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emanresu tnuocca posted:Phone posting, can't embed: https://imgur.com/a/uo7Um Wow, really need to find a way to harness the irony Israel produces cause we could power the whole world with it
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May 11, 2016 19:58
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emanresu tnuocca posted:Phone posting, can't embed: https://imgur.com/a/uo7Um I'd say it's more "one people, one country".
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May 11, 2016 20:03
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Absurd Alhazred posted:I'd say it's more "one people, one country". so, in German, "ein volk, ein reich"? Yep, definitely need to get to work on that Irony Reactor.
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May 11, 2016 20:33
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Absurd Alhazred posted:I'd say it's more "one people, one country". Kinda synonymous in Hebrew wouldn't you say?
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May 11, 2016 21:00
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emanresu tnuocca posted:Kinda synonymous in Hebrew wouldn't you say? Yep. It's the Jewish Nation, Arabs are merely citizens (no such thing as an Israeli nationality)
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May 11, 2016 21:21
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In one case, a court orders the release of two 12-year-old boys from jail, where they had been held for three days during the investigation of property crimes they are suspected to have committed using a knife in the West Bank. In another, a 12-year-old girl was charged with attempted murder and sentenced to four months in prison solely for possessing a knife. Although the Prison Bureau unilaterally released her after she'd served a bit over half her sentence, her father has been barred from working in Israel. I wonder what the difference between these two cases could be.
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May 11, 2016 21:44
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Lum_ posted:so, in German, "ein volk, ein reich"? Yep, definitely need to get to work on that Irony Reactor. Start with an environmental impact statement, and we'll go from there. emanresu tnuocca posted:Kinda synonymous in Hebrew wouldn't you say? Not really. עם-אומה-לאום-מדינה is kind of the same scale as ethnicity-people-nation-state, and in this context there is a point match between עם and people. Generally it varies, of course.
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May 12, 2016 03:39
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Am Yisrael Hai? Mavdil bein Yisrael laamin? As far as I can tell the nation of Israel and the people of Israel mean the same thing.
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May 12, 2016 06:15
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emanresu tnuocca posted:Phone posting, can't embed: https://imgur.com/a/uo7Um  Seriously though, I had to watch the actual thing on youtube to see if it wasn't a photoshop. Goddamn, how can you lack so much self awareness? 
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May 12, 2016 08:58
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Bear Retrieval Unit posted:Someone on the internet fixed it for you: I saw that yesterday as well (John Browns timeline?) but the photoshop was so bad I couldn't bring myself to post it here. What really tickles my funny bone is that two years ago during protective edge Barak Cohen handed out posters with the "one people, one country, one leader" slogan at a right wing rally organized by Yoav Eliassi. After that happened many a salty tear were shed and of course Cohen himself was accused of treasonous leftism and the such, so yeah, i'm lolling.
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May 12, 2016 09:22
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emanresu tnuocca posted:I saw that yesterday as well (John Browns timeline?) but the photoshop was so bad I couldn't bring myself to post it here. Eh, it's ok for a rushed job. Yeah I remember that rally. Didn't know those posters were given out by Cohen though, but I guess it doesn't really matter as those people were glad to unironically hold them up anyways.
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May 12, 2016 10:46
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I can't read these. Which is shopped/how?
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May 12, 2016 14:05
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The original is the one I posted containing only the upper two rows which say 'one nation/people - one country' the shop adds the third line 'one leader'.
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May 12, 2016 14:44
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Israeli news outlets and social media are buzzing with stubborn reports that Isaac Herzog intends to join Netanyahu's coalition, he is rumored to covet the foreign ministry for himself. Several prominent Labor MKs have announced that they will splinter from the Zionist Union if these rumors prove to be true, among them Shelli Yehimovitch, Stav Shaffir and Erel Margalit. Safe to assume Livni and her party "the movement" (it sounds even worse in Hebrew where it can also be read as 'the gesture') will stick with Herzog. Herzog has also went to admit that there were secret negotiations between him and Netanyahu all along which maybe would have annoyed Bibi's voters but I think they might just be too dim to care.
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May 12, 2016 19:48
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So coiuld Israel launching more air strikes in Syria lead to Hams launching a attack on a patrol again?
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May 13, 2016 04:17
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Crowsbeak posted:So coiuld Israel launching more air strikes in Syria lead to Hams launching a attack on a patrol again? So far Israeli media says the IDF hasn't confirmed it was them. Also, I don't know that Hamas and the Syrian Regime/Hezbollah are on good terms.
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May 13, 2016 04:27
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Crowsbeak posted:So coiuld Israel launching more air strikes in Syria lead to Hams launching a attack on a patrol again? We know that attacking al qaeda, boko haram, ISIS, et al might 'lead to' those groups launching attacks on us or our allies again, but we do it anyway because that's the world we live in and we are on the side we are on. Anyway, another win for the good guys today. Mustafa Badreddine, a Hezbollah terrorist, has met justice in Damascus and will never trouble the world again.
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May 13, 2016 13:20
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Crowsbeak posted:So coiuld Israel launching more air strikes in Syria lead to Hams launching a attack on a patrol again? I don't really see why Hamas would care. They've got enough trouble just working for their own cause, let alone taking up others' cause. Also, I'm pretty sure they don't like ISIS, who are as much of a threat to them as to anyone else.
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May 13, 2016 14:14
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one of my breasts is large and sumptuous, the other but a pellet
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May 13, 2016 14:24
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Main Paineframe posted:I don't really see why Hamas would care. They've got enough trouble just working for their own cause, let alone taking up others' cause. Also, I'm pretty sure they don't like ISIS, who are as much of a threat to them as to anyone else. Sorry meant hezbellah. Also AV that's hosed up if true.
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May 13, 2016 14:45
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Main Paineframe posted:I don't really see why Hamas would care. They've got enough trouble just working for their own cause, let alone taking up others' cause. Also, I'm pretty sure they don't like ISIS, who are as much of a threat to them as to anyone else. Hamas and ISIS are definitely not on good terms. I think in the last I/P thread someone(maybe you main p?)linked a video from a palestinian comedy show depicting two ISIS soldiers manning a checkpoint and basically finding a reason for murdering everyone who came across their path while bickering over how much more blessed one was than the other.
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May 13, 2016 16:48
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Ultramega posted:Hamas and ISIS are definitely not on good terms. I think in the last I/P thread someone(maybe you main p?)linked a video from a palestinian comedy show depicting two ISIS soldiers manning a checkpoint and basically finding a reason for murdering everyone who came across their path while bickering over how much more blessed one was than the other. The final punchline being, after executing insufficiently pious Muslims and a Jordanian Christian, they let an Israeli Jew pass right through. ISIS' war against everyone but Israel seems not to have played well in Palestine.
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May 13, 2016 16:53
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hakimashou posted:We know that attacking al qaeda, boko haram, ISIS, et al might 'lead to' those groups launching attacks on us or our allies again, but we do it anyway because that's the world we live in and we are on the side we are on. ISIS are the good guys now?
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May 14, 2016 11:55
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So I really don't know where to ask this so if it should go somewhere else, forgive me. This is the first time I've been interested in moern politics in, well, ever. The US Presidential election is coming up and I figure I should actually vote for once. One of the issues key to me, and apparently most Republicans, is the Israeli/Palestinian situation. I differ from the Republicans though in that I favor neutrality instead of being rabidly pro-Israel. That seemed to be Trump's position too, such as it is. His website doesn't make any mention of his official policy and this is all I could find. quote:On democracy in the Middle East, Trump said, “We went from mistakes in Iraq to Egypt to Libya, to President Obama’s line in the sand in Syria. Each of these actions have helped to throw the region into chaos and gave ISIS the space it needs to grow and prosper. Very bad. It all began with a dangerous idea that we could make western democracies out of countries that had no experience or interests in becoming a western democracy.” Why Israel Loves Donald Trump In meeting with Orthodox, Donald Trump reveals Israel advisers: His Jewish lawyers As I said, I'm new to this whole politics thing and I've avoided it my whole life because I figured it was all BS and lies anyway. But...I dunno, I figure I should try and do something finally. My point is, I'm not sure how trustworthy any of the info I linked to is. But it looks like Trump's neutrality is a bit...sketchy. He's not a diehard Israeli fanboy but I dunno. Perhaps Hillary's position of still working for a two state solution is more viable than Trump's...uh, indecisiveness? From what I could find she hdoes have pretty good history in the region as far as these things go. So yeah, I'm sorry. If I should inquire about this elsewhere, I will do so. I just didn't know where.
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May 14, 2016 19:51
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As they say in Yiddish: Dezelbe Dreck. Same poo poo. Clinton has always signaled to the pro Israeli community that she intends to patch up the relationship following Obama's scuffles with Netanyahu, she basically wants Edelson and Bibi to stop supporting republican candidates and wants to regain their favor. Trump began with some bold statements saying that he doesn't consider Israel to always automatically be the good guys, it seems he had a few talks with Edelsons folks since then as he recently declared that "no one is a pro Israel as me", moreover Edelson's propaganda rag "Israel Today" has recently started churning out some very pro trump headlines so it would seem to me that Trump was accounted and paid for. Don't pick your candidate based on their attitude towards Israel as both are terrible, vote for the candidate that seems best for yourself and your country, imo.
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May 14, 2016 20:01
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NikkolasKing posted:So I really don't know where to ask this so if it should go somewhere else, forgive me. This is the first time I've been interested in moern politics in, well, ever. This isn't the thread for elections discussion in the US. In fact, this isn't really the forum for it. There is a subforum currently called Molsten Salt Reactor but originally Your Candidate Sucks, where that would be more appropriate. I do warn you that it is more lively than D&D. Speaking of location, how about those of you interested in talking about ISIS and/or Assad and or Syria qua Syria do so in the Middle East thread? If the Israeli government insists on mixing up with that then there's no avoiding discussing it here, but it is probably healthy to keep up the sequestration as much as possible.
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May 14, 2016 20:03
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emanresu tnuocca posted:As they say in Yiddish: Dezelbe Dreck. Same poo poo. Absurd Alhazred posted:This isn't the thread for elections discussion in the US. In fact, this isn't really the forum for it. There is a subforum currently called Molsten Salt Reactor but originally Your Candidate Sucks, where that would be more appropriate. I do warn you that it is more lively than D&D. Fair enough. Thank you both for the information.
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May 14, 2016 20:10
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Absurd Alhazred posted:This isn't the thread for elections discussion in the US. In fact, this isn't really the forum for it. There is a subforum currently called Molsten Salt Reactor but originally Your Candidate Sucks, where that would be more appropriate. I do warn you that it is more lively than D&D. I think it might be legitimate to ask specifically about a candidate's views with respect to the I/P situation in this thread, though (which seems to be what that guy was doing). The right wing's "anyone who kills the muslims is a friend of mine" attitude is going to inevitably result in some bizarre situation where they simultaneously applaud and condemn nearly every single faction in the Middle East.
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May 14, 2016 23:43
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Yes, that is what I was inquiring about. But now I have an actual question relevant to the current ME situation as it relates to these two. So I'm relatively new to all this and I kind of have a lot of reading to do. But for right now, I figure I should focus on the present. Is this article legitimate? http://www.al-monitor.com/pulse/originals/2016/04/israel-al-sisi-egypt-saudi-arabia-islands-transfer-alliance.html Israel is making pals with one of the countries that they fought with in their country-defining wars? I know it's not the same Egyptian regime, although how different the people in power are I cant say, but it seems like a dangerous game to try and b uddy up to these folks. I have always heard the Saudis were our biggest not Israel pals in the ME so them getting along seems reasonable enough but banking on Egypt to protect you from Iran and Turkey and whoever else? The way I heard it, the numer one enemy of everyone in the ME was Israel. Maybe it's ISIS now but still. Im just wondering what the informed posters here think of this? Or is the article's speculation a crock of poo poo?
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May 15, 2016 09:38
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NikkolasKing posted:Yes, that is what I was inquiring about. Hamas is a militant offshoot of the Muslim Brotherhood, an Islamist organisation who briefly ran Egypt after Mubarak's fall in the Arab Spring. Then the current military government ousted the Brotherhood and set out to exterminate them and anyone who might have the most tenuous of connections to them. As a result, they're very enthusiastically helping Israel against Hamas - with such vigour, in fact, that their brutal efforts to close the Gaza border have caused a major insurrection in the Sinai (bringing in jihadist organisations way scarier than Hamas or the MB to exploit the chaos). That's how that Russian airliner got shot down. Also, this is off-topic, but Jesus Christ don't vote for Trump. Not even as an ironic joke.
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May 15, 2016 10:18
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Darth Walrus posted:Hamas is a militant offshoot of the Muslim Brotherhood, an Islamist organisation who briefly ran Egypt after Mubarak's fall in the Arab Spring. Then the current military government ousted the Brotherhood and set out to exterminate them and anyone who might have the most tenuous of connections to them. As a result, they're very enthusiastically helping Israel against Hamas - with such vigour, in fact, that their brutal efforts to close the Gaza border have caused a major insurrection in the Sinai (bringing in jihadist organisations way scarier than Hamas or the MB to exploit the chaos). That's how that Russian airliner got shot down. Eh, I'm probably gonna go with Clinton as per emanresu tnuocca's recommendation. As neither Hillary's nor Trumps foreign policies appeal to me, I focus on what they can do for me at home and Clinton's promises at least appeal to me. If they actually happen, I guess I'll have to see. And that's very interesting about Egypt and stuff. Is there any chance of another, less Israel friendly regime coming to power in Egypt any time soon? Or is this attempt at fostering friendship a good, solid plan for the foreseeable future? Then Israel won't be alone in a land that hates their guts. They'll have one, maybe two friends. I guess that helps?
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May 15, 2016 10:24
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Absurd Alhazred posted:I think that if you're spending most of your argument with someone trying to argue that they must be Jewish due to their opinions, and if you think that exposing them as Jews is a valid way of discrediting them, then you are bigoted against Jews, which in common parlance is called "antisemitism". Particularly when you add the "Jews control the news and the media and politics" angle. Forums rule question clarification: Is it still probate-able to do that? Darth Walrus posted:As a result, they're very enthusiastically helping Israel against Hamas - with such vigour, in fact, that their brutal efforts to close the Gaza border have caused a major insurrection in the Sinai (bringing in jihadist organisations way scarier than Hamas or the MB to exploit the chaos). That's how that Russian airliner got shot down. The Sinai insurgency started after Mubarak was ousted, so it obviously can't be pinned on Israel. It continued through Morsi's administration, it was an attack on an army barracks in the Sinai that got Morsi to put al Sisi in as defense chief. And it's mostly been the work of indigenous Salafist groups that eventually swore allegiance to ISIS, not foreign fighters.
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May 15, 2016 11:43
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Ytlaya posted:Either way, it is pretty obvious that it is absurd to accuse Israel apologists of being Jewish Not just absurd, noxious. Accusations are for bad things; being Jewish is not one.
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May 15, 2016 13:25
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So, another question. Sorry, I really am new to this and while history is simple enough to get as far as these things go, understanding the modern or present situation is kind of hard for me. Is there like, a primer or something somewhere? A guy elsewhere told me that the Saudis are no one's friends. Not ours, not Israel's. They play nice but that's all and so it seems like Israel's potential ME allies base is even shakier. Also another guy said the US is the real broker between Egypt's and Israel's freedom by bribing them. But all I am wondering, as I read up on the history of Israel, is there any chance of a repeat of the old Arab alliance against Israel? Everyone talks about how all the ME countries hate Israel. Even Iran, who I'm learning isn't even popular with its fellow Islamic states, hates Israel. But is this all talk, all bark and no bite? Or could the future see an alliance against Israel again and a real war?
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May 16, 2016 08:45
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NikkolasKing posted:So, another question. Sorry, I really am new to this and while history is simple enough to get as far as these things go, understanding the modern or present situation is kind of hard for me. Is there like, a primer or something somewhere? There's never going to be another real war against Israel. Well, unless Iran lets the nukes fly, but in that case we're all dying in nuclear war anyways and Iran knows this, so it's extremely unlikely. The Saudis were never part of the anti-Israel coalition, they were always American stoogies. See here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arab_Cold_War The Egypt/Syria/Iraq alliance versus Israel is dead and is not going to be revived
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May 16, 2016 09:10
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icantfindaname posted:There's never going to be another real war against Israel. Well, unless Iran lets the nukes fly, but in that case we're all dying in nuclear war anyways and Iran knows this, so it's extremely unlikely. The Saudis were never part of the anti-Israel coalition, they were always American stoogies. See here: I know the Saudis were never part of it, I was referring to how it seems Israel is trying to buddy up to the Saudis and Egypt now and I was thinking maybe it was trying to create its own alliance in case of any future Arab alliance against them. But that won't happen so.... I guess Israel doesn't need to worry so much. Thank you for that link though. I gotta look into the book this article was seemingly named for.
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May 16, 2016 09:23
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NikkolasKing posted:I know the Saudis were never part of it, I was referring to how it seems Israel is trying to buddy up to the Saudis and Egypt now and I was thinking maybe it was trying to create its own alliance in case of any future Arab alliance against them. The opression of the Palestinians is an important issue for the general Arab population, but not very important for the various leaders of the Arab states, many of whom have official, and maybe more commonly non-official, relations, with Israel. Iran has been able to capitalize on this by talking loud and by its relations to stalwart opponents of Israel like Hezbollah and the Syrian regime (and Netanyahu's total and very public obsession) to gain popular support and credibility. And no, the US has few "friends" anywhere, let alone in the Middle East, for all the obvious reasons.
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May 16, 2016 10:31
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NikkolasKing posted:And that's very interesting about Egypt and stuff. Is there any chance of another, less Israel friendly regime coming to power in Egypt any time soon? Or is this attempt at fostering friendship a good, solid plan for the foreseeable future? Then Israel won't be alone in a land that hates their guts. They'll have one, maybe two friends. I guess that helps? That all depends on the stability of Sisi's regime. He's a brutal dictator who rose to power via military coup just a year or two ago and has been aggressively suppressing any and all dissent ever since, so who can say how long it'll last? That said, I wouldn't go so far as to say that Egypt and Israel are fast friends. Like other dictatorial regimes in tough situations, al-Sisi is cutting deals with anyone it takes to secure his interests and his rule. He's cooperating with Israel to strangle Hamas, which he considers to be a potential threat to his rule due to its links to the Islamist government he overthrew, and he's cooperating with Saudi Arabia in return for massive economic guarantees which will be very helpful in ensuring the stability of his rule. On top of that, cooperating with America's favorite Middle Eastern allies will help persuade the US to look past that whole "being a military dictatorship that overthrew a popularly elected democratic government" thing, which the US government officially frowns upon. He's making concessions, but not for free; he's doing it in return for aid and support he badly needs. NikkolasKing posted:So, another question. Sorry, I really am new to this and while history is simple enough to get as far as these things go, understanding the modern or present situation is kind of hard for me. Is there like, a primer or something somewhere? Israel has nuclear weapons of its own, and is the only Middle Eastern country to possess them. They will never again face an existential military threat, no matter how many countries are against them. Besides, Israel has gotten much stronger since 1948 and 1967, its foes generally have not, and its ties with the US have deepened considerably since then. The notion that any of its neighbors would dare pick a fight with them now is frankly laughable. They're well aware that they can't possibly win that fight. The Middle East is complex, but mostly runs in accordance with the first rule of politics: don't believe anything anyone says, because they're all damned liars. This is particularly the case in regards to poo poo-talking other nations - since most Middle Eastern countries aren't particularly stable, aren't very democratic, have deep-seated economic problems lurking somewhere in the present or the foreseeable future, and have historical reasons to dislike pretty much every other country in the world, leaders tend to eltalk a lot about foreign enemies as a way to distract the populace from domestic problems. For example, Netanyahu doesn't campaign on fixing Israel's massive economic inequality issues or resolving the considerable tensions between secular and religious institutions, he campaigns on protecting Israelis from mean old Iran and thwarting the evil plans of Arab voters. His speech to Congressional Republicans that stirred up such a ruckus in US politics was really just a campaign speech for back home (doing it in front of Congress was simply a clever way to circumvent laws that restricted campaigning right before the election). It's the same for other Middle Eastern countries; they invoke an existential threat from outside to pull political attention away from internal problems that are difficult or inconvenient to fix. Most of the hostility between Middle Eastern countries is just political noise, not serious desire for war.
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May 16, 2016 14:44
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Ytlaya posted:I think it might be legitimate to ask specifically about a candidate's views with respect to the I/P situation in this thread, though (which seems to be what that guy was doing). I assure you that it is, in fact, not a good idea to talk about candidates in this thread, as it resides in D&D, not YCS. No reason to put more than one powder keg in the same room. The Insect Court posted:Forums rule question clarification: Is it still probate-able to do that? If they persist in arguing in bad faith for an abhorrent position, they will be taken care of. Otherwise, we did give that Stalin apologist a shot, did we not? Any further modding questions and feedback should go to QCS.
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May 16, 2016 16:42
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Main Paineframe posted:That all depends on the stability of Sisi's regime. He's a brutal dictator who rose to power via military coup just a year or two ago and has been aggressively suppressing any and all dissent ever since, so who can say how long it'll last? That said, I wouldn't go so far as to say that Egypt and Israel are fast friends. Like other dictatorial regimes in tough situations, al-Sisi is cutting deals with anyone it takes to secure his interests and his rule. He's cooperating with Israel to strangle Hamas, which he considers to be a potential threat to his rule due to its links to the Islamist government he overthrew, and he's cooperating with Saudi Arabia in return for massive economic guarantees which will be very helpful in ensuring the stability of his rule. On top of that, cooperating with America's favorite Middle Eastern allies will help persuade the US to look past that whole "being a military dictatorship that overthrew a popularly elected democratic government" thing, which the US government officially frowns upon. He's making concessions, but not for free; he's doing it in return for aid and support he badly needs. So I might not be up on modern politics but as a fan of Cold War history this all sounds very familiar. America's selective blindness to dictatorships as long as the dictatorships are on their side continues a proud tradition indeed. quote:Israel has nuclear weapons of its own, and is the only Middle Eastern country to possess them. They will never again face an existential military threat, no matter how many countries are against them. Besides, Israel has gotten much stronger since 1948 and 1967, its foes generally have not, and its ties with the US have deepened considerably since then. The notion that any of its neighbors would dare pick a fight with them now is frankly laughable. They're well aware that they can't possibly win that fight. Well one person elsewhere was going on and on about how Israel is right to hate the Iranian nuclear deal because Iran is an empire and is all over Syria, Lebanon and Iraq and that MAD doesn't work when your opponent is crazy and when your own country could be destroyed by a single nuke. Israel is very small as countries go. quote:The Middle East is complex, but mostly runs in accordance with the first rule of politics: don't believe anything anyone says, because they're all damned liars. This is particularly the case in regards to poo poo-talking other nations - since most Middle Eastern countries aren't particularly stable, aren't very democratic, have deep-seated economic problems lurking somewhere in the present or the foreseeable future, and have historical reasons to dislike pretty much every other country in the world, leaders tend to eltalk a lot about foreign enemies as a way to distract the populace from domestic problems. For example, Netanyahu doesn't campaign on fixing Israel's massive economic inequality issues or resolving the considerable tensions between secular and religious institutions, he campaigns on protecting Israelis from mean old Iran and thwarting the evil plans of Arab voters. His speech to Congressional Republicans that stirred up such a ruckus in US politics was really just a campaign speech for back home (doing it in front of Congress was simply a clever way to circumvent laws that restricted campaigning right before the election). It's the same for other Middle Eastern countries; they invoke an existential threat from outside to pull political attention away from internal problems that are difficult or inconvenient to fix. Most of the hostility between Middle Eastern countries is just political noise, not serious desire for war. So it's just the same as the authoritarian regimes of old. Problems inside, focus everyone's attention outside. Of course you gotta watch out because that bluster can become real danger a la Nazi Germany but I guess no ME country is anywhere near that powerful. NikkolasKing fucked around with this message at 17:28 on May 16, 2016 |
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May 16, 2016 17:26
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