HAS ASKED OR CARED WHAT CANADA THINKS. YOU ARE NOT A COUNTRY. YOUR MONEY HAS THE QUEEN OF ENGLAND ON IT. IF YOU DIG AROUND IN YOUR BACKYARD, NATIVE SKELETONS WOULD EXPLODE OUT OF YOUR LAWN LIKE THE END OF POLTERGEIST. CANADA IS SO POLITE, EH?; Fun Shoe

Jordan7hm posted:

Elementary school kids have 2 teachers who would conceivably assign homework. Their normal teacher for 80% of the time, and their second language teacher.

Also every elementary school I've seen has pretty solid guidelines on the amounts of homework kids get, and it's not 2-3 hours.

Maybe it's different because I'm old but I remember in Elementary you'd end up with 3-4 teachers, each covering 2 subjects, and they'd each assign 'just a little bit' of homework per subject.

Which would amount to a fuckton of work, even if it was only 15-20 mins of homework per subject.

I also remember how thanks to being assigned a half a dozen subjects a day all with homework you'd end up carrying an entire big as your average kid backpack home stuffed with lovely textbooks.

For some reason the french textbooks always included illustrations that seemed to be specifically designed to be easily defaced in the most hilarious ways possible.

# ? May 15, 2016 22:42

brucio: Nov 22, 2004

EvilJoven posted:

Maybe it's different because I'm old but I remember in Elementary you'd end up with 3-4 teachers, each covering 2 subjects, and they'd each assign 'just a little bit' of homework per subject.

Which would amount to a fuckton of work, even if it was only 15-20 mins of homework per subject.

I also remember how thanks to being assigned a half a dozen subjects a day all with homework you'd end up carrying an entire big as your average kid backpack home stuffed with lovely textbooks.

For some reason the french textbooks always included illustrations that seemed to be specifically designed to be easily defaced in the most hilarious ways possible.

Did you go to a public school? That is hosed.

I had one teacher all day except for gym and music and 45 minutes of French a week from grade 4-6. I think that's more the norm for 80s/90s elementary than what you're describing.

# ? May 15, 2016 22:46

EvilJoven: Mar 18, 2005; NOBODY,IN THE HISTORY OF EVER, HAS ASKED OR CARED WHAT CANADA THINKS. YOU ARE NOT A COUNTRY. YOUR MONEY HAS THE QUEEN OF ENGLAND ON IT. IF YOU DIG AROUND IN YOUR BACKYARD, NATIVE SKELETONS WOULD EXPLODE OUT OF YOUR LAWN LIKE THE END OF POLTERGEIST. CANADA IS SO POLITE, EH?; Fun Shoe

The first few years ya only 1 or 2 teachers but by I think grade 6 In my school I remember having 2 teachers for the majority of subjects, then one for french and some sort of home room sorta thing, and the VP taught math.

EDIT: maybe things were different because I went to a K-8 school and didn't have any sort of jr high.

# ? May 15, 2016 22:53

Jordan7hm: Feb 17, 2011; Lipstick Apathy

In Ontario you had one teacher for everything except your second language and gym all the way until grade 7, and as far as I can tell that's still the case. I don't think your experience was different because of age, but different provinces maybe?

# ? May 15, 2016 23:02

namaste friends: Sep 18, 2004; by Smythe

How many hours per day do you dumb fucks think you need to practice factoring polynomials at a grade 9 level before you get it

# ? May 15, 2016 23:05

Tighclops: Jan 23, 2008; Unable to deal with it; Grimey Drawer

EvilJoven posted:

Maybe it's different because I'm old but I remember in Elementary you'd end up with 3-4 teachers, each covering 2 subjects, and they'd each assign 'just a little bit' of homework per subject.

Which would amount to a fuckton of work, even if it was only 15-20 mins of homework per subject.

I also remember how thanks to being assigned a half a dozen subjects a day all with homework you'd end up carrying an entire big as your average kid backpack home stuffed with lovely textbooks.

For some reason the french textbooks always included illustrations that seemed to be specifically designed to be easily defaced in the most hilarious ways possible.

I typically only had one teacher at a time in elementary but they'd assign a couple of hours of busywork every night regardless of whatever we got done in class that day, and our backpacks would indeed be stuffed full of textbooks and worksheets that half the time nobody bothered completing because taking the participation hit in your marks and getting yelled at by your parents at report card time was better than completely burning out at age loving 11 because the by the time you take your eyes off the papers each night it's loving dark out

High school wasn't much better, but each course's teacher would assign a massive project right near the end of each semester that would be worth an absurd chunk of your final grade, and of course they'd all do it and have them due at the exact same time and pre-emptively poo poo on everyone by saying they of course they weren't responsible for what the other classes teachers assigned you.

There are days I look back and seriously wonder if the whole loving thing isn't seriously designed just to break people

# ? May 15, 2016 23:06

Kafka Esq.: Jan 1, 2005; "If you ever even think about calling me anything but 'The Crab' I will go so fucking crab on your ass you won't even see what crab'd your crab" -The Crab(TM)

Cultural Imperial posted:

How many hours per day do you dumb fucks think you need to practice factoring polynomials at a grade 9 level before you get it

I don't know math and I took international relations just to be sure.

# ? May 15, 2016 23:27

Reince Penis: Nov 15, 2007; by R. Guyovich

I went to alt-high school and spent my last 2 years mostly smoking weed, writing code and playing hacky sack.

Sorry for you're childhoods.

# ? May 15, 2016 23:28

PT6A: Jan 5, 2006; Public school teachers are callous dictators who won't lift a finger to stop children from peeing in my plane

In high school you should just do all the homework and projects when you're drunk as poo poo anyway, because it's not like there's any kind of difficult standard to attain, and the teacher is going to be drunk as poo poo marking it too (trust me, I know several teachers).

I showed up to exams in university drunk and I still passed with the yugest, most tremendous marks, so what does that tell you about education anyway? It's all a loving sham (and CI, you're right about McGill, it's a complete loving joke, and I can't believe anyone actually respects it on any level). Maybe it starts getting difficult after the B.Sc. level, but then again that's what everyone told me constantly at the completion of every single other level of education so I'm not particularly inclined to believe it.

EDIT: Also, if you think you simply "can't learn" something, whether it's another language, or history, or how to write well, or how to cook, or how to do math, and you don't have some sort of really bad learning disability, you're just a lazy sack of poo poo. Anyone can learn anything; if you think you can't, it's because you're not putting an effort into it probably because you just don't give a gently caress. That's fair, but let's not pretend becoming a well-educated and rounded individual is some sort of Sisyphean task that is simply beyond the capacity of some people.

PT6A fucked around with this message at 23:39 on May 15, 2016

# ? May 15, 2016 23:32

Kindest Forums User: Mar 25, 2008; Let me tell you about my opinion about Bernie Sanders and why Donald Trump is his true successor.

You cannot vote Hillary Clinton because she is worse than Trump.

You are autistic

(USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)

# ? May 15, 2016 23:50

PT6A: Jan 5, 2006; Public school teachers are callous dictators who won't lift a finger to stop children from peeing in my plane

never happy posted:

You are autistic

Thank you, Dr. never happy. Would you care to share your reasons for that diagnosis, or am I meant to just take your word for it?

# ? May 15, 2016 23:59

Morroque: Mar 6, 2013

My opinion about mathematics in school is mostly in reference to way it is taught. I often asked my math teachers "why is this useful? what does this apply to? where do I use this stuff?" and the response I got at each instance was something along the lines of "in the upcoming test or exam, now shut up and do it." Under those conditions, you can't blame the students for promptly forgetting everything after it expends its usefulness at the end of the semester.

I've had to re-learn a lot of the mathematical concepts I use in programming in a situation outside of the classroom. It is much more interesting to see how all the rules and relationships work when you have the means to see them happening right in front of you, using a compiler or a simulation or whatever else. Trying to do mathematics with pen and paper or on chalkboard just sucks. Even if you tried your hardest, you have no idea if what you did is proper until the next day in class when you do corrections, and by then its been 18 hours later, you've lost your train of thought, and you don't understand why you got it wrong. I wouldn't be a programmer if I had to send my code to a compiler through Canada Post, and I didn't like math class for the same reason.

I have very strong opinions on how math class could be taught so much better, but it would require computers and resources, so of course that will never happen.

# ? May 16, 2016 00:02

Meat Recital: Mar 26, 2009; by zen death robot

all children should show up to school drunk imho. it's not like there's a difficult standard to attain.

# ? May 16, 2016 00:13

Blade_of_tyshalle: Jul 12, 2009; If you think that, along the way, you're not going to fail... you're blind.

There's no one I've ever met, no matter how successful they are, who hasn't said they had their failures along the way.

Removing homework entirely seems like the dumbest thing. It's useful as a tool to reinforce what you've just learned, which I feel is what it usually is in elementary school; learn about multiplication, do twenty multiplication questions. For whatever reason, that changes in junior high to this weird set-up where there's apparently just so much to cover in the course that you have to do additional learning on your own time or you'll flunk. Read these chapters and answer the questions on them, meanwhile the in-class lecture is so painfully dull that nobody pays attention.

Like, how about changing the way classes are taught so as to engage youth and capture their interest? Let's try that, first.

# ? May 16, 2016 00:13

Seat Safety Switch: May 27, 2008; MY RELIGION IS THE SMALL BLOCK V8 AND COMMANDMENTS ONE THROUGH TEN ARE NEVER LIFT.; Pillbug

I would probably teach it by presenting a problem and then letting the kids hit their heads against it for a day before revealing the newer technique that makes it easier. Sort of like how all of math was developed in the first place.

But that would take more time and also wouldn't get done as a result.

# ? May 16, 2016 00:15

namaste friends: Sep 18, 2004; by Smythe

"I refuse to learn this unless you prove that it will be useful to me later in life"

Yeah because why should you waste your precious brain power on anything other than your wow raids

You loving white people

# ? May 16, 2016 00:22

PT6A: Jan 5, 2006; Public school teachers are callous dictators who won't lift a finger to stop children from peeing in my plane

Meat Recital posted:

all children should show up to school drunk imho. it's not like there's a difficult standard to attain.

Being a small child is pretty much like being drunk all the time anyway. You're stupid, you slur your words and speak improperly, you have limited impulse control, and little ability to reason. Apart from vomiting and ill-advised sexual escapades (I sure hope), there are very few differences.

Seat Safety Switch posted:

I would probably teach it by presenting a problem and then letting the kids hit their heads against it for a day before revealing the newer technique that makes it easier. Sort of like how all of math was developed in the first place.

But that would take more time and also wouldn't get done as a result.

In a sense, isn't that what educators are trying to do with this new curriculum that causes people so much distress: basically, to present multiple approaches to solving the same problem to allow children to learn about how math actually works? The further you go down that path, the more people seem to bitch about it, and I've not got a single clue why. As far as I can tell, everyone hates math and yet it must never be taught in a different way than it was taught to them, ever, or the world will end!

# ? May 16, 2016 00:23

flakeloaf: Feb 26, 2003; Still better than android clock

Cultural Imperial posted:

"I refuse to learn this unless you prove that it will be useful to me later in life"

Yeah because why should you waste your precious brain power on anything other than your wow raids

You loving white people

Gee, Edison. The stuff you learned last year is instrumental to the stuff you would be taught if you weren't asking stupid, impertinent questions. And last year's poo poo wasn't going to make any sense without the stuff you learned the year before that. And somewhere down the road, a postsecondary something will make you employable, and you might have a chance of achieving it if you only had the wits to fill in the blanks of what might happen between now and then. Now put your hand down, shut your mouth and draw your loving conic sections.

# ? May 16, 2016 00:28

namaste friends: Sep 18, 2004; by Smythe

Oh man life is bullshit why should I work my way up to anything my parents told me I'm awesome and to just believe in myself

Now that I've got my ba is sociology why isn't anyone appointing me un secretary general life is so unfair!!!!!!

# ? May 16, 2016 00:31

flakeloaf: Feb 26, 2003; Still better than android clock

PT6A posted:

In a sense, isn't that what educators are trying to do with this new curriculum that causes people so much distress: basically, to present multiple approaches to solving the same problem to allow children to learn about how math actually works? The further you go down that path, the more people seem to bitch about it, and I've not got a single clue why. As far as I can tell, everyone hates math and yet it must never be taught in a different way than it was taught to them, ever, or the world will end!

They "hate math" because they got the idea it in their heads that "math is hard", probably after ignoring a few too many lessons or refusing to think about what they were being taught long enough to absorb any of it. That's about it, really.

e: I am angry about people, staff and students, who somehow manage to gently caress up high school.

# ? May 16, 2016 00:32

Tsyni: Sep 1, 2004; Lipstick Apathy

never happy posted:

You are autistic

Using autistic as a pejorative is untoward.

# ? May 16, 2016 01:15

Chicken: Apr 23, 2014

I had one teacher in elementary school because I went to a school with 30 students. I guess there was a French teacher who came in every two weeks, but French was her third language and we didn't learn any French. Well that's my cool and fun school story, thanks for listening.

# ? May 16, 2016 01:43

ductonius: Apr 9, 2007; I heard there's a cream for that...

flakeloaf posted:

They "hate math" because they got the idea it in their heads that "math is hard", probably after ignoring a few too many lessons or refusing to think about what they were being taught long enough to absorb any of it. That's about it, really.

I took and passed Calc II in university and "math is hard" because the people who teach math and/or write math texts - even down to the elementary level - expect everyone to just "get it" within a couple of examples and can't be arsed to explain the concept past that or even have the correct answers to the chapter question in the back of the book for Christ's sake.

But we can't have a proper, solid, through textbook because the industry needs to poo poo out new editions every year to keep the profits up even though algebra hasn't really changed in the last fifty years, or since it was known as al jabr, really. Same goes for Calc, linear algebra and discreet math. The problem is not the specific method of how math is taught, it's that if you don't get the lesson immediately, they don't care to help.

There is no functional difference between a lesson ignored and a lesson too obtuse to understand. So, endure enough obtuse, uninformative math lessons with unhelpful text book and the soon the only possible conclusion is "math is hard".

# ? May 16, 2016 02:14

flakeloaf: Feb 26, 2003; Still better than android clock

ductonius posted:

There is no functional difference between a lesson ignored and a lesson too obtuse to understand. So, endure enough obtuse, uninformative math lessons with unhelpful text book and the soon the only possible conclusion is "math is hard".

Hear hear. I had a math teacher in grade eleven who spent weeks yammering on about graphing and how this "maps" onto that, without ever once describing the thing that turns x into f(x) with any verb other than "maps", and if you asked her to explain it she'd just short-circuit and say "IT MAPS ONTO F AT X" in an increasingly louder and more comical voice, like a tourist trying to make some poor bastard in a faroff land understand English. It was loving November before I knew what a function was, or how a graph demonstrated the relationship between dependent and independent variables in a function. It's only the fundamental concept that underpins all of calculus and rather a lot of algebra, why should the understanding of that idea have been trusted to someone who can articulate words?

I still remember Mrs. Farrall and Mr. Guthrie's grades 3 and 4 math classes. Specifically the part where they demonstrated how the concept worked BEFORE putting us through the rote memorization of the mechanics. They had to have been pretty passionate about math, because I'm pretty sure these were the same people who knew that if they stuck a giant poster of the times tables on the wall that the third-graders had to march past six times a day and told us that it was "too advanced for us", that not one of us would start fourth grade without knowing that poo poo backwards :getin:

. Clearly the technology to get that information into children's heads existed in 1986, what the hell has happened since then?

# ? May 16, 2016 02:36

Jordan7hm: Feb 17, 2011; Lipstick Apathy

flakeloaf posted:

Clearly the technology to get that information into children's heads existed in 1986, what the hell has happened since then?

It's still there and the systems they use to teach are almost certainly better than what we had growing up. Don't let anecdotes convice you otherwise.

Also, my god some of you are judgemental. I have a kid with a pretty serious language disability who is luckily at least really good at math, but it could easily be the other way around and for some kids in his class it is. Some people are able to quickly grasp concepts that would take other people ages to understand.

# ? May 16, 2016 02:47

Morroque: Mar 6, 2013

There's another aspect of it that always annoyed me in Ontario was the way math tests were weighted in high school. There were four quarters to each test, and each was worth 25% on its own. The final section of each test was called TIPS, which was the Troubleshooting and Problem Solving category. These sections were the shortest on each test in terms of the number of questions, but they were often the most difficult in nature and took the longest time to complete. Because they were at the end of each test, you were often crunched for time by when you got to them -- so if you lagged behind in finishing the other three sections, and you only got 10 minutes before the test is over, even if you did every other question perfectly the best grade you could hope for was still only a 75%. The way it was designed, most of the average students had 15-25% of each unit test automatically forfeit before any other mistakes were tallied.

This was not just for the end of grade exams, but also for each major test as well. The result of it was even the students who were perfectly serviceable at math still ended up feeling like they were terrible at it.

# ? May 16, 2016 02:47

flakeloaf: Feb 26, 2003; Still better than android clock

Jordan7hm posted:

Also, my god some of you are judgemental. I have a kid with a pretty serious language disability who is luckily at least really good at math, but it could easily be the other way around and for some kids in his class it is. Some people are able to quickly grasp concepts that would take other people ages to understand.

I think most of that judgment is reserved for the teachers who give up when their one and only way of getting the idea across doesn't fit the student they're trying to teach. I learn by doing, so you can stand up there and yammer on all day about proofs and I'll copy them down with only those parts of my brain needed to keep an eye open and move a pen without absorbing a word of it. By the time I'm through the odd-numbered questions on page 117 though, I'll either have down for life or I'll know exactly what information I'm missing so I can form one or two intelligent questions for the next class. Usuallly though, the "answers" to that questions are just repeating same thing that made no sense the first time. Then the teacher gives up so she can go get drunk and I give up so I can concentrate on biology or something I'm good at to drag my average back up.

# ? May 16, 2016 02:55

Balthesar: Sep 4, 2006; by Fluffdaddy

I kinda like the Khan Academy idea - watch the instruction at night and do the work during the way with the teacher available to a see questions.

# ? May 16, 2016 03:05

namaste friends: Sep 18, 2004; by Smythe

http://news.nationalpost.com/news/c...abu-sayyaf-says

quote:

Canadian hostage dies on June 13 unless $16 million ransom paid, says Filipino terrorist group Abu Sayyaf

The lone surviving Canadian hostage in the southern Philippines has appeared in a new video, announcing that his captors will decapitate him and a Norwegian man next month if they do not receive $16 million in ransom first.

Robert Hall, looking drawn and gaunt, says he will be executed at 3 p.m. on June 13 if demands of the Muslim extremist group Abu Sayyaf are not met.

�I appeal to my government and the Philippine government, as I have appealed before, for help,� he says in a calm but monotone voice, a phalanx of armed, masked extremists standing behind him.

An English text with the video specifies that a hostage will be beheaded if the ransom is not paid.

The video was posted by the jihadists on May 13 and discovered Sunday by the Site Intelligence Group, about three weeks after Abu Sayyaf murdered John Ridsdel, another Canadian seized at the same time as Hall.

Rachna Mishra, a Global Affairs Canada spokeswoman, said the department is aware of the video, but will not speak publicly about it.

�The Government�s first priority is the safety and security of its citizens and therefore we will not comment or release any information which may compromise ongoing efforts or endanger the safety of the remaining hostages,� she said in an emailed statement.

In the wake of Ridsdel�s slaying, Prime Minister Justin Trudeau said adamantly that the government does not pay ransoms for hostages. Former government officials have said, though, that behind the scenes officials will consider almost anything in the effort to free captive Canadians.

The new video ends with a statement by one of the masked terrorists, his voice rising steadily to an angry crescendo, before he thrusts a machete in the air amid a chorus of �Alahu Akhbar� � Arabic for God is great.

�We say to the governments of Canada and the Philippines not to play games, for we are determined to slaughter all the captives if you do not comply with our demands,� the man says, reading from a smartphone screen. �We are not scared of you or your soldiers or airplanes.�

Both Hall and Norwegian Kjartan Sekkingstad are clad in orange coveralls, similar to hostages in videos produced by the Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant, to which Abu Sayaff has pledged allegiance.

Hall, his Filipino girlfriend Maritess Flor, Ridsdel and Sekkingstad were snatched last September at a marina near the city of Davao, before being spirited by boat 500 kilometres away to Jolo island.

Hall, a Calgary native, has sold insurance, run a welding shop and acted in independent films, but reportedly sold everything in 2014 to buy a 36-foot sailboat, the Renova, which he helmed across the Pacific.

He appeared to have decided to settle in the Philippines, according to one published report, before being kidnapped.

The Philippines military stepped up its operations against Abu Sayyaf on Jolo after the first Canadian was killed, but there is little indication they have made progress in finding and freeing the remaining hostages.

sorry bro canadian supersoldier of honour romeo dallaire's retired so there's no one left to get you out.

On a more serious note, this guy was probably on a sexual exploitation tour so no big loss.

# ? May 16, 2016 03:50

Ambrose Burnside: Aug 30, 2007; pensive

Jordan7hm posted:

In Ontario you had one teacher for everything except your second language and gym all the way until grade 7, and as far as I can tell that's still the case. I don't think your experience was different because of age, but different provinces maybe?

i went to catlick elementary in ontario and one school was that way but the other had rotation with iirc 5 or 6 different teachers. seems to differ on a school-by-school basis

# ? May 16, 2016 04:24

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# ? May 31, 2024 15:16

Pixelante: Mar 16, 2006; You people will by God act like a team, or at least like people who know each other, or I'll incinerate the bunch of you here and now.

Ambrose Burnside posted:

seems to differ on a school-by-school basis

This. I hopped schools a bunch and they were all different. Had one year in a private school where all the boarders had mandatory supervised study hall five nights a week; by god, homework got done. The worst twist was moving from Ontario to BC at the start of Grade 10. Additional year of mandatory PE for a goony goon. It was all poo poo like square dancing and rugby that we never did in Toronto, too. Conversely, French goes to hell the farther you get from Quebec. I spoke more French in two months of Laos than I have in the last ten years of BC.

Does anyone over 30 remember how to do long division?

# ? May 16, 2016 04:57

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > CanPol Megathread: Big Changus

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